Suns trying to climb Mt. San Antonio

Looks like the Suns surely recognize their shortcomings and are trying desparately to keep pace.

http://www.mysanantonio.com/sports/s....527258b7.html

LAS VEGAS — Money talks in July, and it is about to scream at the Phoenix Suns.

Unless they have a change of heart because they believe the Suns are bluffing about matching any offer that is made to swingman Joe Johnson, the Atlanta Hawks are going to offer Johnson a maximum contract.

Don't expect the Suns to blink unless owner Robert Sarver, the guy Spurs coach Gregg Popovich joked had been the man inside the San Diego Chicken outfit, really is afraid to cut a big-time check.

The reason Sarver will swallow hard and then go ahead and pay Johnson? If he does, the Suns are going to have a much better chance at getting past the Spurs in the 2006 Western Conference playoffs.

Everything the Suns have done this summer — trading Quentin Richardson and the rights to first-round draft pick Nate Robinson to the Knicks for center Kurt Thomas and signing free-agent shooting guard Raja Bell — has been predicated on matching up better against the Spurs.

"The Spurs are our mountain to climb," Suns coach Mike D'Antoni said Saturday afternoon before watching Leandro Barbosa work on the holes in his game by playing 32 minutes in a Las Vegas Summer League game against the Los Angeles Clippers. "Everything we've done has been predicated on trying to get over that mountain."

By trading Richardson, whose shooting in the Western Conference finals was shaky, at best, and getting Thomas, the hard-nosed center the Spurs nearly traded for on deadline day in 2004, the Suns got a lot more versatile up front.

"We feel like now we've got two gears, instead of one," D'Antoni said.

In other words, when the Suns need to get a little more physical and play some interior defense against the Spurs, they don't have to ask Amare Stoudemire to try to do something he clearly hasn't yet made a priority.

Stoudemire became an All-Star and MVP candidate last season because D'Antoni made him an undersized center in the NBA's fastest offense. Stoudemire insisted he wanted to go back to playing power forward next season, but D'Antoni said a post-playoff meeting with Stoudemire produced a commitment from his star big man to continue playing whatever role optimizes the Suns' chances to keep winning.

"Now we can go a couple of different ways," D'Antoni said. "We can go half a game with Kurt at the five and Amare at the four, and we can change up, game to game."

Bell will drop right into Richardson's starting spot at big guard. He is not as good a shooter from distance, but he is a much tougher defender, and if you are beginning to get the idea the Suns understand they have to be able to stop the Spurs, in addition to scoring in the 100s against them, you may have a future as an NBA personnel director.

How tough a defender?

Word on the street is that when agent Herb Rudoy disclosed that Bell had agreed to sign with the Suns, one of his more prominent clients, Manu Ginobili, called him to protest that he had just given the Suns the defender he least likes to play against.

manu struggles against raja fucking bell???? okay well if manu sucks that bad then he deserves to whine

but i doubt it

kurt thomas is not going to help the suns, this is like the sixers getting big dog

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Bell ... is not as good a shooter from distance (as Richardson) ...

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Bell: 40% from range, 45% from the field
Quentin: 36% from range, 39% from the field

In fact, over the last three years, Bell's worst is better than Richardson's best.

I did like hearing about the Manu phone call, though :p

is manu calling his agent and forcing his agent to not have one of his other clients go to a specfic team , tampering? or since it is free agency they are allowed to do that

example say tim duncan demands his agent deal some other person to alanta insted of dallas is this againt the NBA rules, any anti competive US law breaking?

could MANu be supoended, deported, killed?

the suns arent going to beat spurs with these minor useless moves.

i believe suns might get a championship, but not in the next 3-4 seasons, cuz

this is spurs time

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Word on the street is that when agent Herb Rudoy disclosed that Bell had agreed to sign with the Suns, one of his more prominent clients, Manu Ginobili, called him to protest that he had just given the Suns the defender he least likes to play against.

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I gotta call bullshit on that.

A cursory glance at Manu's stats says that he averaged roughly 22 points per game against Utah, on north of 50% shooting.

Nice hometown team hypberbole there from a beaten Suns beat writer.

quention richardson totals

fgs
232-525
400-926
203-546
425-1068
407-1045

3pts
50-151
133-349
61-198
120-341
226-631

bell

fgs
2-7
103-240
93-211
329-805
303-667

3pts
1-3
12-44
21-51
62-166
54-164


oo0o0o0o0oo0o0o you realize you have to beat OTHER teams to get to us right suns fan?

how many times did we hear those suns homers (who were so certain they could beat us...) say how quentin won them games with his shooting and scoring....
lol!

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Bell: 40% from range, 45% from the field
Quentin: 36% from range, 39% from the field

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Yeah, that stood out to me too... Quentin isn't a good shooter at all. Just a frequent one.

Someone please say why with the opinion.

I understand I'm on your terf and all, but if the Spurs trade their weakest player, aquiring a guy who averaged 14-17 vs. their style of play and then sign a wing who averaged 12+ per game and is a tough defender, I doubt you think so little of the signing/moves.

Even if the Suns do make a "lame attempt" to play D next season, I personally don't see how they will be able to get Bell, Johnson & Thomas on the floor at the same time.

Kurt is natural power forward. Sure he can play center in the East, but doesn't have bulk to challenge the likes of Duncan, Nazr, KG, Yao, Camby, Nene and other WC post players.

Why?

Manu GInobili averaged 12 free throws per game against Utah this year with your boy Raja guarding him.

Somehow I don't think a guy who has dunked on Amare and Shawn Marion at the same time is going to be phased by a foul-happy perimeter scrub.

Kurt makes y'all better, but he's historically had problems matching up with TD defensively.

first off, gettin 1 (thomas) to shore up ur defense does not always work, considering

that a few quick fouls and he is on the bench and ur back to no defense.

second, i wouldnt take bell over richardson, especially considering this was his

first playoff appearance and he ran into a good defensive team in spurs.

3rd off, u Suns fans are puttin too much faith into JJ, he will not help u overcome

spurs like the media makes u believe

whatever helps the suns sleep at night.

I doubt Manu would call up his agent and say something like that. :rolleyes

i know guys its like lets break it down


kurt thomas to stop who? Tim Duncan. Tim Duncan can rape KT.....

Bell to guard Ginobili. Ok lets say he can...lol...

so you're sporting a lineup of nash, bell, marion, amare, thomas?

i dont get it
wheres johnson

it doesnt work man, kurt thomas is an undersized center in the east, he'll get dominated in the west, and putting serious minutes to raja bell and kurt thomas will affect your offense more than you think

you do realize nash got like ridiculous assists by hooking up amare for dunks right?
and standing on the floor with amare was quentin, a 3 pt threat

with raja on the floor they can crowd amare easier...

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Originally Posted by Cant_Be_Faded

oo0o0o0o0oo0o0o you realize you have to beat OTHER teams to get to us right suns fan?

how many times did we hear those suns homers (who were so certain they could beat us...) say how quentin won them games with his shooting and scoring....
lol!

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Considering I posted here everyday during the series and never saw more than a half-dozen Suns fans, I call BS on your statement. Louis, Catharsis, SirChaz and myself were even thanked for what we brought here.

As far as I know, none of us picked the Suns to defeat the Spurs, nor talked up Richardson as the Suns Savior.

And Last I checked, the Spurs still have to do everything the Suns will have to to get the Western Conference Finals as well.

Fact is, the Suns will be much improved. They were a team that held fourth-quarter leads this year, but couldn't quite hang on. They now have experience and added depth. They've addressed their two biggest needs while getting rid of their weakest link.

No one is asking you to concede, rather acknowledge that it likely won't be as easy as it was this past year.

lol tru, instead of 4-1 we shall take u out 4-2

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Originally Posted by JMarkJohns

Considering I posted here everyday during the series and never saw more than a half-dozen Suns fans, I call BS on your statement. Louis, Catharsis, SirChaz and myself were even thanked for what we brought here.

As far as I know, none of us picked the Suns to defeat the Spurs, nor talked up Richardson as the Suns Savior.

And Last I checked, the Spurs still have to do everything the Suns will have to to get the Western Conference Finals as well.

Fact is, the Suns will be much improved. They were a team that held fourth-quarter leads this year, but couldn't quite hang on. They now have experience and added depth. They've addressed their two biggest needs while getting rid of their weakest link.

No one is asking you to concede, rather acknowledge that it likely won't be as easy as it was this past year.

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another thing you fail to realize is that if Steve Nash has an equal year to last year or better, he will be one of the greatest pg's of all time

not saying its impossible, but it happens rarely, especially with older players

Look at sam cassell after he had his bad ass season in 2004...

do you expect nash to repeat his mvp performance another year? He'll probalby be a gear slower...or two if youre not lucky...

amare will improve and basically thats all yall got

shawn marion has a history of being owned by the spurs
and face it man, so does steve nash....you forget this is the man who ran AWAY from his defensive assignment in Steve Kerr in the WCF 2003, and this is AFTER kerr had already sunk 3 threes!!

Steve Nash hit some amazing shots in game 4, god i was totally shocked. but then they all blew it in game 5...

Raja Bell can guard Manu Ginobili about as well as Shawn Bradley can Shaq.....

The Suns and their used-car salesman coach make me laugh. They get shithammered in the WCF and they think Kurt Fucking Thomas and Raja Bell are going to make a difference? That's like us picking up Rasho Nesterovic and Hedo Turkoglu in an attempt to get better...on wait we did that.

ye steve nash must hate lookin at duncan, cuz the closest he has come to a ring

is WCF twice, and lost both times to him.

can anyone tell me if the NBA will fine Manu for tampering?

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Originally Posted by Walton Buys Off Me

Raja Bell can guard Manu Ginobili about as well as Shawn Bradley can Shaq.....

The Suns and their used-car salesman coach make me laugh. They get shithammered in the WCF and they think Kurt Fucking Thomas and Raja Bell are going to make a difference? That's like us picking up Rasho Nesterovic and Hedo Turkoglu in an attemot to get better...on wait we did that.

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:lol :lol :lol rackkkkkkkkkkk

i've said it all year and i'll say it again

the suns this season were trying to be the mavs of 2003....but instead of a Dirk they had an Amare. Well....that mavs team took us to 6 games using walt williams........

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Originally Posted by clubalien

can anyone tell me if the NBA will fine Manu for tampering?

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Most of us thought you were joking. You should probably just pretend you were.

Johnson is fully capable of playing at the SF position.

As for Bell being a scrub :rolleyes There were several here who pegged him a priority as a free agent and replacement for Bowen. Thanks for proving my point about if it's not San Antonio, then it's not good.

I fail to see how 12ppg on 45% and 40% from range qualifies as a scrub :blah

Obviously no one really knows until the games are played, but while I might be expecting a bit too much, lots here are just being silly/petty.

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Originally Posted by JMarkJohns

Johnson is fully capable of playing at the SF position.

As for Bell being a scrub :rolleyes There were several here who pegged him a priority as a free agent and replacement for Bowen. Thanks for proving my point about if it's not San Antonio, then it's not good.

I fail to see how 12ppg on 45% and 40% from range qualifies as a scrub :blah

Obviously no one really knows until the games are played, but while I might be expecting a bit too much, lots here are just being silly/petty.

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the people that said that were also totally owned by those of us who said this guy cant play small forward

its not all about percentages....u guys were a high scoring offense, raja bell shooting all those shots nash will create, he wont hit as often as Q just cuz his career percentages are better

Speaking of petty, how petty was it for Suns owner, Robert Sarver, mocking an injured Tim Duncan, by flapping his arms like the San Diego chicken, during the last Spurs/Suns regular season game in America West arena? Sure that was real mature on the part of an asshole owner.

If you're gonna dish it out, you'd better be ready to take it.

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he wont hit as often as Q just cuz his career percentages are better

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He won't hit as often because he won't shoot as often. Which is good when you have players like Johnson and Stoudemire who make half of their shots instead of bricking long three pointers and giving the opponent fast break opportunities.

Spurs have proven they can run and score with the best of them and play hard nosed defense at the other end. Suns have yet to prove the latter. Adding 2 defensive players (one who is a bench player BTW) will not do that much for them. I'll give you that the Suns have improved somewhat with the addition of Bell and Thomas, but who's to say that the Spurs aren't going to improve even more next year also? Parker still has room to grow as does Manu, and Duncan should be healthier and playing on 2 strong ankles, we may get Scola....a lot can happen.

If climbing Mountains were so easy....wouldn't everyone be doing it? :)

u kno, when he did that, i was like man i feel sorry for the suns, if they run

into the spurs they are gonna get massacred, which they did, but the spurs

were too classy to rub that in when the series ended

4-1... yes, but the games were all close until the final minutes. a few defensive rebounds (where Thomas helps) or a few more misses (Bell) and the games are toss ups.

Yes, 4-1 Spurs. But the Suns didn't have, then had an injured Johnson and barely got any production from Marion/Richardson. Yet the Spurs couldn't put the Suns away until minute left in the fourth in most games.

Spurs won, but you can stop pretending it was a shithammering and that their improvements won't do anything to help. The games were close and the Spurs won out despite being held to a lower FG% in the series (48% to 49% for the Suns).

But hey, I guess since you had swept the Lakers in 99 kept them from improving and winning over the next three years, right? Or that since the Lakers swept you in 2001, that it kept you from improving and winning years later?!?!

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Originally Posted by SenorSpur

Speaking of petty, how petty was it for Suns owner, Robert Sarver, mocking an injured Tim Duncan, by flapping his arms like the San Diego chicken, during the last Spurs/Suns regular season game in America West arena? Sure that was real mature on the part of an asshole owner.

If you're gonna dish it out, you'd better be ready to take it.

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I believe I was on this site criticizing the very actions :angel

Sarvar was and still can be an idiot about things.

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Originally Posted by clubalien

can anyone tell me if the NBA will fine Manu for tampering?

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The guy was making a joke! Can't you people understand satire!?

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Originally Posted by JMarkJohns

Fact is, the Suns will be much improved. They were a team that held fourth-quarter leads this year, but couldn't quite hang on. They now have experience and added depth. They've addressed their two biggest needs while getting rid of their weakest link.

No one is asking you to concede, rather acknowledge that it likely won't be as easy as it was this past year.

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As long as the suns coach keeps his same strategy to burn out his starters during the season, phx will once again fade at the end of 4th quarters in the playoffs. Nash will be one year older (32) and more susceptible to injury. It's no lock that Nash will be durable. Without a decent backup PG, the suns will not be able to run the fast paced offense. It will be interesting to see what type of defense the suns try to employ

LOLOLLOL
phoenix got so owned oh man im gonna go watch my phoenix series tapes
later

"i think its all about them playing 5 guys 45 minutes"

--Horry

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Originally Posted by GoSpurs21

As long as the suns coach keeps his same strategy to burn out his starters during the season, phx will once again fade at the end of 4th quarters in the playoffs. Nash will be one year older (32) and more susceptible to injury. It's no lock that Nash will be durable. Without a decent backup PG, the suns will not be able to run the fast paced offense. It will be interesting to see what type of defense the suns try to employ

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There's something I'll agree with. D'Antoni did a poor job of developing the youth on the Suns last year, eventually trading three of the players (Lampe, Zarko, Vroman) and another youngin' in Jacobson. He failed to do anything of significance with Barbosa or Hunter until pressed.

However, with Thomas replacing Hunter and Bell being added, hopefully experience will help should troubles arise. Johnson is a very good backup PG, able to slow things down or run the break. Hopefully Barbosa gets some significant' PT early this season.

But unlike last year, the Suns are a bit deeper this year. They still have some money to spend from their exceptions, so they could get even deeper.

Word on the street!????

The only street this damn reporter knows is the street where you pick up $20 nasty hookers. He's full of shit

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Originally Posted by JMarkJohns

4-1... yes, but the games were all close until the final minutes. a few defensive rebounds (where Thomas helps) or a few more misses (Bell) and the games are toss ups.

Yes, 4-1 Spurs. But the Suns didn't have, then had an injured Johnson and barely got any production from Marion/Richardson. Yet the Spurs couldn't put the Suns away until minute left in the fourth in most games.

Spurs won, but you can stop pretending it was a shithammering and that their improvements won't do anything to help. The games were close and the Spurs won out despite being held to a lower FG% in the series (48% to 49% for the Suns).

But hey, I guess since you had swept the Lakers in 99 kept them from improving and winning over the next three years, right? Or that since the Lakers swept you in 2001, that it kept you from improving and winning years later?!?!

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Not to take anything away from the Suns great year...which no doubt they had and also I am not doubting that they have improved for next season...you're arguement that the games were pretty close is kinda crap.

But the Suns didn't have, then had an injured Johnson.
But the Spurs had an injured Devin Brown? He was a huge factor to the Spurs success in the previous games against the Suns...

barely got any production from Marion/Richardson
Marion/Richardson barely got any production due to Bruce Bowen...who will still be there next season. For an all-star to average something like 7.8 ppg, after averaging something like 24 ppg in previous rounds is a considerable drop. That's all due to Spurs defense which will still be there next season.

4-1... yes, but the games were all close until the final minutes. a few defensive rebounds (where Thomas helps) or a few more misses (Bell) and the games are toss ups.
The simple fact is, Suns let the Spurs shoot something like 72% in the 4th quarter for 3 of those games. That is a crazy stat. I highly doubt Kurt Thomas and Raja Bell are going to help you out that much in those aspects.

You say put Raja Bell on Manu and JJ on Parker? That leaves Bruce Bowen, Brent Barry, and Robert Horry open from 3 pt land, who's going to be the defensive stoppers then for you?

The reason why the Spurs beat the Suns 4-1 is because Spurs can run one end of the floor and play TEAM DEFENSE at the other end. Suns have yet to grasp the latter idea. Having 2 somewhat average defensive players/rebounders on a team of 12....isn't going to help you that much against teams like the Spurs, Pistons, Pacers, and even the Heat.

Yeah, the Suns lost CBF, but they held fourth-quarter leads in several games. The games, not the series is what I'm arguing. They are now better equipped to hold on to the leads with the defense and rebounding. They have 82 games to figure things out as to how.

As for injuries, it's not like Duncan and Ginobili haven't had injury history or a style the lends itself to nagging injuries. For as much talk as their is with Nash ans his age/injury, Duncan and Ginobili are just as susceptable.

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Originally Posted by JMarkJohns

4-1... yes, but the games were all close until the final minutes. a few defensive rebounds (where Thomas helps) or a few more misses (Bell) and the games are toss ups.

Yes, 4-1 Spurs. But the Suns didn't have, then had an injured Johnson and barely got any production from Marion/Richardson. Yet the Spurs couldn't put the Suns away until minute left in the fourth in most games.

Spurs won, but you can stop pretending it was a shithammering and that their improvements won't do anything to help. The games were close and the Spurs won out despite being held to a lower FG% in the series (48% to 49% for the Suns).

But hey, I guess since you had swept the Lakers in 99 kept them from improving and winning over the next three years, right? Or that since the Lakers swept you in 2001, that it kept you from improving and winning years later?!?!

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What's up with all the "ifs" and "buts"? There is a reason Marion/Richardson were MIA during that series. Just as much as there was a reason the Suns only one a single game.

If "ifs" and "buts" were "candy" and "nuts", the Suns and everybody else would have a Merry Christmas and a share of championship glory. Guess what? It didn't happen!

It doesn't matter how close the games were or whether they were of blowout fashion. The bottom line is the better team won, in convincing fashion - I might add.

As far as the historical commentary, the last time I checked Lakers have won three championships in a row, the Spurs have how three in seven seasons and the Suns have won how many? Ooops - "0". :elephant

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Originally Posted by JMarkJohns

I believe I was on this site criticizing the very actions :angel

Sarvar was and still can be an idiot about things.

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OK, I'll give you a pass on that.

phoenix is making some good moves, but i think they see their window for a championship as steve nash, not amare. thats why they're making bold moves now (even going so far to hold on to jj for max money) that will be close to 4 players making the max in a year or two.

their offense seems to fold without nash in control... their coach (who seems like a good guy) basically rides him and counts on him to make the calls. i thought they should have gone after solid backup help for him and not touch the rest of the team... get an antonio daniels to back up nash and Q... and then get a guy like j james to come in off the bench. that would have probably caused more problems for the spurs... and saved nash's legs.

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Originally Posted by MaNuMaNiA

The guy was making a joke! Can't you people understand satire!?

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Ever heard of jokes that are in "poor taste"? If he was so, amused about his actions, why did the jerk apologize? Don't sound like satire to me? Sounds more like classless, unsportsmanlike, childish behavior by an overzealous guy with a lot of cash.

this thread is turnin into bitching and pissing contest.

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Originally Posted by SenorSpur

Ever heard of jokes that are in "poor taste"? If he was so, amused about his actions, why did the jerk apologize? Don't sound like satire to me? Sounds more like classless, unsportsmanlike, childish behavior by an overzealous guy with a lot of cash.

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not even mark cuban acts like that...
(and i hate cuban)

Allow me to get it back on track. The Suns are making some very interesting moves, for which I commend them. It remains to be seen how they'll manage their cap situation with JJ apparently getting a max deal from ATL.

We'll see how it all shake out.

The suns need a new coach its as simple as that. Sure its nice to have a coach

that lets them play the runnin game and letting people get big stats, but when ur

runnin game breaks down, and the players look to the bench for their coach,

they get nothing. best move they can make is get rid of the coach

wasn't bell the one who lost his cool vs ginobli? i don't really think the suns offseason moves improve them very much, it certainly takes a lot away from their high octane offense, which is what got them so far this year. if they tinker with what they had too much, they could end up a 4 or 5 seed easily.

coach himself admits he barely does anything

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Originally Posted by SenorSpur

Allow me to get it back on track. The Suns are making some very interesting moves, for which I commend them.

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which is gonna make it sweeter for me to watch Spurs woop their ass again in the playoffs. :devil

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Originally Posted by JMarkJohns

Yeah, the Suns lost CBF, but they held fourth-quarter leads in several games. The games, not the series is what I'm arguing. They are now better equipped to hold on to the leads with the defense and rebounding. They have 82 games to figure things out as to how.

As for injuries, it's not like Duncan and Ginobili haven't had injury history or a style the lends itself to nagging injuries. For as much talk as their is with Nash ans his age/injury, Duncan and Ginobili are just as susceptable.

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typical sign of a fan who is not used to his team being in the playoffs


that means jack shit jmarkjohns

we had fourth quarter leads on the lakers in several games in 2002 and 2001....and we still got our asses kicked.....

ye man that pissed me off , in 2002 when we lost to 4-1 to the lakers their 3rd title

we had leads in all 4 losses, and i think 2 of them were around 10. That is

when kobe really made his name, cuz he single handedly beat us again and again.

they should really start handin out playoff mvps cuz kobe clearly deserved 2 of the 3mvps shaq got

shaq only takes over in the finals when he knows a trophy is on the line

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Originally Posted by Banks91

ye man that pissed me off , in 2003 when we lost to 4-1 to the lakers their 3rd title

we had leads in all 4 losses, and i think 2 of them were around 10. That is

when kobe really made his name, cuz he single handedly beat us again and again.

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yeah how many tip ins off of missed shaq free throws did he get?
how many of those were dunks?

we blew our leads just like the suns did

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Originally Posted by 1Parker1

Not to take anything away from the Suns great year...which no doubt they had and also I am not doubting that they have improved for next season...you're arguement that the games were pretty close is kinda crap.

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No, it's not. The Spurs won the games, i'm not taking anything away from them. But the did so IN the fourth quarters and in games 1 & 2, did so in the mid-to-late fourth quarters.

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--But the Suns didn't have, then had an injured Johnson.--
But the Spurs had an injured Devin Brown? He was a huge factor to the Spurs success in the previous games against the Suns...

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Please :rolleyes That's like you losing Manu or Parker then the Suns being without Barbosa.

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--barely got any production from Marion/Richardson--
Marion/Richardson barely got any production due to Bruce Bowen...who will still be there next season. For an all-star to average something like 7.8 ppg, after averaging something like 24 ppg in previous rounds is a considerable drop. That's all due to Spurs defense which will still be there next season.

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Partly. Richardson was in a funk since the Memphis series. Marion is due to Bowen, but with Jackson and Bell, two player who can shoot AND create their own shots (unlike Marion), the Suns might actually be a tougher offensive team. Bowen won't be able to guard them the same way he did Marion. Marion's skills allows for him to be taken out of games because his point come from open shots, transition and put-backs. He wasn't getting many of the first two and wasn't able to hit the boards for the latter.

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--4-1... yes, but the games were all close until the final minutes. a few defensive rebounds (where Thomas helps) or a few more misses (Bell) and the games are toss ups.--
The simple fact is, Suns let the Spurs shoot something like 72% in the 4th quarter for 3 of those games. That is a crazy stat. I highly doubt Kurt Thomas and Raja Bell are going to help you out that much in those aspects.

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Yeah, because adding two defensive player won't help with defensive needs.

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You say put Raja Bell on Manu and JJ on Parker? That leaves Bruce Bowen, Brent Barry, and Robert Horry open from 3 pt land, who's going to be the defensive stoppers then for you?

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No, I didn't. And unless you're running a lineup of five wings, I doubt that the Suns will need to guard all five you named at the same time.

Bell/Johnson on Manu. That's the main thing. What you are failing to grasp is that the Suns horrible defense held the Spurs to a lower FG% than the Suns shot (48% to 49%). Phoenix main problem was defensive rebounding, as they allowed 15 per game (compared to 11 for Phoenix). They have now added a top-5 defensive rebounder in Thomas without losing any of their main rebounders from last year.

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The reason why the Spurs beat the Suns 4-1 is because Spurs can run one end of the floor and play TEAM DEFENSE at the other end. Suns have yet to grasp the latter idea. Having 2 somewhat average defensive players/rebounders on a team of 12....isn't going to help you that much against teams like the Spurs, Pistons, Pacers, and even the Heat.

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True, but explain the lower FG% for San Antonio? As for the average defensive players/rebounders, Marion, Johnson and Bell are all very tough on the perimeter. They aren't in Bowen's league, but they provide wing depth for defense. Amare, Thomas and Marion can all average over 9 boards next year in this style. I'd hardly say that's average.

I guess we'll just have to wait and see.

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Originally Posted by Cant_Be_Faded

typical sign of a fan who is not used to his team being in the playoffs


that means jack shit jmarkjohns

we had fourth quarter leads on the lakers in several games in 2002 and 2001....and we still got our asses kicked.....

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Yeah, but you learned from it and have since won two Titles.

It means nothing unless you can learn from it.

I've been a Suns fan since 88. They've missed the playoffs twice since :blah

Not every team has the luxery of two top-10 bigs within a decade. We had Barkley for about two years (healthy) and three years-plus total. Then we had McDyess for 6 months and now Amare.

Hardly something to combat Robinson/Duncan... So, enjoy. :rolleyes Not every team has three bad season within a decade and comes out with two #1 picks.

tru that, spurs have been lucky that the only times they ended up having bad

seasons have resulted in robinson and duncan, but spurs managed to keep them

which is also important

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Originally Posted by JMarkJohns

Considering I posted here everyday during the series and never saw more than a half-dozen Suns fans, I call BS on your statement. Louis, Catharsis, SirChaz and myself were even thanked for what we brought here.

As far as I know, none of us picked the Suns to defeat the Spurs, nor talked up Richardson as the Suns Savior.

And Last I checked, the Spurs still have to do everything the Suns will have to to get the Western Conference Finals as well.

Fact is, the Suns will be much improved. They were a team that held fourth-quarter leads this year, but couldn't quite hang on. They now have experience and added depth. They've addressed their two biggest needs while getting rid of their weakest link.

No one is asking you to concede, rather acknowledge that it likely won't be as easy as it was this past year.

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I think you're putting the cart ahead of the horse. I understand why you should be optimistic about your team...you had one of the top 4 teams in the league last year. However, just because you make moves does not mean your team is better. I don't see how giving up Q and Nate Robinson for Kurt Thomas makes you better. The Suns' game is about speed, Robinson would have added to that and made it even tougher to keep up with you guys. Honestly, without some more moves that helps your team, I don't see the Suns better than they were last year. One of the biggest edges you had last year was the running game, but by trying to keep up with the Spurs you have made yourselves more vulnerable to other teams. If you lose Joe Johnson, I don't even think you win your division next year.

This is what Manu did in the one game Bell started against him:

Code:

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Date Opp Result Min  FGM-A 3PM-A FTM-A OFF DEF TOT AST ST BL TO PF PTS
 Mar 06 vs. Jazz  101-94 W  35  7-11  3-4  14-15  0  8  8  7  1  0  3  4  31

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Yes...you do see...

31 points
8 rebounds
7 assists
15 trips to the Free Throw Line.

That was his best game against the Jazz in points, rebounds, assists, FG% and FTA...

Even if it is true that Manu doesn't like playing against Bell, that doesn't translate to him playing badly...in fact, unfortunately for the Suns, it translates to him playing even better.

My guess is that it's because Manu doesn't like guys that take cheapshots.

It probably is true that Manu doesn't like Bell...because Bell picked up a flagrant and a tech against him and should have been called for another flagrant, in that one start...

To me that just says Manu is going to be even more fired up than normal and Bell is going to pick up a lot of fast break killing fouls on Manu...

Good job Suns...can you say sweep?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by whottt

This is what Manu did in the one game Bell started against him:

Code:

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Date Opp Result Min  FGM-A 3PM-A FTM-A OFF DEF TOT AST ST BL TO PF PTS
 Mar 06 vs. Jazz  101-94 W  35  7-11  3-4  14-15  0  8  8  7  1  0  3  4  31

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That was his best game against the Jazz in points, rebounds, assists, FG% and FTA...

Even if it is true that Manu doesn't like playing against Bell, that doesn't translate do him playing badly...in fact, unfortunately for the Suns, it translates to him playing even better.

My guess is that it's because Manu doesn't like guys that take cheapshots.

It probably is true that Manu doesn't like Bell...because Bell picked up a flagrant and a tech against him and should have been called for another flagrant, in that one start...

To me that just says Manu is going to be even more fired up than normal and Bell is going to pick up a lot of fast break killing fouls on Manu...

Good job Suns...can you say sweep?

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Thanks for adding your perspective

Scoreboard.

Enough already.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by SpursChampsIII

I think you're putting the cart ahead of the horse. I understand why you should be optimistic about your team...you had one of the top 4 teams in the league last year. However, just because you make moves does not mean your team is better. I don't see how giving up Q and Nate Robinson for Kurt Thomas makes you better. The Suns' game is about speed, Robinson would have added to that and made it even tougher to keep up with you guys. Honestly, without some more moves that helps your team, I don't see the Suns better than they were last year. One of the biggest edges you had last year was the running game, but by trying to keep up with the Spurs you have made yourselves more vulnerable to other teams. If you lose Joe Johnson, I don't even think you win your division next year.

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I've answered all the questions and addressed all the issues you've posed in other posts. Obviously a lot depends on Johnson.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by JMarkJohns

What you are failing to grasp is that the Suns horrible defense held the Spurs to a lower FG% than the Suns shot (48% to 49%).

True, but explain the lower FG% for San Antonio?

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Am I missing something or is that a difference of only 1%? You are acting like the Suns outshot the Spurs by 7-10% or something. I am sorry to say, but Kurt Thomas isn't going to be such a big help to you on the defensive end and he's going to have a harder time grabbing those rebounds here in the West against Duncan and Nazr in the paint.

Parker, please go check Thomas' splits vs. the West and other top bigs for last year.

I doubt he struggles the way you hope he does.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by JMarkJohns

Parker, please go check Thomas' splits vs. the West and other top bigs for last year.

I doubt he struggles the way you hope he does.

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I am not hoping for anything. I just don't see how well he'll fit in with the Suns run and gun style that's all. Plus, guarding Tim Duncan/Nazr/Rasho is going to be a tough assignment for him.

"Manu Ginobili, called him to protest"

If I've understood ANYTHING about Manu's character and personality, this would be totally out of character. The writer is a fucking liar.

Amare is the only player that makes me scared of the Suns. If he (and his coach and team) commit themselves to play defense from the first regular season game, the Suns will have just as good a title shot as anyone else.

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Originally Posted by nkdlunch

Word on the street!????

The only street this damn reporter knows is the street where you pick up $20 nasty hookers. He's full of shit

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Word. What a fucking asshole this reporter is.

The only way the Suns can beat the Spurs is the way the Pistons did in 3 games in the Finals, with a big D and I mean a Real D...
I doubt it about the Suns because they aren´t deep enough even with Thomas and Bell...

Nash was out of fuel in last quarters every game(when the Suns struggles)... and nobody can do what he does... ask Amare...
Don´t care about who they sign... without Nash they can do much...

And even when I don´t like too much TParker I hope he can guard him much, much better this year...

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Originally Posted by 1Parker1

I doubt Manu would call up his agent and say something like that. :rolleyes

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If he did, it was on his Time Warner Digital Phone, don'tcha know!

:lol

This so called writer is trying to create hope for the Suns, I mean, do you remember back in March, when the Suns were called an unstoppable force?

Then, reality check, they struggled against the Mavs and were very close of being swept by the Spurs. So desperate teams make desperate moves, while desperate writers make desperate articles, trying to build some confidence from the Suns fans to their team.

So with that in mind, he obviously wrote (or made up) the Manu paragraph. If Manu would have said that, the writer should have quoted him. But he didn't, to cover his ass in case Manu decides to sue him. But he won't. Word in the street is that he doesn't give a damn about classless writers, from teams that don't have a ring.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by JMarkJohns

No, it's not. The Spurs won the games, i'm not taking anything away from them. But the did so IN the fourth quarters and in games 1 & 2, did so in the mid-to-late fourth quarters.

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Well, the Jordan Bulls rode an awful lot of 4th quarter wins and even last-shot wins to their titles. The more titles you win, the less likely it is to be an accident. With 2 of the last 3, the Spurs arrow is sure pointing the right way on this one.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by JMarkJohns

Marion is due to Bowen, but with Jackson and Bell, two player who can shoot AND create their own shots (unlike Marion), the Suns might actually be a tougher offensive team.

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Raja Bell can create his own shots? I don't think I've been watching the same NBA you do.

The Suns must pray to RA or Apollo for a healthy Nash... and a good Defense :cooldevil

Anytime a "reporter" has the phrase "word on the street" in his "article", the reporter should be fired.

Excuse me... but Manu didn´t blame Tyshaun in the Finals and is whining now?!!

Now Manu will be the Flopper and the Whiner!?
Not the whiner... THE WINNER!!!!

:D

the word on the street is that the spurs will repeat

Climbing Mt. San Antonio is pretty straightforward:

Mt. San Antonio:

Quote:

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Mt. San Antonio or better known as Mt. Baldy is the "crown jewel" of the San Gabriel Mountains in Southern California. Although it is not the highest mountain in Southern California it is the highest in the San Gabriel Mt. Range. Mt. Baldy is visible from much of Southern California and much of Southern California can be seen from it's summit on a clear day. It is one of the most photographed objects of the Southern California landscape It's snow covered peak has appeared on post cards and tourist literature for many years. There are four popular routes to the summit. All are considered moderate hikes of 8.5 to 13 miles round trip and anywhere from 3,600 feet to 6,000 feet of elevation gain. All routes can be hiked year round but you'll need snowshoes and/or crampons and ice axe during winter months.

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They can do this on vacation after the Spurs knock them out of the playoffs again next year.

Funny how years ago we were geared to beat the Lakers and now the Suns are gearing up to beat the Spurs.

Their whole philosophy to play defense has to change in order to compete.

BTW i heard that manu was talking to agent about bell on KABB 29 newes @ 9 too

Quote:

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Originally Posted by DDS4

Funny how years ago we were geared to beat the Lakers and now the Suns are gearing up to beat the Spurs.

Their whole philosophy to play defense has to change in order to compete.

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Aint it cool when your team is good enough only to worry about 2 or 3 teams and you can build your roster accordenly

We are in there heads! hahah suns!
Tell your greaseball player to wash his hair once a year ... (nash)

Since everyone is so worried about Nash's health, the same concern involve Duncan. Injuries can happen to anyone and without any happening I would give the suns at 100% a good chance to beat the spurs. Ginobili will see different defenders like Marion, Johnson, and Bell. He will not go off like before.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Spursdaone

Since everyone is so worried about Nash's health, the same concern involve Duncan. Injuries can happen to anyone and without any happening I would give the suns at 100% a good chance to beat the spurs. Ginobili will see different defenders like Marion, Johnson, and Bell. He will not go off like before.

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With their Run and Gun offense, they're more prone to injuries. Especially Nash, since his teams play goes south once he sits, his rest during games is rare. I don't see the Suns getting any closer than this last time. That is if you call 4-1 close!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Spursdaone

Since everyone is so worried about Nash's health, the same concern involve Duncan. Injuries can happen to anyone and without any happening I would give the suns at 100% a good chance to beat the spurs. Ginobili will see different defenders like Marion, Johnson, and Bell. He will not go off like before.

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Then who guards Parker?

Duncan is 7'0. The way he attacks the rim I'm not surprised that he gets ankle injuries. I'm surprised there aren't more injuries coming from the 7'0 and above players. Duncan, Garnett, and Nowitzki seem like prime time candidates for ankle injuries because of being athletic and being tall. Nash has perfect balance and it would take someone to knock into him for an injury to occur. Ginobili is more reckless than Nash anyway.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by SpursFanInAustin

Then who guards Parker?

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Bell or Johnson

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Spursdaone

Bell or Johnson

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Then who will guard Duncan? and who does Nash take, especially if the Spurs resign Devin Brown and the Spurs use Parker, Manu, and Brown on the perimeter?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by SpursFanInAustin

Then who will guard Duncan? and who does Nash take, especially if the Spurs resign Devin Brown and the Spurs use Parker, Manu, and Brown on the perimeter?

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The same question would be ask back. Who is gonna guard Joe Johnson or Marion if Bowen is out of the game? I think Bowen will be playing alot and Joe Johnson would play the point guard for most of the time Bowen is out with Bell and Jim Jackson. Thomas and Stoudemire will take turns guarding Duncan. There aren't too many weaknesses with this Suns defense now.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Spursdaone

The same question would be ask back. Who is gonna guard Joe Johnson or Marion if Bowen is out of the game? I think Bowen will be playing alot and Joe Johnson would play the point guard for most of the time Bowen is out with Bell and Jim Jackson. Thomas and Stoudemire will take turns guarding Duncan. There aren't too many weaknesses with this Suns defense now.

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Stoudemire and Thomas guarding Duncan is :lol especially Amare.

so Joe Johnson is gonna play 48 minutes a game? He'll have no legs in the 4th

Devin Brown guarded Marion in that 4th qtr of that 2nd regular season game, and I'd say he did an excellent job, considering the Spurs cameback from 16 down. That meant that the Suns, including Marion weren't scoring.

Bell and Jim Jackson will come in for Nash and Joe Johnson. Joe Johnson won't have to play the shooting guard as much now due to extra depth in the back court. Marion is starting at small forward so that alone makes the depth better .

Whatever the Suns' combination of players, they'll have another "run-n-fun" season. However this year, they won't have the luxury of "sneaking up" on anybody. They'll be lauded for this entertaining style and will probably be the supposed team that "no one wants to play". Yet, the Spurs will still KICK THEIR ASS when the chips are down.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Spursdaone

The same question would be ask back. Who is gonna guard Joe Johnson or Marion if Bowen is out of the game? I think Bowen will be playing alot and Joe Johnson would play the point guard for most of the time Bowen is out with Bell and Jim Jackson. Thomas and Stoudemire will take turns guarding Duncan. There aren't too many weaknesses with this Suns defense now.

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Except that the guys you mentioned have not proved that they can play team defense. Maybe they can play a liitle one on one but to have team defense you have to have a system. They don't. I believe if they did that their talent and athleticsm would allow them to have a very good defense.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by kskonn

Except that the guys you mentioned have not proved that they can play team defense. Maybe they can play a liitle one on one but to have team defense you have to have a system. They don't. I believe if they did that their talent and athleticsm would allow them to have a very good defense.

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Why do you need a system for man on man defense? If you have good defenders you can be a great defensive team and the suns are much closer now than before.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Spursdaone

Why do you need a system for man on man defense? If you have good defenders you can be a great defensive team and the suns are much closer now than before.

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Yes, and if you go get 5 guys who can score a lot of points, you automatically have a great offense, right? You don't need to worry about silly things like ball movement or setting screens or positioning, you just show up and shoot the ball. Is that it?

I have to say, I think you don't know anything at all about basketball.

He didn't get the worst poster of all time tag for nothing :lol

Quote:

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Anytime a "reporter" has the phrase "word on the street" in his "article", the reporter should be fired.

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The sort of "sources say" reportage that helped us buy into another war in Iraq.

I think this is not a good matchup for Phoenix. Parker is one of the few that make Nash work hard to penetrate. Parker is not overpowered which is the key to the matchup. Detroit will always have a better chance in my opinion over Phoenix because San Antonio likes to run because that is where Parker and Ginobili are at their best.

Quote:

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Detroit will always have a better chance in my opinion over Phoenix because San Antonio likes to run because that is where Parker and Ginobili are at their best.

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Yes, but Detriot's offense is not as good as the Spurs' and the best way to beat Phoenix it to run with them

But Detroit can really exploit the Parker/Billups matchup. They were very close to beating San Antonio in this series. Who knows if Rasheed didn't leave Horry what would've happened. Parker did as good of job on Nash as anyone and Nash isn't getting any younger. This is a matchup nightmare for Phoenix. Phoenix might actually beat Detroit in a close series but the matchups make all the difference.