Lost in the fray

This isn't meant to be a bummer thread, when I saw Aldridge signed I partied hard on the 4th.

But as a student of the game of basketball I think the Spurs have been so successful in years past because of their defense, chemistry, and depth. To me it seems we've taken a step back in all those categories this off season. We were able to run circles around other teams like the thunder simply by playing stifling defense and throwing wave after wave of fresh players at them till they were too tired to fight back.

What's the gameplan now?

If we're just planning on playing our stars vs theirs the thunder will surely come out on top.

We'll keep doing all those things, but with more talent

It's going to be a work in progress, it might not be the typical Spurs-type of basketball at first, but it's a no-brainer move to get a top 15-20 player in his prime + West..

When you're an aging team that just lost in the 1st round to a Clippers team that lost in the subsequent round, you can't come back with the same squad, tbh..

Our offense was the problem last year. Tony falling off a cliff and injuries to many players. Pop not giving a fuck. We'll win 60 plus games next year.

We have big names now. The plan is to just show up and cause the other team to cower in fear. Like real fear. Then we'll pillage the visitor locker room, drink their wine, use up all the toilet paper and not put a new roll, etc. Savagery at it's finest. Finally, we take the LOBT, which is rightfully ours, and bring it back home.


Anyways, that's the movie version. We're still working the basketball details of all that.

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Originally Posted by PopTheGOAT

We'll keep doing all those things, but with more talent

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I agree we got more talented no doubt. But also older and less deep at the same time which is why I'm concerned.

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Originally Posted by Rob123

I agree we got more talented no doubt. But also older and less deep at the same time which is why I'm concerned.

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July 7th concerns.

The switch from Tiago to LMA helps us most against a healthy OKC team. We weren't going to beat them this year relying on Tony fucking Parker. And we don't need Tiago to guard any of their bigs either.

OP makes a good point, tbh.

Chemistry should become less of an issue as the season goes along. And defense, while it won't be as good as it used to be, won't exactly fall off a cliff. Aldridge has the same size, mobility, and defensive versatility as Splitter. He's not as good, but he's not much worse either.

The only real concern for me is depth. Our lack of it will almost certainly mean the team will win far fewer games in the regular season than what the roster on paper might otherwise suggest. This is especially true given our placement in the Southwest division.

Hopefully a veteran or too looking to chase a championship ring comes aboard, especially during the buyout deadline. We desperately need more depth, especially at the wing.

Don't worry. We have the finest coaches in the league headed by legendary POP.
Players will come and go, but SYSTEM Is PERMANENT.

SPURS Basketball is in greatest hands..:)

The great thing about these acquisitions is they were made in free agency, months away from training camp. Still with more personnel to fill out the roster, we should have a full roster ready to go together by opening night. With how veteran laden this team already was, I don't see a particularly long delay of chemistry building. The ball movement will be there, I'm guessing to expect it by late January earliest-during the rodeo road trip at its latest.

^Should've began my post with *barring any injuries*...forgot to include that...please basketball gods, bless us this season...just one more time pls.

There has definitely been a drop-off in depth, but that was inevitable especially with the cap space jumping next season and its effect on FA salaries this year. While its not perfect, at least the Spurs were able to convert some of their depth into star power while retaining their most essential players. Think about it, Kawhi and Cojo were both on rookie contracts. Meanwhile DG was playing out the end of a contract signed immediately after he disappeared in the 2012 WCF. Factor in that most of the players on the team entering FA this year had been around since at least 2013 and either received a raise or were due one (Manu and Tim being the exceptions, and Tim arguably deserves one instead of taking a paycut this summer) some loss of depth was unavoidable.

It's actually pretty remarkable that the only truly significant loss to the roster was Splitter, and he was replaced by an arguably more talented player (albeit less talented at certain things like PnR defense which may prove to be more important). Cojo's departure is unfortunate, but assuming both Parker and Mills are healthy he was likely to only see limited playing time anyways like in years past. Marco hit some great shots and generally showed up on offense when he was needed, but his skillset is one that could be replaced, and at a lower amount than he is making now. Baynes was definitely improving, but its not beyond the realm of possibility that the Spurs could find someone to fill his role and production from the past few years.

They will manufacture depth and make guys rich. Again.

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Originally Posted by Rob123

What's the gameplan now?

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The Suns of Nash-Stoudemire. An explosive, dominant offensive PF without talent to play D being the man on the team, they won everything in regular season, they lost all in playoffs.

You don't even know what our full team will be, so you don't know how our depth will be.

Who the hell needs chemistry when you have biology

I'm tired of hearing the stupid talk about chemistry. We have Pop and TD, both have reached living legend status. Even Lebron turns into Mr. Humble in their presence. LMA and West will play whatever role is asked of them and the beat will go on.

Spurs fans need to top overrating pop so much, people making him more than he is, overlook that he failed and screw things up a lot in his career...

Rubbish.

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Originally Posted by YGWHI

The Suns of Nash-Stoudemire. An explosive, dominant offensive PF without talent to play D being the man on the team, they won everything in regular season, they lost all in playoffs.

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post less

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Originally Posted by Vic Petro

They will manufacture depth and make guys rich. Again.

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Originally Posted by Dingle Barry

post less

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I'll try but having Duncan as the only true big man defender on the team doesn't sound like a balanced roster after all.

I'm not sure where this "huge loss of depth" argument comes from. We lost 3 bench players who averaged a total of 56.7 minutes/game this year in Marco, Baynes, and Corey. We lost one starter who averaged 19.8 minutes/game in Splitter. That's a total of 76.5 minutes/game.

We picked up a starter in Aldridge that should average around 32 min/game (he averaged 35.4 last year). I expect to see Patty get around 5 more minutes a game, putting him to about 20/game total. If West gets the same as Diaw, which is 24.5, that takes us down to 15 minutes left to divide among Anderson, Bonner, and whoever else we pick up as a backup small.

We'd still have a solid 9-10 man rotation averaging in double figure minutes. That's more than most teams, and not thin by any stretch. And that's all assuming we don't really add any other veterans of note.

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Originally Posted by ChumpDumper

July 7th concerns.

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...and straight over their heads.


Slowly, now, so it can all settle in.

It's July 7.
The roster hasn't been filled yet.
You don't know what the depth will look like.
You don't know what the chemistry will be like.
Most of the old players are still here, and there's no reason to think the new ones won't mesh.
The regular season doesn't start until the end of October.

Can't expect the Spurs to stay put forever. Moves needed to be made.

Im pretty sure the FO is working on adding some defensive minded player to give a balance. Sit back and enjoy the ride

We gonna keep doing those things except everything will be easier due to having a top 5 PF and a ex allstar vet.

Everything should be easier. On paper.

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Originally Posted by Uriel

OP makes a good point, tbh.

Chemistry should become less of an issue as the season goes along. And defense, while it won't be as good as it used to be...

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I keep laughing at the "defense won't be as good" take when Sassy couldn't move without his calves exploding. Defense was great last season because of MF Anchor Tim Duncan, DPOY Kawhi Leonard and Block Machine Danny Green.

Last time the Spurs had major additions in '10 it took them a while to figure it out that season and I don't think they really ever did. They finished 50-32 that season I think. Hopefully it will be alot quicker. There does seem to be more continuity this time with KL and DG.

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Originally Posted by YGWHI

I'll try but having Duncan as the only true big man defender on the team doesn't sound like a balanced roster after all.

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He might want to work on gaining some weight. He might have to defend bigger and stronger players this season.

Did anyone else start humming "how to save a life" when they saw this thread

Our starting 5 and bench are forces to be reckoned with. We are auditioning and looking for some spare parts to see us through the regular season and will have many people wanting those spots. Will be fun to see who fills out the roster.

Not really worried, especially since FA isn't over.

Splitter-20 mpg, Baynes 15mpg
Swapped for La-West, and you can still sign some big body C

Belli for Anderson, Belli was so bad last year, Anderson can't be any worse, no real loss here. I'd even take Williams over him, that's how bad he was.

Cojo, saw limited mins, Mills finally gets more playing time, maybe KA at pg. I also think his defense was overrated, he really fed off of Green-Leonard.

West should be able to carry a decent load off the bench, his numbers dropped because he was without a PG (also influenced his offensive game) and played limited minutes.

Last time I checked, the game of basketball is still won by the team THAT SCORES THE MOST POINTS AT THE END OF THE GAME............

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Originally Posted by ElNono

We have big names now. The plan is to just show up and cause the other team to cower in fear. Like real fear. Then we'll pillage the visitor locker room, drink their wine, use up all the toilet paper and not put a new roll, etc. Savagery at it's finest. Finally, we take the LOBT, which is rightfully ours, and bring it back home.


Anyways, that's the movie version. We're still working the basketball details of all that.

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I strongly disagree with this barbaric assessment. I believe that Tim and Manu are likely to replace the toilet roll when the Spurs plunder and assault the oppositions locker room and perform various acts of ultra-violence on those foolish enough not to run for shelter.

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Originally Posted by ajh18

I'm not sure where this "huge loss of depth" argument comes from. We lost 3 bench players who averaged a total of 56.7 minutes/game this year in Marco, Baynes, and Corey. We lost one starter who averaged 19.8 minutes/game in Splitter. That's a total of 76.5 minutes/game.

We picked up a starter in Aldridge that should average around 32 min/game (he averaged 35.4 last year). I expect to see Patty get around 5 more minutes a game, putting him to about 20/game total. If West gets the same as Diaw, which is 24.5, that takes us down to 15 minutes left to divide among Anderson, Bonner, and whoever else we pick up as a backup small.

We'd still have a solid 9-10 man rotation averaging in double figure minutes. That's more than most teams, and not thin by any stretch. And that's all assuming we don't really add any other veterans of note.

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Not to mention CoJo and Baynes minutes were inflated by injuries (when team was healthy, they'd get DNPs sometimes which don't bring the average down). Biggest loss is Marco's minutes, which hopefully can be filled by playing less Manu/Green at the three and using Anderson for RS minutes. Will be very interesting to see if they can pick up a hybrid guard who can play some PG and shoot. Too much to ask for though.

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Originally Posted by Rob123

But as a student of the game of basketball I think the Spurs have been so successful in years past because of their defense, chemistry, and depth. To me it seems we've taken a step back in all those categories this off season.

If we're just planning on playing our stars vs theirs the thunder will surely come out on top.

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http://images.yuku.com/image/gif/df6...87506c6d04.gif

The "boogie man" Thunder died a long time ago. Let it go already. The Spurs are the class of the league and will be the team to beat. I doubt the Warriors even make it to the WCF. They had a great, magical year with good health and favorable playoff matchups but their run is over before it even started.

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Originally Posted by spurs10

I strongly disagree with this barbaric assessment. I believe that Tim and Manu are likely to replace the toilet roll when the Spurs plunder and assault the oppositions locker room and perform various acts of ultra-violence on those foolish enough not to run for shelter.

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Heck, Pop might leave behind an unopened bottle of Rock & Hammer... damn, we're pathetic...

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Originally Posted by ElNono

Heck, Pop might leave behind an unopened bottle of Rock & Hammer... damn, we're pathetic...

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Too nice...thinking that bottle of Rock & Hammer is missing a glass or two though.

Don't complicate. The Spurs are already deep. They'll play 10-12 guys the entire season. Probably will go 9-10 deep in the playoffs. As for chemistry, I think lockerroom-wise they'll be good. They are all in a similar age group and they are veterans, so that will be fine. On the court, yes, that will take time, but not that much. Spurs and Blazers run similar plays, and I'm sure Tim and Tony will get used to Aldridge finishing their passes. It will take training camp and a month or two to get on the same page, but by season's end, they will be a well oiled machine. Plus, don't forget half the team has already been playing together for the last three or four years, and some even longer.

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Originally Posted by dabom

Our offense was the problem last year. Tony falling off a cliff and injuries to many players. Pop not giving a fuck. We'll win 60 plus games next year.

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This...the Spurs stingy defense went out when Bowen left. Now there still is an emphasis on defense but the Spurs are still more geared to win by scoring more points, BUT can be geared to bring up the defensive pressure when the shots aren't falling.

If you are worried about the Thunder, with Aldridge at PF, he will pull Ibaka out of the paint a lot further and more often than he would want to be. Even then, Aldridge still has the ability to shoot over the top of even Ibaka as recent games and stats have shown.

Another way to solve something like this is with a Leonard and Aldridge PnR or PnP. Could you imagine the switch (which is how OKC played the Spurs) and having Durant now having to guard Aldridge in the block? Durant will have his hands full.

My only real concern from OKC is Westbrook and figuring out how to keep him out of the lane.

As long as wingstop is healthy, defense will be more than adequate imo

Yeah, I don't think our defense fell off the cliff. I don't know the numbers, but I'd bet we were at least top 8, and probably top 5 defense. We'll be pretty damn good with Wingstop, Duncan, and Alderidge.

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Originally Posted by ElNono

We have big names now. The plan is to just show up and cause the other team to cower in fear. Like real fear. Then we'll pillage the visitor locker room, drink their wine, use up all the toilet paper and not put a new roll, etc. Savagery at it's finest. Finally, we take the LOBT, which is rightfully ours, and bring it back home.


Anyways, that's the movie version. We're still working the basketball details of all that.

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:lol

Yeah the Spurs definitely reversed the youth movement they had going the past couple of years. Now it's another team with a few young players surrounded by a bunch of old veterans. We all know how that worked out during the pre-Splitter era.

But the offense was a huge problem last season. The Spurs just couldn't score in crunch time and relied on a 38 year old Duncan's post ups to carry them at the end of the fourth quarter and overtime. Having Aldridge at least gives the Spurs a go to scorer when needed. Hopefully the Spurs can still run the motion offense with Aldridge. I don't see how it will be too much of a problem, Aldridge is a good jump shooter and decent passer. He'll also give the Spurs some much needed interior scoring. I'll be disappointed if I see Pop revert back to a bunch of four downs just to feature Aldridge... the motion offense just cuts teams apart. It's not like Aldridge is a top 15 player and Pop shouldn't feature him as one. Pop should try to plug him into the motion offense and let Aldridge play a big role in it.

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Originally Posted by Uriel

OP makes a good point, tbh.

Chemistry should become less of an issue as the season goes along. And defense, while it won't be as good as it used to be, won't exactly fall off a cliff. Aldridge has the same size, mobility, and defensive versatility as Splitter. He's not as good, but he's not much worse either.

The only real concern for me is depth. Our lack of it will almost certainly mean the team will win far fewer games in the regular season than what the roster on paper might otherwise suggest. This is especially true given our placement in the Southwest division.

Hopefully a veteran or too looking to chase a championship ring comes aboard, especially during the buyout deadline. We desperately need more depth, especially at the wing.

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LA's offense is light years ahead of tiago and his D will improve on this team. And we're atleast 9 deep what more do you want?

also lost in the excitement: Spurs will not need to take part in next summer's Free Agent spending spree, where bench players will probably get Danny Green deals

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Originally Posted by Blake

Did anyone else start humming "how to save a life" when they saw this thread

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yeah and then you posted and the lyrics transformed into "how to lose a wife".

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Originally Posted by Ignignokt

yeah and then you posted and the lyrics transformed into "how to lose a wife".

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I laughed. 9/10

To all those guys bashing LAs D.
I believe he is as ctually a pretty decent defender when healthy and checked in. And he did play with a torn ligament last season so he was probably not as aggressive as well

They'll address depth and I don't see continuity as a problem -- they'll return somewhere between 8 and 10 players and other than Kyle Anderson, those guys have all been here through at least the 2012, 2013, and 2014 runs (in fact, the last guys to arrive before KA were Patty and Boris, who arrived on March 23 and 27, 2012; by the time the playoffs roll around again, that core group of 8 or 9 will have been together intact for 4 years and through 65 playoff games).

Time travel to 2009, bring back Hedo Turkoglu to play point forward and hit threes. But more realistically, they should look at Alexey Shved, who could absorb some minutes at the 3 being another ball-handler/play-maker/capable shooter. He plays a style that would give him a shot at filling Manu's shoes assuming he doesn't flame out or go back to Europe. Probably money motivated at this point in his career but might be willing to take the minimum to escape New York's Bermuda Triangle and have a chance to contribute to a winning team for once and have a wink-wink agreement to get paid next summer if he proves he can fill the void post-Manu.

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Originally Posted by TheDoctor

I keep laughing at the "defense won't be as good" take when Sassy couldn't move without his calves exploding. Defense was great last season because of MF Anchor Tim Duncan, DPOY Kawhi Leonard and Block Machine Danny Green.

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Tiago is a better defender than Aldridge. That's just a fact. He had a higher defensive real plus-minus and a higher defensive rating last season, even with "his calves exploding." If Aldridge takes Splitter's minutes, the defense will decline.

However, as I said, Aldridge has the same defensive versatility as Splitter. He's not as good a defender, but he isn't much worse either. So while our defense will suffer, it'll still be among the league's best. And given how much better Aldridge is offensively than Splitter, the net gain from switching the two should more than offset the defensive cost.

[QUOTE=Uriel;8104388]Tiago is a better defender than Aldridge. That's just a fact. He had a higher defensive real plus-minus and a higher defensive rating last season...QUOTE]

Those individual stats say only a part of the complete scheme as NBA basketball isn't a "one on one" game. Tiago's rating is derived, affected by San Antonio's system (players). They go hand to hand and the Spurs were only notch better defensively than Portland thanks mostly to TD, KL and DG. I'm pretty sure Aldridge's defensive ratings will improve this season. Tiago's defense will be felt in PnRolls, as he's an elite PnRoll defender. But like you said, our D will still be among the league's best and I suspect will be better than last year's.