Quick Grades: Spurs vs. Nuggets - Dec. 22

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Originally Posted by GSH

I was at the game tonight, and noticed some things that might not have stood out as much on television.

As a unit, I would give them about a C for the night, which seems wrong since they won the game. But there were a number of plays on each end of the floor where it looked like guys just didn't know where they were supposed to be on the court. On the defensive end you would see three different players switching places, pointing, pushing, and signalling. It was pretty disjointed on the offensive end at times, too. (Watching Tony and RJ cutting across the lane in the same direction at the same time, and then turning and tangling with each other was just bizarre.) Matt Bonner got hung out to dry, holding the ball out on the perimeter with the clock winding down, and his teammates just milling around watching. Say what you want about him dribbling to the basket, he really didn't have much choice.

I know it's early in the season still, but I don't remember them looking this... what, confused? It reminded me, at times, of a pre-season game with a lot of new players on the roster. I felt like we won a number of earlier games by playing well as a unit. Tonight we won because of a heavy dose of Gary Neal and Tiago Splitter.

The other thing that was more troubling than usual was just how weak we were in the middle. We got outscored 46-36 in the paint, but it was worse than that. The points we did get in the middle were almost exclusively speed and/or finesse, not power. There were guys camped in our passing lanes at times because the Nuggets knew we weren't going to try to go to work down low. There was some serious disrespect going on.

That's not supposed to be gloom and doom - just making observations. There were still a lot of good things to be seen:

Gary Neal deserves a whole thread. His confidence is growing visibly from game to game, and he's starting to feel it on the defensive end now. He'd slip right into the starting lineups of a number of teams around the league.

Splitter looked good in his second trip to the floor. He tried to suck out some calls against Nene early, and the refs weren't buying. He's still not sure where to be at times, but tonight he recoverd quicker and got back into plays. He needs some work on his hands, though. He loses too many balls after he initially controls the rebound.

Matt Bonner deserves every bit of his B+ for this game. Those two 3-pointers in the beginning of the 4th were absolutely what turned the momentum. And even though he didn't pull down a lot of boards, he did something that just about no one else was doing - he boxed out and allowed his teammates to get the rebounds. (I take that back, Neal and Quinn boxed out nicely on a couple of plays. Go figure.) He was also disruptive on defense for a stretch that really helped us get back into the game.

Quinn played solidly again. I think he got victimized on defense a few times by some outrageous moving screens. I know the refs can't catch everything, but that was a little too much. There's nothing you can do when you're giving up that much size and the other guy gets to play fullback.

I saw James Anderson shooting tonight, which was good news. It made me start thinking about having him back in the lineup, and how many players we have who deserve minutes. (B'bye Ime.) Other than Quinn, we don't have anybody I think of as deep bench - and Quinn is no slouch. I don't think Pop is going to be able to shorten his rotation down in the playoffs as much he has in previous years.

The Spurs won a game that the Nuggets really, really wanted. They were missing Melo, but Billups was back, and he was huge. KMart being back helped them too. It was a game the Spurs could have easily lost, and they owned the 4th quarter, which is usually what counts.

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Nice write up.

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Originally Posted by GSH

I was at the game tonight, and noticed some things that might not have stood out as much on television.

As a unit, I would give them about a C for the night, which seems wrong since they won the game. But there were a number of plays on each end of the floor where it looked like guys just didn't know where they were supposed to be on the court. On the defensive end you would see three different players switching places, pointing, pushing, and signalling. It was pretty disjointed on the offensive end at times, too. (Watching Tony and RJ cutting across the lane in the same direction at the same time, and then turning and tangling with each other was just bizarre.) Matt Bonner got hung out to dry, holding the ball out on the perimeter with the clock winding down, and his teammates just milling around watching. Say what you want about him dribbling to the basket, he really didn't have much choice.

I know it's early in the season still, but I don't remember them looking this... what, confused? It reminded me, at times, of a pre-season game with a lot of new players on the roster. I felt like we won a number of earlier games by playing well as a unit. Tonight we won because of a heavy dose of Gary Neal and Tiago Splitter.

The other thing that was more troubling than usual was just how weak we were in the middle. We got outscored 46-36 in the paint, but it was worse than that. The points we did get in the middle were almost exclusively speed and/or finesse, not power. There were guys camped in our passing lanes at times because the Nuggets knew we weren't going to try to go to work down low. There was some serious disrespect going on.

That's not supposed to be gloom and doom - just making observations. There were still a lot of good things to be seen:

Gary Neal deserves a whole thread. His confidence is growing visibly from game to game, and he's starting to feel it on the defensive end now. He'd slip right into the starting lineups of a number of teams around the league.

Splitter looked good in his second trip to the floor. He tried to suck out some calls against Nene early, and the refs weren't buying. He's still not sure where to be at times, but tonight he recoverd quicker and got back into plays. He needs some work on his hands, though. He loses too many balls after he initially controls the rebound.

Matt Bonner deserves every bit of his B+ for this game. Those two 3-pointers in the beginning of the 4th were absolutely what turned the momentum. And even though he didn't pull down a lot of boards, he did something that just about no one else was doing - he boxed out and allowed his teammates to get the rebounds. (I take that back, Neal and Quinn boxed out nicely on a couple of plays. Go figure.) He was also disruptive on defense for a stretch that really helped us get back into the game.

Quinn played solidly again. I think he got victimized on defense a few times by some outrageous moving screens. I know the refs can't catch everything, but that was a little too much. There's nothing you can do when you're giving up that much size and the other guy gets to play fullback.

I saw James Anderson shooting tonight, which was good news. It made me start thinking about having him back in the lineup, and how many players we have who deserve minutes. (B'bye Ime.) Other than Quinn, we don't have anybody I think of as deep bench - and Quinn is no slouch. I don't think Pop is going to be able to shorten his rotation down in the playoffs as much he has in previous years.

The Spurs won a game that the Nuggets really, really wanted. They were missing Melo, but Billups was back, and he was huge. KMart being back helped them too. It was a game the Spurs could have easily lost, and they owned the 4th quarter, which is usually what counts.

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I was there as well. :toast It was great to see James Anderson out on the court and walking fine without the boot. :tu I gotta agree that the interior defense probably looked 10X worse in person than it did on television. The game was won with the beginning 4th quarter line-up. When I saw a line-up of Quinn-Neal-Manu-Bonner-Splitter trot out there to start the 4th I wasnt sure what to think. But they stepped up big time and were the reason the Spurs got back into the game in the 1st place. Neal is just a great all-around scorer. He is great energy off the bench and a very good scoring punch when you need it....

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Originally Posted by GSH

Matt Bonner got hung out to dry, holding the ball out on the perimeter with the clock winding down, and his teammates just milling around watching. Say what you want about him dribbling to the basket, he really didn't have much choice.

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Nice catch, I was furious about that. I seriously didn't understand why those guys allowed that to happen, IIRC Manu and Quinn were on the floor with him? But I know I saw 2 ball handlers out there.

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Originally Posted by angelbelow

Nice catch, I was furious about that. I seriously didn't understand why those guys allowed that to happen, IIRC Manu and Quinn were on the floor with him? But I know I saw 2 ball handlers out there.

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Yeah both Manu and Quinn were out there as the shot clock ran down on Bonner...they should've immediately gone to help him as soon as he got in trouble...

I thought Bonner was worthless?

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Originally Posted by GSH

But there were a number of plays on each end of the floor where it looked like guys just didn't know where they were supposed to be on the court.

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Pop said the Spurs were now starting the season with a lighter playbook, maybe they are now adding some plays to their repertoire ?

Nice grades, my props go to Tiago, Neal based on my expectation they were the key factor, rest night for TD, TP not good and Manu there.

For me the TEAM is working, okey our defense sucks, but we can run.

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Originally Posted by ericb

i thought bonner was worthless?

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he is worthless you fat fuck!

Give TP a break...he will be better tomorrow.

I agree with mostly everything that's been said in this thread (except for Ducks' posts of course).
I thought Neal was amazing, Tiago played great, you could tell he knew he was being televised in Brazil (Tony was very good at finding him for easy baskets) and liked Quinn as well, although both Tiago and Quinn were absolutely lost on defense in a few posessions.
What concerns me is the lack of a lockdown perimeter defender. It's the second game in a row where our guards cannot stop the opposing teams guards to save their lives. Smith just killed us and we looked absolutely helpless.
I think the Lakers are a matchup nightmare for us, with a great frontcourt and Kobe behind them.

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Originally Posted by janetcn12

Give TP a break...he will be better tomorrow.

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You are future mrs ducks material for sure

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Originally Posted by vanvannen

I agree with mostly everything that's been said in this thread (except for Ducks' posts of course).
I thought Neal was amazing, Tiago played great, you could tell he knew he was being televised in Brazil (Tony was very good at finding him for easy baskets) and liked Quinn as well, although both Tiago and Quinn were absolutely lost on defense in a few posessions.
What concerns me is the lack of a lockdown perimeter defender. It's the second game in a row where our guards cannot stop the opposing teams guards to save their lives. Smith just killed us and we looked absolutely helpless.
I think the Lakers are a matchup nightmare for us, with a great frontcourt and Kobe behind him.

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Could be.

Maybe Dallas takes care of them for us though? Right now I'm pretty dang high on this Mavericks squad and think they could hang with a very underwhelming Lakers squad.

I agree, Dallas looks scary too. They are playing great and they proved they can beat us in the playoffs.

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Originally Posted by vanvannen

I agree, Dallas looks scary too. They are playing great and they proved they can beat us in the playoffs.

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I think Dallas is better than the Lakers. But I also think we match up better against Dallas than against the Lakers...so I'd rather play Big D.

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Originally Posted by Mugen

Manu deserves a B+ just for destroying Afflalo on that behind the back step back in the 4th.

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"Afflalo needed a GPS to find Manu on that play!"

Call of the night:lol

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"Afflalo needed a GPS to find Manu on that play!"

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:lol I saw that play, but I had my TV sound off... was that Sean?

If Gary Neal is capable of performances like this when NEEDED then looking at trading Hill is something the Spurs should seriously consider especially when Anderson is a keeper and should be back before the season is over, waiting to see how well he has recovered and plays is certainly expected but if all things go well some sort of trade scenario should be put in place or in the works. Enough of the undersized two guard glutton trend, let's get some size to plug on the wing or to make up for Bonner's uselessness when he gets more than 15 minutes a game.

Tiago looked pretty good, though it seemed like he was close to a defensive 3 second call on most possessions. I guess it will only take a couple for him to adjust, it just had me worried when the game was close.

I need a clarification of the 3 second rule: I know they stop counting when you're near/guarding an opposing team's player, but can multiple players on your team 'guard' the same player indefinitely in the lane? Also, does the 3 seconds reset when you place one foot out of the lane, or do you have to remove both feet? For that matter, what about half your foot?

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Originally Posted by Thompson

Tiago looked pretty good, though it seemed like he was close to a defensive 3 second call on most possessions. I guess it will only take a couple for him to adjust, it just had me worried when the game was close.

I need a clarification of the 3 second rule: I know they stop counting when you're near/guarding an opposing team's player, but can multiple players on your team 'guard' the same player indefinitely in the lane? Also, does the 3 seconds reset when you place one foot out of the lane, or do you have to remove both feet? For that matter, what about half your foot?

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per wikipedia:

defensive three-second violation, also known as illegal defense, is a rule violation in the National Basketball Association. It is assessed when a member of the defending team spends more than three seconds in the free throw lane (also known as the 16-foot lane, or colloquially as "in the paint") while not actively guarding an opponent. To be considered actively guarding, a defender must be within arm's length of an opponent and in a guarding position.[1] A three second count is suspended if:[2]
a player is in the act of shooting
there is a loss of team control
the defender is actively guarding an opponent
the defender clears the painted area
it is imminent the defender will become legal
In addition, a player guarding an opponent with the ball may be in the paint without actively guarding the opponent.[3]
The team committing a defensive three-second violation is assessed a team technical foul. The offense will receive one free throw and retains possession of the ball.[4]
Previously, any form of zone defense was considered an illegal defense violation and resulted in a warning on the first violation and then a technical free throw for any subsequent violations. In the spring of 2001 the rule was changed to its current form as part of an initiative to speed up play in the NBA.[5] The high school and college game do not use this rule.

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Originally Posted by ducks

how did manu lead the spurs to another win?

neal lead the spurs to the win

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:lmao butthurt a little?

Manu +14

parker -8

That is how Manu led this team to a victory . . . once again :lmao

Thanks. I still have trouble finding out what stops the 3 second count (half a foot out, 2 feet out, etc.).

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Originally Posted by Thompson

Thanks. I still have trouble finding out what stops the 3 second count (half a foot out, 2 feet out, etc.).

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I kinda think Ref forget this rule unless someone is screaming " 3 seconds"

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Originally Posted by Bender

:lol I saw that play, but I had my TV sound off... was that Sean?

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Oh yeah that's classic Sean

With the way everyone is playing It's going to be very difficult to find a spot for Anderson when he comes back. He could have Ime's minutes of course but thats not much.

Due to his injuries I don't see Anderson being apart of the prime playoff rotation this year. Nothing against him but when he went down it allowed other players a chance to show what they can do and they have been very impressive.

There is still a little bit of time this season of course but I just don't see where he can fit right now.

Shoot, Gary Neal is giving even Hill a run for his minutes.

Anderson will get minutes mainly at the small forward position, Manu is rough out there, he's slightly undersized in build to guard alot of them, Neal is two short, and Jefferson plays alot of PF, I can see him carving out a decent ammount of minutes as long as he comes back fairly ready to play. He takes all of Ime's minutes which are about 3 per game, 2 or 3 minutes from Manu, 3 or so from Jefferson and a couple from Neal and You have a true rookie getting 10 minutes per game, which is about what you'd expect 12 to 15 minutes if he lights things up.