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smalls favor smalls, u dont hear them credit bigs...
MIAMI HEAT’S DWYANE WADE SAYS ‘KOBE IS GREATEST OF OUR ERA”
“When you look back at this era there’s going to be a lot of players that you can pick from,” said Wade “You can talk about their greatness. This is a good era for basketball, and it would be led by Kobe Bryant – who was the greatest player in our era.”
http://www.sportscity.com/miami-heat...ra/2013/02/15/
smalls favor smalls, u dont hear them credit bigs...
It's weird though considering LBJ is obviously sensitive about the Kobe V LBJ thing. I am surprised Wade said that. The way I see it though, Kobe IS NOT in the same generation as Lebron. It's like when Kobe was killing MJ when he was in the Wizards, it didnt mean anything. Kobe was winning championships when Lebron was in middle school. Kobe's compe ion was always Iverson, McGrady, Carter, and the ghost of Michael Jordan. He hands down killed his compe ion with the exception of course of MJ's ghost.
I would NOT put Kobe V Tim Duncan in the same argument, Kobe even commented how Tim was more of compe ion against Shaq. Nobody debates if Wilt was greater than Larry Bird and no one will ever debate if Tim was greater than Kobe years from now. Both are legends TBH
He has maintained a level of excellence for most of his career, but he got eclipsed by many players.
That is how I see it myself.
I have no arguments tbh, most of the ppl here are blinded by kome hate or some other strong bias to have a valid opinion on the matter
Who exactly from his generation eclipsed him?
that fat little nig in the OP, is that me?
that fat little nig in the OP, is that me?
Good take. I've always felt comparing bigs to perimeter players was rather stupid, since they play different roles on the court, much a quarterback vis a vis a running back.
And like I always say on this board, back in the early-00s, Shaq vs. Duncan was the hot debate as far as bigs, while Kobe vs. T-Mac was the hot debate as far as wings. Duncan and Shaq shouldn't really be compared to Kobe, but they are since Kobe's rivals (T-Mac, Carter, A.I., Ray Allen, Paul Pierce) got injured, failed in the playoffs, or won les past their primes, as in the case of Allen and Pierce. Furthermore, Kobe never had a memorable playoff series where he went back-and-forth with another top perimeter player, since the great teams of the early 00s were all built around bigs and the top wings were all in the East or on ty teams, so by default the only other players you can compare Kobe to are those with similar ring counts, Duncan and Shaq, which I think is unfair for all the players involved. As you alluded to: You compare Wilt to Russell, not Bob Cousy. Magic to Bird. MJ to Clyde. Duncan to Shaq, KG. Etc.
But claiming Kobe is the best player of this generation IS arguing Kobe > Duncan. If you're saying "best guard" of the generation, that's one thing, and I wouldn't disagree with it. Kobe has been the best guard in the NBA post-Jordan. Claiming best "player" though, you're putting him over Shaq, Duncan, LeBron, and everyone else. I don't agree with that at all. He hasn't been better or more positively impactful than Tim Duncan regardless of having an extra ring.
Well said, I do have to be honest though it amazes me sometimes when I think to myself how many different ways the Lakers have changed since 1999 from the Kobe-Shaq-Rice era to the Kobe-Shaq-Fisher era, to Kobe-Shaq-Payton-Malone era to Kobe-Gasol era etc etc etc and someway somehow the Spurs have always been the Duncan-Parker-Ginobli era (with exception to David Robinsons last year) and still maintained a shot at the Finals since 1999. I have to admit Greg Popovich truly is an Emperor which makes me also realize the fact that Phil always had his number makes Phil a God.
Too be fair, the Lakers were overwhelmingly more talented in '01 (After Derek Anderson got hurt, a mediocre player in his own right, Antonio in' Daniels was the second scoring option), '02 (a 19 year old Tony Parker was the 2nd option) and '08 (Old and slow Spurs team that was taken to 7 and almost beaten by the Hornets). I leave out '04 because I thought those teams were fairly equal talent wise, and the Spurs with their speed actually matched up very well with the Lakers, forcing Jackson to pack the paint to take away Parker's penetration and swarm Duncan on the inside. Doing so, Phil conceded the outside shot, which was a huge risk with all the shooters the Spurs had, but Phil had no choice. It was either let Parker have a layup drill all series and Duncan kill Malone (and Duncan obliterated Malone the first two games) or concede jumpers. Paid off, since the Spurs shooters couldn't hit the broadside. The paint never opened up again and it was GG.
Since he hit his prime around 2001, Shaq, Duncan, then LeBron since his second season. Head to head, LeBron always plays better, Pierce usually too.
As I said, Lebron and Kobe are not from the same generation. You will see what I mean 5 years from now when Lebron is battling Durant and we all see Kobe is practically a grandpa. As for Shaq, dont even get me started. Shaq is a legend but in what regards is he greater than Kobe? Take off your Kome hate glasses for 1 second, if you're going to use the Kobe needed Shaq argument then understand that Shaq always road a hall of fame player as well ie Penny Hardway, Kobe Bryant, and Dwayne Wade.
Lastly, Tim Duncan is definitely the only one you can make a case for out of those guys but the inability for the Spurs to win back to back as well as captivate the fans is what will always make the Spurs forgettable outside their fan base. I'm not trying to be a , I have respect for the Spurs much more than the avg Laker fan but there's a reason why an episode of Walking Dead had more viewers than a game 7 of Spurs V Pistons.
It's like he says in The Gladiator,"You're good spaniard but you're not that good, you can be better. Win the crowd."
Can't really pin that on Duncan.
Injured in '00.
In '04, the Lakers reload and build one of the most stacked rosters in the modern era. Still, like I said, the Spurs matched up well with them. Spurs shooters choke on their own s after game 2. Duncan nearly saved the season until the most improbable shot ever fell through the net.
'06. Duncan puts up these stats in a series that was lost on the stupidest mental mistake Manu Ginobili ever made: 32.2ppg, 11.7rpg, 3.7apg, 2.5blk, 1.0spg, .556FG
'08. Duncan indeed deserves some of the blame for his inefficient shooting that series, but Manu sucking huge ass didn't help much, and at the end of the day, the Lakers were just flat out more talented with Kobe, Gasol, and Odom all at the peak of their careers.
I don't think the inability or ability to repeat should figure that much into the equation of a player's all time greatness. I know Red mind ed Laker fans when he disparaged the Lakers' first 3 les of the 80s by saying you're not a true champ until you repeat and Lakersfans been obsessed with repeats ever since, but ultimately, you don't receive any additional banners for repeating. Besides, les are a team accomplishment anyhow.
But I get you might be speaking from a "sports journalist" perspective here.
As for captivating fans, hard to do in a small market. Viewership has little to do with the brand of basketball you play and is heavily determined by market size. Lakers in the Finals would draw huge ratings whether they played like the Showtime Lakers or the Mike Brown Lakers. Even the impact of a marketable star is overrated. George Gervin and David Robinson were both relatively popular players and they weren't enough to transform the Spurs into one of the most popular franchises. And currently, they're one of the most aesthetically pleasing teams to watch with their passing and speed, and still can't draw outside SA.
Last edited by midnightpulp; 02-16-2013 at 04:33 AM.
I def think that Duncan\Spurs are a legendary team, especially the fact they are still relevant without doing anything dramatic for 14 years now!
Btw, I remember after the infamous .04 shot I went to a really upscale restaurant in Santa Monica on a date. Sitting right next to me was Ginobli (he wasnt very famous in 04) and some guy that looked like an agent or manager. He looked like he wanted to kill himself...nobody was even noticing Ginobli. He was having a beer and looked suicidal. I made a nice bet on the Lakers following that day :-D INB4 DNA sample or it didnt happen
When a player talks of another like he is now a has-been, he means two things:
"He is done, Long Live The King!" or "Come to our team next year, we'll carry you to another ring"
Sounds a lot like the 2012 WCF, now that I think about it.
i dunno how u can say lebron doesnt belong in the conversation, when kobe got his own team whether it was prime or just another scrub volume shooter those 2 years, lebron started to peak and also made the finals and some deep runs...even though he didnt have the team to win it all, just another regular season record and playoff fodder, it was better winning % compared to kobes 2 years as leader b4 the pau trade...his mvps back it up; playoffs is just another story...
then we can move forward and count those pau years and can still continue to compare kobe to lebron even though he had , but h2h matchups lebron still outplayed and team wins against kobe lakers....2 rings and 3 finals appearances is also a good indicator kobe was still at the top of his game, but he was never the best in the game cause that le belong to lebron...even if u dont count rings, from 04/05-11/12 thats a good 6-7years of basketball h2h u can still come to a conclusion...
When Kobe misses the playoffs this year he will slide behind Duncan for good.
Kobe was a great player.
This season just is adding to the separation for Kobe over Duncan. Another great season by Kobe, he made the allstar team, will make all nba first team, already surpassed 30000 points, and is less than 500 points away from passing Wilt for 4th all time on the scoring list. Making the playoffs is a team accomplishment. If you want to just go by team accomplishments then Kobe>Duncan is an inarguable fact because he has more rings, WC championships, more playoff wins.
The whole "Wade being jealous" of Kobe thing has gone overboard. I think as they both get up in age, they're both coming to appreciate each other's games. After we waxed them, Kobe made sure to talk to Wade for a while. And during the game Kobe actually helped Wade up on one play.
That said, the way Wade phrased it, he was able to give Kobe props while implying (correctly) that Bron isn't part of their generation.
Wade and Bron were in the same draft class
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