Reassessing the Roster After the Spurs Win the Victor Wembanyama Lottery

[RC_Drunkford]

no way Wemby is coming off the bench

[mo7888]

Spurs might add a flashy FA or move up in the draft and it wouldn't surprise me. But I think the realistic expectation is to retain corporate knowledge in true Spurs fashion. If so the roster is largely set:

Jones/Graham/Wesley
Vassell/Branham
Johnson/McDermott/Bates-Diop/[Champagnie]
Sochan/Wembanyama/Mamu/[Barlow]
Zollins/Bassey/(Birch)

That's 14 so if they pick #33 and keep the preexisting two-ways they get one more two-way and then that's it. Just don't see a big Jaylen Brown type splash but not against it and not ruling anything out. Could see a smaller typical SA move like stealing Jaxson Hayes to fortify the bigs rotation.

I think Spurs have enough ball handlers already outside just some additional depth to optimize.

Spurs are better than they look, people are tainted by the tank season but that was deliberate losing efforts and even still look at the Nuggets game late season. NBA Finals future DEN was full strength and played hard and Spurs hung with the big dogs. I think people are underestimating the pre existing core a lot and getting dazzle eyes for a big splashy move but maybe we already got our guys barring some PG and C depth optimization.

I have been trying to solve the starting 5 and have settled on Victor off the bench. Retains the best chemistry starting 5 (Jones, Vassell, Johnson, Sochan, Zollins), resolves the issue of playing people out of position (Sochan is not a PG, Victor is not a C), preserves the wear and tear management of Victor, and bolsters the bench.

Eventually working Victor to the Starting 5 asap but at least starting out it's a great way to ease in and see what you've got both with Victor as well as the surrounding complimentary pieces.

Another issue no one has mentioned is foul trouble. Victor is going to be an incredible player on the court but he's only got 6 fouls just like everyone else and he is no use to SA benched in foul trouble. If you play Victor at C, or if you start Victor against NBA starters, he is liable to rack up quick fouls. Bring him off the bench at first to help manage this until it shows it's not a problem. And run Victor at PF or SF. With Victor as PF you run a 4:3 P&R with a SF as the roll guy and let Victor stay out of the paint and be a quarterback hub for the offense. Branham cutters fed by Victor.

Seems so unorthodox to not start a #1 pick so I don't think I've seen many suggest this, but it would be true Spurs fashion to pull this and once you get over the optics it's a really workable solution that checks the most boxes. Try it out in your sims and see.

There's no way a #1 pick is coming off the bench...and even moreso this #1 pick..

[heyheymymy]

Welp back to the drawing board then. I'm agreeable that the suggestion to bring a #1 off the bench initially temporarily is outlandish for sure.

Just still trying out different roster looks at first and liked this one for the functionality of it but tradition/appearances truly are so heavily weighted in this league.

Victor still has the same max carve out of mins reasonably allowed to him in both sim scenarios- starting 5 or off bench. He's still getting his mins either way fwiw.

[KobesAchilles]

Yeah you don’t fit your franchise player around a 21 win team by having him come off the bench for chemistry issues. You fit ur team around the franchise player so you know who to keep or who needs to work on what. “Chemistry” is whoever tf fits around Wemby not the other way around

[MultiTroll]

Will Durant try to force a trade to the Spurs now?

[Extra Stout]

Wemby needs shooters. Jeremy Sochan needs to have a jump shot.

[heyheymymy]

haha alright apologies for the take I'll walk it back. It's just not an option.

To be fair I did say only at first: "Eventually working Victor to the Starting 5 asap but at least starting out"

Good problem to have though, pushing some talent to the bench at this point regardless who it is barring new personnel.

[heyheymymy]

Well you're still benching a top ten pick either way, or playing a Spur out of position so I don't see the riddle solved yet but clearly there are some non-negotiables. Obvs #1 trumps all but there's still questions in any current configuration barring new personnel.

[Mugen]

Don't waste a roster spot on Dieng tbh, wtf

[rjv]

i'd rather keep branham than jones and, as for wesley, it seems as if how far he goes with the spurs may be in his own hands. i was concerned about vasssell's knees before the spurs even secured the rights to draft wemby but i'd love to see him stay healthy and secure his spot with this roster. there are a lot of questions towards the end of the roster and that doesn't even include figuring in the question of whether or not there are any free agents out there that the spurs may be considering, which i assume will be the subject of a forthcoming ST piece.

[rjv]

Timvp touched on it, but it bears repeating: Wembanyama turned Dougie from a "trade now" guy into one of the most valuable players on the team. He will absolutely punish teams for doubling Victor, and he can be covered on the defensive end. Before the draft lottery he was at the top of my to-trade list. Unless the Spurs are planning not to make the playoffs, he needs to stay at least until the deadline.

by which time, assuming dougie's overall play shows vast improvement, his value will have increased.

[KingKev]

not too high on wesley and hope the spurs do not choose him over - say langford - langfords defense is better than wesleys defense AND offense - COMBINED...

thanks for the write - up but i was hoping to read something about the spurs efforts to acquire another point guard in the draft?

are you serious? Wesley is 20 and on a rookie deal. Langford’s cap hold alone is >10mm.

[Spurs Homer]

are you serious? Wesley is 20 and on a rookie deal. Langford’s cap hold alone is >10mm.

kid cannot shoot
cannot finish drives
cannot play defense

but CAN be used to acquire a real point guard!

[rjv]

wesley's only trade value at this point in his career is as ballast on a trade including other players or picks. alone, he has no trade value.

[montgod]

https://www.spurstalk.com/reevaluati...or-wembanyama/

In reassessing, IMO, I think the Spurs need to be more stubborn about handing out long-term deals. Previously, I liked the idea of extending Vassell, Jones and Collins. Now? Man, I like the idea of having cap flexibility until we get a better read on what Wembanyama is currently and the best type of players to surround him with going forward.

- I agree that Spurs will probably only extend DVassell sooner than later. No need in rushing anyone else like Jones who will probably just have to go out and shop himself and Spurs will sit back and see if they match unless they offer him a lower than market contract ahead of time.

- McDermotts, I still feel he can be used in a draft day trade for cap space challenged playoff teams in exchange for similar type of player with contracts that might not be desirable. So like Bertans w/the 10th pick, or being a conduit to a Ayton trade for Dallas; Miami with DRobinson and 18th pick, etc. In a similar vein, Graham and Birch could be used in helping w/larger contracts but probably not as easy to move.

- Free agents, I just don't see any that jump out to fit in now with what I believe the Spurs are trying to do in building this time right and for the long haul. No need in throwing money away for older prime time players when it could possibly hurt your draft outcome and give minimal success for the year. Again, unless it's a trade w/other assets in return, I just don't see any significant adds that will happen outside of their own free agents (Jones, Mamu, Julian, Barlow). After the draft, things should get clearer to some degree.

[Mr. Body]

kid cannot shoot
cannot finish drives
cannot play defense

but CAN be used to acquire a real point guard!

He sucks! But other teams will want him!

weird logic

[heyheymymy]

Aren't we giving up on Blake Wesley too soon?

It's like knowing the cake takes 20-30 mins to bake and looking in the oven at 10 mins in but blaming the cake for still being mostly batter.

Was a #25 overall ever supposed to show you everything in year one? What if they kinda were until having a serious injury grade 3 MCL tear and missing several weeks. Blake only played 37 games last year due to injury. Missed an entire half the season.

Don't sleep on Wes yet imo tbh.

[exstatic]

- I agree that Spurs will probably only extend DVassell sooner than later. No need in rushing anyone else like Jones who will probably just have to go out and shop himself and Spurs will sit back and see if they match unless they offer him a lower than market contract ahead of time.

- McDermotts, I still feel he can be used in a draft day trade for cap space challenged playoff teams in exchange for similar type of player with contracts that might not be desirable. So like Bertans w/the 10th pick, or being a conduit to a Ayton trade for Dallas; Miami with DRobinson and 18th pick, etc. In a similar vein, Graham and Birch could be used in helping w/larger contracts but probably not as easy to move.

- Free agents, I just don't see any that jump out to fit in now with what I believe the Spurs are trying to do in building this time right and for the long haul. No need in throwing money away for older prime time players when it could possibly hurt your draft outcome and give minimal success for the year. Again, unless it's a trade w/other assets in return, I just don't see any significant adds that will happen outside of their own free agents (Jones, Mamu, Julian, Barlow). After the draft, things should get clearer to some degree.

There is a window to extend a FRP after their 3rd season. It runs from the opening of FA to the day before the season starts. That’s when Devin’s extension will get done, or not. His year 4 option was picked up, so, even if an extension gets done, it kicks in in July 2024.

[montgod]

I highly doubt that he would get the supermax from the Celtics. Other teams can obviously offer the max, but not the supermax. Add to that that we have cap space to utilize as long as Wemby is on a rookie deal and with the increasing cap the contract might look a lot better later down the line. Now I don't know if you can frontload that deal, but that would make it even better. I'm not stuck on Jaylen coming here and also think he's not worth the money, I'm just looking at that type of scenario. The Spurs can bring in a guy that they overpay until Wemby is due for his extension. Another reason why I'm saying they should frontload the contracts of "the other guys"

I agree with LeBowen, no way I see the Spurs going after Brown after this year unless Vassell and MBranham show absolutely zero which I'm 98% sure won't happen. Even still, I don't think he's a fit. They'd be moreso looking at PG and PF/C types imo w/some SG exceptions (ie in no order - Claxton, Haliburton, Ball, AEdwards, Sabonis, Quickley, Maxey, Osman, Kennard, Josh Green, Monk, IStewart, McDaniels, etc)

[montgod]

Aren't we giving up on Blake Wesley too soon?

It's like knowing the cake takes 20-30 mins to bake and looking in the oven at 10 mins in but blaming the cake for still being mostly batter.

Was a #25 overall ever supposed to show you everything in year one? What if they kinda were until having a serious injury grade 3 MCL tear and missing several weeks. Blake only played 37 games last year due to injury. Missed an entire half the season.

Don't sleep on Wes yet imo tbh.

I'm looking forward to see how he's improved this summer and training camp. I think he still has until his rookie deal is up to show something just like LWalker did. Spurs won't be lacking on talent after all their draft picks so he's got to show something by late next year imo.

[Mr. Body]

Aren't we giving up on Blake Wesley too soon?

It's like knowing the cake takes 20-30 mins to bake and looking in the oven at 10 mins in but blaming the cake for still being mostly batter.

Was a #25 overall ever supposed to show you everything in year one? What if they kinda were until having a serious injury grade 3 MCL tear and missing several weeks. Blake only played 37 games last year due to injury. Missed an entire half the season.

Don't sleep on Wes yet imo tbh.

Yes.

The board is all over the place on the roster. We have to trade for Jaylen Brown. We don't need any more guards. We have to chose between Vassell and Branham right now. We have to get Scoot Henderson or else.

Blake Wesley has a few major plusses in his favor. He's very fast. He's a good and willing defender. At least so far he's a good spot-up shooter. When kicking to shooters, he locates and places the passes pretty well.

Blake Wesley has a major, major detriment. Which is he gets his pushed in whenever he gets to the basket. He cannot elevate over them and gets stuck in the air every time, so bad it's embarrassing. Even when he avoids shotblockers, his touch around the basket is pretty bad.

Coming out of Notre Dame, his shot selection was horrible. In part because as a freshman he was forced to do everything for the team. That's actually improved a ton.

His big swing right now is whether he can figure out what to do once he drives. The silver lining is he blasts past his coverage a lot. Question is what he does after. To me, he just needs to slow down the processing, see his options, develop a floater, a stop-and-pop J, those sorts of things. I don't think his touch is quite as bad as we saw -- to me he was overthinking his finishes and concentrating on where he was.

So... I don't think he's that far away from being an effective player. Not to say he's going to make it. Not going to say it's right away. But his issues are clearly identifiable.

Now... what his ceiling is -- that's more my thing. I don't see him as a full-time starter. I see him as a potentially good rotation guard/undersize wing. I think there's a limit to how high he can get. For a 25 pick, that ain't too bad.

[Mr. Body]

I agree with LeBowen, no way I see the Spurs going after Brown after this year unless Vassell and MBranham show absolutely zero which I'm 98% sure won't happen. Even still, I don't think he's a fit. They'd be moreso looking at PG and PF/C types imo w/some SG exceptions (ie in no order - Claxton, Haliburton, Ball, Sabonis, Quickley, Maxey, Osman, JGreen, Monk, IStewart, McDaniels, etc)

You can get scoring guards all the time. They're everywhere in every draft.

[R. DeMurre]

No interest in Jaylen Brown at all. He'll want a max contract and to be the main focus of the offense as the vet/star. His impact and efficiency aren't nearly as high as his counting stats, his assist-to-turnover is mediocre, etc... I'd target two of Derrick White, Caleb Martin, Immanuel Quickley, Herb Jones, or even Austin Reaves types at reasonable prices before I'd ever max out Brown. Brown might be the main reason that Boston is very good but not great, and the danger in overpaying him is you lower your ceiling when it comes to championship aspirations.

[montgod]

There is a window to extend a FRP after their 3rd season. It runs from the opening of FA to the day before the season starts. That’s when Devin’s extension will get done, or not. His year 4 option was picked up, so, even if an extension gets done, it kicks in in July 2024.

Thanks for the clarification. Then yeah, Vassell will most likely be the largest contract given out this year imo. I just don't have a good read on how the FO feels about Jones long term. I could easily see them extending him affordably w/thought of him being a long term backup, but if other opportunities occur during draft and/or FA, I don't see him returning.

[montgod]

No interest in Jaylen Brown at all. He'll want a max contract and to be the main focus of the offense as the vet/star. His impact and efficiency aren't nearly as high as his counting stats, his assist-to-turnover is mediocre, etc... I'd target two of Derrick White, Caleb Martin, Immanuel Quickley, Herb Jones, or even Austin Reaves types at reasonable prices before I'd ever max out Brown. Brown might be the main reason that Boston is very good but not great, and the danger in overpaying him is you lower your ceiling when it comes to championship aspirations.

- Fully agree. I think the last game showed you what happens when JBrown is by himself w/no other offensive threat on the other side. JT was on the floor but not active w/his ankle so JBrown should have taken over but it was more of the other supporting cast that tried to pick up the slack (i.e. DWhite). So I'd pass especially because of how many assets you'd have to give up to get him. Not worth it.

- DWhite unfortunately will probably be past the timeline to sign him next year. And I can't see Boston not re-signing him quickly, probably before JBrown.
- AReaves is going to be pricey and not sure he fits in w/the Spurs. Not opposed but I think he overperformed this year. Lakers will overspend for him for sure.
- CMartin, he did well when he got minutes, but has like 2 yrs left after this year I believe. We will see how he plays w/Herro returns.