TD's Knee Watch

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Originally Posted by TD 21

She's not a team fan, she's an Anderson fan.

That's what her and a few others don't get. I understand that they probably no longer have a chance at a championship with them, but they definitely won't without them. The intangibles they bring to the table are irreplaceable.

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I don't think that's fair. I think she is a team fan and she is not alone in hoping the Spurs keep pursuing getting better and being a true contender. I would even be fine with that and not mad at all because I am a team fan and that would be exciting.

I'm just saying for this rare moment, I am willing to put aside the team for the players because the team can still be enjoyable and competitive (not a Kobe situation at all). If it were like Kobe, I'd say GTFO, but it's not.

I also think of course it will be impossible to replace Tim/Manu (and TP when that comes) with what they have meant to the franchise and with how talented they were. Unfortunately Tim Duncan's do not grow on trees so we should expect a much more normal franchise up & down because we don't have another Tim anchor to usher in that level of success. However, with where they are at now? I have no doubt basketball wise the team could improve over their level of play.

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Originally Posted by TD 21

She's not a team fan, she's an Anderson fan.

That's what her and a few others don't get. I understand that they probably no longer have a chance at a championship with them, but they definitely won't without them. The intangibles they bring to the table are irreplaceable.

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This is 100% bull shit. Did golden state get these " intangibles" from kerr? Are these intangibles like cooties? Leonard and lma were/are championship talent. It's the rest that determine how far we go.

The meltdown If Duncan opts to return will be micro small.

The meltdown If Manu opts in will be somewhat loud, but fade quickly.

The meltdown when we trot out the new turd tower 3 (say Kyle and caddy) will be hilarious though.

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Originally Posted by DPG21920

I don't think that's fair. I think she is a team fan and she is not alone in hoping the Spurs keep pursuing getting better and being a true contender. I would even be fine with that and not mad at all because I am a team fan and that would be exciting.

I'm just saying for this rare moment, I am willing to put aside the team for the players because the team can still be enjoyable and competitive (not a Kobe situation at all). If it were like Kobe, I'd say GTFO, but it's not.

I also think of course it will be impossible to replace Tim/Manu (and TP when that comes) with what they have meant to the franchise and with how talented they were. Unfortunately Tim Duncan's do not grow on trees so we should expect a much more normal franchise up & down because we don't have another Tim anchor to usher in that level of success. However, with where they are at now? I have no doubt basketball wise the team could improve over their level of play.

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Hoping to get better is one thing, but repeatedly trashing the greatest player in franchise history is another.

They could potentially become a more well rounded, versatile team, but they're not winning a championship without them. Right now, they don't have the talent. Without them, they still won't have it, only at that point, they won't have the intangibles either.

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Originally Posted by K...

This is 100% bull shit. Did golden state get these " intangibles" from kerr? Are these intangibles like cooties? Leonard and lma were/are championship talent. It's the rest that determine how far we go.

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As good as Leonard and Aldridge are, they're the worst top two of any of the five elite teams. The Spurs aren't winning a championship unless they can out depth/IQ the other four and that ship has sailed.

This board wouldn't be here if it wasn't for Tim Duncan...tbh

Just my 2 cents I feel the people that want Tim to retire are the younger people who just don't really comprehend what he means for not only the team but the city of San Antonio..

Thr ego stroking and "player fans" are really pathetic because no Spur will ever have the impact that Duncan had in our lifetime.

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Originally Posted by TD 21

Hoping to get better is one thing, but repeatedly trashing the greatest player in franchise history is another.

They could potentially become a more well rounded, versatile team, but they're not winning a championship without them. Right now, they don't have the talent. Without them, they still won't have it, only at that point, they won't have the intangibles either.

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I disagree. At this point in their careers, as much as I love them, there are clearly better players than them to be had. Clearly. Spurs weren't that far off with Manu/Tim not really contributing in the playoffs (intangibles or not) and if SA had more productive players, they definitely get past OKC.

It will be a big loss losing them for many reasons but that is more to do with future expectations than short-term play. Losing Tim/Manu hurts because of what they have done and how good they have been in always giving you a chance every year to be a playoff team at worst & contender at best.

Without a Tim and lesser degree Manu/TP, there is no reasonable way to be a playoff team for 20+ years unless you luck out when you are bad and get another Duncan/Lebron type.

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Originally Posted by coachmac87

This board wouldn't be here if it wasn't for Tim Duncan...tbh

Just my 2 cents I feel the people that want Tim to retire are the younger people who just don't really comprehend what he means for not only the team but the city of San Antonio..

Thr ego stroking and "player fans" are really pathetic because no Spur will ever have the impact that Duncan had in our lifetime.

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Well, I think the argument is that if the team can be better with Tim/Manu being gone because they get more productive players, doesn't that make you the player fan because you are choosing Tim/Manu over the team?

I see both sides and there are definitely player fans. I just don't think it's black and white in this situation because Tim is not doing what Kobe did.

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Originally Posted by DPG21920

Well, I think the argument is that if the team can be better with Tim/Manu being gone because they get more productive players, doesn't that make you the player fan because you are choosing Tim/Manu over the team?

I see both sides and there are definitely player fans. I just don't think it's black and white in this situation because Tim is not doing what Kobe did.

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Better how? I haven't seen ONE legit plan to replace Duncan on this board. He won't hurt us by coming back lol..yes he should play a lesser but we are not a better team without him.

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Originally Posted by DPG21920

I disagree. At this point in their careers, as much as I love them, there are clearly better players than them to be had. Clearly. Spurs weren't that far off with Manu/Tim not really contributing in the playoffs (intangibles or not) and if SA had more productive players, they definitely get past OKC.

It will be a big loss losing them for many reasons but that is more to do with future expectations than short-term play. Losing Tim/Manu hurts because of what they have done and how good they have been in always giving you a chance every year to be a playoff team at worst & contender at best.

Without a Tim and lesser degree Manu/TP, there is no reasonable way to be a playoff team for 20+ years unless you luck out when you are bad and get another Duncan/Lebron type.

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It just depends on whether Duncan's knee can recover to the point where he looks like he did early in the season (obviously, none of us know the answer to that). If it can, he's still better than most realistic candidates and Ginobili is probably better than all realistic candidates.

Whether they got past the Thunder or not, they weren't going any further. With what they can realistically do, financially and asset wise, so long as Durant re-signs, I expect the Spurs to drop to fifth out of the five elite, in terms of ability to win the championship.

People who are eager to see Duncan and Ginobili go, are going to be in for a rude awakening in the years to come, when they watch this team inevitably repeatedly come up short short against the elite, in the playoffs. I'm not suggesting it would be any different with them, at this point, but that's just it: It's not going to get better.

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Originally Posted by TD 21

It just depends on whether Duncan's knee can recover to the point where he looks like he did early in the season (obviously, none of us know the answer to that). If it can, he's still better than most realistic candidates and Ginobili is probably better than all realistic candidates.

Whether they got past the Thunder or not, they weren't going any further. With what they can realistically do, financially and asset wise, so long as Durant re-signs, I expect the Spurs to drop to fifth out of the five elite, in terms of ability to win the championship.

People who are eager to see Duncan and Ginobili go, are going to be in for a rude awakening in the years to come, when they watch this team inevitably repeatedly come up short short against the elite, in the playoffs.

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Don Harris last night on Sports Sunday was saying that, privately, Duncan was not a fan being benched in stretches during the season when he was dressed ( Warriors -- the Diaw start, ect). If he doesn't think he can significantly contribute in a starting role he's retiring. He will not come back as a bench piece -- all the work he has to do to get ready in the summer and during the season won't be worth it.

Duncan knew this was his last run coming into the playoffs, nothing else can explain the way he pointed in the sky at the crowd as he was walking out of Chesapeake Arena after Game 6. First time in TD's career he's ever done that after a game on the ROAD and first time he's ever done that after a game he LOST.

This is it. He's retiring.

Spurs will be legit contenders next season with or without TD/Manu unless they absolutely fuck up this offseason bringing in new talent. If they keep TD/Manu and bring in a Gasol/Conley/etc they'll be the second best team in the West/NBA again. Just need to hope Pop gets his shit together or the team takes another step forward cohesive/talent-wise.

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Originally Posted by SAGirl

I am a team fan and it was noticeable that he wasn't right since midseason. We won't win every season, but you try to get better each year.

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if your a team fan why the bullshit about anderson?

P

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Originally Posted by MaNu4Tres

Don Harris last night on Sports Sunday was saying that, privately, Duncan was not a fan being benched in stretches during the season when he was dressed ( Warriors -- the Diaw start, ect). If he doesn't think he can significantly contribute in a starting role he's retiring. He will not come back as a bench piece -- all the work he has to do to get ready in the summer and during the season won't be worth it.

Duncan knew this was his last run coming into the playoffs, nothing else can explain the way he pointed in the sky at the crowd as he was walking out of Chesapeake Arena after Game 6. First time in TD's career he's ever done that after a game on the ROAD and first time he's ever done that after a game he LOST.

This is it. He's retiring.

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Not buying Don Harris at all tbh...

Of course no player wants to get benched.. It's going to come down to the "plan" IMO. Duncan can opt in or see what moves the Spurs can try to make and maybe take less if it gives them a better chance to win. No need to rush the decision..

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Originally Posted by MaNu4Tres

Don Harris last night on Sports Sunday was saying that, privately, Duncan was not a fan being benched in stretches during the season when he was dressed ( Warriors -- the Diaw start, ect). If he doesn't think he can significantly contribute in a starting role he's retiring. He will not come back as a bench piece -- all the work he has to do to get ready in the summer and during the season won't be worth it.

Duncan knew this was his last run coming into the playoffs, nothing else can explain the way he pointed in the sky at the crowd as he was walking out of Chesapeake Arena after Game 6. First time in TD's career he's ever done that after a game on the ROAD and first time he's ever done that after a game he LOST.

This is it. He's retiring.

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I'm not surprised to hear that (I don't care how unselfish he is, you don't become as great as him without a ton of pride and belief) and I agree that he's retiring.

I'm just saying, to determine how many better, realistic options are available to them, we'd need to know in comparison to what version of Duncan and no one here can definitively say whether it's possible to get his knee back to where he was before January.

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Originally Posted by coachmac87

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Not buying Don Harris at all tbh...

Of course no player wants to get benched.. It's going to come down to the "plan" IMO. Duncan can opt in or see what moves the Spurs can try to make and maybe take less if it gives them a better chance to win. No need to rush the decision..

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I don't think he'd opt in regardless. I think he'd opt out whether he's retiring or coming back, its the only way SA can maximize their assets this summer to put together a team good enough to make another run. Tim would care more about improving his chances at 6 than making another 5 million.

All that is irrelevant though because TD is retiring. He's not coming back.

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Originally Posted by MaNu4Tres

I don't think he'd opt in regardless. I think he'd opt out whether he's retiring or coming back, its the only way SA can maximize their assets this summer to put together a team good enough to make another run. Tim would care more about improving his chances at 6 than making another 5 million.

All that is irrelevant though because TD is retiring. He's not coming back.

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Is there a deadline for him to make a decision? And you're making an emotional statement by saying he's for sure done

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Originally Posted by TD 21

I'm not surprised to hear that (I don't care how unselfish he is, you don't become as great as him without a ton of pride and belief) and I agree that he's retiring.

I'm just saying, to determine how many better, realistic options are available to them, we'd need to know in comparison to what version of Duncan and no one here can definitively say whether it's possible to get his knee back to where he was before January.

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I heard it was a bone bruise...and if that's the case his knee shouldn't be an issue

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Originally Posted by SAGirl

I am a team fan and it was noticeable that he wasn't right since midseason. We won't win every season, but you try to get better each year.

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Some posters don't know how to let go of the past. People talk about how hard it will be to replace this guy and that, yet are the same people who can't believe and act surprised when those older players get out played in big games. There's a reason, they're just not that great anymore they can be good role players, but not a significant part of the team.

We made a living on taking other teams older players who had lost a step or couldn't be a focal point anymore, and they came on as role players. The spurs problem was they didn't relegate those older guys to role players and instead relied on them to be much more.

They get outplayed by younger, hungrier players, and then people argue it will be hard to imagine replacing them. No it won't, they got outplayed against elite teams all year for a reason. Not because they're irreplacable. Always thought its such a silly argument to make.

Definitely need to always be looking forward to getting better if you wish to stay relevant. Spurs have a golden opportunity with Leonard to build another decade of success, need to let go of the past if they want to though and be realistic.

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Originally Posted by Mnky

Some posters don't know how to let go of the past. People talk about how hard it will be to replace this guy and that, yet are the same people who can't believe and act surprised when those older players get out played in big games. There's a reason, they're just not that great anymore they can be good role players, but not a significant part of the team.

We made a living on taking other teams older players who had lost a step or couldn't be a focal point anymore, and they came on as role players. The spurs problem was they didn't relegate those older guys to role players and instead relied on them to be much more.

They get outplayed by younger, hungrier players, and then people argue it will be hard to imagine replacing them. No it won't, they got outplayed against elite teams all year for a reason. Not because they're irreplacable. Always thought its such a silly argument to make.

Definitely need to always be looking forward to getting better if you wish to stay relevant. Spurs have a golden opportunity with Leonard to build another decade of success, need to let go of the past if they want to though and be realistic.

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Your GIF says it all tbh... Duncan coming back another year won't stunt the growth of Leonard

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Originally Posted by hemann82

Spurs are going to surprise some people with how much they suck without Manu Timmy or parker for that matter

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I don't think they suck at all. Will be different yes, but despite everything, there are players who can have as much or more impact than Tim/Manu gave this year. I'm not rushing them out the door or anything, just saying who they were does not change who they are now.

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Originally Posted by DPG21920

I don't think they suck at all. Will be different yes, but despite everything, there are players who can have as much or more impact than Tim/Manu gave this year. I'm not rushing them out the door or anything, just saying who they were does not change who they are now.

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When you have two of the top 20 players in the NBA, you are going to be successful. Leonard and LMA provide that. The FO needs to be creative by way of trades and free agency to improve the athletic ability of the team. There are still some youngs guys already here who can take on bigger roles.

The team won't win 67 games in the regular season in 2016-2017, but that is not always the most important barometer of success.

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Originally Posted by Harry Callahan

When you have two of the top 20 players in the NBA, you are going to be successful. Leonard and LMA provide that. The FO needs to be creative by way of trades and free agency to improve the athletic ability of the team. There are still some youngs guys already here who can take on bigger roles.

The team won't win 67 games in the regular season in 2016-2017, but that is not always the most important barometer of success.

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Agreed & Tim/Manu helped a ton in the regular season when there was less game planning and everyone was chipping in. But when they are made to be the ones to beat you vs great competition it's tough. Not their fault, just how it is at the moment.

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Originally Posted by coachmac87

Your GIF says it all tbh... Duncan coming back another year won't stunt the growth of Leonard

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I hope he comes back. Leonard is better off with Duncan around to help shape and lead him. Leonard himself said Duncan's been a great teammate to him and gave him crew for helping him grow.

That wasn't the point at all though. Different argument.