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I'm ed in all ways in that program anyway so it.
My car isnt eligible cause I was smart enough to buy a fuel efficient vehicle.
My truck is too old, cause they pick some number out of the air of 25 years for age. em.
I know you guys know everything. I know you guys have it all figured out so this is for the 3 or 4 people on the board that were unsure exactly whats going on here. Basically its a free pass for a dealership to misuse your voucher at your expense. I'm sure you've seen the adverts on TV...goes something like this.
New Something Something
23,000
-1000.00 dealer discount
-4500.00 Cash for Clunkers voucher
------------------
17,500.00
Lets forget about the fact that it has to be drivable so its already worth the rebate of 3,500 and probably the addition 1k too. Since the vehicle isn't going to be resold its not considered equity for the deal structure. Just for the sake of the argument.
A decent deal. Not a great one but a decent deal would be somewhere around 20% off of list (not counting fees).
So your 23,000 dollar vehicle should be priced around 18,400 to begin with. Then your voucher on top of the deal. There not doing it that way. Instead the voucher is basically being used as a giant down payment to overcome the advance for lending so the dealership doesn't have to lower its price to achieve the parameters needed for financing. Your voucher is covering the difference that would have otherwise been discounted by the dealer. You see no dealership could get a deal done with just a 1k discount and no money down. The advance is too high and the bank would simply come back and ask for either a down payment or for the dealership to lower their price.
Now usually a salesperson, sales manager or GM would come down to a reasonable figure right off the bat to earn your business with minimal down. Say 20% discount like I mentioned above. With Cash for Clunkers they make it seem like they came down on the price when all they did was apply your voucher to the bottom line to get it through financing with less issues.
Most people are simply satisfied with the good bottom line not realizing that the dealership just sold you a vehicle at near list price and used your voucher to make up the difference.
It should be a real savings not a voucher in sheeps clothing. This should be an incentive for you to purchase a vehicle not act as compensation for the lack of a profit margin had they cut you a legitimate deal.
23,000
-4600.00 Rebate and/or dealer discount
-3,500-4k voucher
---------------------------
14,900-13,900
Good luck getting your voucher applied properly or how it was intended to be applied. You got a program that was designed to put better more fuel efficient vehicles on the road with a huge financial incentive for you to ACT NOW. What you really ended up with is a program that saved you little to nothing but gave a steroid shot in the bottom line of dealership profits.
I heard (not confirmed) of one dealership up north doing things the right way. Again no confirmation on that.
Moral of the Story: Always keep a bottle of lube in the glove box of your clunker.
The End.
I'm ed in all ways in that program anyway so it.
My car isnt eligible cause I was smart enough to buy a fuel efficient vehicle.
My truck is too old, cause they pick some number out of the air of 25 years for age. em.
I'll buy B2B's story but I'm not looking to buy a car right now.
wait wait are you saying our government teamed up with the with the big auto makers and banks is just messing with us...to get inside the wallet of john q public?
you don't say!
Look familiar?wait wait are you saying our government teamed up with the with the big auto makers and banks is just messing with us...to get inside the wallet of john q public?
you don't say!
I know you guys know everything. I know you guys have it all figured out so this is for the 3 or 4 people on the board that were unsure exactly whats going on here.
i'd love to see a youtube clip of you working over a car salesman about this.
it was a sad day, personally, whenever i heard the words "government money" in a chevy advertisement on tv. the word "government" in a supposed capitalist country. yet the idiots are still defending it. stupid. stupid.
Sad to say but most car salesmen don't even understand how they're getting over. They're just following orders.
53% of america is doing that.
The rest are just taking orders.
Cut your deal "no trade in"...get the best price you can get and then drop the clunker on them...
That's pretty much how I'd approach it. Doesn't mean it will work though. All the dealer has to say is that he's not interested in doing business with that deal structure unless its without a trade.
...but yeah that's about all you can do to protect your money and your voucher.
I always get my quotes in writing. If they tried to crab on me after I decided to add the clunker into the deal I would be ALL over their ass.
You realize that they only have to crush the engine/transmission? If you trade in a basically clean car the dealership not only gets the 4500 but they get the salvage on the body.
i don't know about all that, but i heard the best thing you can do is pay with cash and let them know upfront that your paying with cash.
B2B in 1...2....3.....
doesn't whatever you pay down go straight in the salesman's pockets? up to a certain amount?
I thought they could resell the engine and tranny but had to crush the body? Regardless its ed.
They should have allowed the incentive (if desired) to be recuperated with your tax return at the end of the year. That would have made this a lot better. even just a regular old mail in rebate would have been better. To have this plan designed around releasing the voucher to the dealer is ed. Put the money in the hands of the people already!
Its what I would do if I were you.
i'm just kidding man.
pending any scractchoff luck, i'm in no position to pay cash for anything other than an o z.
i'd definitely take b2b's advice on these matters.
I guess your just captain save a ignorant person huh.
now that's interesting.
Whats your source on this? and don't say something like my awesomeness
I said what I said because there is always some know-it-all asshole on here that condescending chimes in with how much he already knows and doesn't need anyone's help. We get it. You think you got it all figured it. That's why this thread specifically wasn't for you. Its for the one or two "ignorant person" who didn't know.
Speaking of "ignorant person" hopefully CC can answer your question for you.
well what about the assholes who think they know it all and make threads...
don't they get no love
CC told me once "i don't know a lot about anything but a little of everything"...or something like that
I read the bill because I was considering trading up on a couple of work trucks. In case you don't believe me here's an article.
Auto recyclers leery of cash for clunkers
By CATHERINE TSAI (AP) – 2 hours ago
DENVER — Not all auto recyclers are relishing the government's new cash for clunkers program, which requires car dealers to destroy the gas-guzzlers they get as trade-ins from new car buyers.
Used engines and drive trains are a big part of recyclers' income from each scrapped car, and under the federal program those engines must be destroyed. The idea is to promote fuel efficiency and help automakers, but it comes at a time when more than a dozen U.S. auto parts suppliers have filed for bankruptcy this year.
"Why throw away good parts when the supply chain is in jeopardy? It doesn't make a whole lot of sense," said Michael Wilson, executive vice president of the Automotive Recyclers Association based in Manassas, Va.
Engines and drive trains account for 60 percent of recyclers' revenue from a used vehicle, Wilson said.
Under cash for clunkers, the government is advising car dealers to replace a trade-in's engine oil with a sodium silicate solution and run the engine to ruin it before giving or selling the car to a scrap dealer.
The Automotive Recyclers Association says that can damage otherwise sellable parts like pistons — and mean smaller profits for scrap yards, considering it can cost $700 to $1,200 to process a car, including transport and removing toxic items like mercury, Wilson said. Recyclers' profits vary but can reach several hundred dollars for a 6-year-old car.
"I haven't decided that I want the cars," said George Clark of Western Auto Recycling in Denver. Still, he said, he might make money crushing clunkers if he doesn't have to buy them from dealers.
The cash for clunkers program took effect July 1, and rules were published Friday. It offers drivers who trade in qualifying vehicles up to a $4,500 credit toward a new, more fuel-efficient car from participating dealers. The government reimburses dealers.
The Colorado Automobile Dealers Association estimates the $1 billion program could boost sales 10 percent or so for its roughly 260 dealers before it ends Nov. 1 — earlier if the federal money runs out. In April, the market research firm Auto Outlook Inc. estimated Colorado would have 108,510 new retail light-vehicle registrations in 2009.
Nationwide, an estimated 250,000 people could get credits, helping to spur sales at a time when industry sales are down 35 percent.
Some recyclers say cash for clunkers will hurt lower-income buyers who can't afford a new car, even with the federal credit. They also claim that destroying vehicles will increase prices for spare parts that lower-income customers depend on to keep their cars running.
"Now you're removing cars people could afford, and they're not available anymore," said Norm Wright, CEO of Stadium Auto and Truck Parts Inc., a Denver recycler. "There will be less cars to pull from, so the price of parts will go up."
At his warehouse next to Interstate 25, used transmissions fill shelves stacked almost as high as the 24-foot ceiling. Outside, rows of salvaged car doors hang from racks. Chrysler PT Cruisers, soon to be discontinued, are being stockpiled so parts are available for years to come.
Despite their misgivings, some auto recyclers are urging dealers to send the trade-ins to them instead of to auctioneers who could serve as middlemen for scrap yards. Recyclers and salvage auctions both have to certify they will follow rules for disposing of clunkers.
Yeah i'm sure some clunkers won't find their way back on the street
"H.R.2751 section (2)(c)(2)(B) permits the "selling of any parts of the disposed vehicle other than the engine block and drive train" and "retaining the proceeds from such sale".
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