I told ya that this topic would come back and haunt W. again...
N.Y. Daily NewsNew holes in Bush military record
BY THOMAS M. DeFRANK, JAMES GORDON MEEK and CORKY SIEMASZKO
DAILY NEWS STAFF WRITERS
In 1968, Papa Bush pinned lieutenant bars on his son, who suited up to fly for the Air National Guard
The Bush campaign was rocked yesterday by allegations that the Top Gun President was a substandard pilot who disobeyed a direct order while serving in the Texas Air National Guard.
President Bush's commanding officer complained of being pressured to "sugarcoat" Bush's review despite his "failure to perform" to Guard standards and that Bush "made no attempt" to maintain his flight status.
<snip>
Also,
ABC NewsThe ABCNote asks re Bush AWOL:
Did Lt. Col. Killian really backdate a report at the request or behest of superior officers? Was this not illegal?
Did Bush himself talk "to someone upstairs" to grease his own path?
Did Bush really ask to get out of the National Guard drill?
Does he remember doing that today?
Were such requests made regularly by members of the Guard?
Did General Walter Staudt, Bush's political patron in the Guard, decide on his own to persuade his commanders to be favorably disposed toward Bush?
Or was he pressured by outside forces?
Why was a flight review board not appointed in August of 1972 pursuant to Killian's orders?
How, if Killian said that Bush lost his flight status because of performance, can one account for the glowing performance reviews Bush got that same month?
Why did Mr. Bush not attend his physical as ordered in May of 1972? Was it because he didn't have to as he already knew he wouldn't fly, or perhaps that he did attend — and something came up? Did he ever get a physical in Alabama? Houston? Why has the White House changed its spin on this?
Was Bush a good pilot? A bad pilot? (Or, as the White House asserts, a pilot who crossed the thresholds he needed to cross?)
With all these problems, why was Bush's transfer request to the 187th TAC Recon group approved in September of 1972?
Was it the result of his conversations with Killian? Because of Staudt's influence? Or simply par the course for back then? What other do ents will come to light?
(The Air Force acknowledges that the state of record-keeping back then ensures that new ones will be found on a regular basis in different boxes in different warehouses. White House says they are trying to get all of his records released but have not gotton around to signing form that OK's the release of all records. )
ABC's Terry Moran's report today: Lt. Col. Jerry Killian wrote in one memo that "I'll back-date, but won't rate," a statement that "raises the possibility that Bush's military records were falsified."
As a really great President said: "There you go again".
How many times you and the Dem-o-craps going to rack
over this story. It didn't stick the first time, not going to
this time. You got an idiot for a candidate who can't keep
his stories straight, just face it. Like old Clint said: "He is
a legend in his own mind".
So we've now discovered that neither a 20-something Bush nor a 20-something Kerry would make good Presidents.
Election Years rule.
Of course, the Demos will throw everything at Bush, again and again and again. The worst thing that can be said about Bush's national guard service is that he got in due to his dad's connections and he missed an annual physical (which apparently was not enough to keep him from receiving an honorable discharge).
Bush's national guard service is a mirage for looney Demo partisans like Nbadan.
And for the record, Kerry and the Demos started questioning Bush's service long before the Swift Vets showed up. It started in 1994 with Ma Richards, again in 2000, again earlier this year, and then now we have that great objective journalist Dan Rather, the pro-Kerry Boston Globe & NY Times, Kerry fundraiser Ben Barnes, etc...
The longer the media wants to chase after this non-story the better for Bush. Given that most people seem to think Bush was a weekend warrior during all of his guard years the fact that he did train full time on a dangerous aircraft might actually help him a little.
Thinking that because the Swift Vets hurt Kerry that the resurrection of Bush's national guard service will hurt Bush is pretty dumb.
Again, for the record...
www.hillnews.com/york/090904.aspx
Bush’s National Guard years
Before you fall for Dems’ spin, here are the facts
By Byron York
What do you really know about George W. Bush’s time in the Air National Guard?
That he didn’t show up for duty in Alabama? That he missed a physical? That his daddy got him in?
News coverage of the president’s years in the Guard has tended to focus on one brief portion of that time — to the exclusion of virtually everything else. So just for the record, here, in full, is what Bush did:
The future president joined the Guard in May 1968. Almost immediately, he began an extended period of training. Six weeks of basic training. Fifty-three weeks of flight training. Twenty-one weeks of fighter-interceptor training.
That was 80 weeks to begin with, and there were other training periods thrown in as well. It was full-time work. By the time it was over, Bush had served nearly two years.
Not two years of weekends. Two years.
After training, Bush kept flying, racking up hundreds of hours in F-102 jets. As he did, he ac ulated points toward his National Guard service requirements. At the time, guardsmen were required to ac ulate a minimum of 50 points to meet their yearly obligation.
According to records released earlier this year, Bush earned 253 points in his first year, May 1968 to May 1969 (since he joined in May 1968, his service thereafter was measured on a May-to-May basis).
Bush earned 340 points in 1969-1970. He earned 137 points in 1970-1971. And he earned 112 points in 1971-1972. The numbers indicate that in his first four years, Bush not only showed up, he showed up a lot. Did you know that?
That brings the story to May 1972 — the time that has been the focus of so many news reports — when Bush “deserted” (according to anti-Bush filmmaker Michael Moore) or went “AWOL” (according to Terry McAuliffe, chairman of the Democratic National Committee).
Bush asked for permission to go to Alabama to work on a Senate campaign. His superior officers said OK. Requests like that weren’t unusual, says retired Col. William Campenni, who flew with Bush in 1970 and 1971.
“In 1972, there was an enormous glut of pilots,” Campenni says. “The Vietnam War was winding down, and the Air Force was putting pilots in desk jobs. In ’72 or ’73, if you were a pilot, active or Guard, and you had an obligation and wanted to get out, no problem. In fact, you were helping them solve their problem.”
So Bush stopped flying. From May 1972 to May 1973, he earned just 56 points — not much, but enough to meet his requirement.
Then, in 1973, as Bush made plans to leave the Guard and go to Harvard Business School, he again started showing up frequently.
In June and July of 1973, he ac ulated 56 points, enough to meet the minimum requirement for the 1973-1974 year.
Then, at his request, he was given permission to go. Bush received an honorable discharge after serving five years, four months and five days of his original six-year commitment. By that time, however, he had ac ulated enough points in each year to cover six years of service.
During his service, Bush received high marks as a pilot.
A 1970 evaluation said Bush “clearly stands out as a top notch fighter interceptor pilot” and was “a natural leader whom his contemporaries look to for leadership.”
A 1971 evaluation called Bush “an exceptionally fine young officer and pilot” who “continually flies intercept missions with the unit to increase his proficiency even further.” And a 1972 evaluation called Bush “an exceptional fighter interceptor pilot and officer.”
Now, it is only natural that news reports questioning Bush’s service — in The Boston Globe and The New York Times, on CBS and in other outlets — would come out now. Democrats are spitting mad over attacks on John Kerry’s record by the group Swift Boat Veterans for Truth.
And, as it is with Kerry, it’s reasonable to look at a candidate’s entire record, including his military service — or lack of it. Voters are perfectly able to decide whether it’s important or not in November.
The Kerry camp blames Bush for the Swift boat veterans’ attack, but anyone who has spent much time talking to the Swifties gets the sense that they are doing it entirely for their own reasons.
And it should be noted in passing that Kerry has personally questioned Bush’s service, while Bush has not personally questioned Kerry's.
In April — before the Swift boat veterans had said a word — Kerry said Bush “has yet to explain to America whether or not, and tell the truth, about whether he showed up for duty.” Earlier, Kerry said, “Just because you get an honorable discharge does not, in fact, answer that question.”
Now, after the Swift boat episode, the spotlight has returned to Bush.
That’s fine. We should know as much as we can.
And perhaps someday Kerry will release more of his military records as well.
Byron York is a White House correspondent for National Review. His column appears in The Hill each week. E-mail: [email protected]
All you need to know."The Bush campaign was rocked yesterday by allegations that the Top Gun President"
The campaign is neither "rocked" and the President has never claimed "Top Gun" status.
Exaggerating and mocking...journalistic professionalism at its finest.
Besides a dental record showing that W. had his teeth cleaned in Alabama, there have been no records released that W. ever showed at the Alabama National Guard. The base commander has said he doesn't remember W. ever reporting.Bush asked for permission to go to Alabama to work on a Senate campaign. His superior officers said OK. Requests like that weren’t unusual, says retired Col. William Campenni, who flew with Bush in 1970 and 1971.
Nice try though.
Did it say that he asked to be transferred to the Alabama National Guard?
Get a ing clue, chump. It's bad enough that you spam this forum with third rate drivel from democratblog.com or whatever.
The transfer to Alabama came under very questionable cir stances...
YahooThe White House released memos Wednesday night saying that George W. Bush was suspended from flying fighter jets for failing to meet standards of the Texas Air National Guard.
The Vietnam-era memos add new dimensions to the bare-bones explanation of Bush's aides over the years that he was suspended simply because he decided to skip his annual physical exam. The exam was scheduled during a year in which Bush left Texas, where he had been flying fighter jets, to work on a U.S. Senate campaign in Alabama.
<snip>
A third Killian memo makes clear that Killian was concerned from the outset over Bush's plan to go to Alabama because the military had spent a substantial sum of money turning Bush into a pilot and that his National Guard duties might suffer if he went elsewhere.
"Phone call from Bush," Killian wrote in a May 19, 1972, memo. "Discussed options of how Bush can get out of coming to drill from now through November. ... Says that he is working on another campaign for his dad. ... We talked about him getting his flight physical situation fixed ... Says he will do that in Alabama if he stays in a flight status."
The memo added that Bush "has this campaign to do and other things that will follow and may not have the time. I advised him of our investment in him and his commitment."
Try to refute this, little dumbass dan:
You can't and you know it. This is why the national guard issue has never really hurt Bush because the worst possible thing that could be said about it has been known for at least 10 years now: that he probably got in because his father was a US congressman.Then, at his request, he was given permission to go. Bush received an honorable discharge after serving five years, four months and five days of his original six-year commitment. By that time, however, he had ac ulated enough points in each year to cover six years of service.
Other than that, there is nothing there.
Again, we are talking about Bush missing a physical.
He met his service time requirements for all of the years he was in the Guard. He missed one physical and he still received an honorable discharge.So Bush stopped flying. From May 1972 to May 1973, he earned just 56 points — not much, but enough to meet his requirement.
Then, in 1973, as Bush made plans to leave the Guard and go to Harvard Business School, he again started showing up frequently.
In June and July of 1973, he ac ulated 56 points, enough to meet the minimum requirement for the 1973-1974 year.
Nbadan, I'm still not understanding the point of this whole exercise.
Let's say, for moment, your allegations are true -- and they can never be proved one way or the other because, well, IT'S BEEN 32 ING YEARS. What does it mean? Uh, nothing. It's not like President Bush is running a campaign dependent on anything he did while in the Air National Guard...which, by the way, if you are familiar, is no piece of cake. There was at least 4 years of intensive flight training from '68 to '71 (more than 4 months and certainly more significant than this inflated curiosity over 1972 when the war was waning, pilots were being pulled from Vietnam). BFD...
All the Demoncrats can do is run around and suggest the lack of do entation means that George W. Bush didn't fulfill his obligation when, in reality, all it means is there is a lack of do entation. And, in my book a DD-214 showing he was honorably discharged should close the book.
The Demoncrats are going to whine themselves into a 532-3 (D.C. doesn't pay attention to anything outside their box) Electoral loss if they'r not careful.
The only lack of do entation is the lack of do entation that the W. campaign has provided.
American Blogspot"After the <60 Minutes> broadcast, the White House, without comment, released to the news media two of the memos , one ordering Bush to report for his physical exam and the other suspending him from flight status."
Yeah, you better not have a comment until you talk to your lawyers because it looks like you just got caught in a conspiracy to withhold do ents that you were legally bound to have already released under the Associated Press' earlier FOIA request.
The White House claimed they had released ALL the do ents, now tonight, conveniently after 60 Minutes shows the NEW do ents on TV, the White House somehow releases the very do ents it said it never had? Where did the do ents come from, and why didn't the White House release them BEFORE 60 Minutes exposed their existence? And finally, what else is the White House hiding?
So the worst case that can be brought by the "unbiased" media and the Demos is that a congressman's son got into the national guard, missed one physical at the end of his Guard career, and was discharged honorably.
Shocking.
Again, how are these profound revelations going to impact the race, considering that these accusations have been tried twice before?
yeah, if you complete ignore that W. got into the guard under favorable cir stances, was a less than adaquate pilot, didn't follow orders to report to the Alabama National Guard, ignored a direct command from a superier officer, and was more than likely hooked on cocaine at this time, that's about it.
Back to my original question Nbadan. What does it all mean?
Proof? According to what I've seen his performance was well regarded in the Guard.was a less than adaquate pilot
Again, the worst case scenario for Bush is that he got into the Guard due to familial connections, missed a physical, and was honorably discharged. This, during a period in his life in which he admittedly led a wild life.
And again, this is the 3rd time this issue has been floated by the Demos and their compliant friends in the "unbiased" media.
Bush has not made his service an issue as Kerry did. Bush's service has been the subject of two prior national media feeding frenzies with nothing to show for it except that yeah, Bush probably got into the Guard since his dad was a politician.
This is like the GOP calling Clinton a draft dodger back in 1996. The general public had already heard the story and made their own conclusions on it the first time around.
I'm not aware of any of his rides becoming lawn darts.
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