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Please...as stated in other threads..this killer had political views. Some of them reflect what old Rand Pauls dad has been espousing about money.
And, as stated in other threads, there is no shred of proof his "political views," such as they may have been, played any role in his decision to attempt to assassinate Congresswoman Giffords.Quote:
Originally Posted by Duff McCartney
Most of what we know points to the simple premise that he just didn't like her because she was "fake" and had slighted him a some other constituent function in 2007. It appears that festered in his brain, over the period of years, manifesting in this insane act.
I don't know if they did or didn't. But to act like he was apolitical is simply not true. It's obvious he had political views. Rand Paul and others are being not so truthful when they say he had no political views. He did, whether they played a role in this isn't known yet. Pointing fingers isn't the right thing to do, but regardless of all that, I think it's fair to say that the vitriol from both sides is ridiculous.Quote:
Originally Posted by Yonivore
Nobody has said Loughner had no political views.Quote:
Originally Posted by Duff McCartney
In this clip, all I heard Paul say was that there is no reason to believe his political views had anything to do with Saturday's act. And, since there's no proof to the contrary, Paul makes a valid point.
I don't recall anyone from the Tea Party or the right, for that matter, jumping to the conclusion this was the work of a left-wing ideologue, pro-immigrant zealot, or terrorist.Quote:
Originally Posted by Duff McCartney
Those on the right spent most of the past 5 days trying to convince the left they were idiots for so relentlessly pursuing the "he-was-animated-by-Sarah-Palin" narrative in the face of increasingly more convincing evidence it just wasn't true.
Any vitriol from the right, over this issue, was, in my mind, born of indignation and disgust at the New York Times, Paul Krugman, Sheriff Dupnick, et. al.
Murder is not a political act. It transcends political discourse, and is only wielded by those who cant conform to civilzed society under any set of circumstances.
If you are going to tie this murder to politics, than you will have no trouble tying other killings to Ozzy Osbourne and Marilyn Manson.
And all these comparisons are deceptive, shallow, fraudulent, and ultimately they do the country a disservice.
http://www.redstate.com/neil_stevens...lefacepalm.jpgQuote:
Originally Posted by Duff McCartney
I disagree...Quote:
Originally Posted by Parker2112
Most political murders/assassins are motivated by a political ideology. That nut that took the hostages at the Discovery Channel prattled on about Al Gore's inconvenient truth.
The Puerto Rican separatists that shot up the House Chamber back in the fifties were motivated by politics.
The list is long.
And, all you have to do is look at pop culture and fashion to know that movie, music, and celebrity have an influence on people.
There is just absolutely no evidence this crime was motivated by any political ideology. All signs point to mental illness.
This guy was a 9/11 twoofer and had The Communist Manifesto on his Oprah book club list. That doesn't lead me to believe these leftist views caused him to go on a murderous rampage.
Dude obviously had some obsession with Giffords.
Funny who else shared those same views.Quote:
Originally Posted by Duff McCartney
....I don't believe for 1 minute this nut did not hear Glenn Beck daily and didn't watch Fox news!
I will contend that he was not a tea party member or conservative. Simply because everyone who i have ever encountered, that believed in such corny conspiracies, were either loony left, or leftist libertarian, or of some other influence that keeps them from having enough conservative views.Quote:
Originally Posted by Yonivore
being anti-govt and talking about the govt controlling grammar is political, if not officially registered as Repug or Dem party member/voter.
being anti-govt is inarguably in agreement with Repug and tea bagger "philosophy" of "GOVT IS THE PROBLEM" and "shrink the govt to drown (destroy) in a bath-tub.
Sorry, motherfuckers, this Jew-Dem-female-murdering political terrorist belongs to You People.
When life hands you shit, eat it.
there are only 2 things known to be certain:
1. he went on a killing spree
2. at a democratic rally filled with democrats.
Yes it was horrible. I too remember the harsh words progressives had for blue dogs.Quote:
Originally Posted by clambake
i'd like to hear about this happening in tucson.Quote:
Originally Posted by BlairForceDejuan
care to expand?
Judge Roll was a Republican.
Who said there weren't Republican constituents in the crowd.
So, really Clambake only knows one thing...and, he has a tenuous grasp on that.
you too?Quote:
Originally Posted by Yonivore
guy goes on killing spree at democratic rally.
is that correct?
Congress on your Corner wasn't a "Democratic Rally." It was a constituent forum for Representative Giffords' district -- comprised of Democrats, Republicans, and anyone else she represented.Quote:
Originally Posted by clambake
Are you suggesting Congresswoman Giffords doesn't represent or isn't interested in the views of anyone but her Democrat constituents?
I don't see her that way.
While I vehemently disagree with her position on a whole lot of issues, Obamacare being chief among them, she was pro-second amendment and shared many of my views on immigration.
I wouldn't be surprised to find her positions on those issues were informed by conservative members of her district. She seemed pretty accessible to everyone and, as is being told, was well liked on both sides of the aisle.
Not everyone thinks in partisan terms.
:lmaoQuote:
Originally Posted by Yonivore
:lol too insecure to be honest.
So, you're disrespecting Congresswoman Giffords by claiming she didn't care about the views of anyone other than her Democrat constituents?Quote:
Originally Posted by clambake
:lmao you didn't have to come back while you run away from the question.Quote:
Originally Posted by Yonivore
What question?Quote:
Originally Posted by clambake
Quote:
Originally Posted by clambake
Correct.Quote:
Originally Posted by clambake
Incorrect and, I did answer that question.Quote:
Originally Posted by clambake
your answer is incorrect. it was a democratic rally.Quote:
Originally Posted by Yonivore
you had no problem telling us how you feel about black people, but you don't have the courage to be truthful about this?
You've yet to answer my question.Quote:
Originally Posted by clambake
give us the names of the republican politicians that were to speak at the rally.
You've yet to answer my question.Quote:
Originally Posted by clambake
And, another; Can you define "rally?"
you didn't ask a question. you simply lied about the rally. you said it was bi-partisan, yet you can't tell us about the republican politicians that attended. (cuz there were none)
It was a constituent forum -- to my knowledge -- Congresswoman Giffords was there to meet and have a dialogue with those she represents. I don't know that their was an agenda or scheduled speakers.Quote:
Originally Posted by clambake
Do you know otherwise?
yep, i know it was a democratic rally. you appear to be the only person that doesn't.Quote:
Originally Posted by Yonivore
So, you're disrespecting Congresswoman Giffords by claiming she didn't care about the views of anyone other than her Democrat constituents?Quote:
Originally Posted by clambake
That's called a question.
I never said it was bi-partisan. I said it was a constituent forum. Her district isn't exclusively Democrat.
tell me when i said that. be specific.Quote:
Originally Posted by Yonivore
nope, its an allegation in a shitty form of a question.Quote:
That's called a question.
why haven't we heard from all the republicans attending?Quote:
I never said it was bi-partisan. I said it was a constituent forum. Her district isn't exclusively Democrat.
You called it a Democratic Rally when the Congresswoman's office clearly called it a "Congress on your Corner" constituent forum. Your characterization implies she excluded non-Democrat constituents from her event. Theirs does not.Quote:
Originally Posted by clambake
I'd say that was disrespectful.
Or, you could have just called it what it was, a rhetorical question. So, and this is the real question, is the Congresswoman's staff lying about the purpose of that event?Quote:
Originally Posted by clambake
One of them is dead and unavailable to call you. Plus, I'm not sure you're in their Rolodex...maybe you should call the Tucson media and let them know you're expecting a roster of attendees and their party affiliations.Quote:
Originally Posted by clambake
show me where i said she excluded anyone. anyone. why have you failed to do this?Quote:
Originally Posted by Yonivore
yep, you shouldn't make up things like that. i guess its better than stealing others words, however.Quote:
I'd say that was disrespectful.
what would she be lying about?Quote:
Or, you could have just called it what it was, a rhetorical question. So, and this is the real question, is the Congresswoman's staff lying about the purpose of that event?
why don't you just tell us about all these republicans eyewitness statements?Quote:
One of them is dead and unavailable to call you. Plus, I'm not sure you're in their Rolodex...maybe you should call the Tucson media and let them know you're expecting a roster of attendees and their party affiliations.
or don't you have any?
sorry yoni, that last question wasn't fair.
if there were any, fox would be running it on a loop.
Rand Paul wishes this kid were black.
...petered out
Really? Here's Jared in his own words. Can you tell me what his political views were because all I hear are the incoherent thoughts of a paraniod schizophrenic.Quote:
Originally Posted by Duff McCartney
It's not obvious, at all. But, even if he did, where's your evidence those view animated his actions last week?Quote:
Originally Posted by Duff McCartney
And, then, where's your evidence those views were informed by the SaraPAC ad, Ms. Palin, specifically, or anyone else in the Tea Party?
When did I ever say it did? I just think it's untrue to paint this guy as being apolitical when his views say other wise.Quote:
Originally Posted by Yonivore
But political speech never can, right?Quote:
Originally Posted by Yonivore
Hypocrite.
I never suggested he was apolitical, although he may be; what I've said is there is absolutely no shred of proof his political views -- whatever they may or may not be -- had anything to do with his actions on Saturday. Period.Quote:
Originally Posted by Duff McCartney
And, as such, the non-stop media barrage, fueled by Dupnik, et. al., that somehow the massacre was related to, or caused by, any alleged vitriolic and rancorous political missives of the Tea Party or Sarah Palin are either libelous or opportunistic. Take your pick because, it's one of the two.
They can't of been mistaken; otherwise, they would have acceded to the growing and overwhelming evidence that Loughner acted out of mental illness and stopped the unfounded assertions. They didn't. Hell, there are still people in here that pretend his actions had something to do with politics.
That's what I've been saying. That's what everyone who recognizes the pathetic, yet concerted, effort of the left to libel the Tea Party, has been saying for the past week.
To me I think you're both wrong. Whatever any leftist says that the Tea Party is to blame, and you for generalizing the entire left as slandering the Tea Party.Quote:
Originally Posted by Yonivore
To be fair I'm a devout liberal, but I haven't accused a single Tea Party member of being responsible for any of what happened. Do I belittle Sarah Palin? Absolutely. But that's different from making her responsible for any of this.
However I do agree with a majority of what people on both sides of the political spectrum have been saying, and most of those have been liberals, that we need to tone down the vitriol on both sides. I do not agree, and this is where I mock Sarah Palin and others like her, that toning down the vitriol is somehow code word for censoring conservative thought. I think it's stupid for people like her or any leader to act and speak as though the end is nigh and soon we'll need to load up our guns and take action.
She may not say it in so many words, but her tone and the tone of others on both sides reflect that idea.
phaggot should have just stfu, done his homework, and paid people in gold bullions. It really is amazing he did not shoot up that school.