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Oh Gee's point is that if everyone who was committing these crimes ran into someone trained to use a gun properly - like a CHL holder - these might be the results.Quote:
Originally Posted by Yonivore
With that in mind I don't know why he's opposed to this law.
And, yet, you still head out on the road.Quote:
Originally Posted by DMX7
If the restrictions to get a drivers license were as strict as those to get a CHL then you'd have less deaths on the road.Quote:
Originally Posted by DMX7
So considering cars kill far more people than guns in this nation each year I wonder when we can expect the people who are anti gun to take the on the crusade of removing cars from campus.
Feelings of opposition to this type of law are as reactionary as they get, IMO. I realize that to most people guns are scary (and there should be an appropriate fear of them of course) but a little education on the subject and perspective can go a long way.
guns on campus? Yeah BABY!
Most of my friends have CHLs and I trust every one of them with their weapon. I personally don't but that's because I don't feel like I need a firearm everywhere I go, just in my house.
However, being a college student is one of the most stressful occupations in the world, especially around finals time. I've seen people throw their books and binders after walking out of a test... now granted that is a far cry from shooting someone but my point is obvious.
My other major concern is who is going to check to make sure the people who have a firearm on campus have a CHL? If no one and the sight of a weapon on campus is commonplace then yes, I do believe criminals are looking forward to this law. How easy would it be for some scumbag to rape a girl at gunpoint on campus during the middle of the night? Again, another fringe example but my point is clear.
And the other obvious concern are parties. I don't even need to come up with a worst case scenario it should be blatantly obvious. My biggest fear would come with drama with relationships + alcohol + knowledge of a nearby weapon... and not necessarily from the CHL holder.
Can you present your case against it with facts or are you simply going to be reactionary and say "guns are bad"?Quote:
Originally Posted by George Gervin's Afro
I have no problem with law-abiding adults packing heat. It's not too big a deal for college campuses IMO though; I think it's much more important that HS teachers should be able to legally carry, assuming the usual CHL standard plus the restriction that the weapon must be kept on one's body and concealed at all times (you don't want students knowing who is packing and where to steal the teacher's gun from). Blaming guns for the crime in this nation is incredibly lazy, and lets our "everything for me, I could give a shit about you" culture off the hook.
You are required to carry the CHL when you're carrying.Quote:
Originally Posted by Vici
No more or less easy than it is now.Quote:
Originally Posted by Vici
I would wager handgun violence at college parties would not increase.Quote:
Originally Posted by Vici
:rollin:rollin:rollinQuote:
Originally Posted by Vici
You can't really have parties on campus though; aren't dorms pretty much alcohol free now? No way you could have ever had parties with alcohol out in the open at my school. You'd really have to scrap private ownerships of guns period to address that situation.Quote:
Originally Posted by Vici
Anecdotes are fine and you yourself acknowledge the two situation are completely different. Can you point to situations where college students who are currently CHL holders have committed crimes due to the increased stress and where those crimes have involved firearms? Furthermore, how do those stats compare to the non CHL holding public?Quote:
Originally Posted by Vici
How is this even a legitimate concern? Has the passing of the CHL laws in Texas made guns commonplace everywhere you go? Has this been an issue anywhere else?Quote:
My other major concern is who is going to check to make sure the people who have a firearm on campus have a CHL? If no one and the sight of a weapon on campus is commonplace then yes, I do believe criminals are looking forward to this law. How easy would it be for some scumbag to rape a girl at gunpoint on campus during the middle of the night? Again, another fringe example but my point is clear.
Once again your point is absolutely clear but its also completely invalid. You're only serving to prove my point that the fears to this are completely reactionary and not grounded in reality. I somehow doubt that the passing of this law is going to suddenly increase the applications for CHLs to the point of making guns commonplace on campus
Once again, how often are CHL holders committing crimes such as your worst case scenario and how does it compare to the general public? We can all imagine a worst case scenario for nearly everything we deal with on a daily basis but if thats the way we governed and lived then we'd never leave the house.Quote:
And the other obvious concern are parties. I don't even need to come up with a worst case scenario it should be blatantly obvious. My biggest fear would come with drama with relationships + alcohol + knowledge of a nearby weapon... and not necessarily from the CHL holder.
Show that there is a legitimate concern with actual facts please.
Obviously but who is going to check to make sure? Who is to stop the kids who don't have a CHL from bringing guns to class?Quote:
Originally Posted by Yonivore
Sure it will be. If the sight of weapons on campus is commonplace, would it be easier or harder for a non-CHL carrying criminal to bring a gun to class?Quote:
No more or less easy than it is now.
Maybe, maybe not but why risk it? If there is no need then why bother?Quote:
I would wager handgun violence at college parties would not increase.
Went to UTSA huh?Quote:
Originally Posted by johnsmith
You don't see concealed handguns, which I think is one of the best reasons to support CHL laws. I'd never agree to open carry, since any criminal can assume you're not likely to be packing if he can't see your weapon.Quote:
Originally Posted by Vici
Never worked for a living huh?Quote:
Originally Posted by Vici
However, being a college student is one of the most stressful occupations in the world
LOL
Whats to stop them now?Quote:
Originally Posted by Vici
Where the hell is it commonplace to see random citizens carrying guns NOW? How is this even a legitimate concern of yours?Quote:
Sure it will be. If the sight of weapons on campus is commonplace, would it be easier or harder for a non-CHL carrying criminal to bring a gun to class?
I don't think Vici understands how concealed handgun laws work.
Not a big deal either way imo.
I know when I was in school they stopped me a good five or six times a day to check if I had a gun with me.........I mean, I saw so many people with a pistol in tucked into their flip flops, I don't see why they wouldn't.Quote:
Originally Posted by MannyIsGod
But then again, I was in Colorado, and it was after Columbine, so you can see why they were so nervous.
Especially with college being one of the most stressful "occupations" in the world.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MannyIsGod
How or where would I find those stats? You know as well as I do that there isn't something out there where I can find stats like that.
Commonplace was bad word usage because truth is it doesn't have to be commonplace. If I see a person carrying a firearm I assume they have a CHL as opposed to not. And why would I think differently? The fact that guns are allowed on campus makes it easier for anyone and everyone to have guns on campus, legal or not.Quote:
How is this even a legitimate concern? Has the passing of the CHL laws in Texas made guns commonplace everywhere you go? Has this been an issue anywhere else?
The thing is my worst case scenarios aren't far fetched at all. Guns present make violence much easier.Quote:
Once again, how often are CHL holders committing crimes such as your worst case scenario and how does it compare to the general public? We can all imagine a worst case scenario for nearly everything we deal with on a daily basis but if thats the way we governed and lived then we'd never leave the house.
Show that there is a legitimate concern with actual facts please.
It happened in a private household and not a college campus, so it has nothing to do with campus security. but if you wanna spin, go ahead.Quote:
Originally Posted by Yonivore
So you're saying carrying a gun is always completely concealed? No bulge under a shirt or belt?Quote:
Originally Posted by MannyIsGod