Key to beating the mavs?

I realize that it's just one loss after 17 wins, and we don't seem to have many chances to critique heir losses, soo..... Did any of our ST gurus that saw the game pinpoint the reason the mavs lost? Or was it just a bad game for the mavs? Nellie knowing the players and playbook too well?

The media seems to be blame it on the up-tempo game that GS played, if that is the case, Phoenix should be able to test that theory pretty well, shouldn't they? And if that is the key for other teams to beat the mavs, does Pop fall in love with small ball again? Should we go that route?

Personally, I think our best shot at beating the mavs is by playing SPURS BALL instead of trying to redefine ourselves again for the playoffs.

brent barry hits threes.

the biggest thing to focus on when playing against the mavs is easy


REBOUNDING


we got rebounded pretty much every game in the last series


without rebounding we'll be screwed as they'll be pullin down offensive boards and getting 2nd chance points all over the place

Golden State just went out and beat a team they were supposed to beat.

If SA does the same, they'll beat Dallas too.

Simple as that.

I didn't see the game but add it up and the combination of the following probably sealed the deal:
1. Nellie Tough
2. Nellie + Up-tempo team = Very tough
3. Nellie + Up-tempo team + at their place = Extremely tough
4. Nellie + Up-tempo team + at their place + 2nd night of b2b = Loss

It was a back-to-back for GSW too, they lost to Portland the night before on the road.
I don't think they were supposed to beat them, they just went out and did it.

I think if we can outscore the Mavs in 4 out of 7 games we'll beat them.

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Originally Posted by Amuseddaysleeper

the biggest thing to focus on when playing against the mavs is easy


REBOUNDING


we got rebounded pretty much every game in the last series


without rebounding we'll be screwed as they'll be pullin down offensive boards and getting 2nd chance points all over the place

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If we are playing Spurs ball, that is probably true, but GS was outrebounded by the mavs 50 - 28. mavs also had 20 offensive rebounds. Pop may look at that and say, "To heck with it, if we small ball we don't need the rebounds." (Actually I don't think pop is that obtuse, I hope)

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Originally Posted by Solid D

I didn't see the game but add it up and the combination of the following probably sealed the deal:
1. Nellie Tough
2. Nellie + Up-tempo team = Very tough
3. Nellie + Up-tempo team + at their place = Extremely tough
4. Nellie + Up-tempo team + at their place + 2nd night of b2b = Loss

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This is a team that has been winning by what, 10 points a game, including on the road, in the new highscoring NBA, against coaches I believe to be better than Nellie. If it was a loss in a close game, ok, but the mavs seem to have been manhandled, there has to be something else there.

Okay then, this excerpt from the Dallas Morning News game story... (Dallas, like San Antonio, doesn't do very well when they don't play D well.)

http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcont...e.9288c14.html

Josh Howard, poked in the right eye in the second quarter, returned in the third but was ineffective.

Dirk Nowitzki was swarmed by Warriors whenever he touched the ball and had one of his poorest games of the season.

But the most unforgivable part of the game was at the defensive end.

Golden State center Andres Biedrins – not exactly the second coming of Shaq – made all eight of his shots from the field. Al Harrington (5-for-5) wasn't far behind. Jason Richardson had a strong all-around game and was one of three Warriors with seven assists.

Golden State was shooting 61.7 percent after three quarters and had five players with at least 16 points.

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Originally Posted by Despot

If we are playing Spurs ball, that is probably true, but GS was outrebounded by the mavs 50 - 28. mavs also had 20 offensive rebounds. Pop may look at that and say, "To heck with it, if we small ball we don't need the rebounds." (Actually I don't think pop is that obtuse, I hope)



This is a team that has been winning by what, 10 points a game, including on the road, in the new highscoring NBA, against coaches I believe to be better than Nellie. If it was a loss in a close game, ok, but the mavs seem to have been manhandled, there has to be something else there.

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GS played small the entire game


plus gs shot 57% the entire night

if this was a 7 game series you aren't going to shoot 57% the entire time

I think people are making too big of a deal of this win as though the mavs exposed their weaknesses.

What this really was, is an example of a great team having an off night and an underdog coming to play

and while GS has had luck against dallas and been a thorn in their side, I think they simply have the right group of athletic players to play small ball and force dallas to keep up

but once again, a 7 game series between the two and dallas would win in 5

Nelson knows that Mavs team very well (like AJ knows Pop). He's the key to beating the Mavs! If the Warriors get the 8th seed... look out Mavs for a very, very tough series.

GS still would have eeked out a victory if they shot 49-51%, even with Dallas shooting more FTs.

Hollinger :San Antonio (Latest daily rankings)

"Mavs may be the team to beat, in the regular season; but they still have yet to prove themselves in the playoffs. The Spurs have the experience, the defense, and Manu Ginobili. Good luck Mavs, you will need it"

Whoa Nellie... The master schools the pupil.

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Originally Posted by SpursDynasty

Golden State just went out and beat a team they were supposed to beat.

If SA does the same, they'll beat Dallas too.

Simple as that.

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Why is a non-playoff team supposed to beat the number one team? Please explain your dumbass logic.

I would feel pretty good if I were MavFan at this point, with one exception...

Manu gonna be on a mof'n mission against you guys this year....to atone. That would bother me....


He holds himself responsible for the Spurs losing to ya'll last year, he doesn't buy in any way shape or form that ya'll were the better team...he's going to be out to prove it, IMO, like never before.

One loss in 18 games? Wow. 10 losses in 62 games? Sweet!

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Originally Posted by mavs>spurs

Why is a non-playoff team supposed to beat the number one team? Please explain your dumbass logic.

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Easy question. Because they have beaten them twice already this year. The Warriors could get that #8 seed and eliminate Dallas too.

DaLoss Mavs are nothing to worry about. They're chokers, after all.

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Originally Posted by mqywaaah

One loss in 18 games? Wow. 10 losses in 62 games? Sweet!

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Hell yeah! A division banner!

I hope the Spurs play the Mavs again on opening night next season just to see Mark Cuban procrastinate raising that thing to the rafters for the next game. I'm sure you all remember his reluctancy to raise the WCF banner this season.

The key to beating the Mavs? I'm going with one word:

CONFIDENCE

The Spurs have owned this Mavs franchise for years, and they only had one minor slip that allowed that team into the finals. The Mavs went because of one simple mistake -- a foul.

I truly think the Spurs will get past both the Suns and Mavs in the playoffs (after what seems like a beating over the Lakers in the first round for now). In fact, I want to play BOTH those teams on the way to the finals. When we get the chance to see the Mavs in a 7-game series, I, like many of you here, expect to see Manu absolutely explode.

If the boys can get the mindset once more that we own this Mavs team and it's time to get some redemption for last season, I truly believe that the Mavs don't stand a chance. I'll even go as far as saying the Spurs win in 5 (maybe 6 if we have a bad shooting night). It will be tough, of course, but I don't think the Mavs are strong enough to take down our big 3 and the veteran leadership that the rest of the core provides.

Dirk doesn't have the "killer instinct" that a team needs to win a ring.

If another team comes out of the West, it's the Suns. Nash has what it takes to win (that instinct and a cast of great support). But I think this may be the best Spurs team since '99...regardless of their current record. They are -- by far -- the smartest team in the league.

The Warriors just shot lights out and swarmed Dirk on D. The Spurs will need to make their open shots, and if yesterday's loss was any indication, the Spurs should double Nowitzki and make the others beat them.

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Originally Posted by whottt

I think if we can outscore the Mavs in 4 out of 7 games we'll beat them.

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NOw here I agree with you whott

showing up.

R-E-B-O-U-N-D-I-N-G :fight

key to beat the mavs=hold Dirk to a low FG%

BTW,yesterday He went 3/11

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Originally Posted by Amuseddaysleeper

the biggest thing to focus on when playing against the mavs is easy


REBOUNDING


we got rebounded pretty much every game in the last series


without rebounding we'll be screwed as they'll be pullin down offensive boards and getting 2nd chance points all over the place

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That's why I keep saying that Francisco Elson could be the key against the Mavs this year.

Some people misunderstand me when I say that. I'm not comparing Elson to Marcus Camby. No, I'm comparing him to Michael Finley (in terms of rebounding/shot blocking)... cause he was our front-court compliment to Tim Duncan against Dallas last year.

I think Elson will see significant time against Dirk this year should the Mavs and Spurs rematch in the playoffs (and I think they will). He's the only guy on the team with both the size and the quickness to guard him.

Do I think Elson will be able to slow Dirk? Nope. But I suspect he'll do as solid a job against him as anyone we've got (Bowen doesn't have the size to keep Dirk from shooting over him, and we need him on Howard anyway).

The advantage of having Elson on Dirk has nothing to do with slowing Dirk, because that's not likely to happen. The real benefit is that we would actually have another rebounder and shot blocker on the floor with Timmy this year.

We don't need Elson to be any better a rebounder or shot blocker than Rasho or Nazzi were. We just needed another reasonably productive big man quick enough to run with Dirk and the Mavs (as well as the Suns), which Rasho and Nazzi were not.

Having that second rebounder on the floor will definitely help the Spurs in that dept. And having another shot blocking threat out there will help the Spurs do a much better job of guarding the paint than they did last year.

I for one, do believe that we match up better with the Mavs, primarily because of Elson. The fact that Manu and Timmy are playing as well as I've ever seen them doesn't hurt either!

The key to beating the mavs is shooting lights out and swarming the mavs on defense and forcing a lot of turnovers.

SA can't beat the Mavs like GS does. GS has great athleticism and good size at every position. Their small ball players like Jackson, Pietrus, Richardson, Barnes (stupid not to pick him up) are longer and quicker than the Spurs small ball players for the most part. GS is quicker and faster on the floor than the Mavs at EVERY SINGLE POISITION. They can swarm and double and get away with it. That is not how SA can beat the Mavs.

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Originally Posted by mavsfan1000

The key to beating the mavs is shooting lights out and swarming the mavs on defense and forcing a lot of turnovers.

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That's the key to beating anyone. Neither team is going to shoot lights out over long stretches though. Both of these teams are too good defensively to let that happen.

Well if we are talking about what style does best against the mavs than I think Golden State and Phoenix are the ones best suited to bother the mavs. Chicago does as well though and they play a slow pace game so it is a mix of matchups.

Someone said it best in an earlier post... the Spurs will have to win by playing SPURS basketball!

That means, in my opinion, running sometimes, playing half-court sets sometimes, and always playing great defense... which means staying "big". We need that second 7-footer next to Timmy to help rebound and protect the rim.

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Originally Posted by mavsfan1000

Well if we are talking about what style does best against the mavs than I think Golden State and Phoenix are the ones best suited to bother the mavs. Chicago does as well though and they play a slow pace game so it is a mix of matchups.

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I think way too much has been made of Golden State's win. It was just a mental letdown. It had to happen sometime. On a normal night, the Mavericks hand the Warriors their nuts in a jar.

Some say that small ball bothers the Mavs. I hear the same said of the Spurs all the time. But the reality is that there's only one style of play that bothers the Spurs of the Mavs... and that's great play. The kind of play the Spurs and Mavs will only see from maybe one or two teams (aside from one another)... Phoenix, and possibly Miami if Wade gets back to 100%.

The Mavs are juggernauts and have been all year. The Spurs finally decided to join them. In my mind, these two teams are the class of the league, with Phoenix only slightly behind them. When the playoffs arrive... San Antonio and Dallas won't give a damn what style these other teams play. They'll just give them the "We're gonna make your our women and you're gonna like it" treatment.

The key to beating the mavs is being the Golden State Warriors.

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Originally Posted by SpursDynasty

Golden State just went out and beat a team they were supposed to beat.

If SA does the same, they'll beat Dallas too.

Simple as that.

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Pure genius...

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Originally Posted by SpursDynasty

Easy question. Because they have beaten them twice already this year. The Warriors could get that #8 seed and eliminate Dallas too.

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Part 2...

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Originally Posted by Amuseddaysleeper

What this really was, is an example of a great team having an off night and an underdog coming to play

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Exactly...

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Originally Posted by Amuseddaysleeper

What this really was, is an example of a great team having an off night and an underdog coming to play

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As Spurs fans, we should recognize this very easily. Seems like the majority of our losses were because of this very reason.

With the kind of D the spurs are playin since the ASG break,they can easily hold Dirk to a low FG % like GS did last night.That + the big three playing the best ball of the last two years is the best combo to beat the mavs.

Score more points than they do.

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Originally Posted by ArgSpursFan

With the kind of D the spurs are playin since the ASG break,they can easily hold Dirk to a low FG % like GS did last night.That + the big three playing the best ball of the last two years is the best combo to beat the mavs.

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Dirk had an off night. There was an overall mental letdown against GS last night by Dallas. That's going to happen from time to time. But there is no such thing as easily holding Dirk to a low FG%. Read nothing into last nights game. It was just one of those nights.

That said, I do favor the Spurs to win the west right now.

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Originally Posted by picnroll

SA can't beat the Mavs like GS does. GS has great athleticism and good size at every position. Their small ball players like Jackson, Pietrus, Richardson, Barnes (stupid not to pick him up) are longer and quicker than the Spurs small ball players for the most part. GS is quicker and faster on the floor than the Mavs at EVERY SINGLE POISITION. They can swarm and double and get away with it. That is not how SA can beat the Mavs.

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I agree. The Warriors just match up well against the Mav's weaknesses. They've beaten them 5 of the last 6 times. It's not just small ball but it's their athleticism to force turnovers vs. Dallas. The Mavs would beat them in the playoffs as they would adjust to them but they're still not a good matchup for Dallas. The Spurs just don't have the players to beat Dallas the way the Warriors do. They have to go about it their own way.

I realize Dirk is having an MVP kind if season.but At the same time I realize that since the ASG brake the spurs are playing the best D of the year and the ¨big three¨ have gotten BIGGER.
So I´ve got no doubts the spurs can beat the mavs in the playoffs

I think you're all reading too much into this.

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Originally Posted by Shank

I think you're all reading too much into this.

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I don't think they are...I feel a 17 game losing streak coming on... :cry

Spurs D before the ASG brake<SPURS D AFTER THE ASG BRAKE
spurs bench production before ASG brake< SPURS BENCH PROD. AFTER ASG BRAKE
Spurs games won/lost average before ASG brake<spurs games won/lost average after ASG brake
Manu´s Numbers before ASG brake<MANU´S NUMBERS AFTER ASG BRAKE
It all seems to be falling in place for the spurs since the ASG brake.
Let the playoffs begin baby!!!

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Originally Posted by monosylab1k

The key to beating the mavs is being the Golden State Warriors.

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That about sums it up.

GS just matches up pretty well with teams like Suns and Mavs. They do bad against post-up teams like Portland and maybe the Spurs. We just need to play like them if we want to win the series.

the key to beating the Mavs: Replace their bench with stationary bicycles.

Key(s) to beating Mavs?

........................consistency
......................execution
...............agressiveness
..............rebounding
.............defense
.........score score score score

Line your basketball shorts with sauerkraut, so Dirk gets destracted by the smell, best shot you got. In reality, unless you have a team that matches up well you have to hope for the Mavs to beat themselves, they are too good.

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Originally Posted by picnroll

SA can't beat the Mavs like GS does. GS has great athleticism and good size at every position. Their small ball players like Jackson, Pietrus, Richardson, Barnes (stupid not to pick him up) are longer and quicker than the Spurs small ball players for the most part. GS is quicker and faster on the floor than the Mavs at EVERY SINGLE POISITION. They can swarm and double and get away with it. That is not how SA can beat the Mavs.

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true that, totally.
It will take great efficiency in all depts.
That will do two things:
1. rattle nerves trans to turnovers
2. put a strain on fg% 2nd, 3rd periods and the first 5 min. of 4th
Then Spurs D takes over last minutes; needs to be wise, not foul, and put the clamps on, help-defense, lots of it.

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Originally Posted by Amuseddaysleeper

the biggest thing to focus on when playing against the mavs is easy


REBOUNDING


we got rebounded pretty much every game in the last series


without rebounding we'll be screwed as they'll be pullin down offensive boards and getting 2nd chance points all over the place

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Yes rebounding is a big key against the Mavs. If the Spurs are going to beat the Mavs in the playoffs they need a lot of thing to go right. The big 3 all have to play at a very high level. They need to play out of this world defense. They need to crash the boards. They need to limit the Mavs bench production. they need big production from their own bench. Mavs are so good this year any of those things go wrong and they probably lose.

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Originally Posted by dbreiden83080

Yes rebounding is a big key against the Mavs. If the Spurs are going to beat the Mavs in the playoffs they need a lot of thing to go right. The big 3 all have to play at a very high level. They need to play out of this world defense. They need to crash the boards. They need to limit the Mavs bench production. they need big production from their own bench. Mavs are so good this year any of those things go wrong and they probably lose.

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Agreed. But I would say the exact same thing the other way as well. The Mavs need a lot of things to go right to beat the Spurs. They've got to find a way to contain Tony and especially Manu. They've got to find a way to compensate for significantly diminished production from Josh Howard (Bowen will be on him). They've got to do the best they can with Tim Duncan. They have to provide help defense on Duncan in the paint as well as Manu and Tony when they penetrate... but they've got to do it without leaving the Spurs shooters open outside...

You get the point. These are two fairly evenly matched teams. It's going to be tough as hell for either team to scratch out a series win. Some one will, obviously, but both teams will have a healthy fear and respect for the other.

here's what i saw last night

1) im not blaming it all on injuries but Howard was out when they made their run and George was about 30% and eventually left the game, so during that stretch we had no small forward
2) Golden State attacked all night defensively and offensively. they would post up Harris/Terry and then bang in to the basket. if help came they kicked it out for a three.
3) crowd was really into it
4)they would back off of Dirk, then run to him quickly and crowd him trying to confuse him
5) Dirk sucked
6) Dirk sucked

b2b is no excuse as both teams were on a b2b

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Originally Posted by Kent_in_Atlanta

Agreed. But I would say the exact same thing the other way as well. The Mavs need a lot of things to go right to beat the Spurs. They've got to find a way to contain Tony and especially Manu. They've got to find a way to compensate for significantly diminished production from Josh Howard (Bowen will be on him). They've got to do the best they can with Tim Duncan. They have to provide help defense on Duncan in the paint as well as Manu and Tony when they penetrate... but they've got to do it without leaving the Spurs shooters open outside...

You get the point. These are two fairly evenly matched teams. It's going to be tough as hell for either team to scratch out a series win. Some one will, obviously, but both teams will have a healthy fear and respect for the other.

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it´s gonna be a hell of a playoff muchup anyways.
the 2 out of the 3 best teams in the league.
I hope the spurs keep on being focus on D,as they are right now.

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Originally Posted by ArgSpursFan

it´s gonna be a hell of a playoff muchup anyways.
the 2 out of the 3 best teams in the league.
I hope the spurs keep on being focus on D,as they are right now.

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I guess the Suns shouldn't even bother showing up for that 2nd round matchup with San Antonio.

Rebound and mix a zone with man-to-man, sticking with a zone in the fourth. Dallas thrives off of offensive rebounds, and switching defenses will confuse them. The zone in the fourth will throw Dallas out of rhythm.

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Originally Posted by td4mvp21

Rebound and mix a zone with man-to-man, sticking with a zone in the fourth. Dallas thrives off of offensive rebounds, and switching defenses will confuse them. The zone in the fourth will throw Dallas out of rhythm.

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Agreed.that´s exacly what I said a few posts ago.That´s the best way to ¨team guard¨such an all around good player like Dirk.

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Originally Posted by mabber

I guess the Suns shouldn't even bother showing up for that 2nd round matchup with San Antonio.

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That was asuming that the 2 of them got to the finals.
Of course we´ll see if the Mavs make it to the finals though. :smokin