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EDIT: Poll fucked up so I guess this is just a discussion with no poll in tact.
Vote for every player you believe is as good as they are thanks to the system.
Don't get mad because a name is there, because it means no indication. Just a vote. Explain reason.
Toss up between Patty and Boris. I went with Boris because he's a pass first guy...and that works perfectly in our system. Released by the Bobcats to almost winning Finals MVP......It's all because of the "Spurs system".
Tony Parker obviously
But decent, not good
Splitter, Mills and Boris are used to bigger roles in their NT than in the spurs. It's just plain stupid.They have good and bad games or even championships, but they had a career outside the Spurs. Danny Green, Kawhi Leonard never played shit outside the spurs system.
OP is a
Gotta be Danny Green. He simply needs space to be effective. Can't dribble worth a damn, and the last thing you want him to do is drive to the basket.
Don't get me wrong, I love DG, and I was ecstatic when the Spurs brang him over because I remembered he was one of those 5 starters from that great 2008 UNC Championship team. Knew he would fit perfectly with the Spurs as he did with UNC. But he needs great players around him to be effective.
Out of these options I'd choose Patty. He's a short SG, whose job is to be a scorer off the bench. Dime a dozen type ( which doesn't take away from his great play during the season and playoffs this year ).
Danny Green has been the best 3 and D guy in the NBA for 2 years now. If he had anything else in his arsenal he wouldn't be a Spur in the first place. Would fit seamlessly in any championship caliber team.
Boris is too unique. He'd probably be lost in a more ISO-oriented team but people tend to forget he was really great at Charlotte the first couple of years he was there. His issues are more mental, than basketball-related.
Tiago is easily the most underappreciated spur, but he guards the best big on the other team night in night out, boards well, scores efficiently and has the sort of chemistry with Duncan that'd allow them to be the only two-center lineup in today's NBA that isn't a complete liability.
Patty can shoot threes anywhere in any team.
I say Diaw.
He is not incredible good at anything, he does a little of everything, and that is only possible with the Spurs, who dont ask him to do one thing.
He cant rebound better than Duncan/Tiago(?), he cant shoot better than Green/Mills, he cant pass better than Parker/Manu.
Kawhi...just no.
Green is a good defender and shooter.
Mills can shoot, the spacing could not be there if he played for another team..but still...
Tiago...well...I dont know why he is on the list.
What? Diaw is the best passer in the team tbh.Quote:
Originally Posted by Captivus
manubetweenthelegs.gifQuote:
Originally Posted by 100%duncan
Danny Green is the definition of scrub player turned into an elite role player in the Spurs' system.
People here is stupid as hell. Players with career outside the spurs are voted as system players. Mills was the best scorer in London 2012, Boris has a long career in the NBA before the Spurs, Tiago was the FMVP of the ACB and had a career before he arrived in SA. Definitely, the spurs products are Green and Leonard. Anything else is just bullshit.
The answer is either none of them or all of them.
Kawhi.. Do I even need to defend this guy? Hell, the Spurs system could be arguably holding him back. But then again, it's also winning him tickets to the finals.
Diaw is a tough one. I'm not sure if it's the Spurs he thrives off of, or if it's just the fact he's been motivated like never before. Perhaps Diaw 2.0 could've helped any team, had he given them the light of day.
Green is a terrific defensive player and possess the ability to knock down open threes, not to mention his fearlessness when the pressure is high. Trade him to the Heat for Ray Allen and the finals are suddenly much more competitive.
Mills is just a tough cookie. He was the leading scorer in the Olympics and filled in for Parker when he was out. Also, he had some of the biggest shots in Game 5. Put him in Houston and the Rockets could be in the WCF.
Splitter... ugh. How can anyone think this guy thrives off the system? On offense, sure. But on defense? This is the same guy who shut down Dirk and LaMarcus in the playoffs. The same guy who was receiving huge offers as a free agent.
One last thing.. is there anyone on the Spurs that the system doesn't help? Would a late 30's Ginobili or Duncan be as effective if there were playing for a shit coach? Would they have been healthy for the playoffs? No. The system helps the Big 3 just as much as it does the role players. That's why the Spurs usually don't miss a beat whenever one of their stars take some rest off.
/threadQuote:
Originally Posted by Prime Time
Green tbh
Green, Diaw, and Splitter. All 3 look like stars on our team and would probably be bench guys on any other team.
If we are specifically talking about the Spurs system, then it is Danny Green and its not even close.
Kawhi would have been able to put up number and have a defensive impact no matter where he went. It's likely he wouldn't have been as efficient and may have developed at a slower rate, but he would have been a positive on any team given his physical gifts and work ethic.
Boris Diaw already demonstrated that he was a great player while he was on the 7 seconds or less Suns, and has shown when he is utilized as more of a facilitator than primary scoring option, that he can help a team out. The area he has struggled with, which was explained in-depth this past post-season, is that he isn't comfortable being a primary option on offense. That impacted his "motivation" on teams like the Bobcats and Hawks. However that isn't skills or system based, but rather knowing how to properly utilize a player.
Green is the biggest candidate for peaking in the Spurs system because he has two areas where he has tremendous skill but has been unable to expand into other areas. He probably the best 3&D guy in the league right now and has demonstrate he is a deadly 3 point shooter when he has space. However when you take away his space he has generally struggled to produce since he doesn't have much versatility (although I believe it was game 4 of this past finals where he was able to dribble/drive). The Spurs system allows him open looks so he can be comfortable without making him produce more than he can handle.
Patty Mills, I'm not even sure he should count as a player in the Spurs system. While he does help run the offense for the 2nd unit, he definitely has a shoot first mentality (see his various fast-break 3s) and seems more of a controlled chaos at times then a player within the system. Maybe that is by design, but patty could be just as successful elsewhere in the NBA as a scoring punch off the bench as he is with the Spurs (see Jamal Crawford, Nate Robinson, ect). The effort he puts in on defense is great as well, but again, a full-court press and his pesky defense is hardly unique to the Spurs. I'd say its the diversity of Spurs personnel (aka having Manu to run the 2nd unit) than the system that has allowed patty to shine.
As far as Tiago, he probably wouldn't be winning or competing for titles like he has been with the Spurs but he is definitely a starter in the NBA. If you don't believe that look at A) is defense against Dirk/Aldridge in the playoffs, B) remember that Kendrick Perkins has been a starter in the league for years, C) that quality big men are increasingly rare in the NBA. The Spurs system has helped Tiago maximize his strengths over what he would have been able to do outside of it, but it has also circumscribed his overall numbers.
Are you serious? Mills led the Olympics in scoring... He's probably the one who needs the system the least tbhQuote:
Originally Posted by BG_Spurs_Fan
The Spurs have the most talented roster in the league. They make the system, not the other way around. That's why the system didn't work before the Medium Three, Diaw and Mills showed up.
Yeah the answers gotta be Danny. I was thinking Boris too, but Boris would do well in any system that allowed him to play his style, its just that a lot of coaches and teams didn't utilize him correctly. Danny was a shitty player in general until Pop lit a fire under his ass and he came back to the team desperate, so under Pop tutelage he's become a premier 3 and D guy in the league. I really doubt he'd be the player he is today if his career had unfolded anywhere else.
Green was a good player who kind of lost his head for a year. The same is true with Diaw. They both would do well in any system that allowed them to play their roles. Mills is just one of literally hundreds (or thousands) of players with his skill-set. But his intangibles are off the chart. That's what makes him such a good fit for the Spurs.Quote:
Originally Posted by SpurSwag
I actually feel the complete opposite, I think Patty is an extremely above average shooter and a very versatile one too. I almost have no doubts about him hitting 3's anymore, and this entire past season he was virtually automatic. I don't know many players that have his combination of lethal shooting and great hustle, especially as a back up. Green in Cleveland was a decent shooter and spotty defender who could barely even hang on to a rotation spot on Lebron's team, but the Danny Green pop has molded would be an absolute perfect fit next to Lebron or in any system. I don't think Green now would only fluorish in our system, as I think 3 and D guys are definitely the most important role players in the league, but I think he was created by the system essentially.Quote:
Originally Posted by Chinook
It's got to be Tiago Splitter hands down.
lol at all the danny hate.
Pop hasn't molded Green at all, skill-wise. He was a great shooter and defender in college. He's just a better version of the player he was in 2008. You really should go back and look at his career numbers if you think the Spurs system has made him. It took a come-to-Jesus moment for him to stick with the Spurs, but that was mainly an attitude thing. He was going to get more shots at the NBA. He was a very good d-league player.Quote:
Originally Posted by SpurSwag
Undersized two-guards are a dime a dozen. Even ones who can shoot at an elite level aren't hard to find. But most end up washing out in the league because they lack the skill to play the one and the size to play the two. It works on the Spurs because Ginobili and Diaw can run the offense, and Mills can focus on shooting. Even so, he almost washed out himself until he lost weight and got stronger. The only reason why he had that opportunity is because he is a great teammate, and he was worth holding onto as the 13th man because of it.
Probably Green. His skills are maximized because of the "Spurs' Way".
As far as Patty Mills goes...true, he was lighting up the board in the 2012 Olympic Games with the highest average ppg, but he wasn't exactly a household name for 4 years in the NBA. He wasn't, that is, until last season. Yes, Patty can score, but I think the Spurs system really helped Patty to flourish in his third (2 full and a partial) season with the Spurs. He's come a long way since being accused of faking a hammy injury and being released by the Xinjiang Flying Tigers in 2012!
http://blog.mysanantonio.com/spursna...-Mills-317.jpg
I don´t buy that ¨system¨ thing, most championship teams play with some order/system/scheme, guys like Jordan would be monkeyballers without a plan.
Our FO tries to select players carefully is not like they bring any clown here and VOILA! you have a solid piece!
Hard work and time made players like Splitter to flourish and I dont think the system made that, you need good team chemistry too also this is a game where you have to chase the ball and use balls and emotions and play with odd impredictable stuff that happens during a game, maybe some guys here thinks that the credit goes to some playbook and nothing else.
For example Pop saw potential in Danny Green, remember when Stephen Jackson said to Pop he was better than Danny and Manu? Captain Shack got cut and this was before the playoffs where Green made 3843 3s.
Kawhi could be great on any team too.
all good points, you're definitely right about mills being able to excel so much due to Manu pretty much being a point guard.Quote:
Originally Posted by Chinook
Obvious candidates are Splitter, Mills and Danny. Odds are they don't stick in the league if not for the Spurs perseverance with them and handing them roles on the system that maximize their strengths and minimize their deficiencies (which were pretty substantial coming into the league). The constant pounding of the idea that they need to excel on their niches, and now can move on to expanding their games. I think all 3 have moved past the growing pains at this point, and now understand what it takes to be in this league.
Now, for a guy that didn't pan out but the system made him look better than he was, you can look at Roger Mason Jr.
Eh, Mason also looked bad his second year with the Spurs. If anything, he shows why people should never think the Spurs scheme is making their players good. There's a marked difference between how the Mason-era Spurs were compared to now. I'd say that's 90-percent due to personnel and 10 percent to scheme.
I don't think Splitter was close to washing out of the league, though. I think a terrible coach could have chased him back to Europe, but Tiago always had NBA-caliber game.
I also think people need to look back at 2010-2012 Green. That player was going to stick on any roster. I'm still waiting for Danny to get back to that level.
No Errors ?
That player choked in big moments tbh.Quote:
Originally Posted by Chinook
That player didn't. He was still the best defender in the WCF that year. Pop made the mistake of not realizing that Danny was still a net plus, even if he was slumping.Quote:
Originally Posted by 100%duncan
Anyway, that Green was a lot better off the dribble than this one. He could handle the ball some and shoot a variety of shots from inside the arc. He was a scrapoy defender. He's much more refined now, but he should bring some of his old game back.