Translating RC Buford's Summer League Interview

-De Colo had a rough start to summer league but RC isn't worried about him. They've watched him all year long and they are aware of what he can do.

-Baynes is a big, physical player who the Spurs like because he goes hard after rebounds. He also has value because he matches up with Dwight Howard well.

-On DeShaun Thomas: Pop is going to put demands on him that will force him to play differently than he did at Ohio State. He can score -- and score from a lot of different places on the court.

-More Thomas: "His attitude and his eagerness to learn and grow has been overwhelming over the first week. A lot of things will need to go right for him to maximize his opportunity but there is a hole in our roster behind Kawhi right now. We're looking forward to what DeShaun brings and we like his approach so far."

-(I think it's very notable that RC admits that the team is missing a backup small forward. It'll be interesting to see if the Spurs now view Thomas as the answer to the hole or whether they'll try to bring in a veteran.)

-(The good news for Thomas is that RC is already talking about him as if he's part of the team. Coming into the summer league, the Spurs probably were leaning toward trying to convince him to go to Europe. Now after the AK47 wooing fell through and Thomas's strong start in summer league, it looks like the Spurs may view him as the answer at backup SF.)

-He hopes Belinelli will be a good fit. People who know him in the league think he will be a good fit. His skillset fits very well within the Spurs system. His relationship and familiarity with Manu and TP will help ease his transition to the team.

Good

Now we can play in pre-season, season and two playoff rounds and go fishing again

Yeah, options are running thin at the backup SF so I wouldn't mind Thomas getting the last spot.

I wonder if they are still set on resigning Gary Neal. We only have 1 guaranteed spot left and for some reason, I see the Spurs keeping that spot open when the season starts.

http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/show...16#post6761016

and....game 6 still stings like a bitch...

I think the Deshaun Thomas situation is good. A young scoring SF with potential to grow and who could be receptive to coaching. What worries me is that the Spurs aren't at a stage where they will depend upon "potential". They need talent to contribute right away and the backup SF/small ball PF position is a key one and a hole as far as the current Spurs are concerned. In that situation it makes sense for the Spurs to keep their search on for an established backup for Kawhi. They are overloaded at the guard position and something has got to give.

Thomas should be allowed to hone his defensive skills in D-League and be a stop-gap over the season just as Cory Joseph was and based on his development could be slowly integrated.

But the Spurs should try their damnest and hardest to trade Bonner along with either of De Colo or Mills for an asset to shore up the backup SF situation. And confidently hand over reins to Joseph as backup PG.

^ yep, they def will try to get a vet sf before the season starts and thats their first option imo

if they cant get one, they'll still try to take adv of opportunities during the season but thomas will have all the opportunity to get some mins in the regular season

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Originally Posted by Spursfanfromafar

I think the Deshaun Thomas situation is good. A young scoring SF with potential to grow and who could be receptive to coaching. What worries me is that the Spurs aren't at a stage where they will depend upon "potential". They need talent to contribute right away and the backup SF/small ball PF position is a key one and a hole as far as the current Spurs are concerned. In that situation it makes sense for the Spurs to keep their search on for an established backup for Kawhi. They are overloaded at the guard position and something has got to give.

Thomas should be allowed to hone his defensive skills in D-League and be a stop-gap over the season just as Cory Joseph was and based on his development could be slowly integrated.

But the Spurs should try their damnest and hardest to trade Bonner along with either of De Colo or Mills for an asset to shore up the backup SF situation. And confidently hand over reins to Joseph as backup PG.

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This man knows his shit. :tu

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Originally Posted by timvp

-De Colo had a rough start to summer league but RC isn't worried about him. They've watched him all year long and they are aware of what he can do.

-Baynes is a big, physical player who the Spurs like because he goes hard after rebounds. He also has value because he matches up with Dwight Howard well.

-On DeShaun Thomas: Pop is going to put demands on him that will force him to play differently than he did at Ohio State. He can score -- and score from a lot of different places on the court.

-More Thomas: "His attitude and his eagerness to learn and grow has been overwhelming over the first week. A lot of things will need to go right for him to maximize his opportunity but there is a hole in our roster behind Kawhi right now. We're looking forward to what DeShaun brings and we like his approach so far."

-(I think it's very notable that RC admits that the team is missing a backup small forward. It'll be interesting to see if the Spurs now view Thomas as the answer to the hole or whether they'll try to bring in a veteran.)

-(The good news for Thomas is that RC is already talking about him as if he's part of the team. Coming into the summer league, the Spurs probably were leaning toward trying to convince him to go to Europe. Now after the AK47 wooing fell through and Thomas's strong start in summer league, it looks like the Spurs may view him as the answer at backup SF.)

-He hopes Belinelli will be a good fit. People who know him in the league think he will be a good fit. His skillset fits very well within the Spurs system. His relationship and familiarity with Manu and TP will help ease his transition to the team.

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The attitude thing is awesome -- just as important as his scoring. Defensively, he may turn out to be the Gary Neal of forwards, but just like with Gary, it's great to have guys who can come out on the court and score the hell out of the ball.

I feel like we'll probably be okay starting our season with our current roster plus Thomas, and we should have some options at the trade deadline based on what happens.

I'm still not sure we'd rather have DeColo or Mills on the roster than Gary, but it would be hard to give both Marco and Gary minutes in the rotation as backup shooters anyway, so it wouldn't be awful sticking with what we have.

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Originally Posted by Spursfanfromafar

I think the Deshaun Thomas situation is good. A young scoring SF with potential to grow and who could be receptive to coaching. What worries me is that the Spurs aren't at a stage where they will depend upon "potential". They need talent to contribute right away and the backup SF/small ball PF position is a key one and a hole as far as the current Spurs are concerned. In that situation it makes sense for the Spurs to keep their search on for an established backup for Kawhi. They are overloaded at the guard position and something has got to give.

Thomas should be allowed to hone his defensive skills in D-League and be a stop-gap over the season just as Cory Joseph was and based on his development could be slowly integrated.

But the Spurs should try their damnest and hardest to trade Bonner along with either of De Colo or Mills for an asset to shore up the backup SF situation. And confidently hand over reins to Joseph as backup PG.

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While I'm not trying to say I disagree, I don't think it's fair to compare CoJo to DeShaun Thomas, who looks a lot more NBA ready than Cory, who should've stayed at least another year.

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Originally Posted by 8FOR!3

While I'm not trying to say I disagree, I don't think it's fair to compare CoJo to DeShaun Thomas, who looks a lot more NBA ready than Cory, who should've stayed at least another year.

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Maybe. But it's also of note that CoJo has always had an NBA position. Thomas does not.

An obstacle like that can totally break down a career before it starts. So it's hard to call Thomas "NBA-ready". While he might have more NBA-ready skills than CoJo did at the moment, it's still uncertain that he'll be able to see the floor at all. If Thomas can overcome this hurdle then he'll be able to carve out a nice career. If he can't then he'll be off to Europe very quickly - where I have no doubt that he'd carve out a nice career as well. The guy can play - but where? And which league?

The one probably I see with Thomas being added to the roster is you have to open up 2 roster spots for him. You cannot go into the season thinking he will be your primary backup at the 3 so you will probably need to still get a veteran who can play the 3 regularly. I would prefer to see DT in Austin for a season and maybe a player like Linas Klieza (1st FA 3 who came to mind) added for that backup sf spot.

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Originally Posted by timtonymanu

Yeah, options are running thin at the backup SF so I wouldn't mind Thomas getting the last spot.

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If Thomas can work like hell on the Spurs team defense concept, he has chance. He's got an NBA body and he's physical enough to play adequate D. He's just painfully slow. Mind over matter. (He's got the O, that's for sure.)

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Originally Posted by timtonymanu

I wonder if they are still set on resigning Gary Neal. We only have 1 guaranteed spot left and for some reason, I see the Spurs keeping that spot open when the season starts.

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As likeable as he is, I don't see Mills contributing. It's time to consider options to free up that spot. Mills has no trade value, but you have to draw the line at giving anything up (even a 2d round) to move him. No more Scola's.

I just don't see what position he (Thomas) would play because so far he is too slow to play SF and too short to play PF. So where would he play?

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Originally Posted by Russ

As likeable as he is, I don't see Mills contributing. It's time to consider options to free up that spot. Mills has no trade value, but you have to draw the line at giving anything up (even a 2d round) to move him. No more Scola's.

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For the first time in many years, the Spurs are well below the tax threshhold. They can simply waive Mills if they need to create a roster spot.

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Originally Posted by xmas1997

I just don't see what position he (Thomas) would play because so far he is too slow to play SF and too short to play PF. So where would he play?

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Lets be realistic. There are many sf's he could guard with no issues since alot cannot shoot the 3pt shot and DT can be given space to cut off any drives. Then there are many sf's who can only shoot the 3 pt shot but have equal or worse footspeed than DT. Now if you are referring to players like Rudy Gay, LBJ, Durant, Melo's of the NBA, then yes he will have major problems. But, who doesnt with these guys?

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Originally Posted by Mel_13

For the first time in many years, the Spurs are well below the tax threshhold. They can simply waive Mills if they need to create a roster spot.

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Do the Spurs make a habit of waiving players? I don't think so, that is what Dallas does and look how far it's got them.

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Originally Posted by Mel_13

For the first time in many years, the Spurs are well below the tax threshhold. They can simply waive Mills if they need to create a roster spot.

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Tres bien.

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Originally Posted by xmas1997

Do the Spurs make a habit of waiving players? I don't think so, that is what Dallas does and look how far it's got them.

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They've always had the luxury tax threshold as a significant barrier. Waiving one player to sign a different player in most recent seasons would have had tax consequences. This season is different.

Translation? Was he slurring his words?

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Originally Posted by yavozerb

Lets be realistic. There are many sf's he could guard with no issues since alot cannot shoot the 3pt shot and DT can be given space to cut off any drives. Then there are many sf's who can only shoot the 3 pt shot but have equal or worse footspeed than DT. Now if you are referring to players like Rudy Gay, LBJ, Durant, Melo's of the NBA, then yes he will have major problems. But, who doesnt with these guys?

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But what people failing to realize he's not going to be matched up agasint the starters. He's going agasint the other teams 2nd unit and I believe he can hold his own. And I like him as a stretch 4 to kind of like a Mike Miller type.

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Originally Posted by xmas1997

I just don't see what position he (Thomas) would play because so far he is too slow to play SF and too short to play PF. So where would he play?

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I am just curious why people say Thomas is too slow to play SF. Yes, he doesn't have Kawhi, Durant, James speed. But we are talking about him being the Backup SF. How many backup SF in the league are super quick, next to none. He has average NBA speed IMO for a SF. Should try to get faster yes. But even at this point, I don't see a problem with defending most of the backup SF in NBA given some tutelage and coaching.

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Originally Posted by timvp

-De Colo had a rough start to summer league but RC isn't worried about him. They've watched him all year long and they are aware of what he can do.

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Translation: "NBA GM's shouldn't let Nando's rough start dissuade them from making me a trade offer for the guy."

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Originally Posted by coyotes_geek

Translation: "NBA GM's shouldn't let Nando's rough start dissuade them from making me a trade offer for the guy."

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Or more accurately "Please don't laugh at us when we offer De Colo in a trade"

if deshawn thomas does not make the team, do we lose his rights? he looks
good for a rookie.

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Originally Posted by spurs50_

if deshawn thomas does not make the team, do we lose his rights? he looks
good for a rookie.

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Not necessarily. The Spurs are obligated to offer him a bare-bones non-guaranteed contract. He can choose to accept the option or decline this option and play out a season somewhere abroad. Usually this is mutually agreed upon and the team revisits a player like Deshaun Thomas the following season. If Thomas agreed to this and played somewhere else then next season he'd find himself exactly where Marcus Denmon is right now.

However, the player can opt to sign that bare-bones contract if they so choose. Jack McClinton famously did so and "forced the issue" a few years ago after he didn't like the "spend a year in Europe and we'll see" plan. He was waived during training camp that year.

But the Spurs have many examples of stashing players abroad. Marcus Denmon, Davis Bertans, Adam Hanga and Ryan Richards are all examples of currently stashed players. Livio Jean-Charles from this year's draft will also be stashed. Nando De Colo, Tiago Splitter and Manu Ginobili are all examples or players that were previously stashed and brought over at a later date. But they don't all pan out. James Gist was stashed for several seasons and never quite put it together. They finally brought him in for a make or break training camp and ended up waiving him, severing the draft rights connection.

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Originally Posted by spurs50_

if deshawn thomas does not make the team, do we lose his rights? he looks
good for a rookie.

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NO, for 2nd round picks, a team owns their rights indefinitely unless they trade them or just renounce them. Its like Lorbek a couple of years ago in the Kwahi trade, Pacers had his rights for like 6 years before trading them to the Spurs. And also like Denmon last year, where he didn't make the team and went to France to play. Spurs still own his draft rights.

Kawhi isn't what you would call fast either, don't see what the big deal is.

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Originally Posted by Cowboys_Wear_Spurs

NO, for 2nd round picks, a team owns their rights indefinitely unless they trade them or just renounce them. Its like Lorbek a couple of years ago in the Kwahi trade, Pacers had his rights for like 6 years before trading them to the Spurs. And also like Denmon last year, where he didn't make the team and went to France to play. Spurs still own his draft rights.

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The Spurs have to make Thomas a QO which he can accept at any time. If he accepts it then the draft rights are gone because he'll be under contract and the Spurs will be forced into deciding between keeping him on the roster, or making him a FA.

Edit: Or just see the post above yours.

Did anybody see what RC was drinking? I wonder if it had Vodka in it lol

I'm all for Thomas getting a spot on the roster and earning whatever minutes Pop is going to feel comfortable giving him, but I would still like to see a trade happen.

Found the full video of the RC Buford conversation:

http://watch.nba.com/nba/video/games...-interview.nba

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Originally Posted by 8FOR!3

While I'm not trying to say I disagree, I don't think it's fair to compare CoJo to DeShaun Thomas, who looks a lot more NBA ready than Cory, who should've stayed at least another year.

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I believe the two guys were the same high school class (2010) so they came in with much different expectations. Spurs also had room on the roster / Austin to develop him, and he seems to have turned a corner (plus as a first rounder was guaranteed a roster spot, unlike Thomas). DeShaun has to be more NBA-ready coming into the league based on his age alone.

If he performs like this the rest of the way through training camp, he may well find a home on the roster. As Spursfanfromafar said, would be great to upgrade Bonner's expiring + one of the excess PGs into another asset, maybe with an extra year on the back end of the deal as we won't be playing in free agency next summer either. Could then fill out the roster with player traded for + Thomas, who can spend all his time in Austin + maybe Neal at the right price.

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Originally Posted by timvp

-De Colo had a rough start to summer league but RC isn't worried about him. They've watched him all year long and they are aware of what he can do.

-Baynes is a big, physical player who the Spurs like because he goes hard after rebounds. He also has value because he matches up with Dwight Howard well.

-On DeShaun Thomas: Pop is going to put demands on him that will force him to play differently than he did at Ohio State. He can score -- and score from a lot of different places on the court.

-More Thomas: "His attitude and his eagerness to learn and grow has been overwhelming over the first week. A lot of things will need to go right for him to maximize his opportunity but there is a hole in our roster behind Kawhi right now. We're looking forward to what DeShaun brings and we like his approach so far."

-(I think it's very notable that RC admits that the team is missing a backup small forward. It'll be interesting to see if the Spurs now view Thomas as the answer to the hole or whether they'll try to bring in a veteran.)

-(The good news for Thomas is that RC is already talking about him as if he's part of the team. Coming into the summer league, the Spurs probably were leaning toward trying to convince him to go to Europe. Now after the AK47 wooing fell through and Thomas's strong start in summer league, it looks like the Spurs may view him as the answer at backup SF.)

-He hopes Belinelli will be a good fit. People who know him in the league think he will be a good fit. His skillset fits very well within the Spurs system. His relationship and familiarity with Manu and TP will help ease his transition to the team.

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?

I'd prefer to go with Thomas at this point. He's young and inexpensive, just what the Spurs need at this point. It is also important to remember that Boris Diaw can play minutes at the 3, as well as Manu. Barring injuries, our front line can do without Diaw at this point.

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Originally Posted by Raven

?

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Listening to the interview, it sounded like they took Beli in on the word of "people we respect that know his game" and that "they think his skillset will fit right in." It was a weird wording and didn't make it sound as if Pop and RC either really knew his game or were really confident that he would fit in here.

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Originally Posted by Darkwaters

Not necessarily. The Spurs are obligated to offer him a bare-bones non-guaranteed contract. He can choose to accept the option or decline this option and play out a season somewhere abroad. Usually this is mutually agreed upon and the team revisits a player like Deshaun Thomas the following season. If Thomas agreed to this and played somewhere else then next season he'd find himself exactly where Marcus Denmon is right now.

However, the player can opt to sign that bare-bones contract if they so choose. Jack McClinton famously did so and "forced the issue" a few years ago after he didn't like the "spend a year in Europe and we'll see" plan. He was waived during training camp that year.

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In a related story, McClinton has played in China and in the D League, but hasn't gotten so much as a camp invite from the NBA since then.

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Originally Posted by monkeypunk

Listening to the interview, it sounded like they took Beli in on the word of "people we respect that know his game" and that "they think his skillset will fit right in." It was a weird wording and didn't make it sound as if Pop and RC either really knew his game or were really confident that he would fit in here.

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To me it sounded more like a case of Pop & RC simply getting a good report on Belinelli from Spur FO/Coaching staff alums Dell Demps & Monty Williams.

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Originally Posted by tesseractive

In a related story, McClinton has played in China and in the D League, but hasn't gotten so much as a camp invite from the NBA since then.

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China & the D-league was probably McClinton's future from the get-go, but it is worth wondering about how things might have been different had McClinton not forced the Spurs hand by accepting the tender offer right away.

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Originally Posted by coyotes_geek

China & the D-league was probably McClinton's future from the get-go, but it is worth wondering about how things might have been different had McClinton not forced the Spurs hand by accepting the tender offer right away.

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Denmon doesn't look like an NBA player either at this point, but he has an NBA team willing to give him every chance and help him find a good situation even if it's not on the Spurs roster. McClinton burned his bridges, and he really has no one to turn to.

Speaking of ex-Spurs who didn't make it, whatever happened to Malik Hairston? He's playing in Europe, right? How's his career going over there?

Buford interview:

http://www.nba.com/spurs/video/games...nba/index.html

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Originally Posted by tesseractive

Denmon doesn't look like an NBA player either at this point, but he has an NBA team willing to give him every chance and help him find a good situation even if it's not on the Spurs roster. McClinton burned his bridges, and he really has no one to turn to.

Speaking of ex-Spurs who didn't make it, whatever happened to Malik Hairston? He's playing in Europe, right? How's his career going over there?

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I haven't kept tabs on Hairston other than to know that he's never made it back over here.

http://www.procanes.com/files/mcclintonspurs.jpg

Is it just me, or is that a "you dumb son of a bitch" expression on RC's face?

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Originally Posted by timvp

-(The good news for Thomas is that RC is already talking about him as if he's part of the team. Coming into the summer league, the Spurs probably were leaning toward trying to convince him to go to Europe. Now after the AK47 wooing fell through and Thomas's strong start in summer league, it looks like the Spurs may view him as the answer at backup SF.)

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:lol Why are people still pretending this spot is up for grabs? The Belinelli signing cliched Ginobili/Green playing backup SF.

I fully expect them to sign an SF too (probably Thomas, after they inevitably try and fail to sign Miller), but it won't be for the rotation, it'll be for insurance purposes.

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Originally Posted by TD 21

:lol Why are people still pretending this spot is up for grabs? The Belinelli signing cliched Ginobili/Green playing backup SF.

I fully expect them to sign an SF too (probably Thomas, after they inevitably try and fail to sign Miller), but it won't be for the rotation, it'll be for insurance purposes.

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Yet RC Buford says there's a hole behind Kawhi...

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Originally Posted by Baam

Yet RC Buford says there's a hole behind Kawhi...

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Yeah, in terms of depth. He didn't say anything about the rotation though, nor did he have to, because it's obvious Belinelli will be the fourth wing.

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Originally Posted by Baam

Yet RC Buford says there's a hole behind Kawhi...

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...because if RC thought there was no shot of Thomas making the team, he'd definitely tell us.

http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lu...37pio1_500.jpg

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Originally Posted by tesseractive

In a related story, McClinton has played in China and in the D League, but hasn't gotten so much as a camp invite from the NBA since then.

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Eh, how often does the 51st pick actually pan out anyways?

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Originally Posted by robdiaz2191

Kawhi isn't what you would call fast either, don't see what the big deal is.

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Saying it's so doesn't make it so.

Pre-draft camp

Kawhi - lane agility 11.45 3/4 court sprint 3.15
Deshaun - lane agility 12.94 (:lol) 3/4 court sprint 3.53

Thomas is a plodder. Everyone else is playing on a hard surface while he plays in quicksand. He's never even going to be an average defender, no matter how much effort he gives.

To put that into perspective, here are the numbers for a VERY fat

DeJuan Blair - lane agility 11.5 (:wow) 3/4 court sprint 3.45

Wow...didn't realize he was that slow. The only chance he has to stay on the floor is to hide him on a really bad offensive player.

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Originally Posted by exstatic

Saying it's so doesn't make it so.

Pre-draft camp

Kawhi - lane agility 11.45 3/4 court sprint 3.15
Deshaun - lane agility 12.94 (:lol) 3/4 court sprint 3.53

Thomas is a plodder. Everyone else is playing on a hard surface while he plays in quicksand. He's never even going to be an average defender, no matter how much effort he gives.

To put that into perspective, here are the numbers for a VERY fat

DeJuan Blair - lane agility 11.5 (:wow) 3/4 court sprint 3.45

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http://www.draftexpress.com/nba-pre-...ce=All&sort=15

George Hill was timed at 12.20. One of the slower times you will see for a player his size and defense was average at worst.
Hollis Thompson was timed at 9.21. At 6'8 is one of the best agility times ever. Is on the SL team and take a look at his defense. No better than DT's at times.

My point is without a doubt quickness is only a small factor in becoming an average NBA defender. That is all DT needs to become since his scoring is his primary attribute to any team he plays for. Hustle, desire, and playing smart are bigger factors in my opinion in becoming an average defender than athletci quickness. If we were talking elite defender then yes agility is a bigger factor but with DT not so much.

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Originally Posted by yavozerb

http://www.draftexpress.com/nba-pre-...ce=All&sort=15

George Hill was timed at 12.20. One of the slower times you will see for a player his size and defense was average at worst.
Hollis Thompson was timed at 9.21. At 6'8 is one of the best agility times ever. Is on the SL team and take a look at his defense. No better than DT's at times.

My point is without a doubt quickness is only a small factor in becoming an average NBA defender. That is all DT needs to become since his scoring is his primary attribute to any team he plays for. Hustle, desire, and playing smart are bigger factors in my opinion in becoming an average defender than athletci quickness. If we were talking elite defender then yes agility is a bigger factor but with DT not so much.

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I agree with this assessment. Like so many former vet players have said, the Spurs teach the proper techniques to improve your defensive awareness and positioning, and everyone of them have said they became a better defender after joining the Spurs.

If Thomas is willing to be coached (which he obviously does) and puts in the necessary work to improve, their is no doubt in my mind he can at least be an average to good NBA defender. He doesn't have the lateral quickness, length and overall defensive mindedness of the elite defenders like Bowen, Cooper, Rodman, Pippen, etc.

Thomas is an offensive minded player. If he can just become an average NBA defender, that be a huge win for him and the Spurs.

There are always shooters coming through the pipeline, just like there are athletes who can jump out of the arena but can't shoot or don't have basketball IQ on the court. We may be seeing two prototypical types in Thomas (shooters) and Ryan (low BB IQ).

You can't teach permanent deficiencies like speed or height. And the knock on this site against our shooting specialists like Neal and Bonner is that they can't defend because they lack speed. Some folks always are looking for the SL phenom--but overlook the deficiencies because they want to 'believe' in a new player so much that they think coaching will develop BB IQ or conditioning will develop speed.

The coaches are paid to spot the hopeless cases whose deficiencies can't be cured and to try to find development leagues for those who are marginal. But the number of marginal players who can find a spot for their talents via development is miniscule. For every Bowen or Danny Green there are a 100 James Whites or Gists or ....

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Originally Posted by wildbill2u

There are always shooters coming through the pipeline, just like there are athletes who can jump out of the arena but can't shoot or don't have basketball IQ on the court. We may be seeing two prototypical types in Thomas (shooters) and Ryan (low BB IQ).

You can't teach permanent deficiencies like speed or height. And the knock on this site against our shooting specialists like Neal and Bonner is that they can't defend because they lack speed. Some folks always are looking for the SL phenom--but overlook the deficiencies because they want to 'believe' in a new player so much that they think coaching will develop BB IQ or conditioning will develop speed.

The coaches are paid to spot the hopeless cases whose deficiencies can't be cured and to try to find development leagues for those who are marginal. But the number of marginal players who can find a spot for their talents via development is miniscule. For every Bowen or Danny Green there are a 100 James Whites or Gists or ....

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And sometimes a late pick make it like Isaiah Thomas.

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Originally Posted by exstatic

Saying it's so doesn't make it so.

Pre-draft camp

Kawhi - lane agility 11.45 3/4 court sprint 3.15
Deshaun - lane agility 12.94 (:lol) 3/4 court sprint 3.53

Thomas is a plodder. Everyone else is playing on a hard surface while he plays in quicksand. He's never even going to be an average defender, no matter how much effort he gives.

To put that into perspective, here are the numbers for a VERY fat

DeJuan Blair - lane agility 11.5 (:wow) 3/4 court sprint 3.45

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blair had 2 30/20 games .................. started on a # 1 seeded team twice................. you point is invalid...................... thomas = steal..........

Incomplete on Thomas until we see what he does at camp.. Needs a compliment of actual Spurs players to measure how much he grows within the actual system.

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Originally Posted by coyotes_geek

I haven't kept tabs on Hairston other than to know that he's never made it back over here.

http://www.procanes.com/files/mcclintonspurs.jpg

Is it just me, or is that a "you dumb son of a bitch" expression on RC's face?

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Who can forget McClinton's SL performance, one of the worst.

It's no secret the Spurs have no backup SF. They didn't in the playoffs as TMac was never really in serious consideration for it and played mostly SG in Houston when he WAS good. Basically, letting SJax go and picking up TMAC was just letting SJax go...

The Spurs still have no true backup SF. They might be able to make due w/ Ginobili and/or Green but that's still building for the regular season. In order to defeat strong playoff teams 4 out of 7 times, they will need a true SF or at least someone who can defend the SF position while Belinelli, Ginobili and Bonner do most of the 2nd unit scoring.

There are still some options that might be available for portions of the MLE - Ronnie Brewer, Corey Maggette (although he's probably too expensive), Mikael Pietrus and Luke Walton. There are probably others. I'd take a flyer on Pietrus if he can pass a physical.

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Originally Posted by Tyrone Jenkins

It's no secret the Spurs have no backup SF. They didn't in the playoffs as TMac was never really in serious consideration for it and played mostly SG in Houston when he WAS good. Basically, letting SJax go and picking up TMAC was just letting SJax go...

The Spurs still have no true backup SF. They might be able to make due w/ Ginobili and/or Green but that's still building for the regular season. In order to defeat strong playoff teams 4 out of 7 times, they will need a true SF or at least someone who can defend the SF position while Belinelli, Ginobili and Bonner do most of the 2nd unit scoring.

There are still some options that might be available for portions of the MLE - Ronnie Brewer, Corey Maggette (although he's probably too expensive), Mikael Pietrus and Luke Walton. There are probably others. I'd take a flyer on Pietrus if he can pass a physical.

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If anything, whoever the team gets to backup Leonard projects to be out of the playoff rotation. Simply put, there's no reason to take minutes from Ginobili, Green or Leonard. Belinelli will probably eat any minutes that Pop decides to not give that trio. Depending on how Green develops, I could see him being the backup three along with the starting two-guard to give Ginobili and Belinelli enough time.

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Originally Posted by Chinook

If anything, whoever the team gets to backup Leonard projects to be out of the playoff rotation. Simply put, there's no reason to take minutes from Ginobili, Green or Leonard. Belinelli will probably eat any minutes that Pop decides to not give that trio. Depending on how Green develops, I could see him being the backup three along with the starting two-guard to give Ginobili and Belinelli enough time.

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Belinelli is Ginobili's replacement (notice how both are on short term contracts) - the SG who plays PG for the 2nd unit (Cory Joseph will be w/ that unit for defensive reasons). If Ginobili and Belinelli play at the same time, Ginobili will guard the SF.

Green is the starting SG and should remain so. Playing backup 3 will take away from his ability to start at 2.

It all comes back to the point that Buford already announce - the Spurs need a backup SF.

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Originally Posted by Tyrone Jenkins

Belinelli is Ginobili's replacement (notice how both are on short term contracts) - the SG who plays PG for the 2nd unit (Cory Joseph will be w/ that unit for defensive reasons). If Ginobili and Belinelli play at the same time, Ginobili will guard the SF.

Green is the starting SG and should remain so. Playing backup 3 will take away from his ability to start at 2.

It all comes back to the point that Buford already announce - the Spurs need a backup SF.

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We're talking playoff rotations, though. I think Belinelli's minutes will be marginalized unless Joseph falls out of the rotation. If the Spurs are playing a team with a strong small-forward, I think we'll see Green get those minutes. Sort of like we saw in the Finals. I think Green and not Ginobili will be on Durant if the Spurs face the Thunder again in the post-season.

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Originally Posted by Durant82

http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lu...37pio1_500.jpg

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Lol damn when did this happen

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Originally Posted by Chinook

We're talking playoff rotations, though. I think Belinelli's minutes will be marginalized unless Joseph falls out of the rotation. If the Spurs are playing a team with a strong small-forward, I think we'll see Green get those minutes. Sort of like we saw in the Finals. I think Green and not Ginobili will be on Durant if the Spurs face the Thunder again in the post-season.

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Diaw, who seemed very unlikely to me to get the assignment, was better at defending the SF than Green was. Durant is too much for Green or Ginobili in that particular matchup.

Playoff basketball requires that your starters get adequate rest for the latter parts of the game (to include OT). Notice LBJ missed the 3 pt of game 6 but a bench player made his (Allen). A true backup SF who has lateral quickness (and some length) to guard Durant, Corey Brewer or Gallinari, Harrison Barnes, Paul George and/or Danny Granger, Caron Butler and/or Lamar Odom when Clipps go big, Rudy Gay, Gordon Hayward, Nicolas Batum, Chandler Parsons and Chase Budinger is needed.

Keep in mind the Spurs need to be planning on injury replacements as well as times when Kawhi needs an extended break during a close game.

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Originally Posted by illusioNtEk

Lol damn when did this happen

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November 2011

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Originally Posted by Tyrone Jenkins

Diaw, who seemed very unlikely to me to get the assignment, was better at defending the SF than Green was. Durant is too much for Green or Ginobili in that particular matchup.

Playoff basketball requires that your starters get adequate rest for the latter parts of the game (to include OT). Notice LBJ missed the 3 pt of game 6 but a bench player made his (Allen). A true backup SF who has lateral quickness (and some length) to guard Durant, Corey Brewer or Gallinari, Harrison Barnes, Paul George and/or Danny Granger, Caron Butler and/or Lamar Odom when Clipps go big, Rudy Gay, Gordon Hayward, Nicolas Batum, Chandler Parsons and Chase Budinger is needed.

Keep in mind the Spurs need to be planning on injury replacements as well as times when Kawhi needs an extended break during a close game.

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Diaw's defense on James is seriously overrated. He was better than expected, but he was good good unless James was trying to back him down in the post.

James made the first three that got the Heat to within two.

Green's as tall/long as most small-forwards. He can get the nod in most cases, especially since Leonard will play almost all of the minutes against elite threes.

It would be nice to have an Ariza-like player. But there's no way Pop is going to play five wings and Diaw in the playoffs.

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Originally Posted by Chinook

Diaw's defense on James is seriously overrated. He was better than expected, but he was good good unless James was trying to back him down in the post.

James made the first three that got the Heat to within two.

Green's as tall/long as most small-forwards. He can get the nod in most cases, especially since Leonard will play almost all of the minutes against elite threes.

It would be nice to have an Ariza-like player. But there's no way Pop is going to play five wings and Diaw in the playoffs.

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That's exactly the point - Diaw's defense was OK at best and he was the best 2nd unit player to defend LBJ. Leading up to the Finals, the Spurs most challenging 3 they had to defend was Harrison Barnes (who is good but certainly not the feature of his team). Next year that might be Durant or Gay that's out there in the latter half of the 3rd qtr when Kawhi needs a breather.

TP, Green, Kawhi, Duncan and either Splitter or Diaw make for a great starting unit (Splitter starts in cases of other teams possessing 2 dominant big men - like Memphis or LA w/ Kaman and Gasol). That unit will do OK vs. most teams.

But, the combo of a not very good decision making PG (like Joseph, Colo or Mills), Ginobili or Neal, Green or Diaw at the 3, Bonner or Pendegraph at the 4 and Baynes at the 5 is pretty turnover prone and has little inside scoring capability. If you insert Belinelli in at PG, you do get some scoring and better decision making but now have horrible perimeter defense.

Backup back court will need to be Belinelli, Ginobili or Neal and a new SF who can play defense and create shots on his own so that Diaw, Bonner, Pendegraph (and sometime Splitter) and Baynes can offer both D and O from the 4 and 5 positions.

Just my thought process but the Spurs REALLY need a backup SF...if DeShaun Thomas ends up maturing/learning the system and capable of decent defense by playoff time, excellent. But I wouldn't count on that if I were RC/Pop. Ronnie Brewer is still available but he has ZERO offense and outside shooting. Luke Walton is intriguing but is fairly old and isn't really stellar offensively or defensively. Mikael Pietrus is my choice for someone who can help out and be happy w/ the remainder of the MLE the Spurs have (if he checks out medically).

Diaw's defense was impressive as fuck who are you two kidding? Everyone who watched it thought so...

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Originally Posted by Baam

Diaw's defense was impressive as fuck who are you two kidding? Everyone who watched it thought so...

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It was OK. LBJ had 32 in game 6 and 37 in game 7. He didn't score all of those on Kawhi...

How well do you think LBJ would've played had he had Kawhi and Stephen Jackson guarding him all game?

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Originally Posted by Tyrone Jenkins

It was OK. LBJ had 32 in game 6 and 37 in game 7. He didn't score all of those on Kawhi...

How well do you think LBJ would've played had he had Kawhi and Stephen Jackson guarding him all game?

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I don't know but Diaw is underated as a defender, he can guard the 5 positions as well as anybody, he did work on Curry and Lebron and also guarded Bogut.

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Originally Posted by Baam

I don't know but Diaw is underated as a defender, he can guard the 5 positions as well as anybody, he did work on Curry and Lebron and also guarded Bogut.

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I've never heard of Diaw being a defensive great. If he's underrated, it's been a LONG time that he has been.

I'm not saying his D is garbage, but he's no Tony Allen or Metta World Peace in his prime.

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Originally Posted by Tyrone Jenkins

I've never heard of Diaw being a defensive great. If he's underrated, it's been a LONG time that he has been.

I'm not saying his D is garbage, but he's no Tony Allen or Metta World Peace in his prime.

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He's just the only player who can guard the 5 positions along with a scrub called Lebron James or something...

Besides he clearly had an impressive run defensively, not sure what else you can say, if you were not impressed everyone else was.

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Originally Posted by Baam

He's just the only player who can guard the 5 positions along with a scrub called Lebron James or something...

Besides he clearly had an impressive run defensively, not sure what else you can say, if you were not impressed everyone else was.

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Ok, hold on. You just got ahead of yourself a lil...

Diaw guarding 5 positions now? You'd put him on Chris Paul, Kobe, Harden, Durant, Pau or Marc Gasol, Howard or LeMarcus Aldridge?

Note: this is a make or break question. If your answer is yes and you TRULY feel that way, then you and I are on completely different levels of thought when it comes to playing defense in the NBA. Frankly, if you'd have no problem w/ doing that w/ Diaw as a HC, then you and I have nothing further to debate...

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Originally Posted by Tyrone Jenkins

Ok, hold on. You just got ahead of yourself a lil...

Diaw guarding 5 positions now? You'd put him on Chris Paul, Kobe, Harden, Durant, Pau or Marc Gasol, Howard or LeMarcus Aldridge?

Note: this is a make or break question. If your answer is yes and you TRULY feel that way, then you and I are on completely different levels of thought when it comes to playing defense in the NBA. Frankly, if you'd have no problem w/ doing that w/ Diaw as a HC, then you and I have nothing further to debate...

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You won't see Lebron on Roy Hibbert either, but for limited period of times these two can obvious do it as well as anyone.

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Originally Posted by Baam

You won't see Lebron on Roy Hibbert either, but for limited period of times these two can obvious do it as well as anyone.

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I don't know anyone who seriously thinks that Diaw's defensive abilities is anywhere near Lebron's. Diaw may be underrated, as you state, but he's NOT Lebron. He's not even Metta World Peace. He can guard the 4 adequately, some smaller 5s and a few 3s when called upon for small stretches. Diaw isn't going to guard Kobe or Chris Paul - ever.

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Originally Posted by Tyrone Jenkins

I don't know anyone who seriously thinks that Diaw's defensive abilities is anywhere near Lebron's. Diaw may be underrated, as you state, but he's NOT Lebron. He's not even Metta World Peace. He can guard the 4 adequately, some smaller 5s and a few 3s when called upon for small stretches. Diaw isn't going to guard Kobe or Chris Paul - ever.

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Because Kobe is harder to guard than Curry?

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Originally Posted by Baam

Because Kobe is harder to guard than Curry?

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Diaw isn't going to guard Curry for any amount of significant time either. If he's done it already, it probably wasn't for a long time and it was when Curry was having an off night (and Pop can gamble w/ Diaw sagging off him to defend the drive).

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Originally Posted by Baam

Because Kobe is harder to guard than Curry?

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BTW - Kobe IS harder to guard the Curry on most nights. When Curry is shooting lights out - no one can guard him. But Kobe, even at 100 yrs old, is stronger, faster, jumps higher and plays harder than Curry. When was the last time you saw anyone other than Green, Kawhi, SJax or Ginobili on Kobe?

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Originally Posted by Baam

I don't know but Diaw is underated as a defender, he can guard the 5 positions as well as anybody, he did work on Curry and Lebron and also guarded Bogut.

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I'll just quote this post, but this applies to the other ones where you mentioned Diaw guarding Curry.

Diaw is not capable of guarding Curry. What you're referring to his hedge on Curry the end of regulation in Game 1 versus Golden State, where Diaw hedged very well and used his length to deny Curry's shot. That type of defense is not uncommon for bigs to be able to provide, although it is very useful. To say Diaw can guard point-guards because he hedged well on Curry is like saying that Green can defend the five because he blocked Bogut's shot on a switch. You don't seem to think Splitter can guard point-guards, and his defense on Conley at the end of regulation in Game 3 against Memphis was at least as impressive as Diaw's Curry defense.

Guarding a position means you can go up and down the floor with a player of that position and play competent defense in all aspects. Diaw was not going to guard Curry or any guard for an entire shot clock. Very few players can guard more than three positions. James and Mbah a Moute are the only players I know who can. And even in their case, they're actually much better at guarding swingmen and forwards than they are at guarding the other two positions.

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Originally Posted by Tyrone Jenkins

That's exactly the point - Diaw's defense was OK at best and he was the best 2nd unit player to defend LBJ. Leading up to the Finals, the Spurs most challenging 3 they had to defend was Harrison Barnes (who is good but certainly not the feature of his team). Next year that might be Durant or Gay that's out there in the latter half of the 3rd qtr when Kawhi needs a breather.

TP, Green, Kawhi, Duncan and either Splitter or Diaw make for a great starting unit (Splitter starts in cases of other teams possessing 2 dominant big men - like Memphis or LA w/ Kaman and Gasol). That unit will do OK vs. most teams.

But, the combo of a not very good decision making PG (like Joseph, Colo or Mills), Ginobili or Neal, Green or Diaw at the 3, Bonner or Pendegraph at the 4 and Baynes at the 5 is pretty turnover prone and has little inside scoring capability. If you insert Belinelli in at PG, you do get some scoring and better decision making but now have horrible perimeter defense.

Backup back court will need to be Belinelli, Ginobili or Neal and a new SF who can play defense and create shots on his own so that Diaw, Bonner, Pendegraph (and sometime Splitter) and Baynes can offer both D and O from the 4 and 5 positions.

Just my thought process but the Spurs REALLY need a backup SF...if DeShaun Thomas ends up maturing/learning the system and capable of decent defense by playoff time, excellent. But I wouldn't count on that if I were RC/Pop. Ronnie Brewer is still available but he has ZERO offense and outside shooting. Luke Walton is intriguing but is fairly old and isn't really stellar offensively or defensively. Mikael Pietrus is my choice for someone who can help out and be happy w/ the remainder of the MLE the Spurs have (if he checks out medically).

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A Ginobili/Belinelli/SF back court is much more worrisome than a Joseph/Belinelli/Ginobili back court. Manu can't play the point defensively, and Beli can't guard the point either. Ginobili on the other hand CAN play the three defensively. For all the talk about the Spurs having to go through elite small-forwards to win a title, they only need to go through Durant and James. Every other elite three is in the East, unless Tyreke Evans does indeed count as a three, and he's not even elite in any case. In a normal rotation with Leonard playing 40+ minutes, there's no need to worry about having another player to guard the opposing small-forward.

You could argue that having a player to put in if Leonard gets into foul trouble would be nice. I think it could be a possibility, but even then, I'd ride with Green and Ginobili for most of the minutes. Adding another player to the rotation already takes valuable minutes from them. Green's as tall and long as Pietrius (taller, actually), so there's no reason to bring a guy like him in. Ariza? Sure if you can get him. Singleton? Potentially good insurance. A typical three? Not that big of a need, in my opinion.

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Originally Posted by Chinook

I'll just quote this post, but this applies to the other ones where you mentioned Diaw guarding Curry.

Diaw is not capable of guarding Curry. What you're referring to his hedge on Curry the end of regulation in Game 1 versus Golden State, where Diaw hedged very well and used his length to deny Curry's shot. That type of defense is not uncommon for bigs to be able to provide, although it is very useful. To say Diaw can guard point-guards because he hedged well on Curry is like saying that Green can defend the five because he blocked Bogut's shot on a switch. You don't seem to think Splitter can guard point-guards, and his defense on Conley at the end of regulation in Game 3 against Memphis was at least as impressive as Diaw's Curry defense.

Guarding a position means you can go up and down the floor with a player of that position and play competent defense in all aspects. Diaw was not going to guard Curry or any guard for an entire shot clock. Very few players can guard more than three positions. James and Mbah a Moute are the only players I know who can. And even in their case, they're actually much better at guarding swingmen and forwards than they are at guarding the other two positions.

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No Boris blocking a 3 pointer from Curry when put on an island with him is much more impressive than the Tiago's play on Conley and Curry is just a much better offensive player.

Besides "being able to guard" doesn't mean that your the best option on the team, it just means that you can do a decent job.

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Originally Posted by Baam

No Boris blocking a 3 pointer from Curry when put on an island with him is much more impressive than the Tiago's play on Conley and Curry is just a much better offensive player.

Besides "being able to guard" doesn't mean that your the best option on the team, it just means that you can do a decent job.

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On that play, Diaw "blocked" Curry by hitting him on the arm. And a big blocking a three-pointer against a player who's not a threat to drive is not impressive. Bigs are taller than guards, and it's easier for them to block them when they know the guards are going to shoot. That's not as impressive as Splitter being put on an island (actually, not on a hedge) and being able to move his feet and contest the shot.

And I didn't say that "being able to guard" meant the player had to be the best option. I said they have to be able to guard the position for an entire shot clock, and up and down the court for multiple possessions. Diaw can't do that against guards, not excellently, not even passably. He can barely do that against small-forwards who don't try to post him up.

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Originally Posted by Chinook

On that play, Diaw "blocked" Curry by hitting him on the arm. And a big blocking a three-pointer against a player who's not a threat to drive is not impressive. Bigs are taller than guards, and it's easier for them to block them when they know the guards are going to shoot. That's not as impressive as Splitter being put on an island (actually, not on a hedge) and being able to move his feet and contest the shot.

And I didn't say that "being able to guard" meant the player had to be the best option. I said they have to be able to guard the position for an entire shot clock, and up and down the court for multiple possessions. Diaw can't do that against guards, not excellently, not even passably. He can barely do that against small-forwards who don't try to post him up.

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Saying that Curry is not a threat to drive is wrong, maybe you're thinking of Klay Thompson.

Also saying he can't guard SFs is just stupid when he did so well on the best SF of all time but whatever...

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Originally Posted by Baam

Saying that Curry is not a threat to drive is wrong, maybe you're thinking of Klay Thompson.

Also saying he can't guard SFs is just stupid when he did so well on the best SF of all time but whatever...

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No, Curry was not a threat to drive, especially after his first ankle injury. No one on that team was besides Jack. That's a big reason why the Spurs were able to beat then in the last two games; they were just a jump-shooting team.

Also being able to guard one player of a position does not equate to guarding that position, no matter how great that player is. Guarding Magic Johnson wouldn't mean being able to guard all point-guards. James decided mid-way through the series he was going to post up primarily or just shoot inefficient jumpers. Diaw was too big for him to back down, and it took him a game to figure out that he should just go around him from the wing instead of in the deep post. Diaw also had significantly more help than Leonard or Green did. Hell, even David West did a good job on James when he got the assignment in the ECF.

Diaw does not have the skills to guard threes that don't play like combo-forwards, at least not to the level that he'd be a great option against them. James is about the only small-forward that Diaw is a good option against. Diaw's not guarding the Gays, Pierces and Durants of the NBA.

Bottom line you're a hopeless Green homer and I'm a hopeless Diaw homer.

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Originally Posted by Baam

Bottom line you're a hopeless Green homer and I'm a hopeless Diaw homer.

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I wouldn't say that. I'm definitely a big Green supporter, but I don't think I'm that crazy. I like Diaw a lot, too. But I'm not a fan of moving players down positions. I think downsizing is the trend of the league and Diaw is a center more than he is a small-forward. I also think Leonard is more of a four than he is a two.

Yeah with his rebounding Kawhi is the perfect small ball 4 once he bulks up a little. Boris did very good things at center in his career but with his lack of rebounding I don't like it that much, ideally I'd like him to lose some weight to play the backup 3 but I know it's very unlikely.