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Maybe 3 peated with Kidd. Probably a net negative with jermain unless they somehow kept Parker and manu. I recall jermain fell off quickly. But prime Kidd and TD get through 04 and 05.
At about 13 minutes here (Rip Stuart Scott) Kidd insinuates he might be interested in pulling what Durant pulled a generation later by bandwagoning the team he lost to... i.e., the Spurs.
Spurs were on cloud nine after the 2003 season and with David Robinson's salary off the books, they were in prime position to build a dynasty around the in bent best player in the league and honestly in sports at the time, Tim Duncan.
But they pissed around in the offseason and found out. They ended up with ass Turkoglu and Jason Hart, oh and Rasho and Ron Mercer.A total motley crew. Shane Heal, whoever that was, that Aussie guy that lasted 1/4 of the season. The only solid signing was Horry, but he was cheap and wasn't even good in '03-04.
Imagine if the Spurs:
-Had re-signed both RFAs Jackson and Claxton to long term contracts. Don't piss around with the integral players that won you the championship.
-Had worked out a S+T with the Nets for Jason Kidd for Tony Parker and a draft pick.
-Had signed Jermaine O'Neal.
Sure, they wouldn't likely have been as good into the 2010s with that aging roster with what they had, they would have had to re-tool a bit. But they would have been loaded to win at least two more championships than the did.
Maybe 3 peated with Kidd. Probably a net negative with jermain unless they somehow kept Parker and manu. I recall jermain fell off quickly. But prime Kidd and TD get through 04 and 05.
Fumbled with Stephen Jackson hard. Could have used his toughness in 04’ and another solid defender to throw at Kobe.
Not sure who fumbled tbh
Spurs couldn't pay him what he wanted and Jax needed to show case himself/stat pad for a season to get his bag.
Sometimes timing sucks
If you're asking me to bet the field (any other scenario besides what actually happened) vs. 2 les in 4 years, I'm taking the latter.
20
Kidd is the only difference maker there. Jackson was probably addition by subtraction given that he admitted to smoking weed before games and playing stoned. But can we really complain that we got stuck with HOF Tony Parker? With Kidd, the next few years probably would've been les, but Parker kept them relevant longer. Don't forget that he was in the MVP discussions during his prime.
Invigorating, informative topic that has never been broached in the history of Spurs discussion. Will share with family and friends.
IIRC, if we got Kidd, Manu would be gone.
Have to thanks Kidd's wife for refusing to go to SA.
I'm glad it worked out the way it did
Uh, what? 2003 was a unicorn year. We SHOULDN'T have won. If you weren't there, you won't understand.
Jackson was never and never will be a "get over yourself" kind of guy, that was the problem and fallacy. He was a mercenary and a team player only for whoever paid him what he wanted, gave him the playing time he wanted, etc. It was a recurring theme. His career started with the Nets and he was a good two-way player for them in the Marbury Nets era (wore #24 the years before they cut him and drafted Jefferson) but the Nets didn't like his or Marbury's expressiveness, dealt Marbury to the Suns for Kidd (good trade for them) and jettisoned Jackson in favor of drafting Jefferson, it's crazy how often those two guys (RJ and Jack) crossed paths in their careers (NJ, SA, GSW) but never played for the same team. Then the Spurs gave him a shot but he didn't play much in the '01-02 season behind Steve Smith, Bruce, Charles Smith, AD, Porter etc and back then Pop was still giving Ferry minutes at SF which was dumb but a relic of its time. He got his chance in '02-03 and was one of the main reasons apart from TD we won it all, then had a journeyman career in the rest of the 2000s of being a borderline allstar but burning bridges wherever he went, quickly wearing out his welcome everywhere. He finally got another chance in 2012 but in 2012-13 wanted more than the Horry role of coming off the bench and playing big playoff minutes but being relegated to a backup during the season. He was great for us in the playoffs in 2012 per par but in 2013 he was the fourth swingman and he didn't think Danny Green deserved more minutes, which didn't make sense. Both guys had their roles. I do think Popovich was largely to blame though for the 2013 falling out because he basically told Jackson to tell Green that [Green] was "better" than him and Jackson's ego was too big but from his standpoint you're basically attacking a hornet's nest with rocks and asking the hornets not to bite. I mean Jackson instead of Gary Neal would have been a heck of an upgrade in some of those 2013 Finals games but I digress.
Jackson was an obvious stoner for sure and his calm but jittery playstyle kind of married up with that. Then again, there's plenty of guys who dominate the basketball courts at the street ball level who are essentially 24/7 stoners. I don't think that was a problem. He was a bit of a turnover liability but he was a heck of a defender, didn't give an inch, played his butt off and was a smart fundamental basketball player. Also had the knack for drilling the clutch three even though he had an ugly shooting form.
Oh, I was there. I was watching. I wholeheartedly agree. The little team that could, with the GOAT Tim Duncan and a hodge-podge of players who were all too young or too old, they said. The team that would miss 15 shots in a row and then make 12 in a row, that was their M.O... Hot-and-cold. No rhyme or reason. But no matter what, they (almost) always got it done defensively. Something you don't see by any team in today's NBA.
I was there watching when the Spurs took down the mighty Lakers in LA in the first game of the season (but the media including NBA 2Night, later known as NBA Fastbreak) saw it as an asterisk game because Shaq didn't play. Then on the next night, the Spurs were pretenders again for losing at the lowly Warriors.
I WAS THERE in-person in the very first game of the SBC Center vs. Toronto. With my mom and childhood best friend whose grandmother was my grandmother's best friend. It was a good game, a little dicey most of the game but we pulled away, but the caveat of that game was Speedy Claxton going down for the first basically 2/3 of the season that night. The replacement...? Jason Hart wasn't available at the time, so we had to go to deeper into the bargain dumpster bin and sign Anthony Goldwire. Goldwire was our main backup point guard for the bulk of November and December (Kerr got some minutes there too, but that was a problem on defense) until Manu was healthier and ready to take up more of that role, and boy did the Spurs offense struggle with Goldwire in the game. With Porter retired and Daniels no longer with the Spurs, it was definitely Tony Parker's time to grow up and fast. He struggled at times but it was good for him long term.
I was there when the Spurs got beatdown by over 20 pts at home against the otherwise-struggling Blazers in early November. To add insult to injury, Bonzi Wells spit on Danny Ferry's neck when the game was already all but over.
I was there when the Spurs blew a massive fourth quarter lead at home against Seattle and Brent Barry (!) buried us at the end with the three to beat us by one. I remember sweating and crying. It was the first time Tony Parker had a dunk, too, when we were riding high and up by around 20 in the early 4th.
I was there the next game when the Spurs blew another double digit lead the next game in ugly fashion to a horrid, talent-starved Denver team on the road and let that one get away. (We did beat them at home big the next day, holding them to 3 points in the first quarter, but no excuse to not win both in blowouts).
I was there when the Spurs looked like crap in Houston in our long awaited first game ever vs Yao Ming. When we got blown out at home by a short handed Kings team that made us look like a JV squad. When we were 12-9 and favored to lose to the "Mighty Mavericks" at home by double digits... but somehow we went on a huge second quarter run from a big deficit and ended up winning.
When we dropped absolute stinkers throughout the month of December 2002, losing at the lowly Clippers with ghastly offense, getting beat at the buzzer by the atrocious Hawks in Atlanta, losing by one to the Knicks after a phantom Allan Houston foul, losing the last game to Jordan and the Wizards close on NYE.
When Popovich got himself tossed at home against lowly Golden State in the third quarter and it looked like we were going to get beatdown, but somehow P.J. and the guys rallied and we came back to win that game. A turning point...??
Jackson's three to beat Boston by one here at home in a low scoring roller coaster game. We were up 18, Boston dominated the second half, Jackson saved the day. Then, barely beat Phoenix, a team we'd have trouble with all year. We had a home stand, won a few more games but lost at home to the lousy Grizzlies... WTF???
Timmy made a game winner at Utah to extend "the streak over the Jazz" after a heroic ten-point fourth quarter comeback. Perhaps a turning point. Lost in Minnesota first game of the first ever rodeo road trip, oh boy, 9 games long, we're in trouble, but then miraculously proceeded to win the following eight including a very tough final three. That put us firmly in contender status. Except for a couple heartbreakers down the stretch, including two more losses to the Suns, we mainly sailed through the rest of the season and even were able to give Dallas a free win and maintain the #1 overall seed.
In the playoffs, it wasn't going to be easy. First up was the Suns, who had our numbers and they knew it. A mostly nip and tuck Game 1 ended up in Amare's strange banked three forcing OT and then all of San Antonio getting MAR-BURIED !!!! in OT. A similarly played Game 2 looked very tough for the Spurs to win as the Suns had the upper hand until the play that changed everything: the Danny Ferry four-point play. See, Kevin Willis was suspended, and the Spurs didn't really have another backup center that year. Spurs were down eight late in the fourth once again but Ferry sunk a three, Timmy was fouled and made the free throw, Spurs got some stops and scores and Manu sunk a three with under a minute left to put the Spurs up four and we won that game by the skin of our teeth. Took all that fortune going our way just to get the 1-1 home split. Would we get crushed in Phoenix? Probably, we lost there both times that regular season. Very surprisingly we won game 3 on the road and it looked surprisingly easy, shots were finally falling, the ball was finally moving, Parker was finally getting out of the fetal position and taking it to Marbury for the first time ever. Game 4? Looked like more of the same, up until midway through the fourth quarter.. Spurs up 17 points, easy win right? Wrong... Suns come all the way back, Amare fouls out but they still win on a .... Jake Voskuhl (WHO???) game winning shot with a couple seconds left. Spurs come back home and mostly dominate game 5 but suffer a late-game scare because this team was hot-and-cold, remember. Game 6 the Spurs were getting dominated but Jackson and Manu, similar to the Dallas game, shot the Spurs back into it with threes and we held on for dear life. Phew.
Next round? None other than the mighty three-time in bent champion Lakers. Game 1 was hard fought, we won methodically, it was Kevin Willis's halfcourt buzzer three at halftime that kind of evened out Samaki Walker's (which shouldn't have counted) the playoff year before with the basketball gods. Game 2 was a rout, but Game 3 back in LA was a rout the wrong way. Game 4 was another heartbreaking meltdown loss. Game 5 was oh-so-close to that, even up 30 in the second half at home. I was in Maine at the time. Horry's shot was in... and ...out... and in.. and back out again! Game 6 I expected to lose but that was one of if not Timmy's best playoff performance to date, I missed the first half life but got in on it when we were leading and doing a great job protecting the lead and we closed the book on their dynasty, it was amazing.
The Conference Finals of course was against Dallas, the other 60 win team who had dominated most of the regular season, but we had home-court due to the division tiebreaker. Game 1 was another one of those supreme let downs, we led the whole game until the very last bucket by Finley at the end, a shoot out and Don Nelson cheesing the foul system with the Hack-a-Bruce whenever we'd have a large lead. Game 2 we dominated, game 3 we played even, started pulling away then Dirk went down for the series and that was that, game 4 was tight but the Spurs were too much with no Dirk, game 5 should have been a blowout with no Dirk but we completely blew that one too like game 1 or more accurately like game 4 of the Lakers series, we just could not buy a bucket in the late 3rd quarter to midway through the 4th. Game 6 was looking awful too until, similar to game 6 in Phoenix, Jackson and Manu started drilling threes to put us back in the game, then with Parker struggling, Steve Kerr made a few more threes to put us well ahead for good. The defense was incredible, and Dirk being out really sunk them in the end.
The Finals was epic... though it shouldn't have been. The Spurs were handily the better team on paper, even though the Nets had won 10 in a row in the Leastern Conference playoffs. Nets had gotten swept in the Finals the previous year. Spurs started slow but played a methodical, strong game 1 and won pretty handily. Game 2 started out that way too but the Nets ended up dominating us most of that game, leading by as many as 18 in the third quarter, though we made a very late comeback and Jackson uncharacteristically missed the game winning shot and we lost by two. Game 3 in NJ was another game the Nets seemed to have the handle on especially by late in the third quarter, but Parker finally stepped up and made some threes, we started playing defense again and Manu's steal and baseline shot saved us and we won in a close one, taking back home court advantage. Game 4 was more of the same, tight first half, Nets pulled away in the third, leading by 15, Pop almost got himself tossed, Spurs stormed back and took a lead even but the Nets were too tough, neither team were making many shots and the refs were letting both sides play for the most part, Spurs trailed by three and Manu uncharacteristically airballed a potential tying three at the end and we lost (I think we lost by one because Timmy made a put back at the buzzer but it was academic). Game 5 was slightly controlled by the Spurs but it was pretty nip and tuck, too. We scarcely ever had a double digit lead. Nets had their chances late but the Spurs played great defense and transition offense at the end and pulled it out. And then of course the epic Game 6, which the Nets mostly controlled until the dam broke midway through the 4th quarter when we went on that epic 19-0 run fueled by Manu, Jackson, Claxton, and of course Timmy. Parker was benched which was a common theme that year. That was one of the reasons letting Claxton walk was absolutely stupid especially if you aren't going to sign Kidd.
Forgot about the Nets episode. Thx
I still can't believe Pop tried to humiliate Jax like that, it's probably around then that I started questioning all the "Pop is such a great dude blabla".
Jax also left hating badly on TP ('s alleged selfishness during the Okc series - where any observer could see we were robbed by the refs anyway)
I caught him a cple time on his podcast and he seems so bitter to have to make a living that way.
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