Brief Analysis of tonights game and what it means going forward.

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Originally Posted by steeledl

Just keep it real..... don't be talking shit about him acting glad he is gone and then excitedly welcome him back.

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:lol

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Originally Posted by apalisoc_9

I dont think Manu minds at all though nor timmy. Parker and Pop is the weird cat..But i wouldnt be surpirsed to know if Pop is doing these shit in purpose to fully start running Leonard in the fourth.

Pop is such a weird dude. Plays a lot of mind games so he can get his..

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Tim doesn't get in anyone's way but Manu can't help himself but play hero ball when the opportunity presents itself. :lol Pop rarely calls crunch time plays for Porker so that isn't the issue.:lol

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Originally Posted by HarlemHeat37

Aldridge and Green have terrible chemistry in every facet of the offense, tbh..

Green gets very little out of the Aldridge post ups..Green can't run the pick & pop with Aldridge..Aldridge gives the ball to Green and expects him to create like Wes Matthews, for some reason, not sure how he hasn't noticed that Danny can't dribble:lol..

I know Aldridge is naturally a pussy and a beta, but he needs to be way more aggressive, rather than trying too hard to play "Spurs ball".. That era is over, tbh..

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I suspect they are both doing what Pop wants.
I can't think they would go to that play without Pop's sanction.
It's the same with Tony heroballing. Whether it works or not, Pop lets him. When Pop wants the ball to move, he commands it.
...
Danny has been the worst player in our regular rotation. It is a problem. I am not sure about Simmons starting over him TBH. I don't think Pop is ready to try that, and I don't think Danny is a good fit for the bench. In case people haven't noticed it is not so much drive and kick by Manu as all perimeter players in the bench making plays off the dribble nowadays, even Patty is dribbling much more, and both Simmons/Kyle make plays too on their own cutting and driving. That is not Danny's game. Danny needs to start, but he's been awful in Pop's new role or offense.

It really needs to be Kawhi/LMA 2 man game, not Danny. Danny needs to spot up and give up the ball if he doesn't have a shot.

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Originally Posted by sasaint

Unfortunately for us Kawhi is our best player in every aspect of the game. I am torn. As long as he is a 45% 3-point threat, I'm not sure I,want the ball in his hands to run PnPs and such. It is a real dilemma until/unless Danny comes around.

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In that case, Simmons FTW:lol

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Originally Posted by apalisoc_9

Leonard has shown flashes of creating. I think they are convinced he can. They are probbly going to go with die and live with Leonard in the 4th team once everyones roles settles in.

I agree about having another three pointer.

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Not really. I'm sure he'll get incrementally better in those situations, almost by default (similar to a DeRozan), but he's just not cut out to be that kind of player, at least on a championship team.

This is less of a chemistry issue than it's being made out to be. As I've said umpteen times, we saw it all of last season, too. They're atrocious in the clutch, especially on the road, against .500 or better teams, mainly because they no longer have a traditional go-to perimeter player.

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Originally Posted by TD 21

Not really. I'm sure he'll get incrementally better in those situations, almost by default (similar to a DeRozan), but he's just not cut out to be that kind of player, at least on a championship team.

This is less of a chemistry issue than it's being made out to be. As I've said umpteen times, we saw it all of last season, too. They're atrocious in the clutch, especially on the road, against .500 or better teams, mainly because they no longer have a traditional go-to perimeter player.

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Hard to improve when you go unnoticed for a long stretch and all you're suddenly expected to bail the team out with a minute left to play.

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Originally Posted by Kawhitstorm

Tim doesn't get in anyone's way but Manu can't help himself but play hero ball when the opportunity presents itself. :lol Pop rarely calls crunch time plays for Porker so that isn't the issue.:lol

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Said the same thing about Manu but i dont want to get in heated arguments and sensless aeguments with elnono. Even Manu admitted in his last intervire sometimes he shoots too much aka Heroball :lmao

I said it after the bulls game and everyone came storming at me with a bleeding vagina only for manu to admit he shoots too much at times a week after in one of his interviews. :lmao

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Originally Posted by apalisoc_9

Leonard has shown flashes of creating.

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Agree. We have seen some nice pick and rolls between Kawhi and Tim, in fact, Tim scored after one of those p&r in the 4th quarter...

At this point of the season, Kawhi should replace Danny in the equation of two man game with LMA.

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Originally Posted by TD 21

Not really. I'm sure he'll get incrementally better in those situations, almost by default (similar to a DeRozan), but he's just not cut out to be that kind of player, at least on a championship team.

This is less of a chemistry issue than it's being made out to be. As I've said umpteen times, we saw it all of last season, too. They're atrocious in the clutch, especially on the road, against .500 or better teams, mainly because they no longer have a traditional go-to perimeter player.

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Going to have to disagree with you here. Still, i think you are one of the few here who actually knows the sports so you can be right.

My point being is that there are various ways to get a clutch touch. Either on the triple threat or deep post. They are a great defensive team, they can afford to go this route offensively as oppopsed to a full breakdown the defense in crunch time via perimetter attackers.

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Originally Posted by TD 21

Not really. I'm sure he'll get incrementally better in those situations, almost by default (similar to a DeRozan), but he's just not cut out to be that kind of player, at least on a championship team.

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-He doesn't have bad numbers in those situations, in fact, the last time I looked at his stats he was the 2nd best Spurs player in those pick and roll situations after Parker.

-If Danny driving and trying to run pick and rolls is the option, I'd rather to see Kawhi with the ball in his hands instead of Green.

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Originally Posted by Kawhitstorm

In that case, Simmons FTW:lol

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I would argue Kyle.
I think Kyle is more clutch and smart in half court offense and has come through in games against playoff teams already playing with the starters (Grizzlies/Boston). Both games saved possessions and made the right play. He was very good defensively too might I remind you.

It won't matter though. Danny is not getting benched. We might get off that wagon early.

It is like calling for Tony to get benched last season: it ain't going to happen.

Live and die by Danny I guess. What I hope is that Pop adjusts his role.

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Originally Posted by apalisoc_9

Said the same thing about Manu but i dont want to get in heated arguments and sensless aeguments with elnono. Even Manu admitted in his last intervire sometimes he shoots too much aka Heroball :lmao

I said it after the bulls game and everyone came storming at me with a bleeding vagina only for manu to admit he shoots too much at times a week after in one of his interviews. :lmao

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:lol

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Originally Posted by SAGirl

I think some guys were disinterested... not all. Kawhi and LMA were balling, but Tony/Tim looked bad to start the game.

Do you feel like Tim is starting to show his age TBH? At times he does look old, there is always the defensive effort, but offensively I thought Timmy started off poorly.

Game was lost beyond just the crunchtime execution. We had many mistakes and empty posessions. Tony was bad most of the time I saw him.

I saw a brief stretch of the bench when they were engaged. Simmons made some plays. Obviously I missed 2 entire Q and some of the 4th Q. .. that is why I am so interested in others' reviews and appreciate opinions (that are not pure hate threads, more like observations and criticism.)

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I do not agree that LMA was balling. He looked as soft and bereft of energy as any game since he joined the Spurs. Kawhi may have been but the others on the floor with him were getting the ball to him for the most part at times or spots that were quite awkward expecting him to go get his own and bail them out.

As for Tim, it is impossible for me to judge at this stage of the season. Frankly, it has been my assumption all along that the plan was for Tim's role to diminish through this regular season as we brought LMA online. I expected this process to be complete when late this season or next, Tim came off the bench with the second unit (which would be in large part our old starting lineup). With that assumption, I gauged Tim's performance this season to be one of disciplined deference to our future "stars". (His stats are already at second unit-type levels.) Seen through that lens, I have not seen games like this as a sign of age, but of Tim's kind of losing his way, his understanding of his new role when others are expected to be The Man at crunch time. But, it is possible that my assumptions have clouded my perception, and these type performances are just a sign of age. The team, while looking very encouraging at times, is still struggling to discover its new identity - especially at crunch time, as apalisoc_9 brought out in his thread. I am willing to give Tim the benefit of the doubt until after the Rodeo Roadtrip.

IMHO, Simmons and Kawhi were the lone bright spots tonight. Every time out now, Simmons looks more and more comfortable and confident, playing within himself, making plays not turnovers. He will get some decent, regular rotation minutes before the season is over if he continues to make these strides.

To be honest, Pop worries me as much as the guys on the floor. He doesn't seem to know what he wants the team to do at times. He doesn't know how to use all of his new toys, and it is distracting him more than his usual mad science. If I had been Pop, I would have played Simmons more and Manu less in the second half. I also would have played Patty at crunch time. (Come to think of it, Patty was a bright spot, too.) for a team that played the most beautiful series in NBA playoff history and had that fabulous 8-pass possession just last game, our passing tonight was an abomination - laughably bad.

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Originally Posted by SAGirl

I would argue Kyle.
I think Kyle is more clutch and smart in half court offense and has come through in games against playoff teams already playing with the starters (Grizzlies/Boston). Both games saved possessions and made the right play. He was very good defensively too might I remind you.

It won't matter though. Danny is not getting benched. We might get off that wagon early.

It is like calling for Tony to get benched last season: it ain't going to happen.

Live and die by Danny I guess. What I hope is that Pop adjusts his role.

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Kyle will never play over simmons or any meanigful games until he starts taking those wide ope corner threes.

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Originally Posted by apalisoc_9

Kyle will never play over simmons or any meanigful games until he starts taking those wide ope corner threes.

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You might be quite right.

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Originally Posted by apalisoc_9

Kyle will never play over simmons or any meanigful games until he starts taking those wide ope corner threes.

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Against Minny he was a little more intent on taking his shot, and he hit a trey, IIRC. I think the guy can develop that shot to a respectable level, but 1) he has to be more aggressive and 2) Pop has to encourage it more and cut him a little more slack. Not sure either one of those things will happen this season, if ever.

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Originally Posted by sasaint

I do not agree that LMA was balling. He looked as soft and bereft of energy as any game since he joined the Spurs. Kawhi may have been but the others on the floor with him were getting the ball to him for the most part at times or spots that were quite awkward expecting him to go get his own and bail them out.

As for Tim, it is impossible for me to judge at this stage of the season. Frankly, it has been my assumption all along that the plan was for Tim's role to diminish through this regular season as we brought LMA online. I expected this process to be complete when late this season or next, Tim came off the bench with the second unit (which would be in large part our old starting lineup). With that assumption, I gauged Tim's performance this season to be one of disciplined deference to our future "stars". (His stats are already at second unit-type levels.) Seen through that lens, I have not seen games like this as a sign of age, but of Tim's kind of losing his way, his understanding of his new role when others are expected to be The Man at crunch time. But, it is possible that my assumptions have clouded my perception, and these type performances are just a sign of age. The team, while looking very encouraging at times, is still struggling to discover its new identity - especially at crunch time, as apalisoc_9 brought out in his thread. I am willing to give Tim the benefit of the doubt until after the Rodeo Roadtrip.

IMHO, Simmons and Kawhi were the lone bright spots tonight. Every time out now, Simmons looks more and more comfortable and confident, playing within himself, making plays not turnovers. He will get some decent, regular rotation minutes before the season is over if he continues to make these strides.

To be honest, Pop worries me as much as the guys on the floor. He doesn't seem to know what he wants the team to do at times. He doesn't know how to use all of his new toys, and it is distracting him more than his usual mad science. If I had been Pop, I would have played Simmons more and Manu less in the second half. I also would have played Patty at crunch time. (Come to think of it, Patty was a bright spot, too.) for a team that played the most beautiful series in NBA playoff history and had that fabulous 8-pass possession just last game, our passing tonight was an abomination - laughably bad.

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I only watched sections of the game, so I could quite be wrong on LMA overall, just the minutes I watched he was fine I guess.

I thought Kawhi kept making defensive plays specially in the 2nd Q, that is why I think regardless of how the game went for him offensively, he was trying to win this one. The minutes I watched of him, he was competing.

I am unsure about Tim's role. To start the season, I thought he was posting up on the left block and grabbing post up position before LMA early and thus bumping LMA to the dunker's spot, which aggravated LMA early deferential state and lack of aggressiveness. I really thought there was some bumping going on between them, not intentional, just Tim getting to his spots out of habit, LMA not getting to his spots bc he doesn't want to step on toes. At the time, Tim gave an interview when he admitted the team didn't have an established identity and he didn't even know his own role. It has started to come together, defense first, the lob throws, Tony had played really well until this game getting everyone involved and picking his spots, and Pop was taking advantage of Tim's passing skill, etc. Tim is still special in the SL and honestly when its been LMA/West, as good of a passer as West is, they are not as good. But I thought Tim didn't look good this game. He also struggled against the Pels. and Bulls. It is kind of a pattern when we struggle that Tim is not quite himself. Note we won games without Tim too. Wizards we went with Boban. Timberpups last game, all the starters got benched in the 3rd Q, and although ppl want to diminish the contributions by Kyle, the 3rd Q was his best showing. I thought the SL in the Timberwolves game didn't have the energy either, and may I also remind others the game was close until that 3rd Q. It was not on Kawhi. I thought Tim/LMA were having a bad game.

The concern is that Simmons or Kyle are unlikely to bump anyone in the rotation, right now they are bumping just each other, and both guys can play and have played well when given opportunities. I believe in Kyle's potential and I think he was very restrained by Pop to start the season bc the kind of player he can become you have to truly, really trust. At his core, he's a guy that likes to make plays for others, but he's a young kid, basically a rookie since Pop sent him down to the dleauge last year and didn't really concern himself with him until this season. It doesn't surprise me that Pop is reluctant to trust this two bc it took Pop a good 3 years to trust Kawhi with the ball to begin with. I would not expect either guy to be fasttracked. Kyle is young and the Spurs can afford to take a scenic route with him. To really use him at his best you have to trust him like you trust Manu. He's going to have to earn that from Pop, and Pop is going to be supremely tough (tougher than on Manu, he wont get away with bad shot selection, TO, etc)

I believe Simmons broke through because even if he's not trusted with the ball, he's a great transition scorer, and plays well off the ball and off other people. He's a better roleplayer right way, and his transition scoring is something that the team really lacks outside of Kawhi, but in reality, in terms of trust he is in the same boat.

Pop has had the luxury or relying on his vets this long. Even a guy of Kawhi's talent (a genuine MVP candidate in this league in his own right) didn't even really get Pop's trust with the ball until last season. Heck fans in this boards are still claiming for Kawhi to get the ball more. So even though I love both Simmons and Kyle and believe in their potential, I also think they are not getting fasttracked in any way over what it took Kawhi to get to where he is, specially not over Manu or Danny.

The concern for me right now is why Pop is trusting Danny with the ball so much, I don't think he's done well. I am thinking maybe Pop is stuck at this point.

Some great analysis and some people over thinking. Pops letting them figure it out. Pop can play God and clone an idea of his or he can let things play out and be as it should. Problem is we got a couple players who are still in the mold in which they were crafted and who can blame them. They can still get w's but when they aren't on it's a L. Parker and everybody can say its KL and LMA's team all they want but until they start letting them lead in the clutch we are only sewing seeds of future failure due to a lack of identity. KL and LMA need clutch shots that win or lose games and they need the big 3's trust and support during the learning curve. When it was Duncan's team we went at Shaq even though it didn't seem like it was a good matchup or favorable. You win some you lose some. Bottom line the play should be a Leonard post or a Aldridge post or even pick and pop. Put KL and LMA in a pick and roll and get everyone out the way. Two best players working together.

Side note: Some players have off nights. Just because a player has a percentage next to his name doesn't mean he's going to reach it every night.

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Originally Posted by SAGirl

I would argue Kyle.
I think Kyle is more clutch and smart in half court offense and has come through in games against playoff teams already playing with the starters (Grizzlies/Boston). Both games saved possessions and made the right play. He was very good defensively too might I remind you.

It won't matter though. Danny is not getting benched. We might get off that wagon early.

It is like calling for Tony to get benched last season: it ain't going to happen.

Live and die by Danny I guess. What I hope is that Pop adjusts his role.

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Does he pull out or finish inside?

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Originally Posted by UNT Eagles 2016

Does he pull out or finish inside?

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Rude!

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Originally Posted by SAGirl

Rude!

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Just kidding! Sorry. I thought you ignored me earlier, that's what you posted :( I promise I won't say anything like that again if you don't ignore me... please? = )

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Originally Posted by UNT Eagles 2016

Just kidding! Sorry. I thought you ignored me earlier, that's what you posted :( I promise I won't say anything like that again if you don't ignore me... please? = )

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I ignored you in the thread, bc we were loosing the game and you were going ballistic lol

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Originally Posted by apalisoc_9

- The spurs took this game seriously, no doubt so lets take the its only a regular season win BS out first.

- The spurs struggle in close games for a variety of reason but the biggest culprit today is Turnovers.

- The ball handlers today, particularly parker was so predictable that it allowed houston to defend the paint the way they did. Way too much predictable PnR/Pop with Tim and Lamarcus. Very little off ball screens for the starters. The offball screens today had zero convinctions and Purpose. Bigs shit the bed tonight, both the starters and the bench.

- The bench got fucked anally by terrence Jones and I expect Draymond Green who plays minutes with the bench to exploit the lack of toughness that second unit has.

- The Spurs crunchtime execution is soo poor because of one obvious reason. THEY DO NOT HAVE a crunch time identity. Unlike the older spurs that relied on Manu, Tim and to a lesser extent Tony..this team is still stuck between transitioning from Parker/Manu heavy crunchtime to allowing Leonard or LMA to make plays..Theyve been so poor the whole season.

- Pop has been shitting the bed. He has been soo poor in terms of outbounds playcalling..

- Until they bulild an identity in late game situations, they are going to conitune to be inconsistent on a possession by possesion basis.

- Disgusting how your best player is reduced to a bail out shooter.

- Green was actually awesome in the first half. But as evident LMA-Green just dont work on offense. It just does not. When the team is running through LMA green is basiclly a non factor since his Gravity is useless when LMA has the ball.

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Great points. I think that Danny and Timmy have lost their offensive identities in the SL. Tim has the talent to kind of make it work, whereas Danny relies on that pristine ball movement to make his impact offensively.

You bring up a very good point about the identity crisis being a big reason for the crunch time success, but I don't want us running the offense through LMA in crunch time, tbh. With the regression of his post game, he's now more suitable as a second-banana type. Kawhi should be a go-to guy, but his inability to effectively attack the basket is a big negative. His 1st step is mediocre and he just doesn't do a good job of dipping his shoulder consistently on his dribble drives. Once he improves one or both of those flaws, he'd be a MORE viable late-game iso or pnr option.

On another note, I honestly don't know what I'll do if I see another pathetic low-post pumpfake/forced shot combo from LMA...

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Originally Posted by SAGirl

I ignored you in the thread, bc we were loosing the game and you were going ballistic lol

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Alright then lol glad we're on okay terms now

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Originally Posted by UNT Eagles 2016

Alright then lol glad we're on okay terms now

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:toast