Mavericks "Certain" to Trade No. 13 Pick?

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Originally Posted by Chinook

That doesn't matter. A team can't take back salary unless they're under the cap or have a trade exception. Most teams that have cap space have it because they've worked hard to shed salary. They aren't just going to give it up for Carter and a likely bust (and Cunningham, whom you seem to keep forgetting).

You seem to underestimate the value of cap space in big free-agent summers. The Knicks gave Houston Jordan Hill (a rookie 10th-overall selection) a pick and the right to switch picks so that Houston would take Jared Jeffries' $6 Million off their hands. If Dallas can clear the same amount of cap space for just the 13th pick, you better believe they're going to do it.

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Maves don't have any poisonous contract. They won't trade away 13th pick for random players.

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Originally Posted by timmy2003

Maves don't have any poisonous contract. They won't trade away 13th pick for random players.

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They have one in Marion and two other important ones in Carter and Cunningham. They also don't want the actual pick. They don't think it has value to them, and that's why they're trying to move it. I don't know why people are wildly overvaluing late-lottery picks. Besides Leonard, they haven't turned out well lately.

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Originally Posted by Chinook

They have one in Marion and two other important ones in Carter and Cunningham. They also don't want the actual pick. They don't think it has value to them, and that's why they're trying to move it. I don't know why people are wildly overvaluing late-lottery picks. Besides Leonard, they haven't turned out well lately.

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Marion's contract will expire next summer plus I don't think he is significantly over-paid. Carter and Cunningham are paid 3 mil and 1 mil respectively.

How about Green + Bonner for Shawn Marion + 2 or 3 first round picks including one in 2014?

I could live with a PF rotation of Marion/Diaw, basically as good as it gets vs Bron/Durant.

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Originally Posted by Baam

How about Green + Bonner for Shawn Marion + 2 or 3 first round picks including one in 2014?

I could live with a PF rotation of Marion/Diaw, basically as good as it gets vs Bron/Durant.

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You overestimate the value of Green. Noway Maves would give up 2 or 3 first round picks for him.

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Originally Posted by timmy2003

Marion's contract will expire next summer plus I don't think he is significantly over-paid. Carter and Cunningham are paid 3 mil and 1 mil respectively.

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They want to free up the space THIS summer, which is why they're trying to trade in the first place. They need to get a team to take some of their contracts without sending salary back. Teams aren't usually able to do that, and the ones that are usually have plans for that space. That's why the Mavericks have to try to pay a team to do so.

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Originally Posted by Chinook

They want to free up the space THIS summer, which is why they're trying to trade in the first place. They need to get a team to take some of their contracts without sending salary back. Teams aren't usually able to do that, and the ones that are usually have plans for that space. That's why the Mavericks have to try to pay a team to do so.

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If that's the case, the only viable option is Marion.

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Originally Posted by Baam

How about Green + Bonner for Shawn Marion + 2 or 3 first round picks including one in 2014?

I could live with a PF rotation of Marion/Diaw, basically as good as it gets vs Bron/Durant.

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Terrible deal. The Spurs don't make the WCF without Green. They don't make it to Game 7 without him. They're not going to move him unless they get someone better--and that's not Marion. Also, it doesn't save Dallas enough money this season, which defeats the purpose of the trade.

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Originally Posted by timmy2003

If that's the case, the only viable option is Marion.

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Trading away Carter, Cunningham and the pick saves Dallas $5.4-6.2 Million. The other team only has to find the cap space for $4.2 Million, which is a lot easier to get than the $9 Million Marion costs. Plus Dallas would probably like to keep Marion to use in a later deal if they can.

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Originally Posted by Chinook

Trading away Carter, Cunningham and the pick saves Dallas $5.4-6.2 Million. The other team only has to find the cap space for $4.2 Million, which is a lot easier to get than the $9 Million Marion costs. Plus Dallas would probably like to keep Marion to use in a later deal if they can.

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I would take that in a heartbeat. Carter is a solid back-up SG and the 13th pick may turn out to be an all star calibre player.

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Originally Posted by DrunkTXLabrat

if the spurs can get that high of a pick. i love gobert!

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Amen!!! I thought I was the only one.

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Originally Posted by Thomas82

Amen!!! I thought I was the only one.

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Height: 7'2" Wingspan: 7'8.5"
I like him.

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Originally Posted by DrunkTXLabrat

if the spurs can get that high of a pick. i love gobert!

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Amen!!! I thought I was the only one.

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Originally Posted by timmy2003

I would take that in a heartbeat. Carter is a solid back-up SG and the 13th pick may turn out to be an all star calibre player.

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Yeah, the Spurs would only have to trade Bonner and maybe some future picks/rights to players overseas to make that deal happen. I don't know if Dallas would make that deal, though, since they probably don't want to deal with the Spurs.

A possible trade I've heard is Marion (or Carter and Cunning, although less likely) and 13 to Cleveland for 19. Unless the Mavericks really want someone at 19, the Spurs' offer would probably be better.

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Originally Posted by Chinook

There are two reasons why the Carter deal is the most likely:

-Dallas only needs about $3 or 4 Million to get enough space to offer a max contract. So that savings is enough to get Paul or Howard, and they can then use Marion's deal to bring in another player.

-As weird as it sounds, late-lottery picks aren't really valuable nowadays. If they were, then Dallas would keep theirs. A lot of teams would bristle at the idea of eating $8 Million for the pick, especially before they see who falls.

Of course, someone could pull a Golden State and bite on taking Marion. But it's far from certain. What's less likely is that a team will give up an actual productive player for it before the draft, as even role-players like Gary Neal are worth a late-lottery pick to some teams.

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If we can get far enough under the cap, would Bonner + our pick for Marion + theirs would come pretty close to working, right? I don't know if they make that trade within the division, but if they're willing to, it gets us a veteran backup 3 and a pick. Might be an interesting move.

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Originally Posted by Chinook

Terrible deal. The Spurs don't make the WCF without Green. They don't make it to Game 7 without him. They're not going to move him unless they get someone better--and that's not Marion. Also, it doesn't save Dallas enough money this season, which defeats the purpose of the trade.

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Saves more money than Bonner for Carter...

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Originally Posted by tesseractive

If we can get far enough under the cap, would Bonner + our pick for Marion + theirs would come pretty close to working, right? I don't know if they make that trade within the division, but if they're willing to, it gets us a veteran backup 3 and a pick. Might be an interesting move.

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It sounds like an interesting move. Marion's ability to defend multiple positions helps the Spurs.

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Originally Posted by tesseractive

If we can get far enough under the cap, would Bonner + our pick for Marion + theirs would come pretty close to working, right? I don't know if they make that trade within the division, but if they're willing to, it gets us a veteran backup 3 and a pick. Might be an interesting move.

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If the Spurs decide to go under the cap, it will involve them waiving or even amnestying Bonner. If they go that route, they should have enough cap space to just take back Marion without having to send salary to Dallas, which I'm sure they'd prefer. The two teams could agree to that trade during the draft and finalize it after the moratorium in July. So the Spurs could pick their player, Dallas could get their cap space and everyone could be happy.

There's also the possibility of trading Bonner and non-salary assets to Dallas for Carter, Cunningham and 13. I'd actually like Carter a bit for than Marion, because the bench desperately needs a scoring wing. Carter could come in a play the three, and the Spurs could use 13, 27 or and the MLE to bring in another big and defensive wing.

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Originally Posted by tesseractive

If we can get far enough under the cap, would Bonner + our pick for Marion + theirs would come pretty close to working, right? I don't know if they make that trade within the division, but if they're willing to, it gets us a veteran backup 3 and a pick. Might be an interesting move.

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I agree in that kind of deal getting Marion would kill two bird with one stone since we have a real use for Marion.

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Originally Posted by Baam

Saves more money than Bonner for Carter...

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Sorry, you're right. What I meant to say was this:

It's not about saving MORE money; it's about saving ENOUGH money. Both deals save enough money, but one of them gives Dallas more leeway to improve down the road/remain competitive. Marion is a great piece to keep if you can, as he's still a good player and also an expiring contract that can net the Mavericks up to $14.3 Million in incoming salary. Green is a good player, but he doesn't offer much more than Carter does, and Vince would still be on the team. Neither team should WANT to make this trade with Marion instead of Carter/Cunningham.

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Originally Posted by Chinook

If the Spurs decide to go under the cap, it will involve them waiving or even amnestying Bonner. If they go that route, they should have enough cap space to just take back Marion without having to send salary to Dallas, which I'm sure they'd prefer. The two teams could agree to that trade during the draft and finalize it after the moratorium in July. So the Spurs could pick their player, Dallas could get their cap space and everyone could be happy.

There's also the possibility of trading Bonner and non-salary assets to Dallas for Carter, Cunningham and 13. I'd actually like Carter a bit for than Marion, because the bench desperately needs a scoring wing. Carter could come in a play the three, and the Spurs could use 13, 27 or and the MLE to bring in another big and defensive wing.

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As long as there's somebody at 13 that the front office likes, I like either of those moves. Random picks often have a lot more value to us than to most teams.

Ok makes sense...

But then again Marion has an ETO so we could still get him but getting him on his expiring contract was more attractive than signing him to a new deal...

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Originally Posted by tesseractive

As long as there's somebody at 13 that the front office likes, I like either of those moves. Random picks often have a lot more value to us than to most teams.

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I agree. Either this deal would get done during the draft, which would mean someone fell to 13 that the Spurs liked, or it would be done before the draft, which would give the team enough time to package 27 with 13 to maybe move up a couple of spots to get a player. If the Spurs did the Marion deal, they wouldn't be able to package the picks, though, as they wouldn't actually own 13.

What about Andre Kirilenko, he would be the best fit for spurs imo

Trade diaw/neal for a sign and trade maybe

Dallas won't deal with spurs. We're rivals. Like Lakers and Celtics.

End of story.