The Demonizing of Illegal Immigrants

[nsrammstein]

Even crimnals are eligible for Parole for good behavior why not let these ''criminals'' have 2nd chance? even rapist or murderers are eligible for parole after a certain number of years and good behavior.

[SRJ]

There is no excuse to allow America to be solely responsible for this problem. So far we have shouldered the entire burden, and it has to stop. There are both positives and negatives to immigration for the US, but tell me one significant way it hurts Mexico.

IMO, hold the Mexican govt responsible and American businesses responsible and this problem will be dramatically lessened.

Thank you very much.

[Phenomanul]

For everyone making the same point...




Here it is as clearly as I am capable of stating it:

Murder is a crime.
Stealing is a crime.
Public intoxication is a crime.
These are all criminal actions,
and those who commit crimes
are criminals. While it is true
that murder is much worse
than either public intoxication
or stealing, they are all crimes
nonetheless.

Illegal aliens are not (usually)
murderers, rapists, or even
public drunks, but they are
criminals nonetheless. No
matter how badly they
suffer, no matter how good
their intentions are, illegal
aliens are committing a crime.

Do you forgive a man for holding up a bank if he's just trying to improve his family's situation?

That right there is the crux of our impasse. Your perspective on the matter lacks compassion and understanding... I mean, why would you s it out? These people mean nothing to you... they are beneath you... they don't deserve to breathe the air we breathe or even to set foot in this glorious nation.

We get it (you didn't have to enlarge the font for us to understand this underlying philosphy governed your thinking).

[Phenomanul]

I must go now.... have somewhere to be.

Besides, changing peoples' minds was never the intent of this forum... I won't however, tolerate the slander of innocent people (the majority are not iden y thieves people - their one true crime). Especially when this sector of society is indirectly responsible for improving my own cost of living.

[SRJ]

That right there is the crux of our impasse. Your perspective on the matter lacks compassion and understanding... I mean, why would you s it out? These people mean nothing to you... they are beneath you... they don't deserve to breathe the air we breathe or even to set foot in this glorious nation.

We get it (you didn't have to enlarge the font for us to understand this underlying philosphy governed your thinking).

Yep, that's exactly right. I want people to suffer.

Here, let me distort your viewpoint now.

We should just have open borders everywhere. In fact, we shouldn't have nations. And you know, we shouldn't ever observe the law if someone is trying to feed their family. In fact, I hope someone with a starving family mugs me tonight. I won't press charges.

[SRJ]

I won't however, tolerate the slander of innocent people.

Yeah! You tell 'em! Uh, tell me!

[peewee's lovechild]

I don't particularly want a wall on either border; I want adequate security. If that means putting up a wall here or there so be it.

Rep. Solomon Ortiz, a Democrat and ex-Border Patrolman, said in Texas Monthly that you don't need a wall across the entire southern border, but you do need a wall in a few spots. I hope Ortiz isn't a racist for saying so.

First of all, Ortiz is an idiot (I know, I've met the man) who has the benefit of representing a purely Democratic cons uency where no one who ever opposes him during election.

I know, I lived in his region.

Secondly, just what good to build only a few walls??
Really, that's just the height of idiocy.

Explain, if you can, the effectiveness of having only a few walls instead of one long wall on the entire southern border.

But, you never answered my question about a border on the Canadian front.
Do you, or don't you support walling up the northern border with Canada??

Explain your answer either way.

[peewee's lovechild]

You are fooling yourself if you think not having illegals here doesn't help the cost of living big time, I am a brick/block/stone mason, if there were no illegals it would cost twice as much for a block wall, or stone work, three times as much for any kind of brick work, Americans are too lazy to do the work I do, (I'm Canadian). You just don't see many white workers in my field.

Just curious:

Do you ever face the same type of xenophobia that our darker friends from the south face?

Or, do they tell you that you should go back home to Canada because you're taking American jobs?

[peewee's lovechild]

Stealing someone else iden y is not illegal? How would
you like it if they stole yours and screwed up your life?

Those that come into the country illegally break the law
at least twice, once from entering the country illegally
and again when they take someone else's iden y.

It is also an insult to those that try to do it right and
come into the country legally. Or is it okay by you
to have someone cut in the line ahead of you?

I don't understand why you relatives have such a hard
time coming here to visit. I know many from out of
country to visit have no trouble at all.

When I was working at UT-Brownsville, there was a guy who stole over a thousand social security numbers from the university database. People panicked and some had to change their ssn.

The guy who did it was white.

He was arrested and charged with a couple of felonies.

It's too bad he wasn't Mexican . . . it sure would have backed up your theory.

[peewee's lovechild]

Why Joe? Those people entering were doing so legally.
And some weren't admitted. Learn your history before
trying to make a mockery of the term immigrants.
Illegal is illegal. There is no such thing as human rights
or rights for those that come illegally. They are law
breakers just like a robber. They also rob, rob other
people of their iden y.

You should make a flow chart and draw out what people weren't admitted to the U.S.

It would be pretty high on white Europeans and very low on other races.

How many peoples from Africa have been turned away, aside from the ones that were forced to be here of course?
I'm curious.

[xrayzebra]

There isn't a simple answer to immigration in the United States. For some reason many people believe that the American society cannot survive without these "illegal" people working for us. Before this summer I was always one of these people who believe that no matter what happened, if someone came into the United States without going through legal processes should be thrown out without question. I really don't have anything to say on the recent immigration news, but I would like to share a little story with all of you. You can read it, skip over it, or even call my bull , but it has really affected my "Get them all out of here!" opinion."

About two weeks ago a parent came up as my elementary students were coming in to their last day of camp. One of my co-workers asked for me to come up and listen to a conversation she and a parent were having, just to be clear because it was in Spanish. We talked for a little bit and the mom, who has 5th grade twin boys with the biggest at udes in the world, says, in broken English, "I don't think the boys are going to be here tomorrow." In my rushed actions I shrugged it off because it was the last day. I said, "It's okay, it's the last day." She responded with..."My husband was taken back to Mexico by immigration." I had a shocked look on my face. I would never have thought of it. We went through the day with a heavy heart, just because I knew it was a family. They seem tight knit and loving. I hugged and held on to the boys just to let them know I was there for them. I even asked the more mature one if he was alright with what was going on with his father. He just told me "He's on vacation in mexico."


heir mom came in with their cousins and little sister close to pick them up and their mother came up to talk to me. I embraced her and told her things would get better. Through her tears we talked and she told me their story. It was a story of uncertainty. That's what I never though of before. The United States brings some sort of certainty to these families lives. Whether they're here for a few weeks or for nine years working towards their visas, there is a pay-check and food...if they find a good job. This family of five had rent to pay ($480 a month), school to get ready for, and all those other things I can't think of. The mother was just so unsure of what to come she couldn't keep it together any longer. She was so strong, so powerful, so amazing. I admire her now. Before she was just a mother.

The church secretary came over to talk with us to make sure all over things were taken came of, that the boys would have clothes, a place to live, food, etc. The boys and sister grabbed their end of the day activities and started to leave. I hugged the two of them and shed a tear for their uncertainty. After my co-workers and I gathered our composure, the less mature one of the two came in to get our phone numbers. As we gathered around him we realized that the boys knew what was going on. They knew he was gone, they knew they weren't going to talk to their father for a long time, and they knew he could be in Mexico, in jail. There was nothing they could do. We hugged the smaller boy and he started to cry, knowing that we wouldn't see him again. We cried with him, with all the same uncertainty as he had. As he left we saw the other boy and hugged and cried with both of them.


I now see the personal side of this issue. I know this issue is too large to see every single story, and it's like any other issue, a few stories will get lots of attention, but I'm just asking that anyone who has the mentality that everyone who somehow gets into the United States to do that so called "work Americans don't want to do" or even the work we do want to do, that we think about the families, the children, and their futures.

Your story is touching. But, how is it the fault of the
United States that someone who comes into the U.S.
illegally and gets caught and sent back home and it
breaks up his/her family. Why cant the whole family
return with the illegal person? Even if the person who
marries the illegal is legal, aren't they aware that this
may be consequence of their marriage?

Oh, but the conditions that live in when they return will
be terrible. Sorry, but that again is not the fault of the
United States.

People keep talking about human rights. What in the
world is human rights? Someone care to explain that
to me. Is it to have a good job? Decent housing?
Two cars? A color TV? Football on Saturday/Sunday
afternoon. You as an American citizen aren't even
guaranteed that. All you are guaranteed is the
"pursuit of happiness" and even that can be defined
in any number of ways. We, as U.S. citizens have
certain rights, as defined by the cons ution. The
other so called rights are what people "think" they have.
The government does not create wealth or happiness. It
takes money from the producers and redistributes it
in any number of ways. By force is necessary and will
take your home, vehicles and bank account to raise that
money. Nice rights, huh? (is that a violation of your human rights) And I might add does government ever
ask you if you can afford the pay those taxes. Nope
they take their cut up front.

Those that come to the United States illegally are
fully aware of the risk they are taking. And obviously
willing to take those risk to improve their lot in life. But
even in Mexico and any number of other countries they
have the same basic rights as we do. They don't flee
their country to find basic rights, just to improve their
plight. And unfortunately you have situations where they
attempt to raise a family as you describe knowing full
well what the consequences may be. I understand know
it isn't a good situation but it is not one of my making or
the governments making. It is a situation brought on
by the actions of the illegal.

[SRJ]

Since you addressed Ortiz, I don't know how you missed this answer, since it was in the same post. I'll repost it:

I don't particularly want a wall on either border; I want adequate security. If that means putting up a wall here or there so be it.

So the opinion of an ex-Border Patrolman, a man who has actual firsthand experience about this issue, is irrelevant? Consider this your chance to educate me about Congressman Ortiz, as I didn't live in his district as you did.

If he's an idiot, I need evidence. I'm not prepared to accept your word just yet, but I am receptive to the case against.

[peewee's lovechild]

For everyone making the same point...




Here it is as clearly as I am capable of stating it:

Murder is a crime.
Stealing is a crime.
Public intoxication is a crime.
These are all criminal actions,
and those who commit crimes
are criminals. While it is true
that murder is much worse
than either public intoxication
or stealing, they are all crimes
nonetheless.

Illegal aliens are not (usually)
murderers, rapists, or even
public drunks, but they are
criminals nonetheless. No
matter how badly they
suffer, no matter how good
their intentions are, illegal
aliens are committing a crime.

Do you forgive a man for holding up a bank if he's just trying to improve his family's situation?

How absolutely very Christian of you.

I'm sure Jesus is looking down on you with a smile.

[peewee's lovechild]

Since you addressed Ortiz, I don't know how you missed this answer, since it was in the same post. I'll repost it:



So the opinion of an ex-Border Patrolman, a man who has actual firsthand experience about this issue, is irrelevant? Consider this your chance to educate me about Congressman Ortiz, as I didn't live in his district as you did.

If he's an idiot, I need evidence. I'm not prepared to accept your word just yet, but I am receptive to the case against.

He was asked about his voting record in the House and he said that he didn't keep count of his vote (he said all this in broken english). It turned out that he only voted twice during that particular session.

Yea, he's a great man and his opinion really counts.

[peewee's lovechild]

You still haven't told me about your opinion on the Canadian border.

Both borders are porous, although the Canadian border isn't patrolled as heavily as the Mexican border. Which, in turn, means that it is easier to cross the Canadian border and do some damage in the U.S.A.

Yet, Congress and the rest of America is concerned with putting a wall only on the Mexican border.

I'd just like to see you say that the Canadian border should be treated the same as the Mexican border.

Will you agree with that?

[nsrammstein]

We are all murderers we've all stepped on a bug or squashed a mosquito before

[peewee's lovechild]

We are all murderers we've all stepped on a bug or squashed a mosquito before

When it comes to insects, I'm a mass murderer.

I'm freaking serial.

I hate insects.
I want to promote insect holocaust.
The world would be better of without insects.

In my opinion, that is.

[CuckingFunt]

When it comes to insects, I'm a mass murderer.

I'm freaking serial.

I hate insects.
I want to promote insect holocaust.
The world would be better of without insects.

In my opinion, that is.

Agreed.

With the exception of bees and the whole pollenation thing, the only real purpose of insects is to kill other insects. Eliminate them all, and problem's solved.

Bees can stay for honey.

And ladybugs, dragonflies and mantises can all stay 'cause they're cool looking.

The rest are gone.

[nsrammstein]

Your story is touching. But, how is it the fault of the
United States that someone who comes into the U.S.
illegally and gets caught and sent back home and it
breaks up his/her family. Why cant the whole family
return with the illegal person? Even if the person who
marries the illegal is legal, aren't they aware that this
may be consequence of their marriage?

Oh, but the conditions that live in when they return will
be terrible. Sorry, but that again is not the fault of the
United States.

People keep talking about human rights. What in the
world is human rights? Someone care to explain that
to me. Is it to have a good job? Decent housing?
Two cars? A color TV? Football on Saturday/Sunday
afternoon. You as an American citizen aren't even
guaranteed that. All you are guaranteed is the
"pursuit of happiness" and even that can be defined
in any number of ways. We, as U.S. citizens have
certain rights, as defined by the cons ution. The
other so called rights are what people "think" they have.
The government does not create wealth or happiness. It
takes money from the producers and redistributes it
in any number of ways. By force is necessary and will
take your home, vehicles and bank account to raise that
money. Nice rights, huh? (is that a violation of your human rights) And I might add does government ever
ask you if you can afford the pay those taxes. Nope
they take their cut up front.

Those that come to the United States illegally are
fully aware of the risk they are taking. And obviously
willing to take those risk to improve their lot in life. But
even in Mexico and any number of other countries they
have the same basic rights as we do. They don't flee
their country to find basic rights, just to improve their
plight. And unfortunately you have situations where they
attempt to raise a family as you describe knowing full
well what the consequences may be. I understand know
it isn't a good situation but it is not one of my making or
the governments making. It is a situation brought on
by the actions of the illegal.

Some people are just living in this fantasy world where everyone will be legal and no one will commit any crime or heaven forbid cut in the restaurant line, it ain't gona happen why? because the demand for labor is great in this country and as long as there is a demand for hard labor illegal immigrants are going to keep coming here. Unless we make the requirements for a work visa less demanding we will keep having illegals here.

[peewee's lovechild]

Agreed.

With the exception of bees and the whole pollenation thing, the only real purpose of insects is to kill other insects. Eliminate them all, and problem's solved.

Bees can stay for honey.

And ladybugs, dragonflies and mantises can all stay 'cause they're cool looking.

The rest are gone.

I hate the way mantises stare at me.
They give me that "I'll kill you in your sleep" look.

I hate them.

I don't consider bees insects.
They're cool.

Honey is so much better than sugar.

[CuckingFunt]

I hate the way mantises stare at me.
They give me that "I'll kill you in your sleep" look.

I hate them.

[peewee's lovechild]

Some people are just living in this fantasy world where everyone will be legal and no one will commit any crime or heaven forbid cut in the restaurant line, it ain't gona happen why? because the demand for labor is great in this country and as long as there is a demand for hard labor illegal immigrants are going to keep coming here. Unless we make the requirements for a work visa less demanding we will keep having illegals here.

Dude, do you even realise how much money it costs to go the legal route???
me!!

They are asking Mexicans, and others from 3rd world countries, to pay up thousands just so their applications can be considered.

I know people who paid all of thier fees and then the government says, "thanks, but no thanks." There's no refunds if they should no be accepted.

So, if you can come in for free by any means possible and avoid paying thousands of dollars just so you can be rejected (eventhough employers are dying to get to you), of course you're going to do it.

[peewee's lovechild]

I almost stabbed my screen with a spoon!!!

[nsrammstein]

Dude, do you even realise how much money it costs to go the legal route???
me!!

They are asking Mexicans, and others from 3rd world countries, to pay up thousands just so their applications can be considered.

I know people who paid all of thier fees and then the government says, "thanks, but no thanks." There's no refunds if they should no be accepted.

So, if you can come in for free by any means possible and avoid paying thousands of dollars just so you can be rejected (eventhough employers are dying to get to you), of course you're going to do it.

Yeah I heard its close to $500 dollars just to get an application! lol

[peewee's lovechild]

Yeah I heard its close to $500 dollars just to get an application! lol

$500 for the app.
$500 for the background check.
$200 for pics and other items I'm forgetting at the moment.

$2,000 for residency.

And, $500 for citizen app (if you should want citizenship).