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  1. #1
    5. timvp's Avatar
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    Spurs Basketball is predicated on defense. For the past eight seasons, the Spurs have been great defensively. Their system relies on the perimeter players to funnel the opponent into the Spurs' bigmen.

    Offensively, the Spurs have been an inside-out team. Recently the guards have gotten more involved, but the Spurs still win or lose with the play of Tim Duncan down low.

    For years, the Spurs have been successful using these strategies. The problem is that the NBA is evolving. With the rule changes that have been made over the past five years or so, it's now harder than ever to play defense. Perimeter players who can drive to the basket are almost impossible to stop.

    The NBA is also getting smaller. Just a few years ago having a decent center was important. Nowadays, if you don't have Shaq or Yao, your center is going to struggle playing in today's game. Power forwards are a lot faster. Stand still perimeter players are going the way of the dodo bird.

    Going into the 2006-07 season, do you think the Spurs can still win by playing Spurs Basketball? Can they win with defense and an inside-out offensive system?

    Or do the Spurs need to evolve. Do they need to scrap the twin tower look and not funnel as much defensively? Do the Spurs need more all-around weapons offensively who can create without having to play inside-out?

    These are questions that the Spurs need to answer during the offseason. If they try to win the same way that has worked over the years, they could look like a dinosaur next year. Or, perhaps, Spurs Basketball is still the way to the river parade.

    What do you think?

  2. #2
    5. timvp's Avatar
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    Here is an article from a couple days ago. It details how the NBA is attempting to alter the game. They want high scoring action. They want perimeter players to get to the basket with ease.

    The NBA is agaisnt Spurs Basketball. Do the Spurs still try to win with it anyways?

    Trend in NBA favors offense
    By David Aldridge
    Inquirer Columnist

    MIAMI - For the last two decades, just about every team that has won the NBA Finals has been the league's best defensive team. And on that team there has been a player - or players - considered among the best defenders at his position.

    The '80s Lakers had Michael Cooper. The Celtics had Kevin McHale and Dennis Johnson. The Pistons had Dennis Rodman and Joe Dumars. The Bulls had Michael Jordan and Scottie Pippen - and, in their second Threepeat, Rodman. The Rockets had Hakeem Olajuwon. The Spurs had David Robinson and have Bruce Bowen. And the new-millennium Lakers had Kobe Bryant and Rick Fox.

    Which is why this season, in so many ways, represents a sea change in the NBA.

    The defending champion Spurs have already been shown the door. And the defending Eastern Division champs, the Pistons, are about to join them. After a half-dozen years in which either Detroit or San Antonio set the standard for defense, and won four championships between them, both dropped noticeably this season. And both have been sliced up by superior offenses in the playoffs.

    Which is by design.

    It's a natural progression from a series of rule changes over the last few years designed to liberate offenses, combined with an influx of quicksilver guards and forwards capable of handling the ball and finishing at the basket. It has made players like Miami's Dwyane Wade even more unstoppable. And it's keeping more fans in front of their televisions, if the increased ratings for this postseason are any indication.

    People love offense. And they're getting it, while defensive-oriented teams look to be going the way of the stegosaurus.

    "I think that it is fair to say we went through a period where it became fashionable to get a piece of a player" on his way to the basket, commissioner David Stern said Monday night before Game 4 of the Eastern Conference finals.

    "If he didn't stop him, he slowed him up," Stern said. "And we made a decision to say we want to try it the other way. And I think our fans - and our players - are responding beautifully to that. It's giving people a chance to see how talented our players really are. And so we're pretty excited about that."

    Exhibit A is Wade, who is rolling faster than a beer barrel down the Matterhorn. He's averaging 30.7 points against the Pistons. In the series, Wade is shooting 69.5 percent from the floor.

    That included two baskets Monday that defy description: one a flip over his head as he fell to the floor after being fouled, the other a heave from the corner as he was hit on the arm.

    Right now, he is stupid hot.

    And telegenic.

    And cooperative with reporters.

    And rocking the Sean John clothing line.

    And saying things like "I'm just a kid in a candy store" after busting the Pistons for 31 points on Monday.

    Think Stern wouldn't mind this kid being the image people think of when they think of the NBA - instead of, say, brawling Pacers and Pistons fans - for the next five or six years?

    "He's the reason I came here," Shaquille O'Neal said Monday after the Heat's 89-78 victory gave them a lead of three games to one.

    "I know I was getting older," O'Neal said. "I knew I needed somebody of his caliber. I never really heard of him before I saw him, but then I saw him do what he did to Baron Davis that one year" - in 2003, Wade's rookie season.

    "I was, like, this kid has potential," O'Neal said. "And with the secrets I have, I came down here and showed him stuff, told him stuff. And now he's blossoming very nice. But the good thing about him is, he's doing it the right way. He's earning his spot. Other guys have been given their spot."

    O'Neal made it clear to Pat Riley that he would not OK his trade from the Lakers in the summer of '04 if Wade were part of the package that went back to Los Angeles. So Riley resisted the insistence of Lakers general manager Mitch Kupchak that Wade be in the deal.

    "I wouldn't have done it" if Wade had to go, Riley said this week.

    So Wade stayed. And he has teamed with O'Neal to create a 1-2 punch that is rolling through the East, just as the Mavericks, with Dirk Nowitzki and Jason Terry, have dominated the West and look as if they will ultimately wear down the game, but small, Suns.

    That would set up a Miami-Dallas final, with everything the league could want - the Q rating of O'Neal, the style and scoring of Wade, and the international flavor of Nowitzki. And offense. Lots of offense, with scorers freed up to do what they do.

    For that, the commish will put up with Mark Cuban for a couple of weeks.

  3. #3
    The Timeless One Leetonidas's Avatar
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    I don't think so. We had to play that way because of the matchup. The Mavs are a good jumpshooting team and a good team around the rim and putting in Rasho or Nazr wasn't going to do much.

  4. #4
    Nostradamas Jr.
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    Pop thought so, obviously.


  5. #5
    5. timvp's Avatar
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    I don't think so. We had to play that way because of the matchup. The Mavs are a good jumpshooting team and a good team around the rim and putting in Rasho or Nazr wasn't going to do much.
    That is true. The Mavs presented matchup problems for the Spurs ... which led to adjustments.

    But looking at the big picture, you have three teams left who averaged 100 points during the regular season. Offense is winning more games this playoffs than any I've ever seen.

  6. #6
    The Timeless One Leetonidas's Avatar
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    Because the Spurs aren't playing. It's hard to contain the offense of the teams in the West. Dallas and Phoenix are the two most prolific scoring teams in the West so it's not always easy to contain the offense.

  7. #7
    Mahinmi in ? picnroll's Avatar
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    That's what I've thought for a while. The way the rules have changes and the refs are calling it is making it very difficult to stop middle penetration if the other team has outstanding penetrators. The Spurs defensive foundation of stopping middle penetration and channeling baseline is becoming much more difficult to exectue.

  8. #8
    Get Refuel! FromWayDowntown's Avatar
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    I don't think we'll see the old grind it out persona that the Spurs had through about 2003, but I'm not sure we've really seen that as a truly consistent theme since the 2003 Finals. Popovich realized in 2004 that he had a group that was more offensively explosive than anything he had between 1999 and 2003. He has adjusted -- to a degree -- to permit more offense and settle for a bit less defense. There have been matchups that dictated a more defensive-oriented effort (the 2005 Finals, for example), but I think Pop has understood that the days of holding everyone under 90 and keeping shooting percentages in the low 40's are gone. The league won't allow teams to play that way anymore.

    This season reminded me -- to a degree, at least -- of the 1999-2000 season in the sense that the Spurs seemed to struggle with holding on to their old iden y in a league that is changing. As was true after the 2000 playoffs, I think the Spurs will find a way to evolve. That evolution, I think, is embodied in Pop's identification of "a Derrick McKey type" as the model for what he seeks this off-season; it indicates to me that Pop thinks that defense still wins, but that it's a different kind of defense. It's a more athletic defense that will prioritize rebounding over blocking or changing shots. It's a more athletic defense that will emphasize rotations to deny penetration. It's a more flexible defense that isn't prone to falling into gross mismatches.

    The dynamism on offense doesn't change the fact that the Spurs with Tim Duncan will always play inside-out. Even with the changes in the league, the Spurs were thisclose to beating the likely West Champion and doing so by almost grossly emphasizing an inside-out game and allowing Duncan to exploit single coverage. The issue, I think, arises with how the Spurs respond to situations against opponents with bigs who are good enough to defend Duncan one-on-one: teams like Detroit (Rasheed Wallace) and Orlando (Howard and Darko), for example. It would be helpful to the Spurs offensive effort to find someone in the second group who can take people off the bounce and attack the rim, if only to create spot-up opportunities for shooters and to draw defenders away from Duncan. I don't see that as being a monumental tweak, though.

  9. #9
    Mr. Dignity Solid D's Avatar
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    They'll have to adjust for certain teams. They actually had to last year also with PHX but they beat the Suns at their own game in the WCF.

    I still remember the OT reg. season game when Pop went with Tim, Bruce, Brent, Manu and Beno the 2nd half (with TP playing sparingly because he wasn't doing well that game)

  10. #10
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    We were not exactly routed out of the playoffs. Is it possible we are making too much of losing in the last second of game 7? Would you be pursuing "solving the Spurs great problem" if Manu had not fouled Dirk or perhaps made his shot, or even if Tim gets the rebound and slams it home.

    You'd be like me and the rest of us with this assumption: WE are starting a dynasty! No! Spurs basketball is not dead.

    I think it was a great season, with lots of thrills and things to be proud of about our team. And that seventh game against the Mavs was a thriller. One team had to lose.
    Our season is over.

  11. #11
    bandwagoner fans suck ducks's Avatar
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    I like pop but if spurs basketball is dead do spurs need to bring in guy that is more famous for his o then d? the spurs o was fine in the playoffs though.
    mike brown who is more of a d guy is thinking of bringing in a o guy...

  12. #12
    Basketball Expertise spurster's Avatar
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    The Spurs didn't have a bigman who could guard other perimeter bigmen or rotate quickly enough. Neither TD nor Horry showed much lateral quickness, and the other Spurs bigmen were too slow or too dumb. It's not like this is a completely new thing to deal with: Rasheed Wallace, Chris Webber (as a King), Robert Horry (as a Laker), in addition to Dirk are/were perimeter bigmen, at least in part. One might argue that TD of previous years was also, though not at the 3-point line.

  13. #13
    Stuck In La La Land
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    Aside from finding the player(s) Pop may want next season, he will spend the summer developing a new hybrid defense designed to counter the rule changes rather than embrace a new offensive and defensive philosophy. A hybrid that addresses one of the fundamental problems the Spurs defense had in these playoffs...mis-matches created by switching defensively. Whether it be a type of match-up zone in certain areas on the floor or whatever, I think he will still stick to his tenets of defense and believe that for every offense tweak there is a defensive counter...you just have to find it.

  14. #14
    bandwagoner fans suck ducks's Avatar
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    certain times against mavs in game 5-7 they showed signes they could d up going small

    I think that is what they will practice during training camp

  15. #15
    Mahinmi in ? picnroll's Avatar
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    The way it's going with Stern they ought to just eliminate the Defensive Player of the Year award.

  16. #16
    License to Lillard tlongII's Avatar
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    God I hope so!

  17. #17
    Mr. Dignity Solid D's Avatar
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    The Spurs will adjust but remember, the Spurs only lost 19 regular season games (team record) in this new era. They lost one more game than Detroit, who doesn't exactly play non-traditional ball, nor do the Heat.

  18. #18
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    I don't think there's anything wrong with Pop's "both ends" system.

    As long as we have Tim, it's gonna be inside-out.

    Spurs defense suffered this year because Tim had PF-limited mobility, and no other front court guy was worth a or played enough (Rasho) to really help Tim. But I think the Spurs overall game suffered because of some mental/at ude/toughness problem. LJ says they weren't tested, but , WTF were the Mavs and Kings coming into ATT late in the season other than tune-up test for the playoffs? Letting Magic beat us @ATT? In April? The Spurs seemed to just shrug their shoulders and say "whatever" rather than stepping it up in March and April as it were June.

    Spurs lost nearly every big/statement game last season, sometimes lost solidly.

    If what LJ is saying is really case that 99-05 Spurs basketball is dead, then Bruce is dead meat. His perimiter defense will no longer effective, and his offense is, on average, non-existent, so " 'bye, Bruce. ".

    Before the Spurs chuck everything out the door to become the Suns, I'd like to see "Spurs basketball" one more season, but with Tim 100%, with some real front-court help from a Robertas/Luis/other. But above all, with the Spurs showing some Championship mentality.

    While the rules have changed on-the-ball perimeter defense, the defenders off-the-ball can still play their men tight, hassle the passing lanes, play good position defense, rotate quickly, and ING HUSTLE THE BOARDS!

  19. #19
    Mr. John Wayne CosmicCowboy's Avatar
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    The rules will continue to be tweaked to give offensive slashers the advantage. You can't funnel slashers baseline if you can't touch them and moving screens/picks are "wink wink" allowed. Spurs defense as we know it WILL change but I am confident that building around our core of Tim, Tony, and Manu that the Spurs will be very compe ive for the foreseeable future.

  20. #20
    Spurs are Lottery Bound. SequSpur's Avatar
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    The Spurs won 63 games this year and 3 championships the Spurs way.

    Is this another attempt of letting Popovich off the hook with the illusion of a changing game?

    I declare Bull again and again.

    Pop didn't adjust, he lost the series.

    Try again.

  21. #21
    Believe.
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    Aside from finding the player(s) Pop may want next season, he will spend the summer developing a new hybrid defense designed to counter the rule changes rather than embrace a new offensive and defensive philosophy. A hybrid that addresses one of the fundamental problems the Spurs defense had in these playoffs...mis-matches created by switching defensively. Whether it be a type of match-up zone in certain areas on the floor or whatever, I think he will still stick to his tenets of defense and believe that for every offense tweak there is a defensive counter...you just have to find it.

  22. #22
    Europe's #1 Spurs Fan alamo50's Avatar
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    Only when we play Dallas and Phoenix...............according to Pop.

  23. #23
    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ TheSanityAnnex's Avatar
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    The NBA is agaisnt Spurs Basketball
    Doesn't Spurs basketball also include Parker and Ginobli getting to the rim?

  24. #24
    Spurs Homer. D'oh! MadDog73's Avatar
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    Doesn't Spurs basketball also include Parker and Ginobli getting to the rim?

    Yeah, I agree. Spurs basketball is changing. The minute Pop let Tony and Manu create and make mistakes (for better or for worse), old "Spurs" basketball was dead...

    Offensively, the Spurs have been an inside-out team. Recently the guards have gotten more involved, but the Spurs still win or lose with the play of Tim Duncan down low.
    I was watching the 2003 Championship tapes, and was struck by how many times 3-point shooting saved our ass. Jackson, Kerr, Bowen, Horry, just to name a few.

    Duncan will get his, but how many times as he hit the game-winning shot? I mean, it happens, don't get me wrong, but it seems many times in a pivital game, the Spurs win (or lose) based on their 3-point shooting.

    And sure, Tim opens it up for that. By no means am I dissing Tim here. I'm just saying, I think Spurs Championship Basketball as always been about the team, the role-players stepping up and making plays, that one shot that either goes in.... or doesn't.

    Dallas shot lights out against us, and we lost. We can go back and forth about why that happened, but in the end, Dallas made their shots (and some very tough ones, at that). Of course, the Spurs could play better defense. But, I truly believe if the refs are calling the games differently (a very real possibility), then the Spurs will adjust ( , they HAVE been adjusting) to retake the Championship again.

  25. #25
    themvp's Avatar
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    The Spurs won 63 games this year and 3 championships the Spurs way.

    Is this another attempt of letting Popovich off the hook with the illusion of a changing game?

    I declare Bull again and again.

    Pop didn't adjust, he lost the series.

    Try again.

    +1

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