How do we convince Gasol to opt out so we can sign Cp3

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Originally Posted by TheDoctor

We won't need to convince anyone. Pau, Patty, Nico, B3RTANS, Tony and Manu are getting deported as soon as January tbh

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Originally Posted by lefty

I think the new President has already taken care of that

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Holy @#$%
You're right on. I hear Pau speaking fluent Spanish on the HEB commercial. Manu too. The must be Mexican bad hombres...

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Originally Posted by Chinook

Best hope is an amnesty provision to get Parker out of there. The truth is that both he and Pau need to go for the Spurs to have room to offer a max contract.

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I did the math the other day If we renouced everyone except simmons(Manu + Mills then irrelevants), picked up Simmons + Dedmons options we would be at 95mil.

Cap projected at 104-107mil. That leaves 9-12mil add in another 16mil dumping Gasol and I think 25-28mil is close enough to max to be competitve

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Originally Posted by BG_Spurs_Fan

It would be very difficult to go after CP3 and keep Dedmon too, unless he shits the bed for the rest of the season.

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No it wouldn't. Cp3 would have to accept 25-28mil, Manu would have to retire or come back for min and Patty would be gone

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Originally Posted by Cklbmk

I did the math the other day If we renouced everyone except simmons(Manu + Mills then irrelevants), picked up Simmons + Dedmons options we would be at 95mil.

Cap projected at 104-107mil. That leaves 9-12mil add in another 16mil dumping Gasol and I think 25-28mil is close enough to max to be competitve

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Simmons and Dedmon don't have team options. Simmons is a RFA, basically Spurs have matching rights on him, but depending how the season overall goes for him, he will receive a raise. He's now on nearly min salary, so the difference will be significant. Dedmon has a player option that if he plays well, he will likely opt out of as well. You'd renounce a lot of guys that are in your bench on cheap contracts and some would be on their second seasons (Bertans, Murray, Forbes), therefore you'd miss on their improvement from season 1 to 2. It doesn't seem worth it to go around that way. In reality they have to shed guys in big contracts, like Tony and Pau. ....

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Originally Posted by Cklbmk

I did the math the other day If we renouced everyone except simmons(Manu + Mills then irrelevants), picked up Simmons + Dedmons options we would be at 95mil.

Cap projected at 104-107mil. That leaves 9-12mil add in another 16mil dumping Gasol and I think 25-28mil is close enough to max to be competitve

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Sure, if you think $10 Million a year short is competitive. And I dunno if you included roster charges and the like. And the cap is projected at $102 Million. The cap for 2018 is $107 Million.

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Originally Posted by SAGirl

Simmons and Dedmon don't have team options. Simmons is a RFA, basically Spurs have matching rights on him, but depending how the season overall goes for him, he will receive a raise. He's now on nearly min salary, so the difference will be significant. Dedmon has a player option that if he plays well, he will likely opt out of as well. You'd renounce a lot of guys that are in your bench on cheap contracts and some would be on their second seasons (Bertans, Murray, Forbes), therefore you'd miss on their improvement from season 1 to 2. It doesn't seem worth it to go around that way. In reality they have to shed guys in big contracts, like Tony and Pau. ....

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Ya myb double listed Simmons. Intended to put Lee.

Misread Dedmon as TO instead of PO. Pop gotta work some magic with him, tell him he gets to start.

Those guys wouldn't be renounced. Only Mills, Manu, Lapro would be renounced.

BBR has Forbes + Bertans showing GTD next season already. Murray is year 1 rookie so he's GTD too.

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Originally Posted by Cklbmk

Ya myb double listed Simmons. Intended to put Lee.

Misread Dedmon as TO instead of PO. Pop gotta work some magic with him, tell him he gets to start.

Those guys wouldn't be renounced. Only Mills, Manu, Lapro would be renounced.

BBR has Forbes + Bertans showing GTD next season already. Murray is year 1 rookie so he's GTD too.

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Contract issues like these are really not my forte, but it is my impression you are overestimating the ability to sign a premier FA and retain guys you want. Lee/Dedmon both have PO and Simmons is a RFA who will get paid more. You can't sell those guys on discounts. For Lee it might be his last nice contract and Dedmon and Simmons have never gotten a big contract and they are both 27... both rely on athleticism a lot. They need to get paid next offseason. I don't have the numbers or anything like that, but keeping those 3 will cost you enough that you can't get a max FA if you don't shed others and we are not talking about your minimum contract guy others.

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Originally Posted by Chinook

Sure, if you think $10 Million a year short is competitive. And I dunno if you included roster charges and the like. And the cap is projected at $102 Million. The cap for 2018 is $107 Million.

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Really depends how bad he wants to win.

No roster charges would be required in this scenario as there would be enough players under contract

We could make a 25mil offer without much effort as long as Dedmon opts in and Lee is willing to opt out then resign for the min again(effectively costs him 54k).

When you take income tax into account for LA(13.3%) vs Texas(0%) it becomes the equivalent of 27mil from Clippers.

So really he'd be leaving 5-6mil on the table to try to win. I could totally see him do that to attempt to salvage his legacy

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Originally Posted by SAGirl

Contract issues like these are really not my forte, but it is my impression you are overestimating the ability to sign a premier FA and retain guys you want. Lee/Dedmon both have PO and Simmons is a RFA who will get paid more. You can't sell those guys on discounts. For Lee it might be his last nice contract and Dedmon and Simmons have never gotten a big contract and they are both 27... both rely on athleticism a lot. They need to get paid next offseason. I don't have the numbers or anything like that, but keeping those 3 will cost you enough that you can't get a max FA if you don't shed others and we are not talking about your minimum contract guy others.

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What simmons gets paid is largely irrelevant do to his tiny cap hold. They can sign him last and completely ignore that. Lee could create us an extra 1mil by opting out then resigning for the min instead of opting in.

Dedmon is the only real issue in this scenario.

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Originally Posted by Cklbmk

What simmons gets paid is largely irrelevant do to his tiny cap hold. They can sign him last and completely ignore that. Lee could create us an extra 1mil by opting out then resigning for the min instead of opting in.

Dedmon is the only real issue in this scenario.

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You assume Lee would accept the min. I doubt that. You assume Simmons will not get offers right away with FA starting, but I think for a star if you are intent on it and it's a real possibility you risk him.. (kind of like what happpened with Cojo)

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Originally Posted by SAGirl

Contract issues like these are really not my forte, but it is my impression you are overestimating the ability to sign a premier FA and retain guys you want. Lee/Dedmon both have PO and Simmons is a RFA who will get paid more. You can't sell those guys on discounts. For Lee it might be his last nice contract and Dedmon and Simmons have never gotten a big contract and they are both 27... both rely on athleticism a lot. They need to get paid next offseason. I don't have the numbers or anything like that, but keeping those 3 will cost you enough that you can't get a max FA if you don't shed others and we are not talking about your minimum contract guy others.

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All the talk about a max FA troubles me. First, I don't think aside from LMA, SA ever was or will be a max FA destination. But more than that, I think that the Spurs have too many holes to fill to lose guys you think would walk in order to sign some unnamed max FA.

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Originally Posted by SAGirl

You assume Lee would accept the min. I doubt that. You assume Simmons will not get offers right away with FA starting, but I think for a star if you are intent on it and it's a real possibility you risk him.. (kind of like what happpened with Cojo)

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Simmons would have to know h'd be taken care of. I think he'd be willing to wait if the Spurs were like hey we're gonna retain you just need you to wait til we line everything else up. We won't dick you on the contract etc.

I am assuming Lee would accept the min since I think he came here for a reason. I'm fairly certain he could have got more than the min this year.

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Originally Posted by Cklbmk

Really depends how bad he wants to win.

No roster charges would be required in this scenario as there would be enough players under contract

We could make a 25mil offer without much effort as long as Dedmon opts in and Lee is willing to opt out then resign for the min again(effectively costs him 54k).

When you take income tax into account for LA(13.3%) vs Texas(0%) it becomes the equivalent of 27mil from Clippers.

So really he'd be leaving 5-6mil on the table to try to win. I could totally see him do that to attempt to salvage his legacy

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First, if Dedmon is willing to take his offer (he won't be), why not have him also opt out and re-sign for the RE? May as well optimize if we're going to talk about best-case scenarios.

Second, the tax system doesn't work that way. You pay for where you play, not where you're based. So it ends up being a much smaller difference than you assume.

Third, are you accounting for Bertans', Forbes', Murray's and Simmons' deals spiking with the new CBA? The team would have about $3 Million less in that scenario. And yes, their contract would be adjusted upward to match the new min.

This is about what your scenario would look like:

Name	2017-18
LaMarcus Aldridge	$21,461,010
Kawhi Leonard	$18,868,625
Dewane Dedmon	$3,000,000
Tony Parker	$15,453,126
Danny Green	$10,000,000
Tim Duncan (stretched)	$1,881,250
Kyle Anderson	$2,151,704
Livio Jean-Charles (waived)	$414,080
Dejounte Murray	$1,357,874
Jonathan Simmons	$1,522,119
Bryn Forbes	$1,357,874
Davis Bertans	$1,357,874
Roster Charge	$843,740
Roster Charge	$843,740
Total	$80,513,015

So we're talking like $21.5 Million in cap space

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Originally Posted by sasaint

All the talk about a max FA troubles me. First, I don't think aside from LMA, SA ever was or will be a max FA destination. But more than that, I think that the Spurs have too many holes to fill to lose guys you think would walk in order to sign some unnamed max FA.

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1. They wouldn't have to let anyone walk prior to receiving a commitment from said max FA.

2. We would have 12 players under contract and the only real hole would be backup C assuming LMA refused to be backup C.

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Originally Posted by Chinook

First, if Dedmon is willing to take his offer (he won't be), why not have him also opt out and re-sign for the RE? May as well optimize if we're going to talk about best-case scenarios.

Second, the tax system doesn't work that way. You pay for where you play, not where you're based. So it ends up being a much smaller difference than you assume.

Third, are you accounting for Bertans', Forbes', Murray's and Simmons' deals spiking with the new CBA? The team would have about $3 Million less in that scenario. And yes, their contract would be adjusted upward to match the new min.

This is about what your scenario would look like:

Name	2017-18
LaMarcus Aldridge	$21,461,010
Kawhi Leonard	$18,868,625
Dewane Dedmon	$3,000,000
Tony Parker	$15,453,126
Danny Green	$10,000,000
Tim Duncan (stretched)	$1,881,250
Kyle Anderson	$2,151,704
Livio Jean-Charles (waived)	$414,080
Dejounte Murray	$1,357,874
Jonathan Simmons	$1,522,119
Bryn Forbes	$1,357,874
Davis Bertans	$1,357,874
Roster Charge	$843,740
Roster Charge	$843,740
Total	$80,513,015

So we're talking like $21.5 Million in cap space

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No I calculated income tax correctly. I calculated it at half which is the amount of home games. It totals to 6.65% difference between LA and Texas.


Bertans and Forbes contracts are incorrect(905k each) as are the roster charges(550k and we'd only need 1). You're only required 12 players.

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Also Murrays contract is only 1,233,240

and Simmons cap hold is 1,093,295

He looks tired.
Going thru the motions.

Frankly Gasol is not pulling his worth.
Food for thought.

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Originally Posted by SAGirl

Food for thought.

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I'd be happy to feed you

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Originally Posted by Cklbmk

No I calculated income tax correctly. I calculated it at half which is the amount of home games. It totals to 6.65% difference between LA and Texas.


Bertans and Forbes contracts are incorrect(905k each) as are the roster charges(550k and we'd only need 1). You're only required 12 players.

edit:

Also Murrays contract is only 1,233,240

and Simmons cap hold is 1,093,295

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No. You aren't accounting for the CBA. All min deals are increasing by 50 percent. That is retroactive. There's a reason why I mentioned that in your calculations. All deals will bump up to at least the min, as was the case for Hill in 2009-2010. And we have no idea what Simmons' cap hold will be. It could be up to like $3 Million, especially if he keeps getting around 20 mpg. And count the players. You need two roster charges. Paul doesn't count as one.

And no, it's not just home games that account for tax, but it's close enough, I guess. It should be more expensive than that to play for LAC, because they play Cali teams in their division and the Spurs play Texas and TN teams.

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Originally Posted by Chinook

No. You aren't accounting for the CBA. All min deals are increasing by 50 percent. That is retroactive. There's a reason why I mentioned that in your calculations. All deals will bump up to at least the min, as was the case for Hill in 2009-2010. And we have no idea what Simmons' cap hold will be. It could be up to like $3 Million, especially if he keeps getting around 20 mpg. And count the players. You need two roster charges. Paul doesn't count as one.

And no, it's not just home games that account for tax, but it's close enough, I guess. It should be more expensive than that to play for LAC, because they play Cali teams in their division and the Spurs play Texas and TN teams.

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Where are you getting 50% increase on min from? I've found nothing but articles that things might happen with new CBA, nothing definitive

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Originally Posted by Cklbmk

Where are you getting 50% increase on min from? I've found nothing but articles that things might happen with new CBA, nothing definitive

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http://www.basketballinsiders.com/pr...al-labor-deal/

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The working assumption is that minimum salaries, exceptions and rookie-scale contracts for first-round picks will jump by roughly 50 percent.

When calculating cap space, teams are charged a rookie-minimum salary for every open roster spot through 12 players. The current CBA dictates next season’s minimum to be $562,493, but it could scale up by 50 percent to $843,740.

A team with eight players would have $1.1 million total in four roster charges based on the current rules. That would jump to $2.2 million with a higher minimum salary—offsetting a $1 million bump in the NBA’s salary cap.

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There are multiple news pieces about the increase, but that analysis article breaks down the implications on cap space, so I decided to link that.

Parker is not going to cut it anymore. We need more juice at the guard positions. This team looks robotic and stiff imo

Frankly Fatsol is way out of shape and looks hella FAT. Too much jamon and chorizo in the summer do that to you.

Can someone post a gif of when CP3 did that double stomp tantrum thing?

Lol Kawhi or CP3 leading a team past the second round.