Re: Does Manu driving into the paint constitute a post game?
[QUOTE=Kobe_5_Duncan_4;5056131]L
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et's start with the premise that you are coming from a Duncan taint licking POV, which forces you to make excuses for his inability to actually play the low post position. This puts you in face save mode and because you fancy yourself to be a wordsmith you think you can rationalize idiotic basketball fallacies. :lmao
:cry
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Does guard penetration have the ability to break down a defense and force reactions? Of course. But that was never the question. It was whether relying on this type of play can take the place of a low post game and it can't.
Never stated that. I said they have similar effects, but also recognized they are not completely the same. And I do contend that a team with a great penetrator (or two) can win an NBA title if they're complemented by a defensive frontline, who can control the boards and defend the paint. It's not an absolutely essential need for a team to have a dominant low-post scorer to win an NBA championship. Bill Russell's Celtics kinda proved that theory by winning a few championships despite not having a consistent post-option to rely on. So did the repeat Pistons. So, yeah, I guess I do believe that a great penetration/perimeter game complemented by a good defensive frontline can replace an interior post-game. Prove me wrong.
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Spurs drive with the intention of kicking the ball out for a low percentage shot: the 3p ball, hence the 3p chucking label. You have a slew of 3p shooters camping out 23 feet and beyond for most of the game. Which is why the Spurs have one of the lowest points-in-the-paint totals in the league. These "high percentage shots" are a figment of your Duncan-loving imagination.
No, aside from specific plays called, Parker and Manu look to finish first at the rim and if the shot is not there, they'll kick it out.
Their points in the paint total is soooooooo bad that it ranks 13th (not one of "the lowest points-in-the-paint totals in the league") in the league and is merely 2.5 points behind the Lakers. Like I've told your self-proclaimed "Basketball Guru" ass over and over again, the Spurs offense isn't their problem. It's the fact they will get killed on the boards against a team like LA, and because of Duncan's decline and the lack of a second defensive big, their interior defense is weak, and does indeed rank near the bottom of the list at number 20.
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Last night you guys even tried to chuck your way back into the game when you were down big in Miami. It was funny.
Glad you got a laugh. But you still don't know shit about basketball.
Re: Does Manu driving into the paint constitute a post game?
I wonder if KobeCinco_TimQuatro was taken . . .
Re: Does Manu driving into the paint constitute a post game?
[QUOTE=Kobe_5_Duncan_4;5056131]L
Quote:
et's start with the premise that you are coming from a Duncan taint licking POV, which forces you to make excuses for his inability to actually play the low post position. This puts you in face save mode and because you fancy yourself to be a wordsmith you think you can rationalize idiotic basketball fallacies. :lmao
:cry
Quote:
Does guard penetration have the ability to break down a defense and force reactions? Of course. But that was never the question. It was whether relying on this type of play can take the place of a low post game and it can't.
Never stated that. I said they have similar effects, but also recognized they are not completely the same. And I do contend that a team with a great penetrator (or two) can win an NBA title if they're complemented by a defensive frontline, who can control the boards and defend the paint. It's not an absolutely essential need for a team to have a dominant low-post scorer to win an NBA championship. Bill Russell's Celtics kinda proved that theory by winning a few championships despite not having a consistent post-option to rely on. So did the repeat Pistons. As did the '04 Pistons. As did the '08 Celtics (and no, KG is not a great low-poster scorer). And I would like to see how much Jordan slashed/drove as compared to going to the post during his first 3 peat. During the second 3 peat, he definitely looked to post up his man more, but I suspect he slashed more than posted up during the early 90s. So, yeah, I guess I do believe that a very good/great penetration/perimeter game complemented by a very good/great defensive frontline can replace an interior post-game. Prove me wrong. My proof: Russell's Celtics, the repeat Pistons, the '04 Pistons, and the '08 Celtics.
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Spurs drive with the intention of kicking the ball out for a low percentage shot: the 3p ball, hence the 3p chucking label. You have a slew of 3p shooters camping out 23 feet and beyond for most of the game. Which is why the Spurs have one of the lowest points-in-the-paint totals in the league. These "high percentage shots" are a figment of your Duncan-loving imagination.
No, aside from specific plays called, Parker and Manu look to finish first at the rim and if the shot is not there, they'll kick it out.
Their points in the paint total is soooooooo bad that it ranks 13th (not one of "the lowest points-in-the-paint totals in the league") in the league and is merely 2.5 points behind the Lakers. Like I've told your self-proclaimed "Basketball Guru" ass over and over again, the Spurs offense isn't their problem. It's the fact they will get killed on the boards against a team like LA, and because of Duncan's decline and the lack of a second defensive big, their interior defense is weak, and does indeed rank near the bottom of the list at number 20.
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Last night you guys even tried to chuck your way back into the game when you were down big in Miami. It was funny.
Glad you got a laugh. But you still don't know shit about basketball.
Re: Does Manu driving into the paint constitute a post game?
And what the fuck is he talking about me "making excuses for Duncan's inability to play the low-post position?" Does this moron even read what he writes?
First of all, Duncan is still able to play the low-post position, just not at a consistently elite level anymore. Furthermore, the Lakers interior defense is perfectly suited to shut down Duncan at this point in his career. Hell, even at his peak, the combination of Bynum and Gasol would make him work for every point. Congratulations, you have a great frontline. That doesn't mean Duncan is unable to play the post, and it sure as hell doesn't lead to "me making excuses for his inability to play the post," whatever the hell that means. Lol.
Re: Does Manu driving into the paint constitute a post game?
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Originally Posted by
Blackjack
I wonder if KobeCinco_TimQuatro was taken . . .
Simply another indictment of history2b's lack of intelligence.
Too bad the guy looks up to Kobe Bryant and not Budd Dwyer.
Re: Does Manu driving into the paint constitute a post game?
And this faggot still can't explain how the Spurs are a "3 point chucking team" when they average a whopping 2.5 more 3 point attempts a game. Also worth mentioning is that the Spurs average a higher Free throw-to-field goal-attempted ratio than the Lakers. You'd think that the Spurs, "a jump shooting/3 point chucking team" should be nowhere near the Lakers, who supposedly live in the interior, in that stat.
The Spurs' problem is the interior defense. Their offense is fine.
Re: Does Manu driving into the paint constitute a post game?
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Originally Posted by
midnightpulp
Their offense is fine.
Yeah, they've been scoring at will.
Re: Does Manu driving into the paint constitute a post game?
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Originally Posted by
wontstartdumbthreads
Yeah, they've been scoring at will.
Sometimes you get shutdown. It happens. No need to mash the panic button in that regard. More concerning than scoring 80 against the Heat and 83 against the Lakers is letting the likes of Detroit, Sacramento, and an injured Houston break 100 points.
Re: Does Manu driving into the paint constitute a post game?
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Originally Posted by
midnightpulp
Sometimes you get shutdown. It happens. No need to mash the panic button in that regard. More concerning than scoring 80 against the Heat and 83 against the Lakers is letting the likes of Detroit, Sacramento, and an injured Houston break 100 points.
No doubt the lack of defense is more troubling. But without the strong low post game needed to grind it out through the playoffs, I wouldn't say the offense is fine. It's fine for the regular season and for getting HCA but not a title.
Re: Does Manu driving into the paint constitute a post game?
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Originally Posted by
wontstartdumbthreads
No doubt the lack of defense is more troubling. But without the strong low post game needed to grind it out through the playoffs, I wouldn't say the offense is fine. It's fine for the regular season and for getting HCA but not a title.
If they can't consistently win playoff games scoring around 90 points a game, then they have no business being there in the first place. And I'm pretty confident this team will be able to average 90 a game against the elite teams, problem is, they'll probably let the other team average a 100.
And Duncan's low post game is still above average, it just looks like shit against the Lakers, who have the best interior defense in the league, or at the very least, the best interior defense against a player like Duncan. Perimeter oriented bigs with athleticism like Bosh and Aldrige do much better against them.
Re: Does Manu driving into the paint constitute a post game?
Tim's post game is still amongst the best in the league. But you're absolutely right that judging him against the likes of a Lakers team is moronic. Great length and size combined with better mobility = not good for Duncan.
But it's not like they throw the rock to him consistently inside. The Spurs are attacking the Lakers in a completely different way - much more perimeter and pick-and-roll oriented. Tim's been left with sparse opportunities and largely left to take the jumper.
Tim's always been a rhythm player and the older you get, especially for a post player, the more touches/consistency you need. The trick becomes knowing how to get the best from the individual in the confines of a team - Patrick Ewing could have still put up numbers at the tail end of his career had he been fed similarly to his prime years, his teams just would have been blown out the gym on a nightly basis.
But Tim's still an elite post player, he's just not the Tim Duncan we've known on this championship run.
And I agree about the offense being fine. The Spurs are having their best offensive season since 94-95. Offense ain't the problem. It's all about the D. Spurs have won 4 titles with a less potent offense, their D was just light years ahead of this outfit.
Spurs have to close that gap or it's lights out. ... And h2b could learn a lot from Mr. Dwyer. ;)
Re: Does Manu driving into the paint constitute a post game?
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Originally Posted by
Blackjack
Tim's post game is still amongst the best in the league. But you're absolutely right that judging him against the likes of a Lakers team is moronic. Great length and size combined with better mobility = not good for Duncan.
But it's not like they throw the rock to him consistently inside. The Spurs are attacking the Lakers in a completely different way - much more perimeter and pick-and-roll oriented. Tim's been left with sparse opportunities and largely left to take the jumper.
Tim's always been a rhythm player and the older you get, especially for a post player, the more touches/consistency you need. The trick becomes knowing how to get the best from the individual in the confines of a team - Patrick Ewing could have still put up numbers at the tail end of his career had he been fed similarly to his prime years, his teams just would have been blown out the gym on a nightly basis.
But Tim's still an elite post player, he's just not the Tim Duncan we've known on this championship run.
And I agree about the offense being fine. The Spurs are having their best offensive season since 94-95. Offense ain't the problem. It's all about the D. Spurs have won 4 titles with a less potent offense, their D was just light years ahead of this outfit.
Spurs have to close that gap or it's lights out. ... And h2b could learn a lot from Mr. Dwyer. ;)
:tu
As for the last point, we can only hope. :lol
