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The younger black version of Bonner.
The younger black version of Bonner.
Question: how would Matt Bonner be playing against this type of compe ion in Summer League?
Would he be showing up worse than Tolliver? Matt can stroke it from the arc too and he does hustle. Can Tolliver beat out a player like Bonner who is under contract?
while hes a great offensive player his D is very poor. his chances are slim.
If Pop thinks that Bonner will never be able to be a rotation player, working with another "young" shooting PF is a good idea.
I can see a scenario where Spurs trade Bonner for a swingman like Damien Wilkins, sign Tolliver as a project and Horry as a stop gap.
I agree Bruno they only way I can see Tolliver is if Bonner is moved. Personally I'd like to see Bonner get more of a chance to play but if not then Tolliver could work.
I'm calling an 0fer in his next game. Figures, right?
Well, that would bring his three point shooting percentage this summer back down to earth, and a little closer to his career percentage.
Pop's already apparently written off Bonner as having any prospect of being productive, which in itself makes Tolliver an upgrade at the position.
You never know.
We don't have many choices at this point.
I'm not too high on Tolliver. He's Bonner redux but shorter. He also doesn't have much history of being a deadly shooter. He's been knocking them down in summer league but this is an awfully small sample size.
Tolliver makes sense if Pop has 100% given up on Bonner and the Spurs want a young, cheap shooting big to groom. If that's the case, I guess Tolliver wouldn't be too bad. I'm not sure how he'd improve with the Toros though because the other teams would just guard him at the three-point line since there won't be a TD, Manu or TP to double.
I guess as long as it isn't over Gist and Tolliver is a 14-15th man, it won't hurt too much.
I don't think Tolliver's shooting would improve in Austin nor does it necessarily need to. What he would hopefully develop here would be his defense and maybe some consistency on the boards.
I remember Tolliver as a Bluejay. He more of a true post back then, but couldn't be left alone away from the bucket.
I do remember him being a rather average defender (even by MVC standards), but I haven't seen enough of him in the summer league to prove/disprove that.
Toliver's Profile:
http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/...Tolliver-1279/
Anthony Tolliver had a solid camp overall, showing off some nice passing ability, three-point range, and a well-rounded game with the many things he’s capable of doing. Tolliver shows excellent court awareness for a big man, and he passes well out of both posts. He also has the ability to step out behind the arc, shooting a flat-footed shot with decent form that he scored with a few times. In the post, Tolliver battles hard for position and usually goes up strong, as he drew quite a few fouls here, but while not showing the most advanced array of moves down low.
Defensively, Tolliver has some trouble when drawn out to the perimeter, as he couldn’t quite stick either Ivan Harris or Justin Doellman in this game when he was matched up with them, not being agile enough to risk tightly playing them, which left them open for outside shots. He hustles a lot on the defensive end in the painted area, though, and is able to get some blocks and steals off that more-so than explosiveness or excellent athletic ability, which he lacks. In the post, he’s a pretty good defender when he gets physical, but he doesn’t always do that, which is also a problem with his rebounding. He seems to get most of his rebounds due to his size and being in the right spot as opposed to throwing his weight around and using physicality to pull down boards in the crowd.
Here's his vitals:
Anthony Tolliver 6' 7"
6' 8.5" - with shoes
242 lbs - weight
7' 2.5" - wingspan
8' 11.5" - standing reach
5.7 - body fat
28.5 - no step vertical jump
30.0 - max vertical jump
21 - reps bench press
11.49 - lane agility
3.29 - 3/4 court sprint
Compare that with Gist
James Gist - 6' 7"
6' 8.5"
220
7' 4" - Winspan
8' 11.5"
4.8 - body fat
30.5 - vert
35.0 - max vert
5
11.37
3.14 - 3/4 sprint
Gist definitely more athletic. However, Tolliver definitely isn't that bad athletically if we consider his intangibles (i.e. good court awareness and accurate 3 point shot)
Sign him up!!
Tolliver seems to have improved from last fall when he was in Cavs camp. I said this before in another thread, his personality and off the court demeanor makes me think that he will get a invite to Spurs camp. I don't think they'll give him a contract right after summer league or anything though.
I'd expect both Tolliver and Gist to be in camp and see how it goes.
One last observation...
There were 4 key players that the Spurs didn't play against the Suns.
D.Green
G.Hill
I.Mahinmi
A.Tolliver
Let me guess... did these 4 may the cut?
Last edited by ceperez; 07-19-2008 at 05:49 PM.
I liked what I saw from Tolliver and hope he gets a roster spot along with Gist. The biggest knock on him thus far is his size, but I don’t think he is as small as everyone makes him out to be. Yeah he is 6’7”, but more importantly he has a really good 7’2.5” wingspan and an 8’11.5” standing reach. Matt Bonner by comparison only has an 8’9.5” standing reach.
Maric isn't on the Spurs summer league team. He was cut/left before it started.
I would definitively support Damien Wilkins if that happens...
I think Tolliver will be in the camp and then we'll see what happen
Bonner versus Tolliver
Tale of the tape
6' 8.5" - 6' 7"
6' 10" - 6' 8.5" - with shoes
242 - 242 lbs - weight
6' 8.75" - 7' 2.5" - wingspan
8' 9.5" - 8' 11.5" - standing reach
13.6 - 5.7 - body fat
27.0 - 28.5 - no step vertical jump
32.0 - 30.0 - max vertical jump
20 - 21 - reps bench press
11.52 - 11.49 - lane agility
3.32 - 3.29 - 3/4 court sprint
Okay... equally strong and fast.
Bonner is taller, but Tolliver has a 2" standing reach advantage and a 5" wingspan advantage.
Looks like Tolliver definitely has the edge.
Tolliver's shooting has been spectacular, but as has been mentioned it's a very small sample size. If we have indeed given up on Bonner and plan on finding another young, shooter at PF, I think we would do much better trying to steal Fazekas from the Clippers. He has actually shown something in real NBA minutes and is probably available cheap (although not as cheap as Tolliver, still penny-wise can be pound-foolish.)
Draft express info:
http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Nick-Fazekas-175/
Stats while in the NBA with the clippers
http://www.82games.com/0708/07LAC15A.HTM
Note the EFG% on Jumpers - .409, and the Rebounding Rating - 32.5...
Horry 04/05, EFG% on Jumpers .431, Rebounding Rating 20.7
Horry 05/06 EFG% on Jumpers .471, Rebounding Rating 22.2
Horry 06/07 EFG% on Jumpers .422, rebounding Rating 21.3
Horry's a better shooter, although Fazekas might get more open looks on our team than last years Clippers, and Fazekas is a much better rebounder...
with RC saying that horry won't be back...suddenly tolliver looks like he may make the squad.
My main concern with Tolliver is he doesn't have much of a history of being a three-point shooter. His senior year at Creighton, he shot 20% on threes. Last year in the D-League he shot 36% ... but that was only 50 shots (less than one-fourth of his attempts). Take away his three-point shooting and he's not an NBA player.
Bringing him in to space the floor is a risk because he hasn't proven to be a three-point shooter in any stretch other then during this summer league.
That's what camp will be for. I'd certainly rather take a Brian Skinner at this point, but it will be interesting to see if Tolliver can develop any more of his game.
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