Duncan vs. Shaq

Ive been having this discussion with a friend of mine who is originally from LA. He thinks Shaq is better than Duncan. I happen to think Tim is better than Shaq. Here is why I think that:

Tim Duncan vs. Shaq

Career numbers
Duncan: 22.5ppg, 12.2rpg, 3.1apg, 2.54bpg
Shaq: 26.7ppg, 12rpg, 2.8apg, 2.57bpg

Number of times named to the All NBA First Team
Duncan: 8, Shaq: 7

Number of times named to All Star team
Duncan: 7, Shaq: 11

Number of times named to NBA All Defensive First Team
Duncan: 6, Shaq: NONE!!

MVP Awards
Duncan: 2, Shaq: 1

Finals MVP awards
Duncan: 3, Shaq: 3

Championships
Duncan: 3, Shaq: 3

Just look at the numbers! Note that Shaq has been in the NBA for 13 years, while Duncan has only been in the NBA for 8 years. Tim Duncan has done just as much (and more) as Shaq, in less time! You tell me. Who is better??

Shaq has been, is now, and always will be the greatest Sports player in the history of the universe.

No one can ever beat him at anything.

He's even better than God...

But seriously, I think the last 2 categories carry the most weight, and they're tied in both.

However, I think Duncan has a better chance of winning more Titles and Finals MVP's just because he's a bit younger.

IMO apples and oranges. Two different players at two different positions. Shaq in the post...no one can move him or really effectively guard him strengthwise. Duncan moves better, has better footwork, more range on his shot and IMO is a better all around basketball player. Inside 5 feet...no one can stop Shaq. Outside that, IMO, its all TD.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by samikeyp

...and IMO is a better all around basketball player.

---

Thats what I was trying to say.

And they are both big men, so its not really apples and oranges.

Basically what samikeyp said, they play 2 different positions. You can't really judge who is better or not.

Quote:

---

And they are both big men, so its not really apples and oranges

---

I was alluding to the fact that Shaq is more of the tradtional center while Duncan is more of a forward who occasionally plays center. "big man" is a generic title for PF, SF and C. While they are both "big men" the positions they play are innately different. That was what I was trying to say. :)

While Duncan's accomplishments will continue to pile up as he approaches Shaq's 13 years in the league, his stats will likely decline.
Still, a player's value is more than his statistics. IMO, Duncan is the better player.

The thing i look at is this . Physically look at duncan, ur gonna find a whole lot of players with a body similar to his , in the past, now or in the future. So he isnt technically a freak of nature. And he still trumps all those before him, (we wont kno about the future till that time comes). But shaq is physically something else, so when someone of that size comes along again, we should compare shaq with that player.

I dont like to compare shaq with any of todays players, unless were specifically talkin achievements. Its not right, just like its not right to compare duncan with a player like mcgrady or kobe or jordan etc.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dre_7

And they are both big men, so its not really apples and oranges.

---

yeah...its Green Apples and Red Apples. :drunk

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by HB22inSA

Shaq has been, is now, and always will be the greatest Sports player in the history of the universe.

No one can ever beat him at anything.

He's even better than God...

---

Except three point shooting and freethrows..




I think Tim Duncan is the better guy, he has everything to be a complete player.


Shaq is just big...

Tim Duncan Is A Fucking Center!

Duncan is basically a center. Yes he starts at PF, but he is a C. Its like Amare. He starts at C, but he is basically a PF.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by elpimpo4cc

shaq is big

---

:lol

Tim is a whole different position he handles. he scores, he boards, he plays D, and even though he has better numbers (or might) the press will always argue Snaq, just because hes more marketable.

Quote:

---

Duncan is basically a center. Yes he starts at PF, but he is a C. Its like Amare. He starts at C, but he is basically a PF.

---

To me....Duncan is re-defining the position. Shaq is the last of the superstar traditional centers, Duncan, KG, Amare are hybrids of the positions C and F. They are natural forwards but in the NBA now, the center position is decreasing becoming one of your big, slow, plodding big man plugging up the lane. They can play in the post and on the perimeter. I disagree that he is a center. Just because we say he is...doesn't make it so..That is an opinion I disagree with...I think he is a natural forward that can play both C and PF. The center position is being redefined and TD is in the middle of it.

Shaq was always considered the better player until the 2003 playoffs, specifically game six where TD dropped 36 pts in an elimination game.

At that point TD vs Shaq debates began to spring up but most people still sided with Shaq. 2004 playoffs were the most important season in determining the best player and heres why

KG had an MVP season, TD was aiming for back to back rings and Shaq was now doubted by some as the games best player. In the end Shaq was the clear winner in match ups with TD and KG in the 04 playoffs and proved he was still the games best when he wants to be.

I think we could all agree that Shaq could easily beat Duncan in a pie eating contest.

In terms of what they've done, they're equals. But Duncan has more years left in him, we presume and hope, so there's a good chance he'll do more when their careers are done and over.

In terms of athleticism and talent, Duncan has the edge. He's a better shooter - when was the last time Shaq shot anything out of the paint, whereas Duncan can make the occassional 3 point shot. Duncan is a better passer, better rebounder, and has better footwork. THat being said, for a guy of his size, Shaq is only a notch below Duncan.

In athleticism and skill, however, KG has the edge, however, over Duncan - but other than one regular season MVP award, his career has been so far marked by losing. We'll see how it pans out - Shaq's career was marked by losing when he was in Orlando.

Amare could wind up being like KG (so far) or he could wind up being like Duncan and Shaq. Sheer talent and skill is not enough to be a winner, and to be a legendary player.

Shaq made the Finals with Orlando. I think that he is among the most overrated players in the game. If he didn't get the benefit of foul calls, he would be extremely ineffective. He wasn't even his teams best player, but the media acted like he got ripped off when Nash won it. I just think Shaq is a slow, fat shell of what he used to be and the star hungry NBA lets him do whatever he wants in the paint. Tim Duncan's got skills.

Quote:

---

In athleticism and skill, however, KG has the edge, however, over Duncan -

---

I agree with that to a point. IMO, KG is the better athlete but Duncan is the better basketball player. If you are referring to athletic skill though, I am with you.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by HB22inSA

Shaq has been, is now, and always will be the greatest Sports player in the history of the universe.

No one can ever beat him at anything.

He's even better than God...

---

Don't forget, Shaq is like the Pythagorean Theorem - he can't be solved. :lol

What abpout a TD/Shaq free throw contest, nobody wins there

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Trainwreck2100

What abpout a TD/Shaq free throw contest, nobody wins there

---

That's a joke right? :lol

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by cecil collins

Shaq made the Finals with Orlando. I think that he is among the most overrated players in the game. If he didn't get the benefit of foul calls, he would be extremely ineffective. He wasn't even his teams best player, but the media acted like he got ripped off when Nash won it. I just think Shaq is a slow, fat shell of what he used to be and the star hungry NBA lets him do whatever he wants in the paint. Tim Duncan's got skills.

---

Shaq is much more than what you describe. He does some things very well that people don't pay as much attention, like passing. He's got a very high basketball IQ. It would be hard to overrate one of the two best players in the game. And I for one think he did get robbed by Mr. Steve "No Defense" Nash of the MVP last year.

Have you seen pics from last year? He's slimmed down and gotten himself back in shape. And he is still EASILY the best player on the Heat. When he played with Kobe, people questioned whether he was the best player on the team, but we've now seen Kobe w/o Shaq. Shaq makes any team he joins a championship caliber team. So does Duncan.

As I posted, Duncan get a slight edge over Shaq for versatility, but you can't deny that the two of them are EASILY the most dominant, talented, smartest playes in the game today.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Supergirl

Have you seen pics from last year? He's slimmed down and gotten himself back in shape. And he is still EASILY the best player on the Heat. When he played with Kobe, people questioned whether he was the best player on the team, but we've now seen Kobe w/o Shaq. Shaq makes any team he joins a championship caliber team. So does Duncan.

---

I'm not disputing that Snaq made that Heat a better team, but they weren't exactly chopped liver the year before he arrived. They made it to the Conference Semis in 2004, and only got one round further in 2005. And yes, Shaquille O'Neal is a noted improvement over Lamar Odom and Caron Butler, so anyone who DIDN'T expect some type of progess probably needs to take up another sport. Hell, the improvement made by Dwayne Wade alone might've been enough to do that, even with their old pieces still intact.

Granted, nobody knows WHAT would've happened had they not sustained injuries to O'Neal and Wade, but that's just the way the game goes sometimes. Championships aren't handed out over what-ifs.

But it's not like he turned the Hawks into the Pistons, or the Clippers into the Spurs. He made a team that was already good better, just as he has his entire career. Orlando may have been the lone exception, but he was still option number two behind Penny, which is ultimately what drove him away to LA.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by samikeypI disagree that he [I

is[/I] a center. Just because we say he is...doesn't make it so..That is an opinion I disagree with...

---

If you stand on the sidelines and walk back and forth wearing a suit you are a COACH.

If you bring the ball up the court and run the offense you are a POINT GUARD.

If you clog up the lane and block shots, and on the other end get the ball within ten feet and do a post move YOU ARE A FUCKING CENTER.

I don't give a shit what the program says, or his FLEER card, or what his momma calls him, he's a center.

Each center plays differently from each other, David Robinson had a similar game in that he was a very good perimiter shooter, and he could drive the lane from ten to fifteen feet out, but he's still a fucking center.