Do you guys have any idea who Bruce Bowen will be guarding primarily in this series?
Will Pop stick him on Marion or Nash?
Printable View
Do you guys have any idea who Bruce Bowen will be guarding primarily in this series?
Will Pop stick him on Marion or Nash?
I am pretty sure he will switch between the 2 just as he did with AI and Carmelo.
Just like 05, Marion.
Marion is a big X Factor.
You make Parker make Nash a shooter as opposed to a distributer, shut off Marion completely, let Duncan, Oberto and Finley take their turns on Amare slowing him down.
Who will be guarding Barbosa?
Bruce vs Marion
But Marion knows what's coming up ; in fact, that's what he said after eliminating L.A :
""We gotta be better in the next round cos the Spurs have leadership and can play at this level" :lol :lol
That's somewhat of a relief. The idea of Bowen guarding Nash terrifies me.
if they ran a nash/barbosa back court at times i'd imagine it would be tony on barbosa and bowen on nash..
if they throw out:
nash
barbosa
bell
marion
stoudemire
i'd assume we'd counter it with
bowen
tony
gino
horry
duncan
but damn that phx line up is fairly scary.
Our best offensive lineup is:
Nash
Barbosa
Bell
Marion
Stoudemire
I'd prefer a more defensive lineup to start the game:
Nash
Bell
Marion
Stoudemire
KThomas
Parker guarded him a lot in the regular season.Quote:
Originally Posted by Xylus
I don't know if D'Antoni is going to start KThomas on Duncan (it would be smart if he did). If he does, then Elson on Stoudemire. Duncan on KThomas. Bowen on Marion. Finley on Bell. Parker on Nash.
If Thomas doesn't start, then Elson on JJones. Duncan on Stoudemire. Bowen on Marion. Finley on Bell. Parker on Nash.
When Barbosa comes in, if Parker is still in the game, then Parker slides guard Barbosa. And if Nash is still in, Bowen moves to him.
According to your Offensive lineup, the best Spurs team facing this team should be:Quote:
Originally Posted by Xylus
Parker
Bowen
Ginobili
Finley
Duncan
Otherwise, to counter your Defensive lineup it should be:
Parker
Bowen
Ginobili
Horry
Duncan
Defensively, I think D'Antoni will have Marion on Parker, Bell on Manu, Nash on Bowen, James Jones on Elson, Stoudemire on Duncan.
What are the chances of Pop going even smaller than Elson?
Good chance if Elson doesn't show up.Quote:
Originally Posted by Xylus
If Spurs go small, then I think the Suns stand a better chance in this series. I'd stick with Elson, even if he plays poorly. A secret to beating the Suns is to control the glass, and the Spurs won't do that if they go small.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kori Ellis
I seriously doubt KThomas will get the start or too much burn against the Spurs. He's the only one who can give Timmy fits, but he absolutely kills the D'Antoni style of run and gun (or Controlled Chaos as he calls it), and I'm thinking D'Antoni figures getting the game up tempo is going to be the only way they can beat the Spurs. I think he just saw what SA did to a Nuggets team that had to play in the half court, and IMO the Nuggets have better pieces in which to play a half court game with the Spurs.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kori Ellis
Amare will go off again, I see no reason why Pop changes his gameplan for 05
with the way finley's playing defense and shooting the ball, i'd imagine it wouldn't be as much of a defensive drop as would normally be expected if we went with parker/manu/finley/horry/duncan to offensively counter that small phx lineup.
it will be an interesting series for sure though.
I'd think it would be bowen on marion, parker on nash, manu on barbosa, finley on bell, the bigs on amare.
And I have this tingly feeling in my spine that diaw will be a problem...
Elson isn't much a factor on the glass normally anyway :lolQuote:
Originally Posted by Xylus
But I think he'll have a decent series against the Suns.
The Suns are a better half-court team than the Nuggets, I can guarantee you that.
The Spurs are going to try their best to slow this series down, and for the most part, I think they'll be successful. If D'Antoni fruitlessly sticks to a small lineup even though the game has slowed, the Suns will lose. Why not use Kurt when the Spurs control the pace?
Horry and Oberto will see much more playing time during this series. I just can't see Elson out there guarding Amare.
If the Spurs can find a guy for Oberto to guard, he's the type of guy who can burn the Suns with rebounding and baskets close to the rim. Unless Kurt Thomas plays, the only other guy Oberto can guard outside of Stoudemire is perhaps Diaw.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Xylus
Because a slow paced team isn't what got him there, does D'Antoni even know how to slow that ball up?
I think you have to have Tony on LB whenever the two are on the court together. He's pretty much the only one we have who has the quickness to stay with him.
I like the idea of Bowen on Nash as much as possible. Bowen is stronger, longer, bigger and can mess up the timing of Nash's pick and rolls. He might be able to get away with the occasional elbow or bump because of his reputation as an elite defender that Tony can't get away with. I don't think Tony can bother Nash defensively as much as he bothered AI because Nash isn't looking to score, he's looking for passing angles mainly. You need somebody with some size and wingspan to take those angles away. And Nash's main offensive weapon will be the fadeaway, and Tony can't take that away even if he wanted to.
I really think people are overrating Marion offensively. We can put Finley or Manu on him and get away with it. The guy doesn't post up, he doesn't have a back to the basket game, and he's not much of a driver. His whole game is offensive rebounds, transition, and 3 pointers. You don't need Bowen's size to take away the last two. As long as we keep him off the boards, Fin and Manu can neutralize him about as well as Bowen did.
if parker closes out well, he should be the one defending nash most of the time. when nash and barbosa are both on the floor, put him on barbosa..with good defensive pressure he could get some open looks from the 3pt-line(bowen that is), so could finley for that matter..if the suns duo is not together on the floor, put him on marion..he's already shut him down numerous times..I also think elson could do a good job defending him
My guess is Bowen on Nash and Parker on Barbosa. Bowen's length will bother Nash's vision as well as make it hard for him to penetrate.
Diaw better show up this series... no one will expect him to because he's been such a fucking daisy on both ends of the floor since Amare came back.
As a Spurs fan, I hope to see as little of Kurt Thomas as possible. He's historically one of the best defenders in terms of defending Tim Duncan.Quote:
Originally Posted by Xylus
Duncan fairs rather well against pretty much everyone else on the Suns. Although I have been impressed by Stoudemire's improved defense this season.
The Suns maybe a better half court team than the Nuggets (although I'm not so sure), but not a better half court team against the Spurs. The key to going at the Spurs is to be physical, clog the paint, and hit the boards hard. The Nuggets did about as good a job as I've seen in a while through the first 4 games, and I know the Suns don't have the physicality to go at the Spurs in the half court. It may make sense to play Thomas big minutes if the Spurs are controlling tempo anyway, but to D'Antoni that is surrendering his controlled chaos to play the Spurs game that the Suns cannot win anyway. His best chance is to try to get the Spurs to play the Suns game, and he has zero chance of doing that with Thomas in the game for extended minutes.Quote:
Originally Posted by Xylus
Also, personally I am hoping Kurt Thomas plays a lot. The more the better. He's a good defender but we can just double off of him defensively just like we did to Najera. Najera was the 2nd worst minus player (after Smith) for the Nuggets after four games because they couldn't score at all with him on the court. We doubled Carmelo like crazy when Najera was in the game.
just let him do his thing, so we can concentrate on good team defense and avoid transition points, that way TD can destroy him on offense once againQuote:
Originally Posted by Trainwreck2100
Duncan almost gets shut down by KThomas - he's like Rasheed used to be to him.
But I don't think D'Antoni will play him a lot because of offense.
Bowen has always done awesome on Marion - but I know this series he'll switch between Marion and Nash and Tony will switch between Nash and Barbosa.
The Suns are an underrated half-court team this season. They have a reputation of being a poor half-court team, but I think they've done a good job of proving it wrong this year. They can now win in any sort of game because they have so many offensive threats. Even when the game slows down, Amare and Barbosa can score handily, and Diaw isn't so bad himself.
We all saw it in the last Suns-Spurs game. Duncan was dominating Amare inside, hitting any shot he wanted, basically. Then Kurt Thomas came in for about 7 minutes (2nd quarter) and shut Duncan down, forcing him to miss 4 or 5 straight shots. For some reason, D'Antoni pulled him and Kurt didn't see any playing time after that. If D'Antoni refuses to play Kurt, our best low-post defender, I think the Suns will lose.
I feel most comfortable with Bowen on Marion. With that matchup, you can take Marion out of the series.
But yeah, when Barbosa is on the court, Parker pretty much has to guard him. I don't know anyone else on the team who has a chance against him. Even Bowen and Vaughn would probably get lit up.
I love Manu on Bell because that keeps Manu fresh for the other end.
:smokin
I think they are better than they were with Q, but I think their strengths in the half court play directly to the Spurs strengths in defending the half court. The Suns don't have anyone outside of Thomas to beat up on Duncan and get him off his rhythm, but with Thomas in the game the Suns half court offensive game is not as effective. Keeping Thomas in the game will keep the game a low scoring, grind it out game, and the Spurs are the masters of that kind of game. The Suns playing that game is as dumb as the Spurs trying to run the Suns out of the building.Quote:
Originally Posted by Xylus
You might be right. I think D'Antoni is probably following the same train of thought.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin Blackistone
God damn fucking Catch 22's! :madrun
I've seen various line-ups the suns listed on here, but my question is don't they ever go super big in the front court, with Thomas/Diaw, Amare, and Marion at the 3?
If it's that line-up, and then a Nash-LB backcourt, I really don't know who Pop could have Manu guard. Marion I guess. Or maybe he wouldn't even have him playing.
He pretty much has to guard Jones or Bell most of the time, right?
Hopefully we can see a repeat of this ...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Me
I don't think it's about Bowen to keep Marion out of it. We just have to take away his threes, his transition and his rebounding. Finley or Manu should be able to do that just as well as Bruce could. He's not this big slashing/driving/cutter that only Bruce can guard.Quote:
Originally Posted by timvp
This is going to be a tough series for both teams. I'd bet on the Suns beat any team in the NBA in a seven game series ... except for the Spurs. The Spurs matchup about as well as you can matchup against the Suns.
With the Suns having homecourt, I'd say this series is a coin flip.
For the Spurs fans who remember the 2005 Suns, you should just forget about that Phoenix squad. This team is much, much better. Stoudemire is a smarter basketball player. Nash is playing better than ever, especially defensively. Marion might be the most dynamic player in the league. Bell is a hard ass who will do whatever it takes to win. Barbosa is playing at a very high level. Diaw is talented. Kurt Thomas can guard Duncan with success. James Jones is like a sane Stephen Jackson.
The Spurs can win this series, but it's not going to be easy. They'll have to play better than they did against the Nuggets.
With homecourt advantage, I'd be confident that the Spurs could win handily. Without it, it's now a toss up.
I don't want Manu to have to work very much on D this series. Give him an easy assignment.Quote:
Originally Posted by aaronstampler
This is his series to go off offensively.
According to 82games.com, the most efficient and most common Suns lineup is Nash-Bell-Marion-Diaw-Stoudemire.
Would the Spurs trot out a Parker-Manu-Bowen-Horry-Duncan lineup to counter?
Well who's he supposed to guard if Bell and Jones are off the court then Kori?
I personally like the idea of changing up who guards Nash. Nash is the key to their offense, and he's too great of a player to lock up one defender on him. He'll adjust and pick the Spurs apart if only TP or only Bruce guard him. IMO throwing Bruce at him and switching TP and possibly Manu for a possession or two early in the game will keep Nash in the process of trying to adjust to his defender. That tandem could make it difficult enough for him.
Needless to say, keeping an eye on your man and good old fashioned denial defense is going to be essential for the Spurs.
I'd rather have Bowen on Nash and disturb so much that he can't run the offense.
Marion cannot, i repeat cannot create his own shot. Finley is enough for Marion.
Before Bowen joined the Spurs, Marion was a top Spur Killer in the league. Even his rookie season, he tore the Spurs up in the playoffs.Quote:
Originally Posted by aaronstampler
Perhaps the Spurs have figured out as a whole how to slow Marion, but I have bad memories of the days that Marion would run the Spurs right out of the gym single-handedly pre-Bowen.
Bell is averaging ~37 mpg in the playoffs. I don't think that will be a big factor. Manu can guard someone else in very small stretches but most of the time he's on the court, Bell will be on the court.Quote:
Originally Posted by aaronstampler
manu works well on bellQuote:
Originally Posted by Kori Ellis
That's a good question. I guess you have to put Manu on Marion. You might be able to get away with Manu on Barbosa if the tempo is slowed but that's probably risky.Quote:
Originally Posted by aaronstampler
I know, that's what I am saying.Quote:
Originally Posted by inagra
I still feel confident that the Spurs can win in 6. Get a split in games 1 and 2 and the HCA is theirs. I don't know if Diaw and Jones are ready to take the big step and man up against the Spurs in the playoffs. Nash, Amare, and Bell will bring it, but the others I'm not so sure about.Quote:
Originally Posted by timvp
Marion.
Good point. Bell was brought on board to the Manu Stopper. He'll probably see a lot of time against Manu.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kori Ellis
I think Manu should be fine as long as Manu is put into pick-and-roll action and doesn't try to take it one-on-one against Bell.
The last game we did a good job on Marion for three quarters with mainly Fin/Manu, he had 8 points through 3, but he scored 9 in the 4th when the Suns hit us with that comeback.
I'm really glad you said that. For some reason, no one takes us Suns fans seriously when we say that this '07 team is a step above that '05 team.Quote:
Originally Posted by timvp
One thing I noticed about Manu this series is he doesn't seem to have much confidence going behind his back. A lot of his turnovers are coming because he's putting the ball out in front of him on the dribble and the second man on those screen and rolls is able to lunge and tap it away.
If he just did a behind the back dribble instead of that one hand crossover move that doesn't work as much as it used to, he'd probably be able to have a clear path to the hoop, blowing past a lunging big man behind him.
I'd put Bruce on Nash and Finley on Marion
That's what I hope is successful, that Finley can hold down Marion. I think Pop will hold Bowen playing Nash though until critical junctures, the way he did with Billups, to muck up the Suns in crunch time.Quote:
Originally Posted by Spurs Brazil
the spurs coaching staff seems to vary their strat on the suns from game to game since the conference finals in 2005. who knows what they will come up with, but it will probably be effective as long as they hit their own shots.
Barbosa is the guy you gotta watch out for. marion doesn't scare me as much as Barbosa does...
BINGO!!!!!! We have a winner!Quote:
Originally Posted by inagra
You're kidding, right? A more defensive lineup?
I've read and heard a few things this year that Phx is a different team than the last two years because they've ramped up their defense. What???
Allowing 110 points to a poor Lakers team in an elimination game doesn't seem like very good defense, esp. when Kobe only scored 34 of them and you've got Kwame, Odom, Parker(Smush), Walton, and other lesser names on their squad scoring the other points.
So don't come with a "defensive" lineup, just come with what you've got and we'll still beat you in 6. There, I gave you one more win than 2 years ago.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Xylus
Tony' pwns Nash on offense and defense for the past year.
Bowen has pwned Marion for the last several years.
Timmah pwns Amare on offense.
Amare can score all he wants, the Spurs shut down the others.
Spurs in 5, like '05. Sun goin' fishin'.