Talk about inmates running the asylum.
Billy Hunter and his posse need to take a long walk off a short cliff.
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Talk about inmates running the asylum.
Billy Hunter and his posse need to take a long walk off a short cliff.
The only one who deserves reconsideration is BWallace.
Wow. Never saw this coming.
I thought KORI said Rick said they would accept whatever the nba handed down
Rick will....the NBAPA won't.
AgreedQuote:
Originally Posted by samikeyp
Well, Carlisle and the Pacers may not have wanted to challenge, but ultimately, the association has control over whether to challenge the penalties. The Pacers organization is part of the body that imposed the penalty -- Stern has his job because Pacers ownership and the rest of the NBA owners hired him. It wouldn't make sense for one of Stern's employers to challenge his decision.
Just a guess, but I'd hazard a thought that the league might reduce the suspensions to Jackson and O'Neal by a few games, but that it won't budge on Artest. If Ron's going to get his penalty reduced, he's going to have to go through mediation like Sprewell did in 1997-98. The bad news for Ronnie is that the mediator in the Sprewell case said a remainder of the season suspension was permissible.
how much do their agents lose monetary wise also?? millions??
well atleast v-bookie already paid out so it will not matter for that!
Stern said he's very confident the suspension will hold up. I don't think the appeal will go anywhere.
Doesn't the league hear the appeal? It seems to me that when suspensions are handed down, an appeal is heard by someone in the league office -- perhaps Stu Jackson. That's part of the reason that league-mandated reductions are pretty rare.
Now, I would expect that if there are no reductions, O'Neal, Jackson, and Artest will hire lawyers to argue, either in court or to a mediator/arbitrator, that the suspensions are too harsh. I have some recollection of that being the course of events with the Sprewell situation a couple of years ago. A neutral setting might get some reductions, particularly for O'Neal and Jackson, but I can't imagine that any third party would reduce Artest's penalty. Sprewell IS the precedent.
I think it'd be a slippery slope to go down trying to get things flipped. The league might be able to prove anyone going into the stands and throwing punches deserves suspension for the season, and the league could actually argue Jax should be out for the year.
NBAPA should be careful what it wishes for.
True AHF, but I think that Jackson avoided the season-on-ice suspension because he only went in after Artest had gotten mixed up with a fan, and may have looked to some to be attempting to extricate Artest from the situation. I can't imagine the league will make these suspensions any more harsh -- I actually don't think they can; I'm fairly certain that under normal collective bargaining conditions, once a penalty is set by the employer, it can only be reduced -- but I think you're right that Jackson could end up setting a precedent that any aggressive move towards the stands, whatever its provocation, will get you a season off.
You're right.Quote:
Originally Posted by Marcus Bryant
His suspension needs reconsideration. 6 games it's a joke. He deserves at least 10-15 games for acting like the initial instigator and continued to ignite the crowd during the whole incident.
yes because the nbapa could get the nba to hire lawyers who want to press criminal charges to these idiots
Stern addressed that specifically in the press conference and said that it was obvious "Mr. Jackson" was not trying at all to get Artest out and was just there to fight.Quote:
may have looked to some to be attempting to extricate Artest from the situation
I actually thought 5 was enough for Ben. He never attacked any fans. He just responded to a hard foul with a much harder and uncalled for foul.
I think they took into account that Ben didn't just foul him. He continued the taunting near the scorer's table and he threw a towel at Artest, etc. I thought he'd get five games.
My bad -- I've yet to see the press conference, but have read some stories; unfortunately none mentioned that pretty obvious observation by Stern.Quote:
Stern addressed that specifically in the press conference and said that it was obvious "Mr. Jackson" was not trying at all to get Artest out and was just there to fight.
I think there's a link to the whole press conference on the front of NBA.com
``Mr. Jackson was well into the stands, and certainly anyone who watched any television this weekend understood he wasn't going in as a peacemaker,'' Stern said. ``Jermaine, I think it's fair to say, exceeded any bounds of peacemaking with the altercation with the fan in which he was involved.
``His penalty actually would have been harsher if he had succeeded in getting into his stands, which he tried to do but was restrained from.''http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slug=ap-pacers-pistonsbrawl&prov=ap&type=lgns
Pacers co-owner Herb Simon issued a statement saying ``We believe that there was a rush to judgment and not enough opportunity for all sides to be heard. We will vigorously support our players in any available appeal process.
All appeals of disciplinary penalties for on-court disturbances are heard by Stern, making it highly unlikely any of the suspensions will be reduced.
classless pacers
I've been trying to figure out how things are supposed to go from here on out, since I'd imagine this story will continue to dominate for a couple more weeks. For anyone who's interested, here's what I've discovered about the suspension power of the Commissioner and the player's ability to challenge the suspension.
The Uniform Player Contract under the 1999 Collective Bargaining Agreement gives the Commissioner power to impose fines and suspensions according to the rules that exist at the time of the incident giving rise to the suspension:
The league is permitted to create rules governing the on-court conduct of players:Quote:
5. CONDUCT.
(a) The Player agrees to observe and comply with all Team rules, as maintained or promulgated in accordance with the NBA/NBPA Collective Bargaining Agreement, at all times whether on or off the playing floor. Subject to the provisions of the NBA/NBPA Collective Bargaining Agreement, such rules shall be part of this Contract as fully as if herein written and shall be binding upon the Player.
* * * *
(d) The Player agrees to be bound by Article 35 of the NBA Constitution, a copy of which, as in effect on the date of this Contract, is attached hereto. The Player acknowledges that the Commissioner is empowered to impose fines upon and/or suspend the Player for causes and in the manner provided in such Article, provided that such fines and/or suspensions are consistent with the terms of the NBA/NBPA Collective Bargaining Agreement.
(g) When the Player is fined and/or suspended by the Team or the NBA, he shall be given notice in writing (with a copy to the Players Association), stating the amount of the fine or the duration of the suspension and the reasons therefor.
The league has created a rule that expressly deals with this situation:Quote:
Section 8. On-Court Conduct.
In addition to its authority under paragraph 5 of the Uniform Player Contract, the NBA is entitled to promulgate and enforce reasonable rules governing the conduct of players on the playing court that do not violate the provisions of this Agreement. Prior to the date on which any new rule promulgated by the NBA becomes effective, the NBA shall provide notice of such new rule to the Players Association and consult with the Players Association with respect thereto.
Because O'Neal, Jackson, and Artest (among others) violated that rule, they can be suspended and/or fined for that conduct. They are also entitled to appeal the penalty imposed. Here, the suspension was handed down by the Commissioner. By agreement, the appeal of that suspension is to {drumroll} the Commissioner:Quote:
PLAYER CONDUCT-SPECTATORS
Any coach, player or trainer who deliberately enters the spectator stands during the game will be automatically ejected and the incident reported by E-mail to the Commissioner. Entering the stands to keep a ball in play by a player or the momentum which carries the player into the stands is not considered deliberate. The first row of seats is considered the beginning of the stands.
So, it looks like if Stern sticks to his guns, Artest, Jackson and O'Neal are going to have to file a legal action to have any kind of a chance to reduce their well-earned penalties.Quote:
Section 8. Special Procedure with Respect to Player Discipline.
(a) Any dispute involving (i) a fine or suspension imposed upon a player by the Commissioner (or his designee) for conduct on the playing court (regardless of its financial impact on the player), or (ii) action taken by the Commissioner (or his designee) concerning the preservation of the integrity of, or the maintenance of public confidence in, the game of basketball resulting in a financial impact to the player of $25,000 or less, shall be processed exclusively as follows:
(i)Within twenty (20) days following written notification of the action taken by the Commissioner (or his designee), a player affected thereby or the Players Association may appeal in writing to the Commissioner.
(ii) Upon the written request of the Players Association, the Commissioner shall designate a time and place for hearing as soon as is reasonably practicable following his receipt of the notice of appeal.
(iii) As soon as reasonably practicable, but not later than twenty (20) days, following the conclusion of such hearing, the Commissioner shall render a written decision, which decision shall constitute full, final and complete disposition of the dispute, and shall be binding upon the player(s) and Team(s) involved and the parties to this Agreement.
(iv) In the event such appeal involves a fine or suspension imposed by the Commissioner’s designee, the Commissioner, as a consequence of such appeal and hearing, shall have authority only to affirm or reduce such fine or suspension, and shall not have authority to increase such fine or suspension.
LOL, just saw Billy Hunter on TV.
Union presidential dumbass: "I was just hoping, you know, that the suspension would be more reasonable."
Reporter: "What is reasonable in your eyes?"
Hunter: "I'd say 30 games."
:lmao
And the kicker:
"We live in a violent society, things like this happen, there were fights last week in pro and college football." WTF?!?!?
I'd say 40.
E20,
You've got to make a statement loud and clear to the players that shows this won't be tolerated.
Kicking him out for the year (along with his loss of salary) is about the only way to prove you mean it.
perfect punishment for Artest.
Stephen Jackson should be gone for the year as well.
Oneal Wallace and everyone else is far.
BTW Stern, your as much culpable for this BS as everyone else, so dont act "repulsed"
you have promoted the "gangsta" "Thug" "Bad Boy" image for years now.
This is what you get.
A bunch of punks fighting.
You got what you wanted.
How about promoting Duncan, Grant Hill, and other good guys from now on??
Heaven forbid.......
:)Quote:
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Lucky Marcus.Quote:
Originally Posted by Marcus Bryant