Possible Nº1 without Home Court advantage?

[beck253]

I have read the guidelines at NBA.com and i think i am following them... if I am doing something wrong, please correct me...

Let's say that each of the four teams that have 25 losses, lose one more game and they finish all tied at 56-26 (perfectly possible); and let's say Lakers beat Spurs and Dallas beats NO in this scenario.

First, as by the guidelines, the division winners must be called and those ties broken: Lakers, Utah are clear.

And the Southwest goes to New Orleans over San Antonio and Houston (they are all 6-6 in games between them, but NO and SA would have 10-6 in Southwest games and HOU only 8-8; they remain tied and NO would beat SA 34-18 to 33-19 in Conference Games)

Then the team with the best record among the rest must be decided to complete the top 1-4: SA and HOU tie again at 56-26 and SA wins because of Southwest games.

So the top 1-4 must be placed, Utah is 4th and NO, LAL and SAS tied over 1-3 spots.

They are tied again at 6-6 between them. As the Div games not apply here, they go directly to Conference records where LAL 36 wins over NO 34 and SAS 33

So the finish would be exactly like this night standings:
1) LAL
2) NO
3) SAS
4) UTA
5) HOU

But then, and this is when it gets interesting, it says everywhere that playoff position doesn't award Home Court adavantage, records comparison and head to head ties does...

So let's say LAL (1st) wins with HCA and HOU (5th) wins with HCA over Utah (4th).. in the 2nd Round LAL vs HOU, tied in record, but HOU is 2-1 over LAL head to head... so HOUSTON, the number 5, would be the only one team that would have HCA against number 1 team in the conference

Obviously, if this steps are not wrong at some point, it would the first time in history to hapen, statistically unlikely to happen again and uber-embarrasing to the NBA as the ultimate proof that their seeding system is pure trash...

Again, please point to me if there is a different text for tie-breaks guidelines...

[DAF86]

I have read the guidelines at NBA.com and i think i am following them... if I am doing something wrong, please correct me...

Let's say that each of the four teams that have 25 losses, lose one more game and they finish all tied at 56-26 (perfectly possible); and let's say Lakers beat Spurs and Dallas beats NO in this scenario.

First, as by the guidelines, the division winners must be called and those ties broken: Lakers, Utah are clear.

And the Southwest goes to New Orleans over San Antonio and Houston (they are all 6-6 in games between them, but NO and SA would have 10-6 in Southwest games and HOU only 8-8; they remain tied and NO would beat SA 34-18 to 33-19 in Conference Games)

Then the team with the best record among the rest must be decided to complete the top 1-4: SA and HOU tie again at 56-26 and SA wins because of Southwest games.

So the top 1-4 must be placed, Utah is 4th and NO, LAL and SAS tied over 1-3 spots.

They are tied again at 6-6 between them. As the Div games not apply here, they go directly to Conference records where LAL 36 wins over NO 34 and SAS 33

So the finish would be exactly like this night standings:
1) LAL
2) NO
3) SAS
4) UTA
5) HOU

But then, and this is when it gets interesting, it says everywhere that playoff position doesn't award Home Court adavantage, records comparison and head to head ties does...

So let's say LAL (1st) wins with HCA and HOU (5th) wins with HCA over Utah (4th).. in the 2nd Round LAL vs HOU, tied in record, but HOU is 2-1 over LAL head to head... so HOUSTON, the number 5, would be the only one team that would have HCA against number 1 team in the conference

Obviously, if this steps are not wrong at some point, it would the first time in history, statiscally unlikely to happen again and uber-embarrasing to the NBA as the ultimate proof that their seeding system is pure trash...

Again, please point to me if there is a different text for guidelines...

Is this possible? if it is, it's insane!

[m33p0]

[honestfool84]

my head hurts.

[timaios]

Playoff Tie-Break Procedures

http://www.nba.com/statistics/playoff_picture.html#tbb

[beck253]

that's the one I read

[TampaDude]

I have read the guidelines at NBA.com and i think i am following them... if I am doing something wrong, please correct me...

Let's say that each of the four teams that have 25 losses, lose one more game and they finish all tied at 56-26 (perfectly possible); and let's say Lakers beat Spurs and Dallas beats NO in this scenario.

First, as by the guidelines, the division winners must be called and those ties broken: Lakers, Utah are clear.

And the Southwest goes to New Orleans over San Antonio and Houston (they are all 6-6 in games between them, but NO and SA would have 10-6 in Southwest games and HOU only 8-8; they remain tied and NO would beat SA 34-18 to 33-19 in Conference Games)

Then the team with the best record among the rest must be decided to complete the top 1-4: SA and HOU tie again at 56-26 and SA wins because of Southwest games.

So the top 1-4 must be placed, Utah is 4th and NO, LAL and SAS tied over 1-3 spots.

They are tied again at 6-6 between them. As the Div games not apply here, they go directly to Conference records where LAL 36 wins over NO 34 and SAS 33

So the finish would be exactly like this night standings:
1) LAL
2) NO
3) SAS
4) UTA
5) HOU

But then, and this is when it gets interesting, it says everywhere that playoff position doesn't award Home Court adavantage, records comparison and head to head ties does...

So let's say LAL (1st) wins with HCA and HOU (5th) wins with HCA over Utah (4th).. in the 2nd Round LAL vs HOU, tied in record, but HOU is 2-1 over LAL head to head... so HOUSTON, the number 5, would be the only one team that would have HCA against number 1 team in the conference

Obviously, if this steps are not wrong at some point, it would the first time in history to hapen, statistically unlikely to happen again and uber-embarrasing to the NBA as the ultimate proof that their seeding system is pure trash...

Again, please point to me if there is a different text for tie-breaks guidelines...

I think Houston would actually be the #1 seed in your scenario, not #5.

[beck253]

HOU at Nº1 would be the case applying directly the head to head between the 4 teams, but the NBA.com guidelines specifically says the Division winners must be appointed first.

And if we go by head to head directly, we would be contradicting a rule by sending a Division winner or SA (the "other" team with the best record), who should form the top 1-4, to descend to Nº5...

[TampaDude]

HOU at Nº1 would be the case applying directly the head to head between the 4 teams, but the NBA.com guidelines specifically says the Division winners must be appointed first.

And if we go by head to head directly, we would be contradicting a rule by sending a Division winner or SA (the "other" team with the best record), who should form the top 1-4, to descend to Nº5...

[DAF86]

We need somebody to clarify this.

[travis2]

I don't think the tiebreak criteria are RE-applied once the seedings are set. If two (or more) teams had to go through the tiebreak to determine seedings, then that's also HCA.

[Obstructed_View]

What I don't understand is how San Antonio and New Orleans can be in the top three if they are in the same division. I thought Utah was supposed to be second and SA was supposed to be fourth.

[travis2]

What I don't understand is how San Antonio and New Orleans can be in the top three if they are in the same division. I thought Utah was supposed to be second and SA was supposed to be fourth.

Division winners + best non-winner get top 4. Any order.

Plus, there's no way Utah gets the 2 seed. Not with 27 losses.

[Obstructed_View]

Division winners + best non-winner get top 4. Any order.

Plus, there's no way Utah gets the 2 seed. Not with 27 losses.

Ah, that's right. The division winner can't be any lower than fourth. I brainfarted on that. Thank you. It's been annoying me lately.

And actually, I meant Utah should be third, but for some reason typed second.

[beck253]

I don't think the tiebreak criteria are RE-applied once the seedings are set. If two (or more) teams had to go through the tiebreak to determine seedings, then that's also HCA.

Travis, the thing is the tie break that puts Lakers at 1 and Houston at 5 is a "Multiple Team" one and Houston is not even in it because they had been removed out of the equation due to being 3rd in Southwest division.

But the HOU-LAL one is a different, two team tie break, and in that, HOU is definetely over LAL...

[DAF86]

I don't think the tiebreak criteria are RE-applied once the seedings are set. If two (or more) teams had to go through the tiebreak to determine seedings, then that's also HCA.

I don't know about that, let's say that Utah ends up 4th with a 56/26 record and Phoenix ends up 6th with a 57/25 record, if they meet in the WCF phoenix'll have HCA so why should the thing be different in that other case?

[manufor3]

my head hurts.

beat me to it.

[travis2]

I don't know about that, let's say that Utah ends up 4th with a 56/26 record and Phoenix ends up 6th with a 57/25 record, if they meet in the WCF phoenix'll have HCA so why should the thing be different in that other case?

that's not a tiebreak...Phoenix has the better record outright.

[travis2]

Travis, the thing is the tie break that puts Lakers at 1 and Houston at 5 is a "Multiple Team" one and Houston is not even in it because they had been removed out of the equation due to being 3rd in Southwest division.

But the HOU-LAL one is a different, two team tie break, and in that, HOU is definetely over LAL...

Your question is a valid one. All I'm saying is that I don't think the tie-breakers are applied more than once. But an official ruling would be nice.

[WalterBenitez]

Interesting, I thought Maths were comlicated