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He's baaaaaaaack!
I've been saying for years that Bowen is probably the worst starting small forward in the NBA. I gave you people a pass a couple seasons ago, when he could at least slow down top scorers and hit 3s with efficiency.
Now Bowen gives up at least 20 to whoever he is guarding, doesn't hit many 3s and still can't hit 2s or FTs.
He hasn't contained Kobe in years. We don't need him to now without Shaq there.
Can the Bowen supporters please show me the value in Bruce Bowen?
It's getting near impossible to justify him.
He's baaaaaaaack!
Seriously, I mean... even the ardent homer can't justify Bowen getting signifigant minutes, let alone starting for us.
Bowen gets scored on by everyone these days.
I think this could be his last year as a spur
especially if the new d rules hurt him
would you keep bowen over rose if holt is to cheap to keep both?
I think they are waiting to see if LJ III can fill the role, they will keep bowen to teach him the game. Moreover LJIII will have a better time defending on long 3
With Bowen in the game:
Stojakovic: 3-9
Bryant: 4-11
Allen: 6-11
If Bowen continues to have games like last night, I'd agree with you... but even at 3 games into the season, I don't think there's anything to panic about.
Now Bowen gives up at least 20 to whoever he is guarding, doesn't hit many 3s and still can't hit 2s or FTs.
GW, if this statement of yours holds true, then rest assured, he won't be starting for long....he is still one of the defensive leaders of this ball club, and i'll give him more than 3 games to see if he's lost it or not....
1st Team ALL-NBA D Team and finalist for DPOY.
Whatever you say Casper, whatever you say
Ray Allen had a good game on him. But that's it. Peja and Kobe shot like crap against him. Bowen never hits 3's in Oct/Nov -- I've been telling everyone that for the last 3 years.Now Bowen gives up at least 20 to whoever he is guarding, doesn't hit many 3s and still can't hit 2s or FTs.
One thing you are right about is that he has to stop trying his "in between" game. It isn't working.
And for the record, (I don't know if you saw the game last night) but Ray Allen got hot when he was being guarded by Devin Brown.
I'm glad it takes one ty game by the Spurs to bring you out of the woodwork though. Spurs sucked last night -- everyone but Manu. People are praising Tony because he had 21/6 -- but 21 points on 23 shots isn't exactly efficient. They sucked as a team -- rebounding, defense, scoring -- and most importantly aggression.
Hopefully Pop's "soft" and "arrogant" comments will light a fire under them.
The situation is more complex than simply believing that Bowen doesn't deserve to start or play significant minutes.
He hasn't been awesome so far this season, but he hasn't regressed much from past seasons. He's still essentially the same player he was two years ago. He played Peja pretty well and did a solid job against Kobe. It's not fair to evaluate his value to the team after three games, especially when he's been doing what's expected of him for the most part.
You have to consider the team's needs and the players available to fill those needs. What's the alternative to having Bowen play big minutes? None of the alternatives are really very good.
You could have Brown play extended minutes instead. But I'm sticking to my claim from preseason: his needs to improve on the defensive end. Watching last night's game hammered that point home for me. If Brown plays big minutes, you either need to trust him to guard Kobe, Ray, Tracy, Lebron, and Peja or have Manu guard those players for extended stretches. I'm not ready to let Brown guard all of the toughest swing men. I think it's bad for Manu, too. Manu expends so much energy out there. It's quite possible that an increased workload for Manu on the defensive end could affect his offense. The Spurs don't need a worn down Manu. And that doesn't even take into consideration the fact that Manu would have to stop gambling on defense if he was even to get the job done anyway.
Another alternative is to give Barry big minutes. I think we can both agree that it's unrealistic to expect an (almost) 33 year old Barry to play 36 minutes a game and guard the game's top swingmen part of the time. He's not the best defender anyway, and the Spurs need to limit him to under 30 minutes if they hope to keep him fresh for the playoffs. And if you take him off the second unit, the bench will really lack offensive punch.
The Third might help when he gets back, but we can't really know what he'll provide. He's still very raw, and his offensive game isn't much better than Bowen's if it's any better at all.
And it's unfair to blame the Spurs for failing to come up with a solution over the summer. They used most of their cap space to resign Manu. They used the remainder to address their biggest weakness in the playoffs last season: perimeter shooting. They really needed a shooter like Barry and they got him. With all of the money being given to Parker, Barry, and Manu recently, it's unfair to criticize the Spurs for not improving at small forward. Who could they have brought in instead of Bowen? There really weren't any better answers.
Bowen isn't going to conjure up images of swan lake on the offensive end, but I'm willing to give him some time to see if he'll be able to shoot the three ball consistently. We're only three games into the season.
And with most teams having at least one talented swing player, it's good to have a player like Bowen around. Perhaps Brown should get some more minutes and The Third should get some time when he's healthy. But there aren't any better options right now. You can't have great players at every position. And having an all-NBA first-teamer at small forward is a good thing. Unless you want to see Brown guarding Kobe, Barry playing too many minutes, or Manu getting worn down, you'll have to live with Bowen playing significant minutes.
Give him some time. His defense hasn't regressed.
Ghost, I'm on record saying that Devin Brown is going to start sooner or later.
The thing that is killing Bruce is he's trying to be an "all-around" player. His new thing is to pump fake that three and then drive to about ten feet away from the basket. That move is successful about 10% of the time ... yet he does it over and over again in game.
He just needs to go back to basics. Either shoot that corner three or pass the ball. He's trying to be an All World player instead of a defensive stopper. Pop needs to forbid him from ever dribbling the ball to get him back to how he was playing in 2003.
Another bad sign I saw against the Sonics is Seattle used the same plays the Lakers did to free up Kobe against Bruce ... and it worked for Ray Allen. They set a pick away from the ball (they used Fortson and Jerome James) and Bowen can't fight thru it fast enough. That allowed Allen to get some easy shots early and often.
Brown is never going to start playing that kind of D.
Who can fight through a Fortson/James pick?
Last night Pop messed up on the subs utions too. He left Bowen in when Ray was on the bench (and Bowen picked up his second foul) then he sat Bowen when Ray was getting hot.
Oh well, it's one night.
Brown does a much better job of fighting thru the picks. Bowen does the best job of anyone on the planet in playing one-on-one defense.
The problem is if the whole league starts using that "Kobe Play" that killed Bowen in the playoffs. The Sonics ran the same plays last night.
Hopefully that will not become a trend.
But that same type of play killed Devin too.
Why isn't anyone expressing their dismay concering Lewis killing Manu/Barry? Or our front court being owned by the Sonics front court?
It was a bad night and out of the ordinary.
Move on.
And Brown got lit up one on one.
And was afraid to drive the lane.
Pick your poison, they were equally ineffective.That is pure physics--the guy is half a foot taller than anyone guarding him, as was Radman.Why isn't anyone expressing their dismay concering Lewis killing Manu/Barry?
I said in another thread to waive Wilks and get someone to play Lint's role til he heals up -- there are many out there. Doesn't have to be a stopper, just someone who can actually contest a shot from one of these tall forwards out on the perimeter.
Yes, I agree with that. There's no point of Wilks.I said in another thread to waive Wilks and get someone to play Lint's role til he heals up -- there are many out there. Doesn't have to be a stopper, just someone who can actually contest a shot from one of these tall forwards out on the perimeter.
I wonder how much longer Linton is out.
I don't think he'll ever get his subsitution down, that's my biggest problem with POP. He sucks at his rotation, always has, always will.
But other than that, IT'S on THE F'ing third game. You guys are unbelivable.
I've been saying this since the begning. we still need another atheltic three, even after LJIII comes back.
I've watched all the Spurs games so far this season and portions of just about every game so far. NBA League Pass is tremendous.
I didn't get a chance to post over the weekend, as I was thuggin' and buggin' FRI-SUN.
I did catch the Lakers game SAT night while enjoying Effin Black Cherry Vodka and Diet Cokje. Don't knock it until you try it.
Anyway... my problem with Bowen is that at the end of the day, the Pejas and the Allens and the Kobes still wind up with 20-30 points.
Bowen? 5-10 points.
I noticed that new move Bruce is trying, too, timvp. It's akin to Malik Rose still shooting jumpshots. Good idea, but bad result.
I am hopeful for your boy Devin Brown. I see he is trying to add a 3-point shot, which I had said last year was my big knock on him.
If I had to give Bowen one compliment, it would be that he has mental toughness and plays with heart.
I still think his skill set is vastly limited.
Eddie Robinson anyone?
Bold.
ERob will never come here.
And he sucks.
Again, Bruce's impact goes beyond mere boxscores. Ever notice Kobe focuses on his matchup with Bowen to the exclusion of all else? Completely ignoring his role as facilitator of the offense.
My point is get something that works consistently better if you plan on kicking him to the curb.
Erob and Devin don't come close.
Ghost Writer is baaaaaack.
I talked to him in preseason and he said that he's confident in the 3-pointer now. He said he's going to take a lot of them and make a lot of them this season. The problem for Devin is going to be playing time.I am hopeful for your boy Devin Brown. I see he is trying to add a 3-point shot, which I had said last year was my big knock on him.
Chump, your point was lost in another so-so offseason, unless you can envision Barry starting at the 3.
Eddie Robinson was a suggetsion more for my own amusement. We know the Spurs refrain from bringing in and/or retaining young, black street player with at ude.
Why would we need any of that when we got a bunch of foreigners or shook players?
Back to the topic at hand... anyone else wish the Spurs got a little younger or more athletic in the offseason?
At least Bowen has b@lls. I'll give him that much.
Rasho starts for the Spurs.
Boy, I am digressing.
You think that Memphis would deal us one of their 9 billion talented swingmen after their horrible start?
I like Barry off the bench. The only real weakness on the Spurs is at SF. It's like a vacuum of talent there.
Is Deven Brown big enough to play/guard at the SF?
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