Start the modernball movement already

Even though this roster is flawed, we still have enough pieces to play today's NBA winning ball (specially on defense). i.e: 4 (long) perimeter players and a big.

The advantage the Spurs have that most NBA teams don't is that they have two young 6'5'' Point Guards that can switch into any perimeter player of the other team. They should take advantage of this opportunity.

They also have enough long wings that can play as stretch 4's: Bertans, Gay, Anderson and Kawhi.

Imho, once Kawhi comes back the rotation should be:

Starters

White, Green, Kawhi, Bertans, Aldridge.

Bench

Murray, Ginobili, Anderson, Gay, Gasol.

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Now, reality:

I know Pop will never do this at this point of the season, and to some point I understand. Taking Parker out of the rotation for what should be his last season seems way too cold, and doing the same to the guy you just committed 50 millons to is not very smart if the idea is to shop him in the offseason.

So, I'm cool with delaying these moves untill the end of the season, specially because it's not very likely that we will get very far this year anyway. But if by the start of the next season, PATFO doesn't make the necessary moves to start heading into this direction, they will push this franchise into years of obscurity.

Old dogs cant learn new tricks, just let it sink this season is fucked.

Manure? :lol That guy has like 2 points in his last 4 games. He's done. Time to put him out of his misery, not get him more minutes.

Seriously, that bench is so flawed it's not even remotely funny.

3p%:
Gasol - 38.7%
Ginose - 32.7%
Gay - 32.6%
Anderson - 26.2%
Murray - 26.1%

The only time those guys need to be together is when another hurricane hits East Texas and they're building houses for those in need.

I'd start Anderson just to dial the defense up to the max. We'd still have 4 shooters on the court as well.

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Originally Posted by TheGreatYacht

Manure? :lol That guy has like 2 points in his last 4 games. He's done. Time to put him out of his misery, not get him more minutes.

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And who's saying he should play more minutes? :lol

Quote:

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Seriously, that bench is so flawed it's not even remotely funny.

3p%:
Gasol - 38.7%
Ginose - 32.7%
Gay - 32.6%
Anderson - 26.2%
Murray - 26.1%

The only time those guys need to be together is when another hurricane hits East Texas and they're building houses for those in need.

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Yeah, that's something I thought. Ideally you would have one more shooter on that lineup, but it is what it is. Maybe you can switch Murray and White. But I would like to see what White is capable of with the starting unit. You can also switch Bertans and Anderson.

One thing is for sure, The Spurs need to get shooters in the offseason.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Nathan89

I'd start Anderson just to dial the defense up to the max. We'd still have 4 shooters on the court as well.

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Instead of Danny or Davis?

Although Bertans isn't as terrible of option as I once thought. His height seems to match-up well vs the limitations that Draymond, Livingston, and even Klay have tbh. Also stretching Draymond out or anyone that guards him is a nice luxury.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mikeanaro

Old dogs cant learn new tricks, just let it sink this season is fucked.

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Under "the old dogs" I expect more of the same ol' same ol' next season, tbh.

Problem is, even our three point "specialists" are shooting well below the league average. :lmao

- Bertans has to be shooting at a higher clip from deep. 37% isn't awful, but its definitely not good enough for a specialist, and that's what he is. Right now he's a worse Ryan Anderson with an occasional wow play.

- Green has to get back to basics. Outside of transition, he should never be taking jumpers off the dribble. He's not enough of a pure shooter to make it work, but he keeps attempting them. He's actually been shooting north of 41% since the break, but Pop has sliced his minutes.

- I defend Pop all the time, but his aversion to rookies has always been maddening. This team clearly needs some juice at guard, and different combinations of Mills/Forbes isn't going to move the needle.

- Pau has predictably gone to shit after a promising start to the season. We need a better rim presence, and its not fucking Joff. We're short on options, and Costello should have gotten more run earlier in the season to see if he can offer anything.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Darius Bieber

Problem is, even our three point "specialists" are shooting well below the league average. :lmao

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which specialists are you referring to and what do you think the league average is?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by spurraider21

which specialists are you referring to and what do you think the league average is?

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Well specifically our players who don't do much besides shoot the three ball. Bryn Forbes isn't known for his defense nor his inside game. He was shooting around 5% over the course of 8 games last month. The league average is hovering around 37% for all players.

:pop: "Zig when they Zag"

Quote:

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Originally Posted by spurraider21

- Bertans has to be shooting at a higher clip from deep. 37% isn't awful, but its definitely not good enough for a specialist, and that's what he is. Right now he's a worse Ryan Anderson with an occasional wow play.

- Green has to get back to basics. Outside of transition, he should never be taking jumpers off the dribble. He's not enough of a pure shooter to make it work, but he keeps attempting them. He's actually been shooting north of 41% since the break, but Pop has sliced his minutes.

- I defend Pop all the time, but his aversion to rookies has always been maddening. This team clearly needs some juice at guard, and different combinations of Mills/Forbes isn't going to move the needle.

- Pau has predictably gone to shit after a promising start to the season. We need a better rim presence, and its not fucking Joff. We're short on options, and Costello should have gotten more run earlier in the season to see if he can offer anything.

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I expect the shooting % of players like Green and Bertans to go up once Kawhi comes back and a rotation is settled for good.

Also, Bertans is a bit more than just a 3pt specialist. He can put on the floor and pass a bit too. And on defense he isn't as bad as some might want to suggest. If he could cut down on his fouling rate, he could actully be above average.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Darius Bieber

Well specifically our players who don't do much besides shoot the three ball. Bryn Forbes isn't known for his defense nor his inside game. He was shooting around 5% over the course of 8 games last month. The league average is hovering around 37% for all players.

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league average is 36.2

forbes is shooting 38.1

op is correct, but I do not see Pop doing this

I think you have to keep playing Parker. Tony is the third option, and he's more consistent than Gay seems to be and has a game that can fit in better with the others. I've been speculating about White starting literally since before the season began, but he probably should be running with the bench or starting in place of Green for a little while. Ultimately, I think he should be getting minutes over Mills and Murray, though.

Frankly, I don't know what Pop is doing right now. It seems like he could be showcasing Murray and Mills for a trade, keeping White sort of on the back-burner in hopes of keeping him going forward. If that's the case, he should have done this to start the season or as soon as Tony came back. I can't see that combo making it to the summer still looking all that great. If it's not for a trade, then Pop is doing it because he thinks it's helping win games. And, well, it's not. All it did was make Anderson more marginalized with the starters and limit Green to an extent that he probably wants out regardless of money this time around. Way to go.

Forbes is just to short and a terrible defender his percent would need to be at 50+ to stay on team

Quote:

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Originally Posted by DAF86

Imho, once Kawhi comes back the rotation should be:

Starters

White, Anderson, Kawhi, Bertans, Aldridge.

Bench

Murray, Ginobili, Green, Gay, Gasol.

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by sasaint

Under "the old dogs" I expect more of the same ol' same ol' next season, tbh.

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Sure, if Pop is still around you can expect more stubbornness.

I agree with the style of play, this antiquated approach doesn't give the Spurs a chance to win through volume 3-point variance on certain nights where they're lacking high-end talent..

I don't buy that they have the pieces to run this style, though..

Even ignoring that Aldridge would have to agree to a change in style, they still need a 4 with the ability to play both ends and rebound(Bertans and Gay are horrendous defensive players, right now), a guard who can draw defensive attention and an upgrade over Gasol..

Adding White would help eliminate the backcourt's size issues, but I don't see a solution for the rest..

Just bench Tony for good for the rest of the season so he gets the Memo that he needs to retire after this season, tbh.

This team has too many flaws for this. PoopATFO created a team that can't shoot or defend the perimeter which happens to be the two things you need to be conpetitive.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Nathan89

I'd start Anderson just to dial the defense up to the max. We'd still have 4 shooters on the court as well.

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https://media0.giphy.com/media/ZTrjA6lKvB7Q4/giphy.gif

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ElNono

https://media0.giphy.com/media/ZTrjA6lKvB7Q4/giphy.gif

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:lol

Quote:

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Originally Posted by DAF86

Just bench Tony for good for the rest of the season so he gets the Memo that he needs to retire after this season, tbh.

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16 minutes, 0 pts, 0 rbds, 0 blks, 0 stls, 1 ast. At what point do you say "fuck loyalty, we need to start thinking forward"?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by DAF86

Just bench Tony for good for the rest of the season so he gets the Memo that he needs to retire after this season, tbh.

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by DAF86

16 minutes, 0 pts, 0 rbds, 0 blks, 0 stls, 1 ast. At what point do you say "fuck loyalty, we need to start thinking forward"?

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We will find out this summer.

I think had White played he's capable of having a better game. Heck, Bryn Forbes had a better game. Last game too...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by DAF86

16 minutes, 0 pts, 0 rbds, 0 blks, 0 stls, 1 ast. At what point do you say "fuck loyalty, we need to start thinking forward"?

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They won't and this is part of the reason why I think Pop just doesn't care. He wants to coast to retirement while his mummies do most of the coaching for him on the floor. This is why he sticks with guys he knows. It's too much work otherwise. Remember, he has Trump to think about.

This is "just basketball" after all.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by TimDunkem

They won't and this is part of the reason why I think Pop just doesn't care. He wants to coast to retirement while his mummies do most of the coaching for him on the floor. This is why he sticks with guys he knows. It's too much work otherwise. Remember, he has Trump to think about.

This is "just basketball" after all.

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:lmao
Lol has become his own shtick.
Frankly I do have a lot of respect for him, but I used to idolize him so much more. Still love the old man and will miss him when he retires. But I do wish he wasn't so attached to the culture guys.
He might not be up for a rebuild. I fully expect Tony back even though he needs to retire.

Getting tired of Pop and RC bullshit. We all know they need to get rid of players if we want to be more competitive. The fucking Mills contract was bullshit as was Gasoft contract. And what the hell with signing Forbes and Paul G League scrubs and yet not a sighting of White.

We all know Tony is done love the guy but retire with some class.
We all know Mills needs to be traded love the guy but his defense kills us.
We all know Forbes better not be back next year.
we all know Paul should not be back next year.

We all know Joffrey sucks and better be gone.

Not sure about Anderson he does some good things on defense but man the dude is ducking scarrred to shoot the ball.

Manu,Tony,Pau,Joffrey,Anderson,BP3,Mills and Forbes all need to be gone

Why is the OP talking about starting Kawhi? He’s done! :lol

Could have just started to play White after he had a solid outing against GSW back in February but I guess there’s too many cultured guys playing in the guards spots for that to have been possible :pop:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by tenbeersbold

Manu,Tony,Pau,Joffrey,Anderson,BP3,Mills and Forbes all need to be gone

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Eh Manu hasn't looked done honestly. He's looked like a pretty decent older bench vet most of the time that you can count on for 10 minutes a game or so and occasionally more in case of injury, provide some steadiness to the young bench reserves and be a boon in the locker room and practices. Now I am not sure if that is worth what is annual salary contract is, but he hasn't exactly looked done.

Tony on the other hand has looked absolutely done I don't want to keep him around. He's never been that great of a locker room presence, I would argue he's not as big of a local icon as Manu.

Pau is seriously overpaid, I'm not at the point where I consider it done but he needs a number of that vet min annual contracts for the next year or two.

Jeffrey trash,

Mills got paid got fat and lazy which isn't good when your motor is your second most valuable thing as an undersized shooter.

For real I'm not done with Anderson I think he's a valuable she make and good reserve to have on a team he should be kept around. I am not saying give him a huge contract, 6 Mils a year, going up half or a quarter millionaire with some incentive bonuses for a guy who is a quality Reserve at three positions and not inconceivable add another he is a good deal to keep on your bench.

Both Forbes and bp3 have had a few decent moments this year they're both on cheap rookie contracts. Personal feeling is keep bp3 because of the better size and the ability to play two positions Forbes is basically a cheaper Mills anyway so dumb him bring up White.

The only Parts about this that are really hard is convincing a Hall of Famer in Pau that he's really valuable anymore, due to a complete lack of Mobility. Even though he has an outside shot. Then you have to deal with the sentimentalism more or less retiring Tony a pillar of the team for the last 10 years and more who has had his whole career here but is embarrassing himself and his legacy at this point. That's going to be hard and convincing him that this is true will also be difficult because he has had a handful of above-average games this year however one game in six or seven is not enough and he should know this. Unfortunately usually the player is the last person to know and admit it because the drive to defeat the odds and compete is what made them exceptional players in the first place.

The guys that want to drop 8 or more players off of 15 man roster I really have to question extensively especially when a couple of them are net-positive players. I also really don't understand the idea of trying to do a 76ers rebuild when you have to All Star players that should be in the peaks of their career in Aldridge and Leonard. I do get that green is an asset that will start depreciating soon but he is definitely a starting quality shooting guard in the league at this point and probably will be for another couple of years. He has also Ben by all reports a pretty good teammate a long-term member of the organization and has accepted pretty much any role tasked to him. This makes it really hard for me to say he doesn't deserve a fair market contract.

I really think that a roster next year with Aldridge, Leonard Gay, Green, Anderson, Murray, White, Manu, Bertans, and Paul or Forbes pickem. Is a playoff roster with an outside shot to ring depending on how replacements for Mills, Parker, and Gasol's money goes.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by DAF86

16 minutes, 0 pts, 0 rbds, 0 blks, 0 stls, 1 ast. At what point do you say "fuck loyalty, we need to start thinking forward"?

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Ideally it would have been last summer.

People hate on Forbes too much. He is a solid player for the money.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by DAF86

16 minutes, 0 pts, 0 rbds, 0 blks, 0 stls, 1 ast. At what point do you say "fuck loyalty, we need to start thinking forward"?

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Tony has become and official egg layer.