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The thing with Gerald Wallace if the Spurs throw money at him. He needs to learn how to stay healthy.
The problem is they don't have money to throw. Even if they somehow got two of Oberto, Finley, Horry or Bowen off the books, they still aren't really under the cap by much at all.
The thing with Gerald Wallace if the Spurs throw money at him. He needs to learn how to stay healthy.
I asked bb that same question...you guys are the cap experts not I.
If it's possible to get more than the MLE then they have an advantage over many teams.
Additionally, if they can get under the cap it opens up trade possiblities heretofore unseen.
If you take Bowen, Horry, Barry, Oberto, Finley, etc of the books that puts the Spurs cap figure at around 40 million I'd say...
Keep in mind that Bruce may be flexible...that leaves resigning Vaughn, using the draft picks or signing some of our overseas picks...
A-yup. He's like a little Corey Maggette in training as far as missing at least 20 games a year goes.
Around $44 million in a scorched-earth scenario where no Spur free agent would be allowed to come back and no amount of guaranteed salary would count for any of the players you mentioned. I simply don't think they could have pulled this off with that many players unlike the Ferry example where it was one guy who was going to retire anyway. It makes sense with Horry, but not anyone else.If you take Bowen, Horry, Barry, Oberto, Finley, etc of the books that puts the Spurs cap figure at around 40 million I'd say...
But in reality Bowen and Horry's partial guarantee amounts would count, right? As well as a certain amount counts against the cap for each open roster spot to a point.
So, really they'd still be around $50M, correct?
Finley could retire and work for the spurs coaching or FO team.At least he wouldn´t suck any worst tham on the court this year.
2007 MASTER PLAN
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whottt
Explain this...
"no amount of guranteed salary would count for any of the players you mentioned"
I simply don't think they could have pulled this off with that many players unlike the Ferry example where it was one guy who was going to retire anyway. It makes sense with Horry, but not anyone else.
It only has to make sense with Barry.
If they opt out with Bruce does that mean they can't resign him?
Who else would we want back?
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whottt
Maybe I am the only one impressed with what the Spurs FO did last offseason...but that doesn't mean it was something anyone else saw coming prior to the offseason.
SpursFO = ahead of the curve in tricks of the offseason as of this past offseason. Ahead of this board, ahead of the NBA.
Elson and Butler were 2 verifiable RFA steals for basically a MLE...
It was damned slick what they did.
We were talking about this in another thread yesterday. It depends if it's a team option with a partial guarantee if it's not picked up. Or there's no option with a partial guarantee if he's waived. Because if it's the latter, then he would have to clear waivers etc for the Spurs to re-sign him after they waive him.
What's the best case scenario?
Call it a hunch, but I have a feeling Bruce took one for the team if it was possible to do so.
If Elson pans out (and that's still an if at this point), then you'll be right. Althought him panning out would have to be defined as the Spurs doing serious damage in the postseason.
As for Butler, I would say right now it's 70-30 that Zeke >>> Spurs on domestic talent once again.
The best case scenario is the former - that it's a team option with a partial guarantee. Then I guess that they could just not pick up the option and re-sign him for less money per year but more than one year (just like he did last time when he had a player option year). If the scenario is the latter, then I don't think they would just waive him and have someone else pick him up off waivers.
He also needs to learn how to shoot and handle the ball, and basically do everything except run and jump. Gerald Wallace is the Stromile Swift of SFs.
I don't see how Spurs can be by more than the MLE under the cap this summer.
Spurs payroll should be under $50M this summer (the MLE is about $5M and the salary cap will be at around $55M).
Let's take the base case scenario :
- Barry last year is a team option.
- Finley and Oberto opt out.
- Spurs dump Beno to a team.
- Spurs releases Horry and Bowen.
Spurs payroll will be :
Duncan + Parker + Manu + Elson + Butler = $45M
You should add to that unsigned first round picks that count agaisnt the cap : $800K*2 = $1.6M (Mahinmi + 07 first round pick)
You should too fill the roster to 12 with minimum contracts. $400k*5 = $2M
So it make a payroll of $48.6M without counting Horry's and Bowen's guaranteed money.
If Spurs do moves this summer : it will be with trades or with the MLE.
WTF?
I don't even understand this thread. How exactly is timvp going to get owned? Because the Spurs are going to be magically under the cap this summer?
Duncan - $19M
Parker - $10.5M
Ginobili - $9.1M
Barry - $5.6M
Elson - $3M
Butler - $2.3M
Udrih - $1.7M
That arleady is $51.2M and means that the Spurs would only have the MLE. Count in the rest . . .
Oberto - $2.5M
Bowen - $2M (if the Spurs waive him)
Horry - $1.5M (if the Spurs waive him)
That's now $57.2 and that's being generous on how little guaranteed money Horry has on his contract. Then after that Finley has a $3M+ option. And none of this is counting re-signing Bonner or Ely.
In other words, whottt is talking out of his azz if he thinks that the Spurs are going far enough under the salary cap to have something more than the MLE to spend. What's funny is he admits to not being a "cap guy", so who knows where he got this idea.
Even the most fairy tale of estimates where only Duncan, Parker, Manu, Elson, Butler and Udrih are left, with $3M buyouts due to Horry and Bowen, that puts the Spurs at $48.6M. Add in cap penalty for having only six players under contract (6 X $412,718) and the Spurs would be at $51.1M. That's not even close to being under the cap enough to have anything other than the MLE.
Apology Accepted.
Yes, everyone bookmark this thread.
Please.
I like timvp. He is smart.
What I want the Spurs to do, and what I've been begging them to do, is to forget about the 2008 Master Plan and go out this summer and do whatever it takes to put the best team on the floor. Forget opening cap space, just go into the summer with the idea that the number one priority is to put a championship team on the court.
How they could do that is by trading any number of their expiring contracts for players with multi-year contracts. Even if that means eating some bad salaries in the 2012-13 season, so be it.
The Spurs have the tools to bring in some good players this summer. They have tons of expiring contracts, tons of draft picks and tons of overseas players. There is no excuse to not go out there and make moves to bring in the needed players.
The only thing that would stop them would be the 2008 Master Plan or Holt being too cheap to sign off on more multi-year contracts.
That's the reality of the situation. whottt can believe in the Cap Space Fairy if he wants, but this is the troof.
So what you are saying is that you want the Spurs to compete for a championship right away.
Hmm...that's just crazy enough to work!
Seriously...I would have to agree with timvp...the Spurs can do this...the question is will they. Its time for the FO to be aggressive.
WTF?
I don't even understand this thread. How exactly is timvp going to get owned? Because the Spurs are going to be magically under the cap this summer?
Duncan - $19M
Parker - $10.5M
Ginobili - $9.1M
Barry - $5.6M
Elson - $3M
Butler - $2.3M
Udrih - $1.7M
That arleady is $51.2M and means that the Spurs would only have the MLE. Count in the rest . . .
Oberto - $2.5M
Bowen - $2M (if the Spurs waive him)
Horry - $1.5M (if the Spurs waive him)
That's now $57.2 and that's being generous on how little guaranteed money Horry has on his contract. Then after that Finley has a $3M+ option. And none of this is counting re-signing Bonner or Ely.
In other words, whottt is talking out of his azz if he thinks that the Spurs are going far enough under the salary cap to have something more than the MLE to spend. What's funny is he admits to not being a "cap guy", so who knows where he got this idea.
Even the most fairy tale of estimates where only Duncan, Parker, Manu, Elson, Butler and Udrih are left, with $3M buyouts due to Horry and Bowen, that puts the Spurs at $48.6M. Add in cap penalty for having only six players under contract (6 X $412,718) and the Spurs would be at $51.1M. That's not even close to being under the cap enough to have anything other than the MLE.
Apology Accepted.
Spurs have draft picks and foreign talent to use in a trade to get them further under the cap or in a S&T.
The callout is because you and MB have accused the Spurs of biding their time until 08....
I say that won't happen and there will be major moves this offseason to shore up the Spurs problem areas(IMO, SF)....owning you and MB in the process. Don't act like you haven't backed MB up on this...you've been bumping his 08 threads all year.
Are you saying packaging draft picks and foreign talent with current players in a trade?
For the record, I think that whatever the Spurs do this summer, they'll end up with just the MLE and LLE to spend in free agency -- and I don't think they'll use them both. They might trade some people to try to upgrade, but in free agency I don't think they are going to have money to spend.
Uh, I've been calling for the end of the 2008 plan. That means I want them to trade this summer and I have dozens of posts stating that.
I'll admit to getting owned if the Spurs somehow have more money to spend this summer than the MLE. Otherwise, you just owned yourself on this thread.
I want the Spurs to forget about the summer of 2008 and make trades this offseason. That's what I've been asking for all along. You saying you want the Spurs to make trades this offseason isn't exactly a new idea ... it's what I've talked about all season.
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