Spurs were 3rd best defensive team in 20 gms Splitter missed at start of last season

Not worried, tbh..That's good sample size..It was aided by the fact Belinelli also missed a good chunk of those games (groin), which willl be the case this whole season :lol We leaned heavily on Kawhi/Green and TD in that period, but that's not like we are replacing Tiago with Kevin love/D Lee..Spurs's offense was the constant problem last year all along, and not our D except when Kawhi sat out 17 games..

http://i.imgur.com/I921pM8.jpg

Quote:

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Originally Posted by spursistan

Spurs's offense was the constant problem last year all along[/IMG]

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Spurs had the 7th best offense in the league. Not much of a "problem," tbh.

But, yeah, barring chemistry issues, the Spurs offense should be even better this coming season.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by timvp

Spurs had the 7th best offense in the league. Not much of a "problem," tbh.

But, yeah, barring chemistry issues, the Spurs offense should be even better this coming season.

---

Obviously it's relative to the previous year; it seemed like we generated mostly the same look but we couldn't knock them at the same clip..Diaw/Mills/Manu/Kawi struggled from deep all year long and that's been the theme of Clippers series with Green supplanting Mills....

Quote:

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Originally Posted by spursistan

Obviously it's relative to the previous year

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The Spurs have had the 7th rated offense three years in a row...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by spursistan

it seemed like we generated mostly the same look but we couldn't knock them at the same clip

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Fair enough. Yeah, the dip in three-point shooting is a notable difference between the two seasons.

Spurs definitely struggled on offense at times last year. Just because their system makes lower key teams look like they belong in d-league and we run the score up, doesn't mean we didn't struggle on offense. Out of the two , offense was the worse. The horrible shooting percentage makes that obvious in the clips series. Our defense was good enough to get plenty of looks. Our conversion rate will definitely take a bump with LMA and west spreading the floor.
Tony was one step away from converting a lot of layups. That extra spacing plus health will definitely benefit the offense.

OP dropping truth bombs on the splitter crew.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mnky

Spurs definitely struggled on offense at times last year. Just because their system makes lower key teams look like they belong in d-league and we run the score up, doesn't mean we didn't struggle on offense. Out of the two , offense was the worse. The horrible shooting percentage makes that obvious in the clips series. Our defense was good enough to get plenty of looks. Our conversion rate will definitely take a bump with LMA and west spreading the floor.
Tony was one step away from converting a lot of layups. That extra spacing plus health will definitely benefit the offense.

OP dropping truth bombs on the splitter crew.

---

Whoa! Stats don't tell the whole story. Splitter played a lot of injured minutes last year. A healthy Splitter has helped the Spurs have a top notch defense. My guess is the Spurs liked what he did on the court when healthy, but were tired of him being habitually injured. Probably why they couldn't gin up more value in a trade...teams know he's good but injury prone. That said, isn't he in a contract year? If so, expect a nice season from him.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by cd98

Whoa! Stats don't tell the whole story. Splitter played a lot of injured minutes last year. A healthy Splitter has helped the Spurs have a top notch defense. My guess is the Spurs liked what he did on the court when healthy, but were tired of him being habitually injured. Probably why they couldn't gin up more value in a trade...teams know he's good but injury prone. That said, isn't he in a contract year? If so, expect a nice season from him.

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I liked splitter. I'm sure the spurs did too. He fit the niche well. He just wasn't as an amazing loss as some make him out to be. The added offense from LMA more than makes up for the gap in defense loss.

Tiago was the griffin/Zbo stopper

spursfan won't admit this


Tiago stopped LMA


Tiago was the straw that stirred the drink on defense.


http://www.poundingtherock.com/2013/...-consideration


Spursfan cannot :downspin: their way out of this

It was primarily about creating cap space, but I think Pop soured a bit on Splitter and his constant inability to stay healthy..I don't think they ever considered trading Diaw and were probably ready to look elsewhere even if Aldridge didn't pan out....

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mnky

Spurs definitely struggled on offense at times last year. Just because their system makes lower key teams look like they belong in d-league and we run the score up, doesn't mean we didn't struggle on offense. Out of the two , offense was the worse. The horrible shooting percentage makes that obvious in the clips series. Our defense was good enough to get plenty of looks. Our conversion rate will definitely take a bump with LMA and west spreading the floor.
Tony was one step away from converting a lot of layups. That extra spacing plus health will definitely benefit the offense.

OP dropping truth bombs on the splitter crew.

---

Defense was atrocious against the Clippers. They pretty much got what they wanted whenever their starters were in the game and we weren't hacking.

Splitters D was good, but he was so bad on O, that it didn't even out imo...I mean when your 7' tall, you shouldn't be looking to pass, out of the paint...cmon. Cant wait to see LMA get the looks on O, that Tiago couldn't take advantage of.

No other team in the league would have won 50 last year with as many injuries as the Spurs had. But playing Timmy and Manu those heavy minutes came at a huge price; probably the price of a championship.

Also, the Spurs were looking unbeatable last year before the latest Tiago injury; so, let's not kid ourselves about how great he was for this team.

And I don't know how to show tweets; but this page shows a little something-something from the championship year if anyone knows how to post it:

https://twitter.com/SmoothsHoops/sta...92910121218048

Quote:

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Originally Posted by SuperCam

Tiago was the griffin/Zbo stopper

spursfan won't admit this


Tiago stopped LMA


Tiago was the straw that stirred the drink on defense.


http://www.poundingtherock.com/2013/...-consideration


Spursfan cannot :downspin: their way out of this

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You mean Kawhi you stupid fuck. Kawhi fucking mentally and physically fucks their SF and the bigs on the boards. We are a shit rebounding team without Kawhi. Fact.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by SuperCam

Tiago was the griffin/Zbo stopper

spursfan won't admit this


Tiago stopped LMA


Tiago was the straw that stirred the drink on defense.


http://www.poundingtherock.com/2013/...-consideration


Spursfan cannot :downspin: their way out of this

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You obviously didn't watch how bad he was vs the clippers this past April defensively.

As Lowe has astutely pointed out multiple times, Aldridge isn't nearly as big of a defensive downgrade from Splitter as many seem to think and they're actually similar, as far as their defensive range. Overall, the defense should be roughly the same, with the startling lineup being elite and the bench being sub par.

Splitter's defensive impact was/is overstate by some. The rare times he's both physically right and fully engaged, he's an excellent all around defender, but part of the reason he was so important was the drop off from him to all the bench bigs. The fact that they were/are sub par doesn't mean he's a combination of prime Robinson/Duncan though.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by SuperCam

Tiago was the griffin/Zbo stopper

spursfan won't admit this


Tiago stopped LMA


Tiago was the straw that stirred the drink on defense.


http://www.poundingtherock.com/2013/...-consideration


Spursfan cannot :downspin: their way out of this

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1.) Blake Griffin averaged a triple double against our "stopper"
2.) ZBo isn't the threat he used to be, and Aldridge is no David Lee.
3.) We don't need an Aldridge stopper anymore
4.) Are you betting on a healthy Splitter, in June, at age 31?

Losing Beli significantly increases the overall quality of our defense, he was fucking horrendous last year, I think he was out around the same time Splitter was and saw limited minutes when he came back.

Splitter wasn't a black hole on O like some are suggesting. He was excellent with Manu especially on the pick n' roll, set elite screens, and was able to catch tough passes or even make a slick pass to the open guy. His ability to pass was a big part of The Beautiful Game.

Tiago missed 30 games and only played 20mpg when healthy and we were a top 5 defensive team all year. Losing tiago doesn't hurt us at all.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by TD 21

As Lowe has astutely pointed out multiple times, Aldridge isn't nearly as big of a defensive downgrade from Splitter as many seem to think and they're actually similar, as far as their defensive range. Overall, the defense should be roughly the same, with the startling lineup being elite and the bench being sub par.

Splitter's defensive impact was/is overstate by some. The rare times he's both physically right and fully engaged, he's an excellent all around defender, but part of the reason he was so important was the drop off from him to all the bench bigs. The fact that they were/are sub par doesn't mean he's a combination of prime Robinson/Duncan though.

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lol regular season

lets remember zbo shitting on us in 2011 and how he was nullified by splitts?

The grizz were nullified by Kawhi getting all those boards and perimeter defending.

the new bigs will need to set splitter type picks

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5 years later and people are still worried about zbo:lol

The only concern is Blake Griffin and any drop in defense will be more than made up with better offense. Unless you want to see Tony Parker do what he did this year.

There is nothing to worry about with Zbo now, tbh. Tiago completely frustrated him and shut him down, very very true, but a large part of that was the Spurs ability to rebound after Splitter caused missed shots. Zbo does some of his best work off of his own and teammates misses. He can't bully Aldridge like he did McDyess/Bonner all those years ago...

With Duncan, Aldridge, Leonard and Green on the floor, opposing teams are going to struggle to make any impact on the boards offensively. Memphis should be the last of the Spurs worries.

Hopefully Bobi can do some things agains the grizz. If he even plays, that is.

People acting like Aldridge is an average or below average defender are mistaken. He's pretty clearly a positive on that end. The Blazers' starting 5 of Lillard/Matthews/Batum/Aldridge/Lopez had a DRTG of 98.0 last year (for comparison, GS had the #1 defense with a DRTG of 101.4). I know this isn't a fool-proof way of evaluating things, but comparing what our lineup will be to their starting 5 last year:

Parker = Lillard (both are absolutely awful defenders)
Green = Matthews (both are competing for the "best SG defender behind Tony Allen" title)
Kawhi >>>>> Batum
Aldridge = Aldridge (also think he could improve defensively under Popovich/Duncan's mentoring, plus he won't have to carry such a heavy offensive load)
Duncan >> Lopez

There's no reason to suspect that we won't be able to maintain an elite defense next year with Aldridge.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by SpursFan86

People acting like Aldridge is an average or below average defender are mistaken.

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Exactly. People making it sound like we are replacing Splitter with Kevin Love's defense. If that were the case then yeah, we would have a problem. But Aldridge is more than capable of playing good D and is an above average defender.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Vokun

Exactly. People making it sound like we are replacing Splitter with Kevin Love's defense. If that were the case then yeah, we would have a problem. But Aldridge is more than capable of playing good D and is an above average defender.

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Spursfans still trying to pretend that LMA isn't black Kevin Love when they basically have almost identical advanced profiles. :lol


Cavs held team to 3 fewer points per 100 possessions with Love on the floor compared to off during reg season.

Blazers actually had teams score nearly 3 points more per 100 possessions with LMA on the floor compared to off during reg season.


Love with higher Def rebounding %


Hmmm :downspin:

Cp3/Griffin probably played as well as they could and still the Clippers got taken to last possesion of Game 7..Even in that struggling form, Spurs lost the series because fluky Austin Rivers and Matt Barnes games..We get them next time, IMO..

double post

Not sure why people are citing the Clippers' series when it was evident that Splitter could barely move, tbh:lol..his health was probably the biggest reason the Spurs lost the series IMO..

And ya, while the OP is correct, a 20-game sample size is pretty small, especially since it occurred early in the season(early season results generally don't determine the final outcomes, excluding a few teams per season)..while Aldridge is an above average defender when engaged, the biggest difference is going to be mental..Splitter's job and focus was defense, while Aldridge has been the #1 option on a team for the majority of his career, it will take a little time to adjust to tweak his role to slightly less offensive and a little more defensive..

Quote:

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Originally Posted by HarlemHeat37

Not sure why people are citing the Clippers' series when it was evident that Splitter could barely move, tbh:lol..his health was probably the biggest reason the Spurs lost the series IMO..

And ya, while the OP is correct, a 20-game sample size is pretty small, especially since it occurred early in the season(early season results generally don't determine the final outcomes, excluding a few teams per season)..while Aldridge is an above average defender when engaged, the biggest difference is going to be mental..Splitter's job and focus was defense, while Aldridge has been the #1 option on a team for the majority of his career, it will take a little time to adjust to tweak his role to slightly less offensive and a little more defensive..

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Austin Rivers mauling our point guards/Matt Barnes turning into Robert Horry both in couple of flucky yet crucial games (4&7) :lol

The Spurs were #2 on defense and #7 on offense last year. I could see them finish #4 on defense and #2 on offense, for example, with a better point differential. The defense could very well drop off some and still be easily good enough to win a title.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by timvp

Fair enough. Yeah, the dip in three-point shooting is a notable difference between the two seasons.

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The dip in 3P shooting had something to do with opponents concentrating on running Spurs off the 3P line. Everyone remembers the open ones that got missed, but the perimeter guys got a lot of attention. The Spurs couldn't make up the difference on the inside.

Committing to staying on Danny Green is what let Miami win the Championship. Yeah, Danny was missing 3's in those last two games, especially. But that's because they were up in his jockstrap. Do that to the Spurs this season, and LMA is going to punish you in the paint, and West is going to kill you with mid-range. At least that's what I hope.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by spursistan

Spurs's offense was the constant problem last year all along, and not our D except when Kawhi sat out 17 games..
]

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Nail. Hit. Head.

Splitter was a key piece for 5. No him no 5 simple as that. I get the need to downplay him now so we can all feel better about ourselves but there's no need to do that. Splitter when healthy was a defensive beast, but our roster is simply overall better right now than last year. No need to discredit the Golden god.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by timvp

Spurs had the 7th best offense in the league. Not much of a "problem," tbh.

But, yeah, barring Parker's gunning issues, the Spurs offense should be even better this coming season.

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I agree

Aldridge averaged 20/10 on splitter, while being double and even triple teamed.
http://img3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb2...ust_Saiyan.jpg

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 100%duncan

Splitter was a key piece for 5. No him no 5 simple as that. I get the need to downplay him now so we can all feel better about ourselves but there's no need to do that. Splitter when healthy was a defensive beast, but our roster is simply overall better right now than last year. No need to discredit the Golden god.

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There is at least 9 players you can say that about.

Yeah the constant splitter slurping is annoying

Quote:

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Originally Posted by spursistan

Not worried, tbh..That's good sample size..It was aided by the fact Belinelli also missed a good chunk of those games (groin), which willl be the case this whole season :lol We leaned heavily on Kawhi/Green and TD in that period, but that's not like we are replacing Tiago with Kevin love/D Lee..Spurs's offense was the constant problem last year all along, and not our D except when Kawhi sat out 17 games..

http://i.imgur.com/I921pM8.jpg

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this. Would have been #1 by a mile with everyone healthy (minus one)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by KL2

Losing Beli significantly increases the overall quality of our defense, he was fucking horrendous last year, I think he was out around the same time Splitter was and saw limited minutes when he came back.

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it also significantly increases the overall quality of our offence since people don't need to waste energy guarding for 2 and we can get more transition points.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Aztecfan03

There is at least 9 players you can say that about.

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TD, Manu, Kawhi, diaw, green, mills. 6 guys. And even if it was 9, it doesnt make Tiago's contribution less than what it was.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by TD 21

As Lowe has astutely pointed out multiple times, Aldridge isn't nearly as big of a defensive downgrade from Splitter as many seem to think and they're actually similar, as far as their defensive range. Overall, the defense should be roughly the same, with the startling lineup being elite and the bench being sub par.

Splitter's defensive impact was/is overstate by some. The rare times he's both physically right and fully engaged, he's an excellent all around defender, but part of the reason he was so important was the drop off from him to all the bench bigs. The fact that they were/are sub par doesn't mean he's a combination of prime Robinson/Duncan though.

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West is quite a good defender off the bench (he was a key cog on the Pacers' ECF teams), Diaw isn't elite on D but he's not horrid, and we have the tall dude who can alter anything at the rim and body up on guys like Howard. When he's in the game we just need to make sure the guards fight through the screens or cheat (provided it's not Stephen Curry) instead of allowing the guy to be matched up 1-on-1 with our tall dude. Keep the tall guy parked in or near the paint on screens and make the opposing PG/SG shoot long 2's all night.

Also like to point out besides Splitter... Baynes set good picks as well

Hopefully West will be able to bear the brunt of that duty... but I think Baynes youth helped him in that banger role.

From all accounts I've seen of the new center, he isn't very quick side to side, so is weak at screening.

And I don't know at all, but does if there is some truth about LA not preferring to play center, I would think he'd rather not set picks and screens either.

That was a sublime aspect to the Spurs offense, agile big men as swinging blocks.

THANK YOU!!! I'm so sick of this annoying fad going on around here of certain player-fan posters giving this lazy "without x-player we don't win 5"...uh DUH!!!! This team is all about the sum of its parts so every player is important. For instance...do we win without Cory Joseph? Its highly reasonable and likely that his dunk on Ibaka made the starters and main rotation players question why they are afraid of ONE MAN. Because all I know is that the next game Kawhi jammed on Ibaka EARLY. Diaw was his most aggressive of the series. And even Duncan tried to dunk on him in the last 2 games of the series. And Duncan WANTED the ball in OT on Ibaka and took it to him. NONE OF THAT happened BEFORE Cory's dunk! So should we crown Joseph as irreplaceable? Come on...we all know and appreciate the value of Splitter...but its less about downplaying him than it is about just not thinking he was the end-all-be-all to our defensive efficiency like its made out to appear. We will be fine.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by testies

lol regular season

lets remember zbo shitting on us in 2011 and how he was nullified by splitts?

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Yeah, let's just discount the majority of the season because it doesn't reflect well on him.

'13 Randolph wasn't near the player he was in '11. In '13, he was not all the way back from his knee injury. Also, the downgrade in shooting from Battier and Mayo to Prince, meant he had virtually no room with which to operate.

It was still an outstanding job by Splitter (and Duncan; they took turns on him and Gasol, yet somehow Splitter got all the credit), but again, just about anyone would have looked better given the difference in circumstances and options in '11. McDyess was practically retired and Bonner and Blair were Bonner and Blair.

Something else to consider about Splitter and Aldridge defensively, is Splitter is a 20-25 mpg player, who even in the playoffs could barely effectively log high 20's; Aldridge will play 32-24 mpg and can/will effectively average high 30's in the playoffs.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by UNT Eagles 2016

West is quite a good defender off the bench (he was a key cog on the Pacers' ECF teams), Diaw isn't elite on D but he's not horrid, and we have the tall dude who can alter anything at the rim and body up on guys like Howard. When he's in the game we just need to make sure the guards fight through the screens or cheat (provided it's not Stephen Curry) instead of allowing the guy to be matched up 1-on-1 with our tall dude. Keep the tall guy parked in or near the paint on screens and make the opposing PG/SG shoot long 2's all night.

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Not really. West was fine when surrounded by the solid - elite defenders that comprised the Pacers starting lineup during his time with them, but the Spurs bench is pretty much the exact opposite. He'll also have to play out of position, which in terms of 1-on-1 defense, they can probably get away with in most match-ups. The problem is neither he nor Diaw can defensive rebound or protect the rim.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by TD 21

Yeah, let's just discount the majority of the season because it doesn't reflect well on him.

'13 Randolph wasn't near the player he was in '11. In '13, he was not all the way back from his knee injury. Also, the downgrade in shooting from Battier and Mayo to Prince, meant he had virtually no room with which to operate.

It was still an outstanding job by Splitter (and Duncan; they took turns on him and Gasol, yet somehow Splitter got all the credit), but again, just about anyone would have looked better given the difference in circumstances and options in '11. McDyess was practically retired and Bonner and Blair were Bonner and Blair.

Something else to consider about Splitter and Aldridge defensively, is Splitter is a 20-25 mpg player, who even in the playoffs could barely effectively log high 20's; Aldridge will play 32-24 mpg and can/will effectively average high 30's in the playoffs.



Not really. West was fine when surrounded by the solid - elite defenders that comprised the Pacers starting lineup during his time with them, but the Spurs bench is pretty much the exact opposite. He'll also have to play out of position, which in terms of 1-on-1 defense, they can probably get away with in most match-ups. The problem is neither he nor Diaw can defensive rebound or protect the rim.

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That's why you don't play West and Diaw together as the 2 "big men". You play one of them + the tall Russian dude to protect the rim and defensive rebound.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by UNT Eagles 2016

That's why you don't play West and Diaw together as the 2 "big men". You play one of them + the tall Russian dude to protect the rim and defensive rebound.

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West isn't coming to be a non rotation player. He'll be the clear fourth big and though Pop will obviously mix and match throughout, the majority of his minutes are likely to come alongside Diaw.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by TD 21

West isn't coming to be a non rotation player. He'll be the clear fourth big and though Pop will obviously mix and match throughout, the majority of his minutes are likely to come alongside Diaw.

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that's too small. West should be the clear 3rd big with the tall Russian at 4th. Bonbon is still serviceable enough to be the 5th big. Trade Diaw for a cheap shooter who is decent enough on defense, and sign Jack Lalanne for insurance.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by UNT Eagles 2016

that's too small. West should be the clear 3rd big with the tall Russian at 4th. Bonbon is still serviceable enough to be the 5th big. Trade Diaw for a cheap shooter who is decent enough on defense, and sign Jack Lalanne for insurance.

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Maybe so, but make no mistake, that's how it's going to be. Of course, they'll balance it out/tip the scales in their favor by probably being the best bench offensively in the league, particularly if they go with a shooter instead of Anderson/Simmons as the fourth wing.

Diaw is too valuable to be a fifth big or traded and West is 35 and probably one and done as a Spur. Besides, if they were going to go this route, they'd have just kept Splitter over Diaw.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by UNT Eagles 2016

that's too small. West should be the clear 3rd big with the tall Russian at 4th. Bonbon is still serviceable enough to be the 5th big. Trade Diaw for a cheap shooter who is decent enough on defense, and sign Jack Lalanne for insurance.

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This guy should be nominated for dummy of the year.

Diaw as a 5th big.:lmao

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Poolboy5623

Splitters D was good, but he was so bad on O, that it didn't even out imo...I mean when your 7' tall, you shouldn't be looking to pass, out of the paint...cmon. Cant wait to see LMA get the looks on O, that Tiago couldn't take advantage of.

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I agree the offense should allow LA to get some easier looks than he has in the past and it will be interesting to see how he takes advantage.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by HarlemHeat37

Not sure why people are citing the Clippers' series when it was evident that Splitter could barely move, tbh:lol..his health was probably the biggest reason the Spurs lost the series IMO..

And ya, while the OP is correct, a 20-game sample size is pretty small, especially since it occurred early in the season(early season results generally don't determine the final outcomes, excluding a few teams per season)..while Aldridge is an above average defender when engaged, the biggest difference is going to be mental..Splitter's job and focus was defense, while Aldridge has been the #1 option on a team for the majority of his career, it will take a little time to adjust to tweak his role to slightly less offensive and a little more defensive..

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Yeah I hope LA can adjust to the reduced shots. I think he's got to be the clear #1 offensive option then Kawhi, TD/TP. That will help keep him engaged defensively.


Pop has played small before with Bonner and Blair and I assume he will have no issue doing so again with Diaw and West. That big Russian dude will likely not be part of the rotation.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by therealtruth

I agree the offense should allow LA to get some easier looks than he has in the past and it will be interesting to see how he takes advantage.



Yeah I hope LA can adjust to the reduced shots. I think he's got to be the clear #1 offensive option then Kawhi, TD/TP. That will help keep him engaged defensively.


Pop has played small before with Bonner and Blair and I assume he will have no issue doing so again with Diaw and West. That big Russian dude will likely not be part of the rotation.

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Ugh, I don't want to root for a team that trots out the Turd Towers instead of big men :bang