Averaging 115.5 PPG and 4-0 Since Neal's Injury

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Originally Posted by Dr. Robert Ley

We actually have a real backup point guard now that he's not out chucking up threes and ruining the offense, tbh.

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That's too much hate, but i agree, Neal shouldn't play unless Manu/Green are cold.

Its not like DeColo or Mills has played that well in Gary's absence - What has actually happen is that Pop has put the ball in Manu's hands when TP is on bench (one of the reasons DeColo hasn't been so effective) - IF Pop will follow that recipe when Gary returns we will have very good results offensively - then we will have to see how Neal does trying to guard opposing PGs especially the small quick guys - right now there is no complete answer

Neal - great shooter, good ability to create for self and sometimes create for others in PNR game, while better defensively still struggles and probably more so when trying to guard PGs

DeColo - great passer, good ability to create for others especially in PNR, streaky shooter has probably shot better than expected but still not great, below average defender though has probably played better than expected in that area as well.

Mills - great shooter, not good as a creator/facilitator, probably best defender of the bunch (grading on guarding Pgs) though not great, usually enters game with alot of hustle and energy although doesn't always equal good results

At the end of the day, outside a perfect trade scenario - Neal being TP's primary backup with Manu running point is probably best option for Pop, while occasionally using other two guys if Neal's defense is negating his offensive production.

Spurs have a true problem at defending PG when Parker isn't on the court:
- When Parker is on the court, the opposite PG is scoring 18.1 points per 48 minutes.
- When Parker isn't on the court, the opposite PG is scoring 26.3 points per 48 minutes.

I see two possible answers to solve that:
- Pop could pick his backup PG depending on matchups. Against quick small PGs, Mills would be the backup PG. Against bigger and slower backup PGs, Neal or De Colo would be the backup.
- Pop could give the backup PG slot to Joseph. That's a gusty move because Joseph is raw and has shown very litle but his defensive ceiling is way higher than Neal, De Colo or Mills.

I wouldn't mind letting Joseph have some rotation minutes from time to time. But theres already a minutes crunch as it is...and sitting in Austin, CJ gets a lot of burn. Not sure what would be best for him long term.

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Originally Posted by PingPong

Neal is a shooter. And needs to play like one. Don't expect him as a playmaker or even a dribbler. And let it flow...

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Yes, he sure as hell is not a backup PG by any means, good post because this is exactly what he is.

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Originally Posted by JonNOKC

Its not like DeColo or Mills has played that well in Gary's absence - What has actually happen is that Pop has put the ball in Manu's hands when TP is on bench (one of the reasons DeColo hasn't been so effective) - IF Pop will follow that recipe when Gary returns we will have very good results offensively - then we will have to see how Neal does trying to guard opposing PGs especially the small quick guys - right now there is no complete answer

Neal - great shooter, good ability to create for self and sometimes create for others in PNR game, while better defensively still struggles and probably more so when trying to guard PGs

DeColo - great passer, good ability to create for others especially in PNR, streaky shooter has probably shot better than expected but still not great, below average defender though has probably played better than expected in that area as well.

Mills - great shooter, not good as a creator/facilitator, probably best defender of the bunch (grading on guarding Pgs) though not great, usually enters game with alot of hustle and energy although doesn't always equal good results

At the end of the day, outside a perfect trade scenario - Neal being TP's primary backup with Manu running point is probably best option for Pop, while occasionally using other two guys if Neal's defense is negating his offensive production.

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If Neal is the primary backup option the team is in trouble. He can't dribble well nor create or penetrate, he is a spot up shooter basically and thats what he is. He is a slightly better RMJ as someone said. I would just stick to letting him be a volume shooter, thats his game. I still don't get at all where anyone thinks this guy is any kind of PG or can run the PG.

you guys can say anything you want about neal. bring up any metric. tell me about how he plays hero ball. tell me about how his defense can be weak.

dude. hits. big. shots.

/thread

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Originally Posted by Bruno

Spurs have a true problem at defending PG when Parker isn't on the court:
- When Parker is on the court, the opposite PG is scoring 18.1 points per 48 minutes.
- When Parker isn't on the court, the opposite PG is scoring 26.3 points per 48 minutes.

I see two possible answers to solve that:
- Pop could pick his backup PG depending on matchups. Against quick small PGs, Mills would be the backup PG. Against bigger and slower backup PGs, Neal or De Colo would be the backup.
- Pop could give the backup PG slot to Joseph. That's a gusty move because Joseph is raw and has shown very litle but his defensive ceiling is way higher than Neal, De Colo or Mills.

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Good point. Despite not being a good offensive player Jacque Vaughn was able to play great defense, knock down the open shot, and move the ball. That's all you really need from a backup PG. Hold the ship steady till the starter gets back in. CoJo probably is the closest thing to Vaughn at this point.

Neal could be solved by actually playing the young kids more
just because jack is on this team doesnt mean he has to play
hes not that good of a reg season player and hes old and slow
he should be playing 10-15 minutes like mcdyess did

green or leonard are both workhorses who should be able to play around 36 minutes a game
play leonard/green with the bench more
Neal guards SG
Manu guards SF
leonard/green guard backup PG

not that hard

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Originally Posted by Sean Cagney

If Neal is the primary backup option the team is in trouble. He can't dribble well nor create or penetrate, he is a spot up shooter basically and thats what he is. He is a slightly better RMJ as someone said. I would just stick to letting him be a volume shooter, thats his game. I still don't getanyonethinks this guy is any kind of PG or can run the PG.

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I think everyone agrees Neal is not a PG and outside of better ball handling neither is Mills - if Pop goes with either guy as Tony's primary backup then PG duties need to be handled by Manu as stated in my original post. In certain matchups Neal can create for himself but agree rarely creates for teammates. In games where TP is out and Neal has alot of PG duties he has come through with decent assist number (2 occasions posting 7 and one game with 8) unfortunately in those 3 games he also had 18 TOs - clearly he is at his best off the ball, but many under rate his ability to score off the dribble especially in certain matchups

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Originally Posted by Bruno

Spurs have a true problem at defending PG when Parker isn't on the court:
- When Parker is on the court, the opposite PG is scoring 18.1 points per 48 minutes.
- When Parker isn't on the court, the opposite PG is scoring 26.3 points per 48 minutes.

I see two possible answers to solve that:
- Pop could pick his backup PG depending on matchups. Against quick small PGs, Mills would be the backup PG. Against bigger and slower backup PGs, Neal or De Colo would be the backup.
- Pop could give the backup PG slot to Joseph. That's a gusty move because Joseph is raw and has shown very litle but his defensive ceiling is way higher than Neal, De Colo or Mills.

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Letting CoJo get more time at PG is something I wouldn't mind seeing, but the time to do that is now - the only part of his game we know is NBA ready is defense - but if he showed enough to warrant serious consideration then it may allow Spurs to be more aggressive in trade talks especially those regarding Neal

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Originally Posted by Bruno

Spurs have a true problem at defending PG when Parker isn't on the court:
- When Parker is on the court, the opposite PG is scoring 18.1 points per 48 minutes.
- When Parker isn't on the court, the opposite PG is scoring 26.3 points per 48 minutes.

I see two possible answers to solve that:
- Pop could pick his backup PG depending on matchups. Against quick small PGs, Mills would be the backup PG. Against bigger and slower backup PGs, Neal or De Colo would be the backup.
- Pop could give the backup PG slot to Joseph. That's a gusty move because Joseph is raw and has shown very litle but his defensive ceiling is way higher than Neal, De Colo or Mills.

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:cry :cry But Tony isn't a true PG. :cry :cry

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Originally Posted by freetiago

lol at neal haters
no one is acting like he is some 3rd option
hes a bench player who was playing out of position since the teams entire small forward rotation was missing
hes instant offense who can actually pass and is good for 10-15 minutes a game
unless manu goes to the starting lineup then we have no real backup PG and neal is the best of the 3 in that situation
de colo and manu together doesnt look good unless de colo is the ball handler

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+1
Was at the game last night and Rockets game too. de Colo painful to watch. Passing up shots, uncertainty, turnovers. Victories have come against some mediocre teams.

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Originally Posted by JonNOKC

Letting CoJo get more time at PG is something I wouldn't mind seeing, but the time to do that is now - the only part of his game we know is NBA ready is defense - but if he showed enough to warrant serious consideration then it may allow Spurs to be more aggressive in trade talks especially those regarding Neal

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Pop will first give a shot at Neal to be the backup PG. Even if he was quite a disaster last season at that spot, he hasn't really had a shot this year to show what he could do at PG because of injuries. Neal is a good player and he deserves a legit opportunity to get the backup PG spot. If Neal fails, I think it will be time to give Joseph a try.

Aside of the backup PG situation, another factor that could decide whether or not Spurs should trade Neal is the Ginobili situation. With Manu being injured a lot and thinking at retirement, Neal was a damn fine insurance to have. However, Manu has been healthy lately and is playing better and better so he might be more and more tempted not to retire next summer. Before the trade deadline, RC and Pop should have a talk with Manu about what he think he will do next summer because it's a big factor on whether or not Spurs should trade Neal.

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Originally Posted by DapDaGenius

Should trade him, but Blair and Neal for who?

They could try Patrick Patterson or Greg Smith, then if they wanted they could take the time to pull up Wilkerson from the Toros.

But neither of those dudes are on the trading block as far as I know, but I'd much rather have one of them than Blair, Neal would be the to make the trade look a lot better. Then again, I'm not sure the Rockets would trade them to us.

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Patterson for Neal and Blair, the Rockets could use a Harden Lite for when Harden is on the bench and they have plenty of PF's.

If we trade Neal, he will torch us from some other team, probably the Thunder.

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Originally Posted by Bruno

Pop will first give a shot at Neal to be the backup PG. Even if he was quite a disaster last season at that spot, he hasn't really had a shot this year to show what he could do at PG because of injuries. Neal is a good player and he deserves a legit opportunity to get the backup PG spot. If Neal fails, I think it will be time to give Joseph a try.

Aside of the backup PG situation, another factor that could decide whether or not Spurs should trade Neal is the Ginobili situation. With Manu being injured a lot and thinking at retirement, Neal was a damn fine insurance to have. However, Manu has been healthy lately and is playing better and better so he might be more and more tempted not to retire next summer. Before the trade deadline, RC and Pop should have a talk with Manu about what he think he will do next summer because it's a big factor on whether or not Spurs should trade Neal.

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Neal is not PG material. He cannot handle any pressure at the half court without turning the ball over. He doesn't have the handles for it.

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Originally Posted by Bruno

Spurs have a true problem at defending PG when Parker isn't on the court:
- When Parker is on the court, the opposite PG is scoring 18.1 points per 48 minutes.
- When Parker isn't on the court, the opposite PG is scoring 26.3 points per 48 minutes.

I see two possible answers to solve that:
- Pop could pick his backup PG depending on matchups. Against quick small PGs, Mills would be the backup PG. Against bigger and slower backup PGs, Neal or De Colo would be the backup.
- Pop could give the backup PG slot to Joseph. That's a gusty move because Joseph is raw and has shown very litle but his defensive ceiling is way higher than Neal, De Colo or Mills.

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3rd solution :

Start Manu and have Green off the bench to defend the backup PG while De Colo defends the SG.

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Originally Posted by Bruno

Aside of the backup PG situation, another factor that could decide whether or not Spurs should trade Neal is the Ginobili situation. With Manu being injured a lot and thinking at retirement, Neal was a damn fine insurance to have. However, Manu has been healthy lately and is playing better and better so he might be more and more tempted not to retire next summer. Before the trade deadline, RC and Pop should have a talk with Manu about what he think he will do next summer because it's a big factor on whether or not Spurs should trade Neal.

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Well if anything we need insurance in the frontcourt, we already have a Manu-lite anyway.

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Originally Posted by DMC

Neal is not PG material. He cannot handle any pressure at the half court without turning the ball over. He doesn't have the handles for it.

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Neal got badly exposed last year as a PG both defensively and offensively.

Saying that:
- Neal has reportedly worked on his PG skills last summer and he is also a little thinner.
- Neal has played very little PG this year.
- Mills and De Colo haven't been so-so this year.
- If Neal doesn't get the backup PG minutes, he will collect DNP-CD.
- Neal is a good player that has helped a lot Spurs.

Because of all that, Neal deserves a shot at the backup PG slot. I personally think it won't work but it's worth a try. If after 5-10 games, it's clear that he still can't be an effective backup PG, it will be time to look at other options.

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Originally Posted by Paranoid Pop

Well if anything we need insurance in the frontcourt, we already have a Manu-lite anyway.

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If Manu retires, Spurs will have some cap space next summer. In a cap space scenario, Neal has the big edge of costing very little space to re-sign because of a low cap hold. Spurs should be fine at guards spots with Parker, Green, Neal, De Colo, Joseph and they will have a lot of capspace to go after a quality bigman.

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Originally Posted by Bruno

Neal got badly exposed last year as a PG both defensively and offensively.

Saying that:
- Neal has reportedly worked on his PG skills last summer and he is also a little thinner.
- Neal has played very little PG this year.
- Mills and De Colo haven't been so-so this year.
- If Neal doesn't get the backup PG minutes, he will collect DNP-CD.
- Neal is a good player that has helped a lot Spurs.

Because of all that, Neal deserves a shot at the backup PG slot. I personally think it won't work but it's worth a try. If after 5-10 games, it's clear that he still can't be an effective backup PG, it will be time to look at other options.

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I agree with everything but the "deserves" part. It's a business, there's no reason to go by "deserves" when the guy is making a couple million a year. He cannot run the point, he's a huge liability there. I'd take Nando at the point before taking Neal, as Neal will shoot the ball given the look and I don't want him altering that mode by looking to get others involved.

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Originally Posted by DMC

If we trade Neal, he will torch us from some other team, probably the Thunder.

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I can see that happening. I can see him playing really good for his next team against us one game, then the next game we completely shut him down.

team ppg....looks more impressive then the suns run n gun 05-07....

Now we give up 110 points to the BUCKS:lol