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Re: Spurs Draft Board: Daequan Cook Was Number One
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Originally Posted by Mr. Body
9 post chum
Post count smack?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Body
the only claim that Daequan Cook was #1 on the Spurs' board comes from HIS FORMER HIGH SCHOOL COACH. Not like those guys aren't notorious for talking up their proteges and themselves taking unsubstantiated rumor as fact.
That's it. Nobody else reported it. The rest is conjecture.
End of story.
Why the other players? Dudley and Chandler are SFs, a position of need. Fernandez is a foreign player with talent, nuff said. Cook would be meaningless on this team, since he's too small for the swingman position, and his attitude and talent are too questionable to make sense, unless the Spurs truly do suck at judging talent.
If we don't watch out, this crap about Cook as #1 is gonna solidify as Spurstalk mythology and somehow become fact. It's nothing of the sort.
I don't understand why you are having such a hard time piecing this together. Every piece of the puzzle fits perfectly and points to Cook being the Spurs' number one option on draft day.
Let's add it all up:
-Cook's high school coach, who was serving as his adviser throughout the draft process, flat out says that the Spurs were trying to get him at 16. What motivation would the coach have to lie? The draft was over. There was no smoke screening or anything going on. What was done was done.
-The Houston Chronicle reports that the Wizards were planning on picking Cook at 16. That's another source backing up the theory that Cook was going at 16.
-RC after the draft admits to trying to trade for a top 20 pick. That again fits with everything else we've heard. In the top 20, the Wizards were one of the most active traders.
-The Wizards were surprised that Young was still on the board and the Washington Post indicated that with Young on the board, that changed the draft strategy for the Wizards. Again, that fits perfectly with everything else. The Wizards were going to trade the pick until someone unexpectedly fell to them at 16.
-RC after the draft says that their number one option came off the board quickly after the 20th pick. Cook was drafted 21. Again, that fits everything else.
-RC after the draft is asked about whether the Spurs were automatically looking for a draft 'n stash option at 28. He says no, that they were prepared to bring someone in that would have been on the roster next year. That again fits the Cook theory.
-Dudley doesn't make that much sense. The Spurs invited Dudley in for a second workout in which he declined. Do you really think the Spurs would have a player number one on their board who they needed to look at again at the last second? That's not how the Spurs operate. Plus, no one in their right mind would trade into the top 20 to select Dudley. It was surprising for him to go at 22. If Dudley was their guy, they wouldn't have been frantically trying to trade up to get him. Plus in the RC interview after the draft, he said that no one they were looking at drafting was someone who'd help them right away. If the Spurs weren't looking for help right away, they wouldn't have drafted Dudley. Putting Dudley on the Toros would make no sense because he already is what he is.
-Chandler makes zero sense. The Spurs never worked him out. Everyone and their mother knew he was going 23 to the Knicks. He had some character questions. You wouldn't try to trade up to 16 to get a player everyone knew was going at 23.
-Fernandez doesn't make any sense. RC specifically said they weren't looking at a draft 'n stash as their first option. Fernandez is a draft 'n stash. He's most likely staying overseas for at least this upcoming season. Plus, if you go back and read some of the pieces Ludden wrote that mentioned Fernandez from when he went on that scouting trip with RC, the reports were less than flattering.
-Miami and the Spurs have a history of having the same taste in players. The Spurs were once upon a time desperate to trade up for Dorrell Wright. Instead, the Heat ended up with him.
-Cook fits the mold of the long term project the Spurs were looking for. Cook could have been brought in and put on the Toros for the next two years. The Spurs have shown their dedication to the developmental possibilities of the Toros and Cook would have fit right in with that. He came out too early but he showed flashes of greatness in college.
I see no reason to believe Cook wasn't the number one pick ... other than internet scouts not thinking Cook would be a worthy pick, of course. Everything else fits together. I don't know what more you want other than a picture of the Spurs draft board.
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Re: Spurs Draft Board: Daequan Cook Was Number One
Most of what you just posted is massive conjecture, especially the trade up to Washington stuff. I'm also not sure why you place such creedence on what comes out of Cook's old high school coach's mouth. Of course it sounds great to say the NBA champs were looking for your player. Don't you realize how cocky and boneheaded many of these guys are? Guys not ready for the NBA enter the draft every year on advice from former high school coaches and other entourage members; Cook just has an advantage because he has 'NBA skills'.
Regardless, if this is true - and I stake it that it's not at all - then we dodged a massive bullet. Cook is years away from contributing ON AN NCAA TEAM, much less an NBA one, and if it's true the Spurs were after Dorell Wright back in the day, too, then it's just as well they didn't get him, either, because both those players are busts. Following Miami's lead in the draft is numbskullery, especially after all that mewling and crying got them the extra pick from Orlando, with which they drafted Stanko Barac, for God's sake.
While I do think the Spurs' domestic scouting is pretty poor, I don't think there is anything remotely like proof that Cook was #1.
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Re: Spurs Draft Board: Daequan Cook Was Number One
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Originally Posted by timvp
Post count smack?
I don't understand why you are having such a hard time piecing this together. Every piece of the puzzle fits perfectly and points to Cook being the Spurs' number one option on draft day.
Let's add it all up:
-Cook's high school coach, who was serving as his adviser throughout the draft process, flat out says that the Spurs were trying to get him at 16. What motivation would the coach have to lie? The draft was over. There was no smoke screening or anything going on. What was done was done.
-The Houston Chronicle reports that the Wizards were planning on picking Cook at 16. That's another source backing up the theory that Cook was going at 16.
-RC after the draft admits to trying to trade for a top 20 pick. That again fits with everything else we've heard. In the top 20, the Wizards were one of the most active traders.
-The Wizards were surprised that Young was still on the board and the Washington Post indicated that with Young on the board, that changed the draft strategy for the Wizards. Again, that fits perfectly with everything else. The Wizards were going to trade the pick until someone unexpectedly fell to them at 16.
-RC after the draft says that their number one option came off the board quickly after the 20th pick. Cook was drafted 21. Again, that fits everything else.
-RC after the draft is asked about whether the Spurs were automatically looking for a draft 'n stash option at 28. He says no, that they were prepared to bring someone in that would have been on the roster next year. That again fits the Cook theory.
-Dudley doesn't make that much sense. The Spurs invited Dudley in for a second workout in which he declined. Do you really think the Spurs would have a player number one on their board who they needed to look at again at the last second? That's not how the Spurs operate. Plus, no one in their right mind would trade into the top 20 to select Dudley. It was surprising for him to go at 22. If Dudley was their guy, they wouldn't have been frantically trying to trade up to get him. Plus in the RC interview after the draft, he said that no one they were looking at drafting was someone who'd help them right away. If the Spurs weren't looking for help right away, they wouldn't have drafted Dudley. Putting Dudley on the Toros would make no sense because he already is what he is.
-Chandler makes zero sense. The Spurs never worked him out. Everyone and their mother knew he was going 23 to the Knicks. He had some character questions. You wouldn't try to trade up to 16 to get a player everyone knew was going at 23.
-Fernandez doesn't make any sense. RC specifically said they weren't looking at a draft 'n stash as their first option. Fernandez is a draft 'n stash. He's most likely staying overseas for at least this upcoming season. Plus, if you go back and read some of the pieces Ludden wrote that mentioned Fernandez from when he went on that scouting trip with RC, the reports were less than flattering.
-Miami and the Spurs have a history of having the same taste in players. The Spurs were once upon a time desperate to trade up for Dorrell Wright. Instead, the Heat ended up with him.
-Cook fits the mold of the long term project the Spurs were looking for. Cook could have been brought in and put on the Toros for the next two years. The Spurs have shown their dedication to the developmental possibilities of the Toros and Cook would have fit right in with that. He came out too early but he showed flashes of greatness in college.
I see no reason to believe Cook wasn't the number one pick ... other than internet scouts not thinking Cook would be a worthy pick, of course. Everything else fits together. I don't know what more you want other than a picture of the Spurs draft board.
Someone buy this gentleman a beer. :tu
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Re: Spurs Draft Board: Daequan Cook Was Number One
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Originally Posted by drmvp
Someone buy this gentleman a beer.
And while you go get me MY beer, you can write out what timvp said above is more than 'somewhat likely' or 'somewhat possible', i.e., more possible than not; thanks.
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Re: Spurs Draft Board: Daequan Cook Was Number One
Quote:
And while you go get me MY beer, you can write out what timvp said above is more than 'somewhat likely' or 'somewhat possible', i.e., more possible than not; thanks.
Just tip your hat to TimVP and say you got owned. Your point about not wanting him may be valid but it all the facts point to Spurs trying to grab him. For you to be correct everyone one would have to be making things up AND all the made up stories would have to fit together to tell a story of the spurs wanting him.
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Re: Spurs Draft Board: Daequan Cook Was Number One
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Originally Posted by spvrs
Just tip your hat to TimVP and say you got owned. Your point about not wanting him may be valid but it all the facts point to Spurs trying to grab him. For you to be correct everyone one would have to be making things up AND all the made up stories would have to fit together to tell a story of the spurs wanting him.
I don't know why people have a hard time reading. Please, for the love of god, your mother, and our system of education and way of life, read what he wrote. It's well reasoned and possibly true, but there's not a single FACT in the entire post. It's all conjecture. You could go through and make a case for any other player - this is all based off of Daequan Cook's own man talking up his player in a way that he could easily have been passing on a rumor that was third source by the time it got to him and was never remotely true. That's it. The rest of the items sort of point in that direction, but not in any substantial way. They point to other players, as well. Fini... unless you want to believe this dude's entourage.
This isn't about me being 'correct' - this is about casting massive heapings of doubt on a dubious source and story. Which was accomplished. But if I got 'owned' by conjecture, well, that's the lameness of the Internets, isn't it?
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Re: Spurs Draft Board: Daequan Cook Was Number One
No I get you, but your wrong.
As was pointed out there was no motive pointing to this guy lying -- draft was over. The idea that having the "championship" spurs wanting you gives you some kind of street creed is retarded. If they guy was lying he'd have said the Lakers or Knicks, not the small market spurs.
Maybe the guy misheard, that would have been valid point on your part. That's why TimVP included the other like 14 observations were put into back it up.
Are these not facts?:
-The Houston Chronicle reports that the Wizards were planning on picking Cook at 16. That's another source backing up the theory that Cook was going at 16.
-The Wizards were surprised that Young was still on the board and the Washington Post indicated that with Young on the board, that changed the draft strategy for the Wizards. Again, that fits perfectly with everything else. The Wizards were going to trade the pick until someone unexpectedly fell to them at 16.
-RC after the draft admits to trying to trade for a top 20 pick. That again fits with everything else we've heard. In the top 20, the Wizards were one of the most active traders
-RC after the draft says that their number one option came off the board quickly after the 20th pick. Cook was drafted 21. Again, that fits everything else
It's like 95% probablity.
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Re: Spurs Draft Board: Daequan Cook Was Number One
Those things do fit, but I wouldn't place the probability that high. I'd hope we can remove Cook's entourage member's opinion from the equation - I'm not even sure it's Spurs M.O. to tell a player they're trying to move up to get him. I'd be interested in seeing something other than the Chron saying the Wizards wanted Cook at 16 or were looking to trade away in any fashion, although I don't doubt they were happy Nick Young was still there.
That said, whatever's going on with Washington has no bearing on the Spurs. The Wiz wanted a SG and there's no reason to think they'd trade him away. Once Young is off the board, Cook was perhaps the next best U.S. shooting guard (not true, but whatever), but there was a big drop off. There is nothing here to suggest the Spurs were after 1) that pick, or 2) Cook.
R.C. admits they were trying to trade into the top 20. Fine. This does not have to be Washington. It could be anyone. His comment that his pick was 'quickly' off the board is highly subjective and could mean the guy was picked earlier than they thought he'd be - within the top 24 or so.
But fine... if Cook was #1, that's thoroughly flabbergasting, as he's barely first round quality. He tore up Coppin State and San Francisco and East Bumblefuck earlier in the year and was a total non-factor in the conference schedule and especially in the NCAA tournament, had problems with his coach, and failed to play within the system, especially defensively. And when I say he was a non-factor in the part of the season that counts, by that I mean he stunk.
If you play out the string starting with Cook's coach's comments, then you can somehow get to the conclusion that the Spurs were after him outside of his fantasy. But if you look at the draft board as a whole and who was available and - especially - team need, it makes no sense at all. SG is not a position of need on this team at all and I fail to see how sticking Cook deep on the bench for 3-4 years, begging and praying for him to somehow come along before losing his privileged cool, was ever considered a good idea. Once you stop looking at the situation the wrong way through the binoculars and look at it at a wider angle, Daequan Cook at #1 makes no sense at all. The only conclusion would then be the Spurs have no idea what they're doing.
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Re: Spurs Draft Board: Daequan Cook Was Number One
Spurs worked the guy out so they know a hell of a lot more than we do. IF they thought the guy was going to be a dominant player in 4 years then it would have been a good move, assuming Parker develops and someone else in the wings develops you might have a team that competes for the title after Manu and Duncan are no longer big time players. Splitter looks like a complimentary bench piece at best (right now).
Powell says Spurs were unable to work out a deal with Washington for Cook. A separate report states that Washington was going to draft Cook and make a trade. This would mean that while 'talking smack' Powell would have to been amazingly lucky or been somehow privvy to the Washington draft room so that it would have made a plausible story. Now add to it the Spurs say they wanted to trade up and there number one guy was gone and it's like big time probable.
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Re: Spurs Draft Board: Daequan Cook Was Number One
I'll remain in disbelief that the Spurs were after Cook. By all accounts he'll never pan out and will accompany that with an increasingly souring attitude. And why the Spurs were after him above other SGs, if they wanted a SG, like Morris Almond, is also baffling.
Splitter was a great pick and will be more than a complementary bench player - he'll start next to Duncan and be the best center we've had since Robinson. It's not guaranteed he will, but they'll get a far better rate of production at a greater probability of return than Daequan Cook ever could or would in the dim Jules Verne future.
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Re: Spurs Draft Board: Daequan Cook Was Number One
Maybe they were after him, but Im glad they didnt get him
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Re: Spurs Draft Board: Daequan Cook Was Number One
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Re: Spurs Draft Board: Daequan Cook Was Number One
I also believe that the Spurs 1st target was Jared Dudley. A perfect apprentice for Bowens who could contribute year one. Having said that I believe we lucked into Splitter.
Freshman point guards can't run teams unless they have played professionally against older men since they were 16. Sound familiar! Oden and Durant & Conley are one year out of HS. Carmelo has achieved nothing except numbers. King Jame's game wart's were exposed by Bowen's and team defense. Even Magic had an enormous advantage of teaming up a team that had enormous talent waiting for him.
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Re: Spurs Draft Board: Daequan Cook Was Number One
Alright, I concede the point now. The Spurs were probably stupid enough to have Daequon Cook as their #1 target.
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Re: Spurs Draft Board: Daequan Cook Was Number One
Bump.
Seeing as how Daequan Cook made the three-point contest, we can now be confident in what the Spurs saw in him. Pop and co. love three-point shooters and Cook can certainly shoot, although he can't do much else.
Trading to 16 for Cook would have at least been a decent move since Cook would fit pretty well with the Spurs. Splitter, on the other hand, doesn't look like the world's best Plan B . . .
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Re: Spurs Draft Board: Daequan Cook Was Number One
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Re: Spurs Draft Board: Daequan Cook Was Number One
He'll be a 23 YO RFA in 2010. Miami is dying for cap room to bring someone down to play with Wade. Wonder what they'd do if we dropped an offer on him?
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Re: Spurs Draft Board: Daequan Cook Was Number One
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Re: Spurs Draft Board: Daequan Cook Was Number One
Damn Timvp your memory is outstanding...
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Re: Spurs Draft Board: Daequan Cook Was Number One
Well actually when Cook made the three point shoot out I thought the same thing. I thought looks like the Spurs were right about him, but I didn't post about it, and the only way I knew about it was because of this thread which Timvp started. I thought it was a waste of time posting about it and I doubt the Spurs would ever get him. I'd say Pop would have wanted to mold him when he was younger into the type of player he thought he could be.
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Re: Spurs Draft Board: Daequan Cook Was Number One
splitter is a top 10 player in that draft, if we will succeed to bring him over it will be a fantastic pick
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Re: Spurs Draft Board: Daequan Cook Was Number One
timvp saves all of his battles, then brings them back to life when he knows he was right :lol.
I love your work.
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Re: Spurs Draft Board: Daequan Cook Was Number One
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Originally Posted by
kobyz
splitter is a top 10 player in that draft, if we will succeed to bring him over it will be a fantastic pick
I agree. If he was a college guy i dont think it would be a stretch to call him a potential Top 5 pick. He was number 1-3 on most Draft Boards when he was 19 and 20, i think 2004 and 2005.
Its fair enough to be mad at him for not coming over, being a Spurs fan. But i dont think people realise how good he is. Best player in Europe.
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Re: Spurs Draft Board: Daequan Cook Was Number One
If Tiago ever comes to SA, it will be another major steal.
He's already a top 3, if not the best big in Euroleague, at 23.
Technically, it was a great pick. Spurs just couldn't imagine he would stay in Spain.
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Re: Spurs Draft Board: Daequan Cook Was Number One
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Originally Posted by
JPB
If Tiago ever comes to SA, it will be another major steal.
He's already a top 3, if not the best big in Euroleague, at 23.
Technically, it was a great pick. Spurs just couldn't imagine he would stay in Spain.
He aint never coming to San Antonio. He loves them biddies at Spain.
