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Not impossible due to Robinson's no ring history. One post Duncan championship could be enough. But d Rob was pretty much the two way player kawhi is. It seems weird to say kawhi will clear him...a tie is more likely.
Just for fun...make the case...what's Kawhis actual ceiling?
Not really a super bold prediction. The argument could be made that kawhi is already very close or even already there.
Kawhi top 3 all time or goat
Top 3 spur? Sure. Top 3 all time or goat spur no. Timmy will most likely hold the top spur ranking for at least the next 20 - 30 years And probably beyond that
He has 2 rings.Quote:
Originally Posted by K...
K is old and senile. He tends to forget things sometimesQuote:
Originally Posted by SpurPadre
In Robinson's first full 10 seasons as a player, he never finished lower than 6th on season PER.Quote:
Originally Posted by apalisoc_9
89-90 26.35 5th (as a rookie)
90-91 27.43 3rd
91-92 27.51 2nd
92-93 24.19 6th
93-94 30.66 1st
94-95 29.13 1st
95-96 29.41 1st
96-97 INJURED
97-98 27.85 3rd [T. Duncan] 22.63 5th (as a rookie)
98-99 24.91 3rd [T. Duncan] 23.21 7th
99-00 24.55 5th [T. Duncan] 24.78 4th
This is Kawhi's first year in the top 10 in said category (5th at 25.95 currently). Kawhi's benefit is having Pop as coach and his tremendous work ethic is paying off. He has the benefit of coming in to a polished Spurs System that maximizes his talents. It wasn't until Holt purchased the Spurs that the culture changed. The Red McCombs years were disastrous for their lack of identity and support.
Heck, Kawhi's "second banana" in LM Aldridge is way better than David ever had until Duncan arrived.
Not the an apples-to-apples comparison IMO.
Threw up a little in my mouth when I read that Robinson (the reason I'm a Spurs fan) has zero rings.Quote:
Originally Posted by SpurPadre
WTF man....
I thought it was clear that it was no rings as an alpha. You never count Robinson's 1999&2003 rings. Those are Duncan's. You try to.2-2 Robinson and Hakeem and you get laughed at. This is ranking all time greats. You have to qualify titles as lead vs role player.
Come back in another 10 years and we can talk.
David robinson is overrated
the only one getting laughed at is youQuote:
Originally Posted by K...
fineQuote:
Originally Posted by Proxy
Underrated guy was a freak.Quote:
Originally Posted by apalisoc_9
Idk...I'm not a Robinson fanboy (I know we have a few here), but David was a 30 ppg scorer AND best defender in the world at his peak...and he was an all-star level player from day 1, whereas Kawhi needed a few years to develop.
Yeah really. And he'd have more rings if he had half the talent TD's had for most of his career, not to say TD isn't the greatest Spur of all-time but still...Quote:
Originally Posted by Silver&Black
Yeah I'm not sure OP was old enough to watch Robinson play the game.
Kawhi is a very good player and a one in a million talent. While it's certainly possible he'll pass Robinson I'm not sure it's a certainty. Robinson was an absolute monster back in the day. Like a brutal life destroying basketball monster. He would have ate the Monstars from space jam alive.
Gonna have to see that compared to Kawhi's stats before I can admit that into evidence, tbh.Quote:
Originally Posted by Phenomanul
Nobody will ever be above Timmy. Ever.Quote:
Originally Posted by ElKingslayer2
Holeesheet retard convention just got off I seeQuote:
Originally Posted by K...
Well, you know that PER numbers care more about offense than the two ends, it's not surprising that Kawhi has his first season in top 5 averaging +20 points...Quote:
Originally Posted by Phenomanul
Also, having Pop as coach, makes Kawhi doesn't play too many minutes or take too many shots.
David Robinson in his best season took 20.7 FGA per game and played 40.5 mpg.
Kawhi Leonard in his best season is taking 15 FGA per game and playing 34 mpg
Of course "not the an apples-to-apples comparison" because Kawhi will never have the chance to play DRob minutes or take that many shots.
:claw
D-Rob is a top 15-20 player of all-time. I'd say it's pretty bold to state Kawhi will finish ahead of him, and it's ridiculous to say he's already very close.Quote:
Originally Posted by ElKingslayer2
Your point would be valid if D-rob was offense only.Quote:
Originally Posted by YGWHI
He was defensive poy, 4 time defensive first team, and 4 time defensive second team.
AND his per led the league for years, AND he carried the team when the rest of the supporting cast was crap, AND he scored as a volume shooter.
Kawhi is a special, and I think the best 2 way player in the league. His offense is slowing catching up to his D. He is the best wing defender, and probably a top 10 offensive player today.
Kawhi, if he has a decent number of healthy years hopefully, is headed for top 3 spurs of all time, passing gervin, and joining drob and tim.
If Kawhi leads a spurs team to a championship, I can at least see the argument about him being #2, but it is just premature today.
or be surrounded with the same quality of talent... (or lack thereof in Robinson's case).Quote:
Originally Posted by YGWHI
BTW Robinson was a defensive freak... a seven footer with the capability of amassing double-digit steals in any given game... he did it 4 times... Kawhi as a perimeter player has done that exactly 0 times.
What is it with you myopic player fans...? I ABSOLUTELY LOVE Kawhi as a player. But why take a dig at The Admiral in order to prop Kawhi... They're two completely different players.
Of course he did.Quote:
Originally Posted by spursfaninla
But also playing more minutes, and getting a lot more opportunities to score, help his case.
Until Kawhi has been a second-team defensive player or better for 5+ years, I don't know how we can even talk about this.
When a great player finds himself surrounded by poor talent, it's likely he'll put amazing numbers, getting individual success.Quote:
Originally Posted by Phenomanul
That's not Kawhi's case. He will never take 21 FGA per game on this team.
No one is taking a dig at him.Quote:
But why take a dig at The Admiral in order to prop Kawhi... They're two completely different players.
I've said before here he's my dad's favorite player and the reason he's a Spurs fan so I LOVE DRob.
I like Kawhi, but no...just no.
The usual no because he's my hero before
Kawhi as in top 3 spur all time... or top 3 NBA player of all time and effectively challenging MJ for his title as GOATQuote:
Originally Posted by apalisoc_9
We have yet to scratch the surface with this kid.......... His game in my opinion, will mature into him becoming the best or 2nd best player in the WORLD! He has it and it can't be bought or taught; you roll out of bed with it!
Whottt would rip off your head and shit down your throat hole if he was still alive.Quote:
Originally Posted by apalisoc_9
Kawhi Leonard will never ever score 73 points in a game. I guarandamntee it.
This is just another attention whoring thread by Apa. Posting one of his "edgy" predictions. Boring.
If Leonard wins one or two championships without Duncan + the finals MVP that goes with it, maybe. Leonard will already have at least 1 finals MVP and 2 DPOY already by the end of this year. He'll continue to get his all stars, and all NBA selections and pad his resume. The important thing is winning a championship or two post Duncan. Without that, he can't be above Robinson.
Kawhi passed up Admiral w/ the 2014 Finals performance. Robinson has NEVER had a performance H2H like that against an elite player, the '99 run is the closest thing to Kawhi's 2014 run.
If not for David Robinson and Tim Duncan, it would be the St. Louis Spurs or some bullshit like that. There are a lot of bandwagon fans who have no clue of the Spurs history. Love Kawhi, thankful to have him but DRob is Spurs royalty...
The Spurs would be very fortunate if that happens.
IDGAF if the Spurs played on Mars, where a team plays is TOTALLY irrelevant to me. Fuck TEXAS!Quote:
Originally Posted by houston spurs fan
Kawhi might become one of the best to ever play the game, but not yet. Not yet.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SF9C3cklVIQ
^^^^^^ This.Quote:
Originally Posted by DocDoc
Don't forget the Quad double or the MVP season for that matter D Rob had, better yet his 1994 season... I believe he won a DPOY too and was also Rookie of the year. I am still waiting for Kawhis break out game where he drops 40 plus points tbh, it will come but he has only gone over 30 a few times.Quote:
Originally Posted by LongtimeSpursFan
2014 was great and he stepped up but his overall body of work is not there yet, like someone said come re visit this way down the road. He is not there yet, he will get there though. If he gets hurt and bows out early or does not continue to grow by some sort of bad events (Mental or whatever) then he is not passed D Rob as a player at this present point in time. I will give it atleast 5 or so years then say on this one. I hope he does though, would be great.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kawhitstorm
Proof you are a player fan.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kawhitstorm
Mj didn't as well.Quote:
Originally Posted by LongtimeSpursFan
Meow
I became a Spurs because of Team Duncan whom I've been a fan of since his Wake Forest day (rather say some bum like Matt Bonner) & will stay on the ship as long as Kawhi is wearing a Spurs jersey. I'm not a player stan like Kobe fans who will defend him even if he raped their mother. (Calling out teammates when they are wetting the bed isn't the definition of a "player fan", it called speaking the truth)Quote:
Originally Posted by houston spurs fan
I've ZERO obligations to support ANY product Peter Holt churns out when he isn't donating to the Republican party. I also give ZERO fucks about a military city w/ a dirty creek & fat messican women.
Making fun of the city where the Spurs play on a Spurs forum. :lmao
Faggot. :lmao
Seriously a bonafide faggot. :lmao
If Kawhi does finish above DROB than Spurs fans should consider themselves bloody lucky. Robinson was one of the best ballers I've ever seen and a freak of nature.
How lucky are the Spurs... 92 onwards we had a freakshow in David Robinson, Tim Duncan came on board in 97-98 and everyone knows how that turned out, he was followed by Manu and TP. They then stole Kawhi for Hill in the draft, then succeeded in nabbing of the top bigs in the NBA last offseason in LMA. With Kawhi and LMA San Antonio will most likely go from years 1992-apx 2028 (apx end of Kawhi's career) only missing the playoffs once (the perfect year to tank as it landed TD in the draft) As most Spurs fans I dreaded post TD life, yet we are now in good hands.
Brilliant team, and to maintain all this success with one of the poorest ownership groups is phenomenal. All the best to Kawhi, i hope he has a long, healthy, incredible career. Go Spurs Go!
I couldn't find any games where he got double-digit steals, but I did see that he did it in blocks 10 times.Quote:
Originally Posted by Phenomanul
Just affirmed you are not a Spurs fan. So why do you spend countless hours on our team's forum?Quote:
Originally Posted by Kawhitstorm
He is one of only four players in the history of the game to have a quadruple double dumbass.Quote:
Originally Posted by Thomas82
And no. Not yet. He just now made an all star team. Five-oh was an all star from his rookie year. It's not even close right now. Might he? Maybe. And the bullshit about his mvp in the finals putting him ahead then by that logic, Iggy has passed DR???? Come on! Who the fuck are you people. You probably never saw him play. Morons.
Right now, its still Robinson
but who knows after 5 years of Kawhi peak??
I knew about the quad-double, but he did it with BLOCKS, not steals. Alvin Robertson is the only one of the 4 with a quad-double to do it with steals. And don't disrespect me like that again, I never called you out of your name.Quote:
Originally Posted by blizz
Kawhi has surprised with his ability to improve key areas of his game.
But considering the incredible talents DRob had, I doubt Kawhi will pass him on individual achievements.
If he does, all the better for the Spurs and the fans.
I think a lot of people that didn't see Robinson play don't realize how great he was. I still make the mistake of underrating him at times because of the Houston loss and also because of the dominance of the Spurs once Duncan arrived.Quote:
Originally Posted by Russo21
But Robinson did not have a great coach that knew how to build around him and develop system and find players that would work. They would occasionally find some good pieces to put around him but they never had the continuity or real direction until Pop and company showed up. It was basically, "let's find some good players, put them out there with DR and see if it works". Not unlike what the Mavs have been doing around Dirk. Had Pop been in charge from the beginning of DRob's career, I believe he'd have a ring or two without Timmy.
I certainly think KL should be talked about in the same sentence with Robinson but it's impossible imo to ever say that one was a better Spurs than the other. Of course if KL continues his trajectory, maybe it will be an easier call. But right now, I think DRob is above Kawhi.
It's not like Kawhi outplayed LeBron in 2014Quote:
Originally Posted by Kawhitstorm
I was going to say that, but honestly 100 years down the road the Spurs could get Michael Jordan reincarnated. You just never know.Quote:
Originally Posted by SoonerSpur512
I think he will too.
Kawhi better than DROB assumes so much. First-- kawhi continues at this year's level for 7-8 more years, that we win more titles, that he doesn't get hurt, that he doesn't leave SA, and that one overhypes the present for the past. DROB was in MVP conversation (if not winning it) for 7 years in a row. He's a top 20 All time player.
Here's hoping Kawhi does that in SA (and i really do) but come on man-- have some patience and enjoy one of the other Spurs who was an elite player for this team. And while he might have rode TD for second title. He was vital to 99 title and timmy's transition into SA (and the winning culture that remains to this day --as he remains active now)
The amount of disrespect Dave is getting in this thread is disgraceful.Quote:
Originally Posted by SpursFan86
The fact that without Robinson, the Spurs could very well possibly be in another city. That alone should warrant him top consideration. His place at #2 is pretty much cemented.
Respect the man...
http://www.azquotes.com/picture-quot...n-72-15-33.jpg
:lmaoQuote:
Originally Posted by SsKSpurs21
Finish above him in what?
PPG? No. (DRob's average is above Kawhi's career high)
RPG? No fucking way.
APG? Kawhi's career high is DRob's career average.
BPG? No fucking way.
SPG? Kawhi slightly higher and I could see him finishing above in this stat.
PER? DRob's career average is above Kawhi's career high.
Rings? DRob has twice as many.
DRob was a monster. He was LeBron tier, maybe higher.
:lmaoQuote:
Originally Posted by Kidd K
In terms of his position I'm not even sure you could say he has been the best SF in franchise history. Sean Elliott, Larry Kenon, Mike Mitchell, Kawhi Leonard. At this point I would say he has only past Mike Mitchell.
IdiotQuote:
Originally Posted by apalisoc_9
IdiotQuote:
Originally Posted by apalisoc_9
Quote:
Originally Posted by K...
Just delete your account
LOL. I love Sean but come on.Quote:
Originally Posted by LongtimeSpursFan
He's passed everyone on that list already, by leaps and bounds.Quote:
Originally Posted by LongtimeSpursFan
I would say no. Kawhi will put up good numbers but I think things are going to be radically different once the big 3 are gone. It will be hard to find guys who can replace the talent and intangibles they brought to the table. This will definitely impact the spurs ability to win games and will effect Kawhi since he will be forced to carry even a bigger load. It all hinges on Kawhi winning another title and a league MVP along with multiple ASG appearances. 2 out of those 3 things will be hard to attain for Kawhi but we will see.
No reply = no argument.Quote:
Originally Posted by apalisoc_9
You obviously have never seen him play to even make such an asinine claim in the first place.
I hope this is the case. What a win for spurs fans and organization if it pans out that way
Kidd k takes :lmaoQuote:
Originally Posted by Kidd K
Oh, my bad....I didn't know you were a shareholder of the team.:lmaoQuote:
Originally Posted by houston spurs fan
In any case, I'm retired & this what I do on my free time while your mom is cooking after she blows me.:wakeup
He did actually outplay him in the final 3 games which were all blowout wins for the Spurs. Meanwhile, Admiral got his ass handed to him in the finals 3 games against Akeem/Malone.Quote:
Originally Posted by 313
And if you take into account the quality of defenders in the era in which he played, the discussion becomes all the more ridiculous. Kawhi is an amazing defender, but he hasn't earned his way into the conversation with Robinson, Rodman, Payton and Mutombo yet.Quote:
Originally Posted by spursfaninla
:lmaoQuote:
Originally Posted by Kawhitstorm
90s defenders :lmao
Allowed to hack
:lmao
All about the rings imo. If he can get to 3 he passes drob imo
Bruce > Drob?Quote:
Originally Posted by RD2191
Idiot
Quote:
Originally Posted by SsKSpurs21
Can't respect a man who has been a whipping boy of NBA superstars w/o rings: Malone/Barkley. Duke is a beta bible totter like Durant who bends over backwards instead of rising up to the challenge.
Or you'll do what? But yeah, you're right it was blocks. My bad.Quote:
Originally Posted by Thomas82
Uh, no. Not yet.Quote:
Originally Posted by Russo21
Was bruce a 1st option? No, retard.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sec24Row7
http://www.johnlocke.org/site-docs/l...nggoalpost.gifQuote:
Originally Posted by RD2191
Not really. It's obvious that I mean Kawhi ringing as a 1st option. I mean I'd obviously put Horry at my all time number 1 since he has 7 rings.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sec24Row7
Sarcasm by the way
:lmaoQuote:
Originally Posted by Sec24Row7
Kawhi will never drop a quadruple double
Drob was more gifted he just never had a supporting cast to match his effort.
If this year's Spurs had a center giving them 24 points, 12 rebounds and 4 blocks in place of Kawhi I dare say they'd be in contention for first place in the west.Quote:
Originally Posted by dabom
I'd think we'd still be in the same spot. It's never on Kawhi or Drob for losing. Our other players are what lose us games at the beginning of the season.Quote:
Originally Posted by Obstructed_View
Would it be crazy to imagine LMA and Drob with Duncan off the bench? :lol
The offense with bigs is better for transition defense too because your guards are already in position to defend.
That's assuming a big like Drob and not just any other big in the league. Kawhi is the best option right now amd future even if you have to give up some fast breaks. The offense run through him is efficient as fuck right now.
Whether Kawhi passes him or not. I just like both players.
I don't think you've thought this through. A center in today's NBA with Robinson's talent would dominate the league. Curry would be a distant second for MVP.Quote:
Originally Posted by dabom
Except Kawhi is the best wing defender in the game in a perimeter oriented offense nba. Kawhi is no slouch. And like I said. We haven't lost a game because of kawhi all season. Maybe the toronto game but he was poisoned or something.Quote:
Originally Posted by Obstructed_View
Kawhi is indeed the best wing defender in the game. He is indeed no slouch, and it's not disprespecting him in any way by saying he couldn't yet carry Robinson's jock. He's got an incredible work ethic, a champion's mindset, and he's labored really hard to become a top player in the NBA, something Robinson was from the second he stepped into the league.Quote:
Originally Posted by dabom
I hope that OP's prediction comes true, because that will mean that Kawhi continues his immense improvement as a player. Make no mistake about how high that bar is.
That statement is a disrespect statement though. What are you talking about? :lmaoQuote:
Originally Posted by Obstructed_View