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Playing for the spurs is a recipe for disaster in terms of individual accomplishment.
In truth both of them should have a few more All-NBA awards...
This is taking nothing away from these two overachievers. Late first rounder and second rounder are not supposed to turn into hall of famers, but with their compe ive spirit, international players being undervalued at the time, Pop's nurturing and Duncan's individual sacrifice, they will finish their career as top 100 players to ever play in the NBA.
But I always thought part of the reason why Spurs did not repeat was because Duncan peaked much earlier than Parker and Ginobili, and more importantly, after Duncan's decline from top 3 to top 10 players in the NBA, Parker/Ginobili as 2nd/3rd options are just a tad below other teams 2nd/3rd options. Would you really take them over Kobe in Shaq/Kobe era? How about Pippen/Rodman in Bulls era? The 1980's Lakers and Celtics are just as stacked so no point to even go there. Even teams that only won two rings often had stronger 2nd/3rd options, like Wade/Bosh in Miami big three era, or Warior/Cavalier (whomever rings this year).
Both Parker and Ginobili are extremely intelligent players who more than made up their relative lack of physical goods. Ginobili at his peak was basically 2017 Harden with durability/sustainability issues. his feast or famine playing style helped Spurs won le when they are not supposed to (2005 Pistons) and lost les when they had it in the bag (2006 Mavs). Parker, as good as he was, could have been replaced by any top point guard of the era, if that point guard had Duncan to set screens and anchor the defense. Because of their relative weakness against their peers, I felt Spurs for the most part only won rings during the decline/disappearance of super teams. 1999 when Jordan retired, 2003 against a Lakers team that won 3 rings in a row, 2005 and 2007 when league had no real super team, and 2014 against a Miami Heat team that played 3 finals in a row.
In an alternative universe, I would have loved to see what Duncan would have done if he had his own Pippen or Kobe. Taking Parker/Ginobili to 4 rings, it really speaks volumes about his greatness.
And by that same token, I always thought the 1999 Spurs was the strongest Spurs team ever, because David was at the tail end of his prime and that version of David was the greatest teammate Duncan ever had in his career.
Parker
3× All-NBA Second Team (2012–2014)
All-NBA Third Team (2009)
Ginobili
2× All-NBA Third Team (2008, 2011)
Kobe During Shaq Three-Peat Era Alone
3× All-NBA First Team (2002-2004)
2× All-NBA Second Team (2000, 2001)
Scottie Pippen
3× All-NBA First Team (1994–1996)
2× All-NBA Second Team (1992, 1997)
2× All-NBA Third Team (1993, 1998)
Last edited by hitmantb; 02-05-2017 at 12:22 PM.
Playing for the spurs is a recipe for disaster in terms of individual accomplishment.
In truth both of them should have a few more All-NBA awards...
Who was the third option on the Shaq laker's teams?
Ginobili at his peak was basically 2017 Harden
Stop reading right there. You need to check some videos and stop taking numerical stats so serious. Manu was Harden PLUS good defense, more IQ, better passer and clutchness.
James Harden is actually a really good defender and certainly better than prime manu. It shows up in the stats. People need to stop looking at videos and look at numbers more. Manu is a quarter the player of harden and only blind homers would think that.
Stop reading right there. You need to check some videos and stop taking numerical stats so serious. Manu was Harden PLUS good defense, more IQ, better passer and clutchness.
This guy is 15 yo. When Duncan didn't have Tony and Manu in the Olympics what happened?
I'd take Parker or Ginobili over Rodman any day of the week.
Teams that won 3 or more les? I assume you mean teams that were relatively INTACT while winning 3 or more les. So there are basically 3 teams since the merger who have done that?
You made a whole thread to argue over which version of Godzilla was the toughest.
Not even TheGreatYacht would come up with that
Yeah, it's a weird thread. I'd take Kobe over either of them, and probably Pippen, but then the Rockets repeated without a second player I'd pick before them and certainly no third player. Only talking about modern era.
Shut the up you dumb got.
Yea, he should be getting all those all NBA defense awards like Kobe did, too. He was another "really good defender."
Parker and Manu are great players, but they were young when Duncan was in his prime, so you could argue that Tim would've won more les in his prime. But bc Manu and Parker hit their primes later, it lengthened the Spurs great run. My guess is the the Spurs won 4 les spread out (5 had a heavy dose of Kawhi) bc each hit primes at different times. If they had all hit primes together, they prob win 3-4 les bunched together instead of spread out over years.
The refs.
Harden has bad plays where it looks obvious that he is a bad defender because he takes plays off. But he is a good defender in the 95% of plays where he doesn't do that. Its why his defensive stats are pretty good.
I'll take '03, '05, & '07 Parker & Ginobili over '00-'02 Bryant & Fisher.
You're going full re .
I'd argue that Parker was top 3 doing the 12-13 season with Lebron, KD, and maybe Westbrook ahead of him
06 was so in the bag that we were down 3-1 before Manu fouled dirk (after which Tim himself got fouled on a layup (nocall) then went scoreless iirc in OT)
Only reason tims Spurs didn't repeat was injuries and bad refs.
I've never understood the hatred towards players born in Mexico tbh
Manu and Tony are great players in their own right. Sadly the big 3 never peaked together (except maybe 2007 when Parker was entering his peak phase?)
Harden is a very poor Batman, while Manu was a great, great Robin in his peak. Harden is stronger, a bit better in drawing fouls, and shoot three point ball better, the rest are equal mostly, and Manu was & is a better compe or & teammate.
TP has never been a complete player, but in his peak, his specialty is really what made the team go, aka HOTS.
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