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You son of a ,im in
I wonder if there is appe e to trade the #9 down to Charlotte for the #13 and #15. In some gamed-out mocks, the #9 starts losing value while players the Spurs might still covet might last a few more spots.
Obviously the trade compounds the issue of having too many picks, so the later picks would need to be consolidated or traded out. Or something crazy like the #20 paired with one of the new ones to move up.
Charlotte fans seem fixated on Jalen Duren, who probably doesn't last until #13. (I want to ignore proposals for trading Poeltl to them for now.) But Mark Williams might still be there, who the Spurs could value more.
So what are thoughts about such a thing, provided the later picks are accounted for? Is it worth losing out on a Tier 3-ish player like Johnny Davis if you can cement two good Tier 4 players (however you account for them)? Say, a Mark Williams and Ousmane Dieng, that sort of thing?
You son of a ,im in
I’d just offer 20+25 for 15 honestly.
Doubt that gets you there.
A month ago I would have hated this. Today. Not so much. There’s a number of players 12-18 that I think spurs fans would covet in hindsight. Not the worst idea to get two rather than one arguably slightly better.
If we are suggesting 13 & 15 gets you 9, 20 and 25 for 15 comparatively is more than enough.
Compounding things for Charlotte, scenarios exist that have Duren and M. Williams both gone by pick #13. Washington and OKC both need some size, although the Thunder might hav just picked Holmgren. Duren could be an option for teams in the 5-8 range. Although the Knicks have other needs, they're probably losing Mitch Robinson and Duren reads like a Knicks player.
I'm not sure, but there's some possibility there. Sell Charlotte on landing their coveted center. You're probably trading away from Johnny Davis. But gaming it out, it looks like players like Sochan, Branham, Dieng, are still there. You can probably take one of them and make sure you get Jalen Williams.
The problem is the #15 is a Charlotte pick and I'm not sure they want three picks total. Cleveland has the #14 and Atlanta has the #16.
I think this would make sense for us assuming we can still pick up 4 or 5 high floor guys that fill current gaps, which we could do. Drafting at 13, 15, 20, and 25 would quite possibly still get 3 of Dieng, Mathurian, Jovic, Eason, Daniels, Baldwin, Liddell, or Brown. That would leave 25 and 38 for a Procida, Nzosa, or maybe even a bit of Burn,
But quite frankly, I don't see the motivation for Charlotte to do that. This draft may be top loaded with potential future All-Stars, but there may be an additional 15-20 guys that turn into long range NBA starters and contributors. More picks in this particular draft is where the juice is squeezed..
Even if that puts the front office in a pickle with open slots on the roster, I think you take as many high floor guys as you can into camp and see what gives.
So, yes please.
Edit: Just saw Mathurian has skyrocketed up to the 5th pick in the latest CBS draft. Holy . Forget Mathurian apparently. But that just pushes other folks many are high on further down the list.
I think for Charlotte it's because they so badly need a center, especially a defensive center. They seem to be considering RFA Mo Bamba or figuring out how to go for Ayton. If they miss out on M. Williams and Duren, the rank of centers in this class dives pretty quickly. Koloko and Kamagate are limited or projects, and then Kessler seems very slow footed, a problem on any team, very troublesome for a team that will want to fly. The 13 and 15 seem like good value to move into the late top 10, if they want. I suppose the Spurs could use the 20 or 25 to make them feel better.
This is an intriguing idea, Mr. Body, tbh.
No, the play is to try to trade up.
Yeah, definitely worth a deep dive in what we should do as the draft I think is going to be crazy and could see Durren and Williams off the board by 13. So we give up our 9th and 25th pick and we get Charlotte 13th and 15th pick? In that case we probably looking at Johnny Davis, and Dieng or Williams, and Tari Eason.
My question is if we do start the trade talks again with Jakob what would your asking price be from Charlotte? I could see us trading Jakob for their 13th this year, and a first next year with built in protections for both teams?
Trade down and get more of the same guys like already on the roster. Hope not
Trading down and adding more picks doesn't work; we're already pushing up against the limited # of roster spots... More likely to try trading up to consolidate picks (or to move them to a future draft).
If we only had 9, I’d say go for it.
With 20, 25, 38, what’s the point? You’re basically looking at the difference between an Eason and a Liddell, while losing a chance to get a solid piece at 9.
I could easily see doing 9 and 25 for 13 and 15. There are plenty of mocks that have ST favorites like Sochan, Davis, Eason and Williams available at 13 or even 15. It's very possible the Spurs can get two of those second-tier players, if not three. There are obviously scenarios where the Spurs shouldn't do this, like if one of the 1A-tier guys falls (Mathurin, Murray or whomever), or if the Spurs are already planning on using one or both of their later firsts on reaches (no need to pay gambles even more money). But I personally prefer to do this trade then to throw in one of the other picks for a JAG prospect like many STers seem to want.
This trade makes no sense for either team. Spurs already have quan y of picks and desperately need quality.
The Wizards don't need a C (Porzingis, Gafford) and barring trades within' the top 10, the earliest I could see Duren or Williams going is 11 to the Knicks.
There's a good chance of the Thunder at 12 (Holmgren is likely to start at PF early on) and Hornets at 13 have them available and if not both have the assets to swing a trade.
I'm not thrilled with the likely best projected options at 9, but there's still a better chance of getting a quality piece with it than moving further down. This board's fascination with collecting as much likely JAG's as possible is bizarre.
Last edited by TD 21; 06-01-2022 at 11:29 PM.
I’m on the fence. Perhaps the only reason I’d consider it is if, unfortunately, the player we’d pick at 9 would still have been available at 13. There’s a decent chance of that.
In a vacuum, I think is a good idea. But on draft day, I believe there is a strong chance that somebody widely considered to be “out of our range” like Murray, Sharpe, or Daniels will fall. In that scenario, holding on to the #9 pick to draft one of those guys would be the better move.
Incidentally, this is one reason why I believe the #9 pick has historically yielded numerous all-stars. Teams drafting higher tend to fall in love with certain prospects, leading to players that should have been drafted higher falling, and thereby being scooped up by teams at #9.
So we went from "Oh no! we're not top 4!" to.. "we should try to trade up!" to..."some gem might fall to #9!" to... "I want jalen, I want Mathurin, I want Sharpe!" to..."let's trade down for 13 and 15 to get B players you already have in the roster and will piss everyone off here!"
Trading down is OK when you're a contender and don't need some more star power, not when you're a fringe play in team looking for a "game changer". Not like this draft was stacked with surefire superstars.
Now saying this, that might be something spurs could do
Last edited by JPB; 06-02-2022 at 12:14 AM.
I never was for trading up. Also, you didn't really understand anything about this thread, but that's okay.So we went from "Oh no! we're not top 4!" to.. "we should try to trade up!" to..."some gem might fall to #9!" to... "I want jalen, I want Mathurin, I want Sharpe!" to..."let's trade down for 13 and 15 to get B players you already have in the roster and will piss everyone off here!"
Trading down is OK when you're a contender and don't need some more star power, not when you're a fringe play in team looking for a "game changer". Not like this draft was stacked with surefire superstars.
Now saying this, that might be something spurs could do
I believe that is OP's point. Is there a single player that we can't pass up at 9 that wouldn't be available at 13 or 15? I mean this draft class should have a bunch of guys we'd be content drafting that even if we miss out on, other equally intriguing talents should be available a few picks later.
Is there a wide talent gulf between #9 & #13? Imo, no, tbh.
That's it. Utimately, the Spurs' FO aren't gamblers in general. If there's a player they like, they'll take that player. And this deal depends on Duren not getting picked earlier than #9, which I think is still a possibility. So I don't think this happens at all.
But... yes, essentially this all hangs on a feeling that there's a tier of players where the players at #9 and players available around #13-15 aren't that different. To take the leap it requires reading what Washington, New York, and OKC are likely to do at 10, 11, and 12.
Washington -- most needs a good center and a point guard
New York -- also needs a center, a point guard, also could use some shooting
Oklahoma City -- needs everything, in particular size at center and shooting, but could just be BPA
These teams are actually in a weird spot, because their biggest needs don't really have great players there. Regardless, it's conceivable they take AJ Griffin, Mark Williams, Johnny Davis. By my estimation this leaves the Spurs looking at Ousmane Dieng, Malaki Branham, Ochai Agbaji, Jalen Williams, and Jeremy Sochan has not been taken yet. In between the Charlotte picks is Cleveland and they already have bigs, so I have them taking Branham or maybe like Jaden Hardy.
So at the 'cost' of not getting Johnny Davis, the Spurs get Dieng and Sochan. Or Sochan and Jalen Williams. Whatever. Or if those intervening teams pass on M. Williams or Davis then those players are available at 13.
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