DALLAS MAVERICKS
PG: Jason Terry, Anthony Johnson
SG: Devin Harris, Jerry Stackhouse, Maurice Ager
SF: Josh Howard, Greg Buckner, Devean George
PF: Dirk Nowitzki, Austin Croshere
C: Erick Dampier, DeSagana Diop, DJ Mbenga, Pavel Podkolzine
Props to the Mavs so far this summer. They added guys with a history of being clutch in the playoffs (Johnson, George, Croshere), they upgraded their defensive specialist (Buckner >>> Griffin) and they got rid of duplicate talent (Daniels). On top of that, Ager got some pretty good reviews and might be a player.
I think the Mavs have gotten quite a bit better this summer. Anthony Johnson is a top three backup point guard. Austin Croshere fits in perfectly in their isolation offensive sets. Buckner, unlike Griffin, can actually play in the playoffs because he now can shoot the three. Marquis Daniels is a good player but his skillset didn't really help the Mavs.
Dallas hasn't done anything major but they tweaked their roster and made it even more playoff ready. They've gone about it in a very Spur-esque way instead of your traditional Cuban roster explosion.
SAN ANTONIO SPURS
PG: Tony Parker, Beno Udrih, Jacque Vaughn
SG: Manu Ginobili, Brent Barry
SF: Bruce Bowen, Michael Finley, Eric Williams
PF: Tim Duncan, Robert Horry, Matt Bonner
C: Francisco Elson, Jackie Butler, Fabricio Oberto
The Spurs have had pretty much a par summer. They lost Rasho and Nazr and replaced them with Elson, Butler and Bonner. It's tough to tell whether that threesome will be good enough to make the Spurs forget about their centers from last season.
The additions of Vaughn and Williams are for insurance more than anything. Vaughn is here just in case Beno collapses. Williams is here just in case the Spurs can't trade him before the season starts.
Questions:
1) Have the Mavs clearly surpassed the Spurs with their transactions this summer?
2) Is the Spurs' roster as it stands as good as their roster was at the end of last season?
3) Would you be confident against the Mavs next season if neither team made any more moves? If not, what moves do you think the Spurs need to make?
1) Clearly? I'm not convinced. You can't really say whether or not a team has clearly improved by FA signings until you've seen the new guys play.
2) Given that the moves have gotten rid of two centers who Pop wouldn't play, I'd say the Spurs are still where they were last year just with a smaller payroll.
3) I would still be plenty confident, but I'd be even more confident if the Spurs can get themselves a young wing.
Should be a of a rivalry this year.
1. Yes
2. No
3. Reggie Evans.
Where's my prize?
1) The Mavs surpassed the Spurs by beating them last year. They may be neck-and-neck with a healthy Spurs team. A big 'if' with a long summer for three starters.
2) The Spurs' roster is probably as good as it was last year. We have more 'versatility', the catch word of the summer, but it comes from a handful of sub-par players. Josh Howard by himself equals Elson, Bonner, and at this point Butler. Williams I don't expect will be on the team.
3) I wouldn't be confident if either team stays pat. The Spurs need a good, agile, young backup swingman. It doesn't have to be the long-term answer, but we need someone. Rebounding is still a huge problem.
1) Have the Mavs clearly surpassed the Spurs with their transactions this summer?
Yes, Mavs made some minor, but good changes this offseason to counter the Spurs. Buckner is a vast improvement over Griffin and will be able to help defend Ginobili/Barry, etc. Not to mention he's a three point shooter which they needed last season, but couldn't find thanks to the disappearance of KVH. Same for Devean George, who always seems to do well against the Spurs. He's also not a bad defender to have coming off your bench.
Spurs on the other hand, while they definitely got rid of bench wasters Rasho and Nazr, may have shot themselves in the foot. Where's the rebounding? Where's the interior defense? Elson/Oberto/Butler are not going to give you much in those areas next season...at least any more so than Rasho/Nazr, imo. Also, I'm doubtful as to how much of a help they'll be in guarding Dirk next season, should the Spurs and Mavs meet up again. Finally, I'd feel more comfortable with Rasho guarding the Shaq and Yao's of the league, than the current combo.
I give Dallas the edge here.
2) Is the Spurs' roster as it stands as good as their roster was at the end of last season?
I'd say so. Considering the fact that Rasho/Nazr were hardly used in the Dallas series and NVE never showed up, the new roster is comparable to the old one.
3) Would you be confident against the Mavs next season if neither team made any more moves? If not, what moves do you think the Spurs need to make?
I'd have to wait until the season started and saw how Butler/Elson fared with the Spurs before I feel comfortable answering this.
3. The Spurs bench is old. I'd like to move someone to get younger on the wing.
If Butler starts, the Spurs bench will consistent of 7 guys between 30-36 plus Beno and Bonner.
Nice "Current State" LJ. Dallas has done a great job of re-signing key players too! That was not "a given".
1) NO. Ager/Johnson/Buckner/George are nice players but as far as I know you play BB with 5 players at the same time. They won't have a lot of playtime at PG/SG/SF behind Harris/Terry/Stackhouse/Howard. Croshere isn't an upgrade over KVH.
2) YES. Spurs roster is better than last year agaisnt Mavs. We haven't lost a player who have contributed against Dallas and we have got some players who can maybe contribute.
3) NO. Both teams are very close, Spurs really need a SF/PF.
After reading timvp's take, I've just gotten off the phone with the Spurs, asking that they refund the money I've paid for my season tickets.
@ FWD
1) yes
2) No
3) I'll be nervous
1. have they gotten better players? yeah, depending on if this butler guy is as great as people seem to thing. but we were pretty close last year with what we had and the core's of both teams haven't changed that much. i think we're still pretty even.
2. yes. nazr was a constant disappointment throughout the season, rasho for much of his tenure, nve in the playoffs. at the very least we're equal right now.
3. confident, probably not. surprised that we beat them? not at all. we're neck and neck, and if duncan goes off on them like he did last year and manu does his thing without fouling, we don't even have this discussion.
Where's my take? I just threw the pitch.After reading timvp's take, I've just gotten off the phone with the Spurs, asking that they refund the money I've paid for my season tickets.
I don't get this argument and a lot of people seem to have it.2) Is the Spurs' roster as it stands as good as their roster was at the end of last season?
I'd say so. Considering the fact that Rasho/Nazr were hardly used in the Dallas series and NVE never showed up, the new roster is comparable to the old one.
Just because Rasho/Nazr weren't useful against Dallas doesn't mean they weren't useful all last season for the Spurs. So, IMO, we can't just say ... yeah the team is equal because we didn't use Rasho/Nazr anyway. We did use them -- in 82 games during the season that got us to the playoffs.
So I will have reserve judgement on whether the team is as good as last year until I see Elson/Butler on the court. For all we know at this point, they could be a big upgrade (or downgrade) from Nazr/Rasho. Or they could be relatively equal. The Spurs have to win all season long -- not just against the Mavs.
Current state?
Dallas > San Antonio
Nothing else to really say or talk about.
Im waiting till training camp to answer.
Im sure RC and pop are burning up the phone lines trying to package Barry and Williams for something.
Way to go out on a limb about the current state of this intrastate battle.
Spurs are like the Cowboys. they dont spend a lot of money and actually go further then there rivals and win the right way.
Mavs are like the Redskins. they use signing bonuses and get a lot of players but always underachieve.
Redskins/Mavs finally got past their rival. now will it be a fluke or are they actually turning the corner?
I have too this argument.
I don't care how good will be Spurs next year in regular season, it's all about the playoff and matchups : Spurs can be worse against Atlanta if they are better against Dallas.
But if we met Houston with an healthy TMac and Yao, we will badly miss Rasho.
God, how come you spell your name with a zero?
The Spurs need proven bigs to get a ship next year.
because somebody already took my name, pretending to be me
Way to go out on a limb about the current state of this intrastate battle
Alright.
The Mavs are still better right now.
Adding Croshure is a sideways move to Van Horn.
Johnson is a solid backup for when Devin Harris dissapears ala games 5 6 and 7.
Devean George will help more than Spurs fans would like to let on.
George and Johnson make them more solid, and a better team than last year.
Spurs?
Its too much of an unknown of what they have gotten, and what they might get to say if they are better.
If Butler comes in, is agressive, rebounds the ball, and does what is asked.
Then they become better.
1. Yes
2. No, no way. Look at the centers. There's a reasonable chance that, without improving a lick, last year's third-string center may end up this year's starter.
3. There is still one big intangible here. Mavs had a career season with Dirk having a career year . . . and still didn't win it. So you have to figure they have to play even better than they did last year. Can they do that, or will Terry become complacent and Dirk be listening to the whispers about his Finals performance? Spurs, on the other hand, had a record setting regular season with only Tony Parker having his best year. Parker figures to continue to improve, Manu and Tim can't have worst years than last. Oh, yeah, and the Spurs' core has already proven it knows how to win it all.
In the playoffs you go seven, maybe eight deep. Which player/s has Dallas added that will be in that top seven/eight? I don't think they've added a player that will see a lot of playing time in the playoffs unless one of their mainstays is injured.
Mavs have more depth to sustain an injury but for the Spurs to be even or better they need to improve their top seven/eight? Have they? Depends on whether Butler and/or Elson can do more than Nazr, Horry and/or Rasho or if some perimeter player, here or to be added, can do more than Van Exel and/or Barry. I find it hard to believe and will be disappointed if Pop and Buford don't have another move in them.
People need to stop forgetting the Suns a team who will be better then the Mavs and could very much be better then the Spurs if Amare is anywhere near the 04-05 player. They can win the west next year and they have what it takes to do it.
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