Coronavirus is one mutation away from infecting millions

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Originally Posted by midnightpulp

This argument will never, ever be convincing to me because the American military is obviously the most advanced military apparatus the world has ever known, responsible for God knows how many technological innovations over the past 70 years, and it is a "public service." Sure, the contractors are driven by profit, but the military's application isn't, at least in theory. If China invaded us tomorrow, there wouldn't be any bean counters examining if defending against that invasion would be "profitable." They would just do it. On the other hand, insurance companies examine the potential profitability of their patients.

I think our healthcare system should be modeled after national defense. Despite misuse of our national defense by neocon assholes (Irag and staying in Afghanistan for far too long), it's still the best in the world, and by far.

This is why "small Government" conservatives also make zero sense to me. Pretty much all of them fetishize our military when it's the biggest government program there is. "Small government" conservatives are Democratic socialists and don't even know it :lol

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You cannot dismiss technology in a great military. Why is the US military so powerful if not for their technology? Do you think a human being in Russia isn't as capable as one in the US?

The ability to sit on a ship miles offshore and launch tomahawks into cities surgically doesn't factor into the military might? Or the night capabilities, the stealth recon abilities due to AWACS and satellite feeds? Real time threat assessment from drones, with ability to put ordinance on targets unmanned?

Aircraft carriers launching thousands of sorties, nuclear subs that can do stealth insertions of tactical teams?


Sure..

The government part is something like Les Aspin putting SF into a hostile engagement in broad daylight in Mogadishu.

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Originally Posted by ElNono

Sure, but if we can at least leap past the clinical trials, that's a great start

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Yeah, I just don't think that's the hardest part, incredibly smart people dedicate their entire careers to researching vaccines. Vaccine R&D is much higher margin than antiviral treatments which was overwhelmingly underfunded pre-covid... I'm talking private not public R&D

I think if there's one thing that's clear after this pandemic, is that there should definitely be a national interest in healthy working people. It doesn't mean healthcare is a "human right", it means that you can't separate a healthy economy from healthy workers.

As such, it's also pretty clear that the private sector and profit motive couldn't have handled this either (heck, they had to be bailed out). Maybe we need to do more on a day to day basis, so when the emergency comes around, we don't have to bail everybody out.

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Originally Posted by Splits

Yeah, I just don't think that's the hardest part, incredibly smart people dedicate their entire careers to researching vaccines. Vaccine R&D is much higher margin than antiviral treatments which was overwhelmingly underfunded pre-covid... I'm talking private not public R&D

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From what I read, we were supposed to get to the point of having a tested, working vaccine no earlier than next year, THEN start manufacturing. That's why I think this would be good news.

Obviously, your experience overrides anything I say on this topic.

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Originally Posted by vy65

Can you answer the question without spouting conspiracies about South Korea?

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I'm talking about China and other populous nations. If you're going to use metrics for confirmation bias, you might want to make sure the numbers are accurate.

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Originally Posted by ElNono

And North Korea... sure... however, that doesn't mean the rest isn't reporting accurately (or at least as accurately as the US is)

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"There are other countries that if you had a preexisting condition and let's say the virus caused you to go to the ICU and then have a heart or kidney problem some countries are recording as a heart issue or a kidney issue and not a COVID-19 death.""

You're comparing apples to oranges. Comparative data needs to be collected using one scheme, not dozens.

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Originally Posted by boutons_deux

A Virginia preacher believed ‘God can heal anything.’

Then he caught coronavirus.

Landon Spradlin went to Mardi Gras to save souls.

He never made it home.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/dc-md-va/2020/04/27/pastor-landon-spradlin-coronavirus-death/

Mark up another "soul" for Trash

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God can't even wipe his own ass and you think he's curing COVID?

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Originally Posted by DMC

Fify for honesty

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Outside of China or NK (lol 25m) it makes no sense to underreport. You build sympathy and get "western investment" the more devastated you were, at least if you aren't a mooslim country.

The countries that should be trusted the most are those with a large press apparatus that is allowed to be critical of their government.
That basically means Western influenced governments.

"but, but that msm... "

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Originally Posted by Splits

Outside of China or NK (lol 25m) it makes no sense to underreport. You build sympathy and get "western investment" the more devastated you were, at least if you aren't a mooslim country.

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There are other countries that if you had a preexisting condition and let's say the virus caused you to go to the ICU and then have a heart or kidney problem some countries are recording as a heart issue or a kidney issue and not a COVID-19 death.

The reporting mechanism in the US (CDC) isn't duplicated worldwide.

When it is, we can compare data accurately. Why make a value judgment on shitty data? Just say you think the government is doing a shitty job, but you've probably said so already. No need for bullshit data to support your bias.

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Originally Posted by pgardn

The countries that should be trusted the most are those with a large press apparatus that is allowed to be critical of their government.
That basically means Western influenced governments.

"but, but that msm... "

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:lol

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Originally Posted by DMC

You cannot dismiss technology in a great military. Why is the US military so powerful if not for their technology? Do you think a human being in Russia isn't as capable as one in the US?

The ability to sit on a ship miles offshore and launch tomahawks into cities surgically doesn't factor into the military might? Or the night capabilities, the stealth recon abilities due to AWACS and satellite feeds? Real time threat assessment from drones, with ability to put ordinance on targets unmanned?

Aircraft carriers launching thousands of sorties, nuclear subs that can do stealth insertions of tactical teams?


Sure..

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Don't get this rebuttal. I'm saying exactly what you're saying. That the technology of the American military is unparalleled. And that technological might was achieved through a synthesis of private and public industry, resulting in "all Americans" basically owning that technology in a collective manner. If an enemy attacks us, that technology is deployed on behalf of everyone. The greatest American hospitals, doctors, and research is only "deployed" for those who can afford it. The American military protects both Jeff Bezos and the fast food worker, while Jeff Bezos can afford the Mayo Clinic, while the fast food worker has to settle for the local community hospital.

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Originally Posted by pgardn

The countries that should be trusted the most are those with a large press apparatus that is allowed to be critical of their government.
That basically means Western influenced governments.

"but, but that msm... "

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Non sequitur

Freedom of the press doesn't make MSM good.

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Originally Posted by midnightpulp

Don't get this rebuttal. I'm saying exactly what you're saying. That the technology of the American military is unparalleled. And that technological might was achieved through a synthesis of private and public industry, resulting in "all Americans" basically owning that technology in a collective manner. If an enemy attacks us, that technology is deployed on behalf of everyone. The greatest American hospitals, doctors, and research is only "deployed" for those who can afford it. The American military protects both Jeff Bezos and the fast food worker, while Jeff Bezos can afford the Mayo Clinic, while the fast food worker has to settle for the local community hospital.

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The government doesn't develop its own technology. That's done by private industry. This "synthesis" claim is just bullshit. It's supply and demand. I suppose the American public has synthesis with companies like AT&T that drove the implementation of fiber optic networks.

The military finds ways to use technology but that doesn't mean we couldn't exist without it. We have a powerful war machine because the ability to push our weight around globally is why we are a superpower, and that means increased wealth. It's always about increased wealth.

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Originally Posted by DMC

"There are other countries that if you had a preexisting condition and let's say the virus caused you to go to the ICU and then have a heart or kidney problem some countries are recording as a heart issue or a kidney issue and not a COVID-19 death.""

You're comparing apples to oranges. Comparative data needs to be collected using one scheme, not dozens.

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AFAIK, we do somewhat the same here... we're just finding out last week that some people that died earlier Feb due to "hearth attack" had covid.

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Originally Posted by DMC

The government doesn't develop its own technology. That's done by private industry. This "synthesis" claim is just bullshit. It's supply and demand. I suppose the American public has synthesis with companies like AT&T that drove the implementation of fiber optic networks.

The military finds ways to use technology but that doesn't mean we couldn't exist without it. We have a powerful war machine because the ability to push our weight around globally is why we are a superpower, and that means increased wealth. It's always about increased wealth.

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But the private industry doesn't do it unless government foots the bill. It's simply not good economic business sense for the private industry to spend trillions of dollars on a fishing expedition. The symbiosis is inescapable.

There's simply a higher mission than bean counting on why we want the private sector to potentially waste money in order for the US to acquire top tech.

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Originally Posted by DMC

I'm talking about China and other populous nations. If you're going to use metrics for confirmation bias, you might want to make sure the numbers are accurate.

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So the answer is no, you can't answer the question. Figured as much you couldn't.

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Originally Posted by ElNono

From what I read, we were supposed to get to the point of having a tested, working vaccine no earlier than next year, THEN start manufacturing. That's why I think this would be good news.

Obviously, your experience overrides anything I say on this topic.

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I think I posted this when it hit the wires, but yeah the vaccine is ahead of normal schedule.

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Originally Posted by picnroll

Scientists at the National Institutes of Health’s Rocky Mountain Laboratory in Montana last month inoculated six rhesus macaque monkeys with single doses of the Oxford vaccine. The animals were then exposed to heavy quantities of the virus that is causing the pandemic — exposure that had consistently sickened other monkeys in the lab. But more than 28 days later all six were healthy, said Vincent Munster, the researcher who conducted the test..

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Barbaric. Can't we use Vegas or Georgia instead of the macaque?

U.S. deaths soared in early weeks of pandemic, far exceeding number attributed to covid-19

An analysis of federal data for the first time estimates excess deaths --

the number beyond what would normally be expected -- during that period.


https://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-st...-large.jpg?v=7

In the early weeks of the coronavirus epidemic, the United States recorded an estimated

15,400 excess deaths,

nearly two times as many as were publicly attributed to covid-19 at the time

occurred during March and through April 4, a time when 8,128 coronavirus deaths were reported.

in any pandemic, higher-than-normal mortality is a starting point for scientists seeking to understand the full impact of the disease.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/inves...wpisrc=nl_most

The Trump Pandemic, killing for people than Viet Nam

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Originally Posted by baseline bum

God can't even wipe his own ass and you think he's curing COVID?

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And God can't handle money. He's always broke, and always soliciting for more money

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Originally Posted by Splits

Barbaric. Can't we use Vegas or Georgia instead of the macaque?

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not really, cuz Bill Gates, demonic eyes, etc

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Originally Posted by DMC

Non sequitur

Freedom of the press doesn't make MSM good.

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By definition, it does.

Free markets of ideas are the only way to weed out bad information.

:lol liberal media bashing.

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Originally Posted by midnightpulp

Don't get this rebuttal. I'm saying exactly what you're saying. That the technology of the American military is unparalleled. And that technological might was achieved through a synthesis of private and public industry, resulting in "all Americans" basically owning that technology in a collective manner. If an enemy attacks us, that technology is deployed on behalf of everyone. The greatest American hospitals, doctors, and research is only "deployed" for those who can afford it. The American military protects both Jeff Bezos and the fast food worker, while Jeff Bezos can afford the Mayo Clinic, while the fast food worker has to settle for the local community hospital.

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Um, the American military sacrifices the lives of those fast food worker types.

56000 dead americans

but on the positive side-


HER EMAILS!!!