TimVP and Marcus Bryant are going to get owned

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Originally Posted by whottt

Spurs have draft picks and foreign talent to use in a trade to get them further under the cap or in a S&T.

The callout is because you and MB have accused the Spurs of biding their time until 08....

I say that won't happen and there will be major moves this offseason to shore up the Spurs problem areas(IMO, SF)....owning you and MB in the process. Don't act like you haven't backed MB up on this...you've been bumping his 08 threads all year.

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Uh, I've been calling for the end of the 2008 plan. That means I want them to trade this summer and I have dozens of posts stating that.

I'll admit to getting owned if the Spurs somehow have more money to spend this summer than the MLE. Otherwise, you just owned yourself on this thread.

I want the Spurs to forget about the summer of 2008 and make trades this offseason. That's what I've been asking for all along. You saying you want the Spurs to make trades this offseason isn't exactly a new idea ... it's what I've talked about all season. :lol

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Originally Posted by timvp

I want the Spurs to forget about the summer of 2008 and make trades this offseason. That's what I've been asking for all along. You saying you want the Spurs to make trades this offseason isn't exactly a new idea ... it's what I've talked about all season. :lol

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I'm not saying what I want the Spurs to do...I'm saying what they will do.

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Originally Posted by whottt

I'm not saying what I want the Spurs to do...I'm saying what they will do.

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So you want them to follow through on timvp's ideas?

Got it.

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Originally Posted by Kori Ellis

Are you saying packaging draft picks and foreign talent with current players in a trade?

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Among other things...it's not entirely up to the Spurs to maintain this roster another season IMO. They have to have a plan to move this season.

I am saying it is easily possible for them to get under the cap or pull off a S&T due to the options contracts and trade assets they have...including 4 draft picks, at the minimum 7 expiring contracts worth @ 20 million(going into next season), and at least 2 well regarded NBA prospects playing overseas.

I am saying that looking at the cap situation for most teams this offseason, the teams that have cap, and the available FA pool...it's obvious they intend to move this offseason.


I don't know about you guys, but I personally am liking the Bobcats a whole lot right now, for a variety of reasons....edit: and the Bulls.

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Originally Posted by timvp

So you want them to follow through on timvp's ideas?

Got it.

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So basically, if I do a forum search I won't find any TimVP Holt bashings? If that's true I will apologize lmao.

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Originally Posted by whottt

I am saying it is easily possible for them to get under the cap ...

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Explain to me how it's easy to get under the cap by more the MLE.

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Originally Posted by whottt

So basically, if I do a forum search I won't find any TimVP Holt bashings? If that's true I will apologize lmao.

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What does Holt bashing have to do with the Spurs getting under the cap this summer? You insist that the Spurs are going to have "substantial cap space". That has nothing to do with Holt.

Will you apologize when the Spurs don't even attempt to get under the cap?

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Originally Posted by whottt

So basically, if I do a forum search I won't find any TimVP Holt bashings? If that's true I will apologize lmao.

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You are confused. timvp bashes Holt for not doing what he thinks he should do - spend money to build a contender. What you are advocating in this thread (trading, etc) is the same thing that timvp has been saying they should do. Starting this thread made you in agreement with him. The only difference is you think that they will do it and he thinks they should do it.

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Originally Posted by Kori Ellis

Explain to me how it's easy to get under the cap by more the MLE.

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Don't pick up the obvious contracts...if Finley and Oberto opt out...then do a trade with Charlotte either something for Wallace or just a straight up trade of veterans and picks for capspace and future picks.


Do a deal with Chicago...say Mahinimi or Scola and Barry for either one of their SF's or just a straight trade for cap space.


I am right that two of the teams most under the cap will be Chicago and Charlotte right?

Two teams with some nice SF talent...and some cap space...and trading relations with the Spurs.

And even if they can only free up more than the MLE, that still gives them more leverage that most teams this offseason for straight out signing players...they already have shown the know how to manipulate roster slots to their advantage.

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Originally Posted by timvp

What does Holt bashing have to do with the Spurs getting under the cap this summer? You insist that the Spurs are going to have "substantial cap space". That has nothing to do with Holt.

Will you apologize when the Spurs don't even attempt to get under the cap?

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I'll aplogize if they do nothing of note. They are obviously going to do something.

Just asking a question ... Not meaning anything by it.

Has Holt brought up this '08 plan? I ask because it is standard practice to reduce salary before selling a team. I have seen what the Spurs have in store for '08 as far as salery goes .... its great for them ... But still ...

Can someone answer the question without bashing the Mavs fan?

Is this a worry or not? Could he be thinking of putting the team on the market?

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Originally Posted by Dalhoop

Just asking a question ... Not meaning anything by it.

Has Holt brought up this '08 plan? I ask because it is standard practice to reduce salary before selling a team. I have seen what the Spurs have in store for '08 as far as salery goes .... its great for them ... But still ...

Can someone answer the question without bashing the Mavs fan?

Is this a worry or not? Could he be thinking of putting the team on the market?

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I don't think he's selling the team. But if he was the primary value in the Spurs lies in it's status as a championship contender...so anything that hurts those chances would probably hurt his ability to sell the team.

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I don't think he's selling the team. But if he was the primary value in the Spurs lies in it's status as a championship contender...so anything that hurts those chances would probably hurt his ability to sell the team.

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Thats all I wanted to know ... What the Spurs have in '08 is the best team at the lowest salary with lots of "flexability" .... very valuable .... and cost effective. It would be the perfict time to sell.

I might be owned by Alcohol tonight. That's about it.

The only way the Spurs end up with a decent 3 man is via trade and, of course, they have nothing to trade.

Qed.

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Originally Posted by Dalhoop

Just asking a question ... Not meaning anything by it.

Has Holt brought up this '08 plan? I ask because it is standard practice to reduce salary before selling a team. I have seen what the Spurs have in store for '08 as far as salery goes .... its great for them ... But still ...

Can someone answer the question without bashing the Mavs fan?

Is this a worry or not? Could he be thinking of putting the team on the market?

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Holt has never indicated that he was thinking about selling the team, but several of us have pointed out that keeping the commitments down maximizes the book value of the team, and may be a prelude to such a move.

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Originally Posted by Kori Ellis

But in reality Bowen and Horry's partial guarantee amounts would count, right?

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Right that's why I said my figure wasn't counting them.

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As well as a certain amount counts against the cap for each open roster spot to a point.

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I ballparked those in the $44 million

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So, really they'd still be around $50M, correct?

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It all depends on how much the partial guarantees are, but anywhere between $45 and $50 million is acceptable in whottt's fantasy.

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Originally Posted by whottt

Explain this...


"no amount of guranteed salary would count for any of the players you mentioned"

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If any of the playters waived had a partially guaranteed deal, the Spurs would have to pay the guaranteed money and it would count against the cap -- unless some other team picked up the contract.

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If they opt out with Bruce does that mean they can't resign him?

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Signing him for anything above the minimum would eat into the cap space.

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Who else would we want back?

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If Horry is gone, re-signing Bonner becomes critical -- and he counts quite a bit over his current salay against the cap until he's re-signed.

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Holt has never indicated that he was thinking about selling the team, but several of us have pointed out that keeping the commitments down maximizes the book value of the team, and may be a prelude to such a move.

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So you pretty much admitted, you've pulled that out of your ass.

Bump.

I accidentally stumbled across this thread in a forum search. whottt's takes in this thread are legendary. That cap space due to the secret opt out in Barry's contract sure has been nice this summer :rollin

It appears that timvp was probably wrong about The 2008 Plan (although the Spurs could still maneuver to get under the salary cap next summer). The bad news is that whatever plan the Spurs are on looks even worse than The 2008 Plan. At least The 2008 Plan included an attempt to add a 4th star in the summer of 2008.

Currently, The Stay Under The Luxury Tax Threshold By All Means Necessary Plan looks pretty ugly. It's the same as The 2008 Plan without the financial windfall next summer.

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Originally Posted by timvp

Bump.

I accidentally stumbled across this thread in a forum search. whottt's takes in this thread are legendary. That cap space due to the secret opt out in Barry's contract sure has been nice this summer :rollin

It appears that timvp was probably wrong about The 2008 Plan (although the Spurs could still maneuver to get under the salary cap next summer). The bad news is that whatever plan the Spurs are on looks even worse than The 2008 Plan. At least The 2008 Plan included an attempt to add a 4th star in the summer of 2008.

Currently, The Stay Under The Luxury Tax Threshold By All Means Necessary Plan looks pretty ugly. It's the same as The 2008 Plan without the financial windfall next summer.

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Hey...you aren't out of the woods yet...if the Spurs do a trade to bring in a key player the owning still counts.


It's not over yet...no pwnt pre-empting at ST please...wait until it's done.

If the Spurs make a move to bring in a key SF(even by S%T) you are still owned. No ifs ands or butts.

If the Spurs roster stays the same and the Spurs don't do anything signifigant...I get owned.

This is not a reverse jinx or fucking around thread btw...I am dead serious.


The motivation for this thread lies in my sincere belief that there ain no fucking way the Spurs would be stupid enough to attempt a repeat without adding a quality SF capable of defending the bigger sf's. Simple really...if they do you get owned and are forced to dine on crow as well as your own cynicism. And the schitzy one will join you for that dinner...


Keep in mind...FO moves are not my arena of expertise...so an owning by me in this category would be equivalent to you realizing a player is/or isn't a choker...IOW, a major owning...like Ichiro leading the league in HR.

So if the Spurs sign someone other than Udoka timvp gets owned? If not, you get owned?

My favorite parts of this thread are whottt throwing Bowen, Horry and Oberto under the bus before the playoffs even started. He also predicted Bonner wouldn't re-sign.

Not to mention this gem:

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Originally Posted by whottt

Elson and Butler were 2 verifiable RFA steals for basically a MLE...

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Butler a verifiable steal? Haven't you been bashing him ever since the Scola thread and calling him a fat, mumbling bust?

Actually, I have to give whottt props for being consistent in his support of whatever the F.O. does.

And I have to give myself props for this:

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Originally Posted by ShoogarBear

:worthy: 2007 MASTER PLAN
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whottt

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whottt's been smoking too much of that shit with the Mookie Crew.