Thats exactly what I'm talking about when i say they should tweak the ROTATION rather than the starting lineup. The Spurs never did anything drastic to the starting lineup last year but they re-aranged minutes on the bench by giving JV a shot and there you go. They did nothing drastic, just tweaked the bench a bit and I thinks thats what they should do now by giving Ime some more playing time.
Read it more carefully T Park. It's about getting some flow back into the offence early, and using Bruce in a more targetted fashion. And it's not a matter of "wanting", it's a matter of ideas about where to go from here.
@ everyone wanting Bowen to be benched
There are about 5 teams in the league he is needed for. With the rest, there is no reason for him to even broach 30min a game.
@ everyone wanting Bowen to be benched
And maybe you're right. But I think that it isn't the bench letting us down right now, it's the starters, so that's where the change has to come.
Also, at the moment there is no set rotation, so it's hard to tweak... Pop is throwing players around willy-nilly. Maybe what needs to happen is Pop settling on a 9-man rotation and stopping the merry-go-round. That proably won't happen until after ASB though.
This is an ideas thread - I'm not saying I have the answer, but these are some of the things I'd try.
Lakers being one - he's lit up Kobe for 22 and 23 points already this year!
The offense works off the defense.It's about getting some flow back into the offence early, and using Bruce in a more targetted fashion.
Thats the way its been since 1999.
Bruce Bowen will never come off the bench as long as he can still play.
As evidenced the other night against Cleveland, Bruce Bowen can still friggen play.
Of course not, defense never wins anything.There are about 5 teams in the league he is needed for. With the rest, there is no reason for him to even broach 30min a game.
i just think we need to give the ball to tim more
Agreed.
For all the ing for years of diversifying the offense, they've gone away way too much from 4 down IMO.
It wasn't run enough against the Cavaliers, and theres been alot of games they've lost this year where you could say that.
Hey man thats our job as fans to suggest things and ideas when things aren't going so well. The Spurs probably won't try most of the things we throw out there but thats cool cause i would like to think they know what they're doing. In the end all you can do is just hope things work themselves out we end up celebrating again in June.
cause i would like to think they know what they're doing
Indeed!Hey man thats our job as fans to suggest things and ideas when things aren't going so well. The Spurs probably won't try most of the things we throw out there but thats cool cause i would like to think they know what they're doing. In the end all you can do is just hope things work themselves out we end up celebrating again in June.
As for more 4-down, not the answer. Have you seen how much Tim is getting blocked this season, and how few calls he's getting? Unless he rediscovers his left hand consistently, or some spring, Tim's offense will not be as reliable as it once was, and anyway, 4-down stagnates everything. I'd be going the other way and playing more motion offense.
WTF, Duncan hardly shoots some games, hes getting 10 to 11 shots when he should be getting 20 to 25.
This team IMO has swayed wayyy too far away from Duncan and have made him at times close to a second scorer.
I've noticed everytime Tim posts up on the right block he tends to bring the ball right into the shot blocker instead of using the the off hand to keep the ball out of reach. If he doesn't want to use the left the hand then i don't know why he doesn's spin baseline more often and use that little baby hook he is so good at. Thats always seemed weird to me that a guy as fundamentaly sound as Duncan is to bring the ball right into the shot blocker like that because thats something they teach you not to do since you were little.
Yeah Timmy gets blocked alot it seems.
Personally I stand by 4 down needing to be incorporated more.
When run right, its not everyone standing around. Its tim getting the ball, and guys at the perimiter if Duncan is doubled, or runs into trouble cutting and getting open shots.
That maddens the out of me, and i always point it out in the game thread. Glad someone else noticed. That's why I mentioned his left hand, which he used to use in exactly that situation earlier in his career.
T Park, you are exaggerating as usual - Tim's last 10 games, number of shots:
21
17
14
12
16
19
16
16
20
20
So he's averaging about 16-17 shots a game lately, and 15 over the season (504/34), and that's about right. He's not the offensive juggernaut he used to be because he's slowed down and has no spring at all, not to mention less variety in his moves, the (mostly) absent left hand, and fewer calls going his way. The days of a 4-down-dominated offence winning games for us consistently are gone.
In starting and bench group, SPURS can only afford 1 to 1.5 offensive sucker. Now, SPURS have BB, Oberto and sometimes Finley in the starting group.
In the bench group, SPURS have Elson, IU, Horry....
So there is not much room to swap players within these 2 groups.
So possible solution is to swap Finley with Barry to generate more ball movement for starting lineup or to swap Oberto with Bonner or Horry to draw PF out. The cost is the pts given up on defense as Barry/Bonner suck in this department.
Pairing Oberto with Manu could make bench more productive offensively.
Solution 2 is to increase IU minutes and use him as the stable backup for BB, assuming that his offensive production will improve with increased playing time.
I think the line up change will consist of a steady 8 man rotation. Maybe 9. But stop this craziness of putting players in for 2 or 3 minutes and then pulling them to put someone else in for 2 or 3 minutes.
I would like to still see Manu off the bench, but when Vaughn comes in for Tony to rest, also bring in Barry and let him run the point. At least that puts two guys out there that are a 3 point threat with good passing skills.
I understand Tony can't play 48, but it seems to me when Vaughn comes in, we become stagnant on Offense. I've also noticed Vaughn seems to have his best minutes when Tony is on the floor at the same time and running the point. I love his energy, but energy doesn't score. And we need someone running point with better passing skills than Vaughn. When Vaughn is running point, it pretty much lets the opposition run a 5 on 4 defense. They know he isn't going to penetrate, and they will let him shoot 17 footers all day long. He just isn't enough of a threat to run the team.
I also think what we are missing is energy from Elson when he is on the floor. I sat down and watched the first three games of 06-07 Finals and Elson looked like a totally different player then than he does now. We need him to get right, run the court, and bring the emotional energy he brought then.
...? Elson? Frankie Elson? Fans talk without spirit, nonsense
It takes two to tango TPark. If you think Timmy mentally brings it every night these days, you're freakin' crazy. I'm not saying he's taking regular seasons off like Shaq, but Tim clearly looks for his shot more in some games than others and is more aggressive in some games than others. He is 31 now and he just doesn't have that fire in his belly ever game. He's picked it up lately and he'll probably be same old Tim for good once February hits. But with Manu and Tony on the team I don't think Duncan feels too guilty about letting them carry the load now and then. It's not like the guys are purposefully ignoring Pop when he calls plays. Pop can tell if Duncan feels it or not.
Manu should be starter from start of season.
So is Jeremy Richardson starting a one game thing? What is Pop doing now? Do you think he will go back to the normal starting 5 the next game?
The reason I wanted Udoka to start is because I thought the starting five needed some energy, plus Ime is really starting to play better. If not Ime, is there anyone else who could start? I still think a change needs to be made. I wonder if a small ball starting 5 might work to get our offense going then we sub Oberto back in and play big. Would that be a possibility?
thats exactly why you arent the coach lol
Say it ain't so.
Say it ain't so.
I would keep manu coming off the bench. He's the only consistent guy off the bench that can sustain the spurs attack while parker or Duncan is resting. Besides, It's more likely that Pop is reserving Ginobili for the playoffs.
By the way he plays, it unavoidable for him to wear himself out before the playoffs. Unlike parker, ginobili is in his thirties and more likely to injure himself in play. Coming off the bench lessens the wear and tear on his body (and allows PoP to optimized his use in the court). I think this is a good strategy on the part of Pop.
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