Plan A: The Spurs Simple Summer Strategy

Typically at this time of year, the Spurs are on the phones trying to woo free agents while simultaneously pondering major trades. This summer, however, is different. Even after the disappointing end to the 2012 playoff run, I don't think the Spurs need to do anything drastic. In fact, I think Plan A is rather straightforward.

1. Agree with Duncan on a ballpark figure. There's no rush to hammer out specifics right this second. For example, both sides could say something around $11 million per season will be adequate and leave it at that for now.

2. Contact Boris Diaw's agent. Aggressively try to finalize an agreement. Next to Duncan, Diaw is the most important piece because without him, the Spurs would be left without a player capable at starting at power forward. Yes, Diaw has flaws but he fits and there's a chance he can be inked to a reasonable deal.

3. Figure out what it's going to take to convince Erazem Lorbek to sign. Lorbek is the next most important piece because the Spurs need a backup power forward after Matt Bonner flamed out again. Since he can only negotiate with the Spurs if he wants to come to the NBA, he's another player who might be relatively inexpensive. While there are other bigmen on the open market, Lorbek's skillset is a fit and the Spurs could wrap up negotiations quickly.

4. Allow Danny Green to set his market value. It's a little bit risky because a team may get desperate and throw a lot of money at him but that's pretty unlikely. Once the market is set, the preference from San Antonio's end would be to give him a multi-year contract starting at about $3 million. While the Spurs can be patient here, they shouldn't let it drag on too long. Eventually, a team could convince themselves that Green is worth the effort to try to steal.

5. Complete the deal with Duncan. By this time, the Spurs should have a good idea of how much they can pay him without going too far into the lux tax.

6. Select a backup point guard. Patrick Mills and Nando De Colo are the two leading options. If the Spurs have given up on Cory Joseph, signing both of those players is a possibility. The Spurs need a backup point guard but the Spurs don't need to act desperately. They have time to see what Mills is offered elsewhere, scout De Colo even closer and see if any veteran PG falls through the cracks.

If the Spurs can successfully complete the first six steps of Plan A, their depth chart would look like this:

Centers
Tim Duncan
Tiago Splitter

Power Forwards
Boris Diaw
Erazem Lorbek

Small Forwards
Kawhi Leonard
Stephen Jackson

Shooting Guards
Manu Ginobili
Danny Green

Point Guards
Tony Parker
Patrick Mills (or Nando De Colo or a cheap veteran)

7. Decide what to do with Gary Neal and DeJuan Blair. Both are on cheap deals and are thus valuable to the team. The problem is that Neal may be overqualified to be the fifth guard and Blair may be overqualified to be the fifth bigman. However, given the long season, the advanced age of key players and their experience in the system, the Spurs may opt to keep both players.

8. Get rid of Matt Bonner. This is just something that has to be done. Yeah, he'd help you win regular season games but the time has come to remove him. He can't handle playoff pressure; it's indisputable at this point. Either amnesty him or salary dump him somewhere. Hypothetically the Spurs could keep him around as extreme depth but his salary is too high for such a role. Goodbye, Matty.

9. Add a project bigman. The Spurs need to make room on the roster for a project big -- preferably a center -- with some sort of athleticism. Being able to block shots and run the floor is a bonus. It'd also be nice if he is eligible to be sent to the Toros. This isn't a huge need obviously but the Spurs need this type of player somewhere in their pipeline.

10. Fill out the rest of the roster with youth and players with upside. The Spurs don't need any end of the bench veterans. Between the Big 3 and Stephen Jackson, the Spurs have the leadership and the veteran know-how.




It looks easy on paper. Let's hope it proves to be easy in real life. However, if something goes wrong, that could create a domino effect of chaos. At that point, the Spurs may have to change course and start looking elsewhere. Hopefully it doesn't come to that.

I know this question is coming: Do these moves make the Spurs a championship contender? Personally, I think they are longshots to begin with but I actually like the resulting roster this plan would create. It's deep, versatile and has a relatively high ceiling. The Spurs could go a splashier route but I think it'd be unnecessary. This plan allows the Spurs to compete while also building for the future and keeping the books clean of any toxic contracts.

In other words, the more boring this summer, the better.

I commend you for being that eloquent so early in the morning.
Just an exceptional write up, thoroughly enjoyed reading this.

Have a great day.

Nice write up LJ. Thanks

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Originally Posted by timvp

3. Figure out what it's going to take to convince Erazem Lorbek to sign. Lorbek is the next most important piece because the Spurs need a backup power forward after Matt Bonner flamed out again. Since he can only negotiate with the Spurs if he wants to come to the NBA, he's another player who might be relatively inexpensive. While there are other bigmen on the open market, Lorbek's skillset is a fit and the Spurs could wrap up negotiations quickly.

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I agree with almost everything in your post. Nice work as usual.

I'm dubious about their chances to bring Lorbek over. Assuming that Diaw takes all or most of the MLE, then Lorbek would have to sign for the BAE. I just don't see him signing a 2yr/4M contract. I hope I'm wrong.

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Originally Posted by Mel_13

I agree with almost everything in your post. Nice work as usual.

I'm dubious about their chances to bring Lorbek over. Assuming that Diaw takes all or most of the MLE, then Lorbek would have to sign for the BAE. I just don't see him signing a 2yr/4M contract. I hope I'm wrong.

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I too share that concern.

I just hope he becomes possessed
by the spirit of superior competition,
sure he can keep dominating scrubs
for far more money.. but there's no
light like the limelight.

Yeah, the big issue is to be able to sign both Diaw and Lorbek. If Spurs can do it, then "plan A" is a very solid plan.

If you look closely at a picture of Lorbek,
he kind of looks like an unholy combination of Jim Carrey & Kevin Spacey.

Spurs won't amnesty Bonner, and it's a shame. I'm sure if they did a team with caproom like the Raptors would bid at least 1/3rd of his pay to get him, letting the Spurs off the hook for that much.

But the Spurs would rather lose with Bonner than win without him I'm afraid.

For the other guys:

Anything over 3 a year for Green would be a mistake, but even then I wouldn't be that thrilled to see him back. He disappeared in the WCF so bad I don't even care if he's kept for 3 a year. Stephen Jackson at that age never shrank so small. I'd be fine with a 3-man wing rotation of Kawhi, Jackson, and Manu with either Neal or De Colo as the fourth. In the regular season there'd still be other bodies to throw in at the 2 (like Scrubby Josesph smallball or Denmon or whoever) for games when Manu needs rest.

I wouldn't cry too hard if Diaw left either. In the biggest games, he disappears. He did it game 6 of the WCF in 2012. He likewise disappeared for the Suns in game 6 against the Spurs in 07, he was nowhere to be found coming off the one game suspension. Can he be a nice contributor in the regular season or in non-pressure games in the playoffs? Yes. But he's non-entity if the Spurs are up against the wall when trying to win another title.

I'd like to see De Colo. Interested to see if his defense has improved.

Lorbek I'm in for, though I'm not expecting much. But if it was a choice between him and Diaw, I think I'd go for Lorbek as the devil I don't know over Boris.

Blair can leave too if he's not going to drop the 40 pounds that he's added since being drafted.

A shot in dark, but in your honest opinions..

How many points & assists do you think De Colo will
average at the end of the 2012-2013 season?
Many people thought because Rubio's numbers were
declining in Europe, that he wouldn't translate well, but
he did. Not saying De Colo is as good, but hopefully
his situation will be similar, because his numbers don't impress.

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Originally Posted by Mel_13

I agree with almost everything in your post. Nice work as usual.

I'm dubious about their chances to bring Lorbek over. Assuming that Diaw takes all or most of the MLE, then Lorbek would have to sign for the BAE. I just don't see him signing a 2yr/4M contract. I hope I'm wrong.

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I don't understand. I thought the Spurs were going to sign Diaw and Lorbek before finalizing Duncan's contract? Doesn't that mean they'll be using their cap room to sign them, not cap exceptions?

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Originally Posted by Uriel

I don't understand. I thought the Spurs were going to sign Diaw and Lorbek before finalizing Duncan's contract? Doesn't that mean they'll be using their cap room to sign them, not cap exceptions?

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They have no cap room. They only have exceptions.

actually i rather spend the MLE on Rashard Lewis than on Boris Diaw, if we could get him to a good form and will i think he's fit this team better and more what the team need(we could amnesty Bonner and replace him with an upgrad version), then if it still remain a possibility i would bring Erazem Lorbek from Europe.
so that will give us starting front line of Tim Duncan and Rashard Lewis and of the bench a strong combination of Tiago Splitter and Erazem Lorbek.

james anderson is insurance if green walks for more money...

Agree in general, except.

3. Predictably, since Messina was back with CSKA, they are making offers. Messina had Lorbek before and it worked out quite well.
I wouldn't be surprised if he stays in Europe.

4. 3 M /year is absolute maximum for Green.

6. Backup PG. Mills, DeColo is largely untested, and it seems to me a bit slow for the NBA pace. He needs another good year possibly with some tough Euroleague competition.

7. Decide what to do with Gary Neal and DeJuan Blair.
They won't move neal until the Green issue is set.
They coulnd't get a first rounder for Blair. He's cheap. He's more likely to be on board than Bonner.

8. Get rid of Matt Bonner.
This might come at a cost. I don't think amnesty, though.


General outlook is very good. Spurs will be again playing great basketball.
In the RS.

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3. Figure out what it's going to take to convince Erazem Lorbek to sign. Lorbek is the next most important piece because the Spurs need a backup power forward after Matt Bonner flamed out again. Since he can only negotiate with the Spurs if he wants to come to the NBA, he's another player who might be relatively inexpensive. While there are other bigmen on the open market, Lorbek's skillset is a fit and the Spurs could wrap up negotiations quickly.

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Lorbek-- Another candy ass bigman who can't rebound or block shots. This is getting to be a recurring theme. And people wonder why they struggle against physical teams. Sorry, I'll pass on the "softer" version of Splitter.

The Spurs made most of their moves in odd numbered off seasons (2009 trade for Jefferson, which didn't pan out but they turned old Bowen/Oberto/Thomas into Stephen Jackson, fwiw, turning Hill into Leonard/Lorbek/Bertans (Leonard alone makes the trade worth it)).

You don't blow up a roster that was two games from the Finals. You simply get rid of the superfluous parts and weakest links.

Another well-written comprehensive summary.

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Originally Posted by timvp

7. Decide what to do with Gary Neal and DeJuan Blair. Both are on cheap deals and are thus valuable to the team. The problem is that Neal may be overqualified to be the fifth guard and Blair may be overqualified to be the fifth bigman. However, given the long season, the advanced age of key players and their experience in the system, the Spurs may opt to keep both players.

8. Get rid of Matt Bonner. This is just something that has to be done. Yeah, he'd help you win regular season games but the time has come to remove him. He can't handle playoff pressure; it's indisputable at this point. Either amnesty him or salary dump him somewhere. Hypothetically the Spurs could keep him around as extreme depth but his salary is too high for such a role. Goodbye, Matty.

9. Add a project bigman. The Spurs need to make room on the roster for a project big -- preferably a center -- with some sort of athleticism. Being able to block shots and run the floor is a bonus. It'd also be nice if he is eligible to be sent to the Toros. This isn't a huge need obviously but the Spurs need this type of player somewhere in their pipeline.

10. Fill out the rest of the roster with youth and players with upside. The Spurs don't need any end of the bench veterans. Between the Big 3 and Stephen Jackson, the Spurs have the leadership and the veteran know-how.

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I have full confidence the Spurs will accomplish the first six objectives. It's the aforementioned last four objectives that will seemingly be much harder to accomplish and that really concern me. Needless to say, it's essential that the youth movement and talent upgrades around the Big Three need to continue.

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Originally Posted by timvp

9. Add a project bigman. The Spurs need to make room on the roster for a project big -- preferably a center -- with some sort of athleticism. Being able to block shots and run the floor is a bonus. It'd also be nice if he is eligible to be sent to the Toros. This isn't a huge need obviously but the Spurs need this type of player somewhere in their pipeline.

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Henry Sims seems to have all these attributes.

Other than amnesty, I'd be curious to hear the Bonner-Exodus strategies.

Sounds good to me. If the Spurs pull all this off and stay healthy, there is a good chance they win a lot of games and make another deep playoff run. At this point in Duncan/Manu/Parker era that would be considered a very successful season.

I think Diaw just getting back to basketball shape will be a big upgrade. I still think Pop needs to go with a mainly a 3 big man rotation. I am not sure who's the odd man out but if it's Splitter I think they're better of trading him.

The Spurs won't even make it to the WCF with the approach of staying basically with the same core. Timvp even said this past year was the "Last stand" before the playoffs, now next year is the new Last Stand.


Other teams will be making changes and improving. Everything fell right for the Spurs getting the top seed, good playoff matchups and staying injury free and they still could not get to the finals. Could not get past the first real playoff challenger.


The same core team has not made it to the finals in 5 years.

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Originally Posted by kobyz

actually i rather spend the MLE on Rashard Lewis than on Boris Diaw, if we could get him to a good form and will i think he's fit this team better and more what the team need(we could amnesty Bonner and replace him with an upgrad version), then if it still remain a possibility i would bring Erazem Lorbek from Europe.
so that will give us starting front line of Tim Duncan and Rashard Lewis and of the bench a strong combination of Tiago Splitter and Erazem Lorbek.

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Fuck that i would rather spend the MLE on Michael Beasley, Ersan Ilyasova or Nicolas Batum.

If they can pull those moves I don't really even care if they can be contenders or not... that would be a great roster to watch what's looking like the last year of the farewell tour...

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Originally Posted by Duncan2177

Fuck that i would rather spend the MLE on Michael Beasley, Ersan Ilyasova or Nicolas Batum.

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Lmao Batum for the MLE

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Originally Posted by T Park

Lmao Batum for the MLE

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Michael Beasley or Ersan Ilyasova

With the way the market seems to be shaping up, I highly doubt Ersan can be had for just the full MLE. I remember a few months ago thinking that would be high for him but :wow at some of the offers supposedly going around.

Anyone heard anything new on Ryan Richards? Thinking he would be the perfect fit for timvp's #9 a project big man. Also wouldn't he be eligible to go down to the toros and develop his game?

I agree with each point. I especially embrace these 6 action items.

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Originally Posted by timvp

2. Contact Boris Diaw's agent. Aggressively try to finalize an agreement. Next to Duncan, Diaw is the most important piece because without him, the Spurs would be left without a player capable at starting at power forward. Yes, Diaw has flaws but he fits and there's a chance he can be inked to a reasonable deal.

3. Figure out what it's going to take to convince Erazem Lorbek to sign. Lorbek is the next most important piece because the Spurs need a backup power forward after Matt Bonner flamed out again. Since he can only negotiate with the Spurs if he wants to come to the NBA, he's another player who might be relatively inexpensive. While there are other bigmen on the open market, Lorbek's skillset is a fit and the Spurs could wrap up negotiations quickly.

7. Decide what to do with Gary Neal and DeJuan Blair. Both are on cheap deals and are thus valuable to the team. The problem is that Neal may be overqualified to be the fifth guard and Blair may be overqualified to be the fifth bigman. However, given the long season, the advanced age of key players and their experience in the system, the Spurs may opt to keep both players.

8. Get rid of Matt Bonner. This is just something that has to be done. Yeah, he'd help you win regular season games but the time has come to remove him. He can't handle playoff pressure; it's indisputable at this point. Either amnesty him or salary dump him somewhere. Hypothetically the Spurs could keep him around as extreme depth but his salary is too high for such a role. Goodbye, Matty.
http://www.filmsavior.com/wp-content...0/SlowClap.gif

9. Add a project bigman. The Spurs need to make room on the roster for a project big -- preferably a center -- with some sort of athleticism. Being able to block shots and run the floor is a bonus. It'd also be nice if he is eligible to be sent to the Toros. This isn't a huge need obviously but the Spurs need this type of player somewhere in their pipeline.

10. Fill out the rest of the roster with youth and players with upside. The Spurs don't need any end of the bench veterans. Between the Big 3 and Stephen Jackson, the Spurs have the leadership and the veteran know-how.

---

The only reason not to go after Lorbek would be if the Spurs can work a trade that would bring in an interior defender.

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Originally Posted by rascal

The Spurs won't even make it to the WCF with the approach of staying basically with the same core. Timvp even said this past year was the "Last stand" before the playoffs, now next year is the new Last Stand.

Other teams will be making changes and improving. Everything fell right for the Spurs getting the top seed, good playoff matchups and staying injury free and they still could not get to the finals. Could not get past the first real playoff challenger.

The same core team has not made it to the finals in 5 years.

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^ This.

It's true. Many of the Western Conference teams are getting better. Heck, event the top team, OKC, a team that is already young, long and athletic, has just gotter even younger, longer and more athletic with the addition of PJIII.

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Originally Posted by SenorSpur

^ This

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So which of our core players do you propose to trade?

I don't think Neal's overqualified tbh. . .Ginobili is too old and injury prone to expect a fully healthy season. With Danny Green still being pretty one dimensional (on both ends), Neal's still going to get decent playing time even with Ginobili still going. After all, Ginobili tends to get time at SF and PG throughout each game anyway, so that will mean Neal will end up getting extra SG time while Manu's on the floor.

Blair's probably getting traded at some point this year for draft picks. Preferably something in the 18-24 range for next year. But I like the idea of keeping him even if they don't trade him. Yeah he's undersized, but he did well (in limited playing) against both OKC and Utah last season. I think again proving he's capable of going against teams that don't have elite frontlines and doing fairly well. You just can't use him against LA, Memphis, or any other team with super front courts.

And yeah. . .it's time Bonner goes. I don't care what we get back, if anything. Maybe we can get a late 2nd round pick for him. That'd be like, amazing.

I agree it's going to be a tight fit to get both Diaw and Lorbek. However, I'm interested to see how the market develops on Diaw. What other teams are going to make a hard push for him? Bad teams will understandably be wary that he'll balloon in size and become a malcontent. Good teams probably want a player with a higher upside, puts up more stats and isn't on the wrong side of 30.

Logic says Diaw is an average bigman who is unrestricted and still relatively young thus will get an MLE-ish offer somewhere. But with Diaw's baggage and extremely unique skillset, it's not a sure thing that offer comes. And if that's the case, the Spurs may be able to get him for around $3 million in first year salary.

If that happens, could the Spurs land Lorbek with a three-year deal that begins at $2 million? It might be a longshot but if he really wants to come to the NBA, that just might be enough.

Now if it comes down to Diaw vs. Lorbek, which could very well be the case, I'd probably go with Diaw. That'd be the much, much safer pick out of those two because we know he's a fit. Lorbek has the higher upside but that would be an extreme roll of the dice to try to replace Diaw with Lorbek. We don't know if Lorbek is an NBA rotation player, much less a starter.

Hopefully the Spurs can figure out what's going to happen with Diaw and Lorbek rather quickly. If they can't land both, then finding another bigman becomes a priority.

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Originally Posted by timvp

I know this question is coming: Do these moves make the Spurs a championship contender? Personally, I think they are longshots to begin with but I actually like the resulting roster this plan would create. It's deep, versatile and has a relatively high ceiling. The Spurs could go a splashier route but I think it'd be unnecessary. This plan allows the Spurs to compete while also building for the future and keeping the books clean of any toxic contracts.

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Assuming all these variables come true, it would still boil down to this:
With being in the Championship Series on the line...

Game 3

Originally Posted by timvp

Pop C-
The players didn't seem ready for the amount of fire the Thunder would bring to the game. Pop, too, seemed unprepared. His playcalling oscillated between non-existent and confusingly bland. The Thunder threw the book at the Spurs and I didn't see many in-game adjustments by Pop. Rotations-wise, I was disappointed. Matt Bonner was overwhelmed yet Pop inexplicably continues to show belief in him. I thought Diaw and Leonard should have played more. When things started going south, going to Blair to try to change the tenor of the game would have been worth a shot, especially since the Spurs were lacking interior scoring and energy -- Blair's two strengths. Heading into Game 4, Pop has a lot of decisions to make when it comes to countering the Thunder's adjustments. Perhaps even more importantly, Pop needs to ensure that his troops bring the appropriate amount of enthusiasm and desperation.

Game 4
Originally Posted by timvp

Pop C-
First of all, playing Bonner was a mistake. Bonner is totally overwhelmed by the moment. With as well as Blair played, in hindsight Pop probably should have used him beginning in Game 3. I would also like to see better plays called when the bench unit is in the game. There has to be something in Pop's bag of tricks that is able to take advantage of a defense that is switching everything. Leonard also deserved more minutes and, perhaps most blatantly of all, Ginobili needs to play more than 25 minutes. That's an absurdly low number of minutes with so much on the line. Defensively, the Spurs have been horrible this series and Pop deserves a portion of that blame. On paper, Pop's defensive scheming was supposed to help the Spurs overcome the Thunder's brigade of talent. Thus far, that hasn't been the case. I don't think it's hyperbolic to suggest that Game 5 is the most important game of Pop's career, especially because he doesn't have a superstar version of Duncan to fall back on. Pop needs to make a number of difficult decisions regarding the rotation, continue to adjust the offensive sets to account for how OKC is defending, and figure out a defensive gameplan that gives the Spurs a fighting chance. Pop, the time is now to show why you are a future Hall of Famer.

Game 5 at home.

Originally Posted by timvp

Pop F
As both teams were preparing for Game 5, I went on record to say this contest would go down as the most important game of Pop's coaching career. He had many items to consider, many possible avenues to explore and no superstar-level Tim Duncan to rely on. Now that the game is over, I still feel like it was the most important game of Pop's career. Unfortunately, Pop was an unmitigated disaster. His first quarter rotations made absolutely no sense. I realize he was dealing with foul trouble but to play Blair at the center of a small ball lineup when the defense was already porous to begin with was astoundingly stupid. Pop shuffling players in and out added to the confusion. By the second quarter, it was obvious that Pop had committed the coaching cardinal sin: he took the game out of the hands of his players. As the game progressed, Pop was better ... but that's not saying much. The rotation was still a question mark and the playcalling was lacking. I've always been a big supporter of Pop but this was an embarrassingly bad coaching effort. Now he faces the even more difficult task of leading the Spurs to a Game 6 win over the Thunder. From what we saw on Monday night, there's little reason to believe that Pop is up to the challenge.
>end grade quotes

And then we have Game 6 the elimination which you haven't brung yourself to grade yet. Granted it was ref rigged in the 2nd half but with an 18 point lead at halftime you lose?

Can you really hope in the 2013 playoffs for better then up 2-0 WCFs with a completely healthy lineup and homecourt advantage?

I think that the FO has to do two things. The first one is to keep everyone (Green, Diaw, Mills) and add Lorbek. Then trade for an all-star PF or C, were Bonner as serviceable player with $4M base salary could help.

For example, Howard is a gonner in Orlando, they cant demand much for him. If Howard accepts to sign an extension, the Spurs could offer Kwami, Splitter, De Colo's rights or a future first round pick, plus Manu to make the numbers work, on the condition he gets bought out and returns.

^ :lol

if the Spurs are unable to get both Diaw and Lorbek, they should pick up a player along the lines of Reggie Evans (maybe DJ White's that type of player) to bring some toughness to the front line. This would still allow an athletic C to get some PT too in certain situations.

Neal had a bad playoffs and some of that might have to do with his injuries and disrupted rhythm, but if he's not going to be more agressive in driving to the hole (I'm not sure if he can) he limits his worth. The Spurs need players that will get to the lane and draw a foul. Tony and Manu fit that role, but it's probably not a good idea for TP and Manu to take too many hits during the season and even in the playoffs. They need a couple more players that are not afraid to drive the lane and get hit - Green? Leonard? Denmon? Anyone?

Blair needs to go to another team regardless of how cheap his contract is - it's better for him and in the long run it will be better for the Spurs.

I really hope the Spurs can go after Anthony Randolph. Odds are he won't amount to much, but he still shows some really good moments and his upside eqautes to a perfect need if he actually pans out some.

after going up 2-0 on the thunder tim legler said the spurs would win the title and where set up to win multiple titles.


our only weakness is the NBA and their minion refs.

Marcus Bryant had a good point about this team not having time to gel (from no training camp, mid-season trade & Diaw signing...) and they still reached the WCF. However, we don't know if we can duplicate the health or level of play from Manu and Tim which obviously makes things tough to decide.

The point about the above is risk - when it comes to Diaw or Lorbek, if you have to decide, if the goal is to win do we think the Spurs with a known in Diaw are good enough to win it all? Because if not, do you not have to take a risk on Lorbek or someone else if your goal is to win it all?

Tough call.

Jesus, get rid of Matt Bonner at this point is a major plus. I knew that years ago.

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Originally Posted by DPG21920

With the way the market seems to be shaping up, I highly doubt Ersan can be had for just the full MLE. I remember a few months ago thinking that would be high for him but :wow at some of the offers supposedly going around.

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Yeah, and here I thought the new CBA was going to reduce the money that teams threw at free agents

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Originally Posted by Cant_Be_Faded

Yeah, and here I thought the new CBA was going to reduce the money that teams threw at free agents

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No CBA will save the teams from themselves. They will always, always, always overbid and do incredibly stupid things. They'll keep trying to amend terms, but it won't do any good.

CBA do protect owners from themselves. Even if they offer tons of crazy contracts, at the end of the season, CBA mechanisms will ensure that they haven't given up more than about 50% of the BRI to players.

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Originally Posted by Bruno

CBA do protect owners from themselves. Even if they offer tons of crazy contracts, at the end of the season, CBA mechanisms will ensure that they haven't given up more than about 50% of the BRI to players.

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Oh, it certainly was in their favor. But one of their key talking points / goals was to reduce these ludicrous bids for players. Whether that was bullshit or not, it was an impossible task.

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Originally Posted by Mel_13

So which of our core players do you propose to trade?

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I'm not talking about getting rid of core players - only upgrade the talent around them. Start by removing the last vestiges of dead weight on the roster. Spurs were really motivated in getting rid of RJ - and rightfully so. Same approach needs to be taken with the other remaining players that are proven non-playoff performers and thus are considered wasted roster spots.

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Originally Posted by Mr. Body

Oh, it certainly was in their favor. But one of their key talking points / goals was to reduce these ludicrous bids for players. Whether that was bullshit or not, it was an impossible task.

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Well, contract numbers you hear doesn't really reflect the reality. 10% of their salary is put in a escrow fund and if owners spend too much money on players they keep that money. A $40M contract is in fact a $36M contract and the $4M remaining will be returned to owners if they spend too much money as a whole.

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Originally Posted by SenorSpur

I'm not talking about getting rid of core players -

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You agreed with a post that started:

"The Spurs won't even make it to the WCF with the approach of staying basically with the same core."

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Originally Posted by Mel_13

You agreed with a post that started:

"The Spurs won't even make it to the WCF with the approach of staying basically with the same core."

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I should've clarified my initial post. My bad. No way am I advocating getting rid of core players now. That will come once Manu and Tim retire.

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Originally Posted by SenorSpur

I should've clarified my initial post. My bad. No way am I advocating getting rid of core players now. That will come once Manu and Tim retire.

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I agree.

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Originally Posted by Mel_13

I agree.

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I just do not like dead weight on the roster. Timvp has already outlined where some of that dead weight is.

If Tim and Manu were still in their superstar primes, they could masterfully carry the team and it wouldn't be such a big deal. However, it's no longer that way now. As such, the Spurs supporting case MUST be better in order to offset the decline with their contributions.

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Originally Posted by SenorSpur

I just do not like dead weight on the roster. Timvp has already outlined where some of that dead weight is.

If Tim and Manu were still in their superstar primes, they could masterfully carry the team and it wouldn't be such a big deal. However, it's no longer that way now. As such, the Spurs supporting case MUST be better in order to offset the decline with their contributions.

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I want to see them do that as well.

It is, however, easier said than done and may come at a price. Generally speaking, other teams are not interested in taking your least productive players and giving you better players in return. Unless, that is, you sweeten the deal with future draft picks or one of your productive players. There are very few, if any, teams in the NBA who have 12 productive players, all of whom step up in the playoffs.

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Originally Posted by Mel_13

I want to see them do that as well.

It is, however, easier said than done and may come at a price. Generally speaking, other teams are not interested in taking your least productive players and giving you better players in return. Unless, that is, you sweeten the deal with future draft picks or one of your productive players. There are very few, if any, teams in the NBA who have 12 productive players, all of whom step up in the playoffs.

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True. However, I've got two words for that dilemma - young and cheap.

Last season, Pop was forced to rely heavily on young players like Leonard, Green and Splitter. I say, add a couple more young, cheap players, give them some regular season burn and let's keep moving in that direction.

Easier said than done.

The problem is that none of the reasons of why OKC was the better team gets addressed and that's not taking into account the Heat was much better than OKC.

It could be that Mills will defend the point better than Neal, Manu may finally have an injury free season, Green may hit his open 3's, Splitter may be a factor, Lorbek may do what Bonner never could, and so on, but OKC may improve even more.

I think the Spurs need an 8 man rotation of good players all capable of playing defense, the starters, an swing (sixth man), the third big and and the backup PG. The additional talent should be used in a trade to add an all-star bigman.

It would be great to run trough the regular season with 10 or more players, but that won't work in the playoffs.

Point Guards:
Parker / Mills

Swings:
Green / Kawhi / Manu / Jack / Neal (2 swings expandable in a trade)

Bigs:
Duncan / Diaw / Splitter / Lorbek (2 expandable in a trade)
+ Bonner / Blair for RS duty, without that much value.

Of the bigs that are available, the best by far is Howard - he may want a change of scenario, then there is Gasol but the Spurs won't send TP to the Lakers, then Scola that doesn't play good defense - so he won't have more positive impact than Diaw, there could be more.

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Originally Posted by dunkman

Green / Kwami / Manu / Jack / Neal (2 swings expandable in a trade)

Duncan / Diaw / Splitter / Lorbek (2 expandable in a trade)

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:lol you realize Green, Duncan, Lorbek and Diaw are not signed by the Spurs yet?

Also, Howard is owed $20 million this season, meaning you would need to trade one of Manu/Tony/Tim + Jack for a one year Howard rental...

Doesn't make sense... not for the Spurs nor Dwight...

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Originally Posted by ElNono

:lol you realize Green, Duncan, Lorbek and Diaw are not signed by the Spurs yet?

Also, Howard is owed $20 million this season, meaning you would need to trade one of Manu/Tony/Tim + Jack for a one year Howard rental...

Doesn't make sense... not for the Spurs nor Dwight...

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As long as Dwight accepts to re-sign with the Spurs for at least 2 more seasons, it would make sense. Duncan is sure to re-sign, the other 3 are probable.

To make the numbers work, the Spurs must ship Manu or Jack. Plus some young players to make it interesting for the Magic. An agreement should be made that Manu or Jack gets bought out and returns later in the season.

Dwight is not as talented as Duncan, but he has lead the Magic to the finals. He's an franchise player, it does make sense for the Spurs if he stays at least 3 seasons. And it takes sense for Dwight, since the Spurs would win championships in that time, which is good for his endorsement opportunities and he would have the chance to clean up his image which is also important, speaking in commercial terms.

LeBron was considered a clown - until he won the championship. Despite being 3 times MVP. I'm not convinced the Nets are sure to win a championship during the next 3 seasons.

stop...please

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Originally Posted by racm

The Spurs made most of their moves in odd numbered off seasons (2009 trade for Jefferson, which didn't pan out but they turned old Bowen/Oberto/Thomas into Stephen Jackson, fwiw, turning Hill into Leonard/Lorbek/Bertans (Leonard alone makes the trade worth it)).

You don't blow up a roster that was two games from the Finals. You simply get rid of the superfluous parts and weakest links.

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I agree improve the frontline defense and add more playmaking in the form of a backup pg.

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Originally Posted by dunkman

As long as Dwight accepts to re-sign with the Spurs for at least 2 more seasons, it would make sense. Duncan is sure to re-sign, the other 3 are probable.

To make the numbers work, the Spurs must ship Manu or Jack. Plus some young players to make it interesting for the Magic. An agreement should be made that Manu or Jack gets bought out and returns later in the season.

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Manu is set to make $14m, Jack $10m... If you want to ship Manu, you have to come up with another $6m, if it's Jack, then another $10m... that's a lot of filler. Not to mention the Magic won't take shit like Bonner.

To please the Magic you would probably need to ship both Manu and Jack since they're both expiring, and absorb one $4m bad contract from Orlando. They won't release either player, seeing they would rather them come off the books at season's end.

Ultimately, why would Dwight want to sign with an aging core and small market like the Spurs? :lol

Between the news of Camby (sounds like he has an offer from the Spurs) and Ersan, it seems like the Spurs might be going a completely different route which is very interesting due to the limited funds they seemingly have available.

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Originally Posted by SenorSpur

I'm not talking about getting rid of core players - only upgrade the talent around them. Start by removing the last vestiges of dead weight on the roster. Spurs were really motivated in getting rid of RJ - and rightfully so. Same approach needs to be taken with the other remaining players that are proven non-playoff performers and thus are considered wasted roster spots.

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I agree you have loser on your team like Boner then it just spreads like a disease. Some one said it best is when you put Boner in you give the other team Hope and Confidence and you make the Spurs players choke...

TRADE HIS GINGER ARSE!

Don't tell me we can't get a high second round pick for him.....Do it RC I don't care if you and Pop gotta open up your secrete stash of liquor...:flag:

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Originally Posted by ElNono

:lol you realize Green, Duncan, Lorbek and Diaw are not signed by the Spurs yet?

Also, Howard is owed $20 million this season, meaning you would need to trade one of Manu/Tony/Tim + Jack for a one year Howard rental...

Doesn't make sense... not for the Spurs nor Dwight...

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Manu and Jackson for Howard one year rental would be a great deal. All in for one last title. Manu and Jackson will have little value in a couple of years anyways.

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Originally Posted by rascal

Manu and Jackson for Howard one year rental would be a great deal. All in for one last title. Manu and Jackson will have little value in a couple of years anyways.

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Only problem is Orlando is not going to trade expiring for expiring. They would rather trade Dwight for players with longer contracts, and to their vantage point, players younger than 34 years of age :lol

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Originally Posted by rascal

Manu and Jackson for Howard one year rental would be a great deal. All in for one last title. Manu and Jackson will have little value in a couple of years anyways.

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It wouldn't be a great deal simply because both Manu and Jack are still hungry for a ship, while Dwight would be looking where he's going in the offseason. Not to mention that if you're renting Dwight for just a season, you really can't offer Duncan more than 1 year, since he's not sticking around on a depleted/rebuilding team.

Plus everyone knows Manu is retiring a Spur, so there's that too.

BTW, Dwigth for Manu/Jack would be highway robbery for the Spurs... it's not happening :lol

Centers
Tim Duncan
Tiago Splitter

Power Forwards
Boris Diaw
Erazem Lorbek

Small Forwards
Kawhi Leonard
Stephen Jackson

Shooting Guards
Manu Ginobili
Danny Green

Point Guards
Tony Parker
Patrick Mills (or Nando De Colo or a cheap veteran)

That lineup is stacked. I hope someone from the FO reads this tbh.

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Originally Posted by ElNono

BTW, Dwigth for Manu/Jack would be highway robbery for the Spurs... it's not happening :lol

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Never said this could possibly happen because it wouldn't, just saying that you make that deal if it was presented to you.

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Originally Posted by rascal

Never said this could possibly happen because it wouldn't, just saying that you make that deal if it was presented to you.

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Ok...then why the hell are you even talking about it?

"Hey, let's consider trading our young superstar for Manu Ginobili and Stephen Jackson", said nobody ever.

Forget this. A "simple summer strategy" will get this team knocked out by the Conference Finals, at the latest. And maybe any move that they can realistically make will. But you know what? They've clearly made a commitment to Duncan that they'll attempt to contend until he retires. Bringing back the same team that wasn't good enough and having the big three get a year older (while the team that beats them gets a year more experienced, no less) isn't attempting to contend; it's conceding defeat.

Every other contender and pseudo contender is basically going all in. They don't care about "well, what about when (insert veteran star retires), how will we look then?" They're all trying everything they can to squeeze one more title out while said star is around. And that's what the Spurs need to do. If they're going to dip their toes into this water, they better be prepared to jump in.

I've advocated it many times, but always qualified it with something like "it's highly unlikely, but worth a shot"; enough of that. They need to call up Ferry and say, outside of the big three and Leonard, name your price for Smith. Any package of players or players they have the rights to, plus multiple 1sts and 2nds, should be in play. Maybe he still doesn't do it, but he probably at least thinks about it, especially if (when?) Howard consents to go to the Lakers, since Nash can serve as a liaison of sorts between him and Bryant. Once Howard is out, Paul, who's an even bigger long shot, definitely is. And then what does he do with all that financial flexibility? Would Smith, who's apparently back on board, even want to stay at that point?

And let's face it, it wouldn't be the first time in this league that a front office friend did an opposing front office friend a favor. Though Ferry may well have gotten another GM job on his own volition, would he have gotten 6 years and (it appears) full autonomy if he didn't re-join the Spurs and have people seemingly forget the terrible job he did with the Cavs? Probably not. Who knows, maybe he'll feel somewhat indebted to them.

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Originally Posted by TD 21

Forget this. A "simple summer strategy" will get this team knocked out by the Conference Finals, at the latest. And maybe any move that they can realistically make will. But you know what? They've clearly made a commitment to Duncan that they'll attempt to contend until he retires. Bringing back the same team that wasn't good enough and having the big three get a year older (while the team that beats them gets a year more experienced, no less) isn't attempting to contend; it's conceding defeat.

Every other contender and pseudo contender is basically going all in. They don't care about "well, what about when (insert veteran star retires), how will we look then?" They're all trying everything they can to squeeze one more title out while said star is around. And that's what the Spurs need to do. If they're going to dip their toes into this water, they better be prepared to jump in.

I've advocated it many times, but always qualified it with something like "it's highly unlikely, but worth a shot"; enough of that. They need to call up Ferry and say, outside of the big three and Leonard, name your price for Smith. Any package of players or players they have the rights to, plus multiple 1sts and 2nds, should be in play. Maybe he still doesn't do it, but he probably at least thinks about it, especially if (when?) Howard consents to go to the Lakers, since Nash can serve as a liaison of sorts between him and Bryant. Once Howard is out, Paul, who's an even bigger long shot, definitely is. And then what does he do with all that financial flexibility? Would Smith, who's apparently back on board, even want to stay at that point?

And let's face it, it wouldn't be the first time in this league that a front office friend did an opposing front office friend a favor. Though Ferry may well have gotten another GM job on his own volition, would he have gotten 6 years and (it appears) full autonomy if he didn't re-join the Spurs and have people seemingly forget the terrible job he did with the Cavs? Probably not. Who knows, maybe he'll feel somewhat indebted to them.

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I agree they have to do something but I don't think Smith is the savior you think he is. Diaw's a better fit.

Well, looks like Plan A was never their plan. Apparently Marcus Camby has wiggled into the picture and is a high priority.

Weird turn of events, tbh.

Next few days will be interesting. Hopefully there's a flurry of news around the 11th including the re-signing of Duncan, Diaw and Green. As for Camby, the latest I can imagine that taking is until after the Rockets figure out if the Bulls are matching Asik.

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Originally Posted by timvp

Well, looks like Plan A was never their plan. Apparently Marcus Camby has wiggled into the picture and is a high priority.

Weird turn of events, tbh.

Next few days will be interesting. Hopefully there's a flurry of news around the 11th including the re-signing of Duncan, Diaw and Green. As for Camby, the latest I can imagine that taking is until after the Rockets figure out if the Bulls are matching Asik.

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You heard from reliable sources that Camby is the target? I would assume he's more likely heading to the Knicks.

I can't handle another season of Bonner and Blair.

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Originally Posted by loveforthegame

I can't handle another season of Bonner and Blair.

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Could be worse...you could be an Orlando fan.

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Originally Posted by timvp

Well, looks like Plan A was never their plan.

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I still think it contains all the most important aspects of their plan. You just missed on their chances to sign Diaw AND Lorbek.

Overall, plan A is still viable.

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Originally Posted by racm

The Spurs made most of their moves in odd numbered off seasons (2009 trade for Jefferson, which didn't pan out but they turned old Bowen/Oberto/Thomas into Stephen Jackson, fwiw, turning Hill into Leonard/Lorbek/Bertans (Leonard alone makes the trade worth it)).

You don't blow up a roster that was two games from the Finals. You simply get rid of the superfluous parts and weakest links.

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Nothing wrong with this team. The problem is there is no offseason move we can make to assure stern won't take it from us again.

i don't get this plan. if the spurs succeed, they will essentially have the same lineup that got tossed by the thunder in the WCF. the only difference is a negative as the powers of the big 3 get another year slower. how does this make the spurs better? now that lorbek bailed out, the spurs can re sign boris diaw. and then what? the same team but much older. how is that a good plan?