It doesn't matter how bad the call was, he put the refs in the position to decide the game, this isn't a one time deal with this guy. It's what he does is act stupid
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It doesn't matter how bad the call was, he put the refs in the position to decide the game, this isn't a one time deal with this guy. It's what he does is act stupid
The problem there was not knowing how much time was left, when he realized he was already fucked.Quote:
Originally Posted by Spurminator
It doesn't matter with what Allen did. That's a STUPID foul by Manu. No way to sugarcoat it. Even it's not a flagrant call, it could end up with 2+1 play. Plus, if he does this with LeBron and Wade (If Spurs can get that far), it would be more likely to be called a flagrant foul.
The moment it happend I told Jekka it was a flagrant, so I guess so. That play is a flagrant a good amount of the time in today's NBA. Not sure why Spurs fans in this thread are acting like its not. See way softer flagrants than that. He hit him on his arm and pulled him down. No play on the ball. Tony Allen sold it for sure but Manu put him in a position to do so to begin with.Quote:
Originally Posted by 2centsworth
Should have never gotten to the point where this play mattered anyway, tbh.
Oh, there's so much to be mad about in that fourth quarter it's hard for me to get worked up about this one play. (As opposed to 2006, which was colossally stupid.)
After thinking about it, it was a good foul. There wasn't much time to consider the strategy, and if it hadn't been called a flagrant, nobody would be saying anything about it.
However, the refs review . . . :lmao This might be the first flagrant foul in history to not just be overturned, but for the foulee to then get a flopping fine.
I review the play by play and there was 26secs left. I think you let TA go, but borderline.
I thought TD's dumb tip attempt on Tony's missed layup was worse. TD could have secured an easy RB and ran the clock.
Manu was in no position to foul him in a predictable way on that play, he was behind Allen. There were 3 outcomes possible there:Quote:
Originally Posted by 2centsworth
1. Regular foul, 2 FTs
2. And-1, possible 3 point play
3. Flagrant foul, possible 4-point play
Only 1 of those 3 outcomes is superior to the uncontested layup. The other 2 are worse. And, given the score and the clock, that was a risk he did not have to take, no matter how improbable the latter 2 outcomes were
Any time we start leaving Matt Bonner along up top with the ball we aren't playing our game right. We get into that mode sometimes and Matt just stands there looking like he just got caught stealing. Matt in the game means Matt at the 3pt line, he's a horrible defender and he should never get the ball up top like that. They ran that play several times and it caused them to force up desperation shots.Quote:
Originally Posted by ElNono
We cannot win with Matt Bonner getting big minutes, can't happen.
His foul on dirk was the right play too lol
/ Black bold*non gray /
No where near 40 seconds left when that happend. Under 30.Quote:
Originally Posted by 2centsworth
disagree completely. Manu knew he was giving a HARD FOUL. there are no AND 1s with a hard foul. It was a clearly controlled hard foul. Tony Allen pulled the Flagrant ouf of thin air and the refs ate it up.Quote:
Originally Posted by Warlord23
Oh, yeah. I was furious after that one. Called TD some things of which I am ashamed.Quote:
Originally Posted by 2centsworth
Was a good play by Manu. 90% of the time that just gets called for a personal foul and he shoots his Free Throws.
I thought it was a good foul at the time, and thought it was a good hard playoff foul which Allen sold.
The end result was vintage Manu, however.
The foul by Bonner to ZBO was much more of a dumbass foul tbh...
I'll definitely agree with that. Plenty of blame to go around.Quote:
Originally Posted by Spurminator
the spurs execution down the stretch was shitty. plenty of dumb plays
you know it's a bad take when Magic JOhnson AND Bill SImmons agree with the OP :lmao
It was a bad foul by Manu. If you're Manu, you're options are:
1. Let him lay it in
2. Wrap him up -- which at most allows an and-1.
3. Foul him hard where you don't risk the and-1 but you risk a flagrant.
The Spurs were up four so either of the first two options were far superior. The third option is the only one that can end up tying the game.
I mean, obviously Allen flopped ... but you pull someone down with force out of the air and they land awkwardly ... that's going to be called a flagrant a lot of the time.
This wasn't Dirk 2006 dumb but it was pretty far up there on the bad decision scale. Rewinding further, the one thing he couldn't do in that possession was turn the ball over to give the Grizzlies a fast break -- anything else and the game doesn't go to overtime.....
You say that with the benefit of hindsight. What if Allen actually hit his head when he went to the floor? There are a lot of plays which are called flagrant not just based on intent but based on the impact to the player. Also, regarding the and-1, Manu pulled down on Allen's left arm only. Allen could have flipped the ball up with his right and made an improbable shot for the and-1. Even if it's a 1% probability, why take the risk?Quote:
Originally Posted by hater
I disagree with you completely. Even if you only watch ESPN highlights, you'd see many players making that shot by switching hands. It's not like Manu was in front of Allen and tried to block the shot. Allen was in a full movement to an open basket.Quote:
Originally Posted by hater
Yup no And - 1s with those fouls. You know what do get called with those fouls though? Take one guess.Quote:
Originally Posted by hater
It's not like Manu was chasing after Allen. He was right next to him and all he did is extend his arm. I don't think Manu even jumped. He did not grab his collar or head, he grabbed his arm. Legit hard foul by all aspects. It's on videoQuote:
Originally Posted by letmk