I don't want to hear about TP being the MVP anymore

Tony probably has the votes now, but if Bowen keeps Lebron shooting 37%, he's my MVP, especially after this monster game.

Why do I get shit on here when I haven't even written anything?

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Originally Posted by aaronstampler

Why do I get shit on here when I haven't even written anything?

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Well, now you've just written something.

A+

I don't think any of the big three played well today at all. We owe the win to Bowen, Barry, and the total incompetence of the Cavs. They missed a lot of open shots. We didn't play any better tonight than we did in Game 3 at Utah. Cleveland is just that much worse. Against any Western team, we get our hats handed to us tonight.

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Originally Posted by Obstructed_View

The Spurs went on a 10-0 run at the end of the second quarter to take the lead and steal all the momentum and enthusiasm from the crowd.

Who was on the bench during that run?

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This will get me in trouble here, but what the hell...

If you want to get into who's been the best player, that's one thing, but don't bring who's in and who's out and the runs or whatever into arguments, because it's a losing argument.

Tony has the worst +/- of the big three in this series.

Once again, I'm not saying he's played the worst. I'm just saying if you want to make Tony's case for MVP, don't do it that way.

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Originally Posted by aaronstampler

I don't think any of the big three played well today at all. We owe the win to Bowen, Barry, and the total incompetence of the Cavs. They missed a lot of open shots. We didn't play any better tonight than we did in Game 3 at Utah. Cleveland is just that much worse. Against any Western team, we get our hats handed to us tonight.

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I am with you this time aaron :toast
You are a diehard Manu fan and are sometime a bit partial. But you seems to have change your mind on Tony :clap
I don't consider you a hater anymore.

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Originally Posted by ChumpDumper

Well, now you've just written something.

A+

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It's really sad that Spurs fans can't be anywhere near as classy as Spurs players. We're in the damn finals with a 3-0 lead and it's not enough for people to enjoy the team and enjoy the win and be grateful of the position we're in. You have to celebrate the win by trying to degrade or upset your fellow fans, just because they have a different favorite player than you do.

Seriously, what is the point?

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Originally Posted by aaronstampler

It's really sad that Spurs fans can't be anywhere near as classy as Spurs players. We're in the damn finals with a 3-0 lead and it's not enough for people to enjoy the team and enjoy the win and be grateful of the position we're in. You have to celebrate the win by trying to degrade or upset your fellow fans, just because they have a different favorite player than you do.

Seriously, what is the point?

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C-

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Originally Posted by ChumpDumper

C-

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Not an F+? How benevolent of you.

http://aol.nba.com/statistics/lenovo...=20&team=Spurs :toast

Can't you just enjoy the win?

F

The win is fine. I don't like the bullshit putdowns afterwards.

That doesn't sound like enjoyment to me.

F

Unfortunate for me then that God gave you the authority to decide such things. But yeah, really I'm as thrilled with a 75-72 win as I could possibly be expected to be. It's hard to even type right now with this erection.

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Originally Posted by aaronstampler

Not an F+? How benevolent of you.

http://aol.nba.com/statistics/lenovo...=20&team=Spurs :toast

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Aarggg you just proved that ranking player according to +/- is stupid.

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I don't want to hear about TP being the MVP anymore

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Did Duncan collected a triple double ? Did he destroyed the Cavs ? Did TP pulled a disappearing act 03 finals-style ? If something like that happened last night this thread title would be relevant.

But I watched the game and if the finals MVP would be a boxing contest between TP and Duncan I would consider round 3 a draw.

Stop the hate, just enjoy the win. :toast

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Originally Posted by aaronstampler

Unfortunate for me then that God gave you the authority to decide such things.

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F

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But yeah, really I'm as thrilled with a 75-72 win as I could possibly be expected to be. It's hard to even type right now with this erection.

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D+

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Originally Posted by mathbzh

Aarggg you just proved that ranking player according to +/- is stupid.

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Why? It's not a one on one game. All the stat measures is how you function within a group.

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Originally Posted by aaronstampler

Why? It's not a one on one game. All the stat measures is how you function within a group.

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Simple answer:
When is Bowen on the floor? When Lebron is!

This ranking depend on the lineup you face up. You can check the +/- for all teams if you want. It is almost always leaded by a bench player.
I don't say the stat is meaningless. It can be an interesting indicator but it don't give you a player ranking.

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Originally Posted by mathbzh

It is almost always leaded by a bench player.

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Actually I should say often. Half of the top rated are team leaders.

The top three in +/- this year were 1) Duncan 2) Nash 3) Nowitzki.

Show me the bench player.

Marion was fourth. Bruce was fifth.

In the playoffs it's 1) Billups 2) Prince 3) 'Sheed.

For the Spurs it's 1) Fab 2) Tony 3) Manu.

I think maybe game to game you can always find faults with the stat, like you can with any stat, but over the long haul it holds up pretty well.

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Originally Posted by mathbzh

Simple answer:
When is Bowen on the floor? When Lebron is!

This ranking depend on the lineup you face up. You can check the +/- for all teams if you want. It is almost always leaded by a bench player.
I don't say the stat is meaningless. It can be an interesting indicator but it don't give you a player ranking.

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I never said it gives you a player ranking. I find PER more useful for that. But +/- punishes bench players rather than helps them. The less minutes you play, the less time you have to accumulate a high + total.

I'd vote for Duncan as MVP. But, Parker and Bowen (and others) are great too.

But who give a fuck about a meaningless trophy anyway.

Spurs are about to win a Title. The Team got them in this position.

As a French Spurs fan i'm surprise there's so many TP haters....Tony his now doing what the haters were waiting for and they still complaining. Enjoy, as real Spurs fan, that you have another player than TD who deserve the final MVP...as you did for Manu in 2005...
For the Manu lovers he had a bad game that's it!!
He made some FT at the end...
I can't imagine the TP haters if Tony was the one missing a FT with 10 second left giving a chance to the Cavaliers to go to the OT...
The team is great...."They live as a team and die as a team"

Just to start :
This is our best 5 yesterday.
R. Horry
B. Barry
M. Ginobili
T. Parker
F. Oberto
Let play this five for 30 minutes and see what happens.

Your ranking works because you are looking at top teams (the ones with the best starting five, supposed to outscore oponent starting five). Check this also for losing teams.

My feeling :
+/- tell you how good is your starting 5 and how good is your bench. But it doesn't tell you if a player is better than another.

It is still an interesting tool. It shows clearly that Manu is great coming of the Bench. But if you say Barry (+7) had a better game than Bowen (-3) you clearly don't use this tool correctly.

I learnt to deal with the fact that the TP haterz will never acknowledge the guy and all but damn...this has to be a new record :

- up 3-0 in teh Finals
- 3 good games from Tp (2 great ones)
- big shots LATE in the clutch
- etc...

and the first thing that comes to your mind is to create threads like this ???? WTF????

I don't even give a shit about finals mvp ! what matters is winning the title !

Can't you people just enjoy the win and the position we're in ???