God damn Lebron's team sucks

[baseline bum]

Yesterday during that Cavs-Celtics game I kept cursing out Lebron's teammates, the thing that infuriated me the most was that jump ball near the end of the game, it was 7'3 Ilgauskas and 6'6 James posey, Posey mistimed his jump and the ball was right there for Big Z to take, instead of him to grab the ball like a man he tapped it with 2 fingers like a little girl and it ended up with paul pierce.

God I'm so angry at that play, Big Z is soft as , last year in the finals Tony parker went at him time and time again for easy layups. Its time for this guy to go, Cavs should look at getting Dirk imo, Dirk and Lebron are in the same situation, and together I think they would win championships.

It would have been a turnover if Ilguaskas grabbed the ball.

[1Parker1]

And look at Kobe now, he's got a team that can contend until he exits his prime.

Don't be so naive to assume Lebron is just going to keep his mouth shut and sight tight while his team continues to get knocked out in the 1st/2nd round. If he has to put up with this much longer he will be making the same trade demands Kobe did, maybe not as publicly.

The double standard between Lebron and Kobe is just laughable. When Kobe had to deal with this the last 3 years he was labeled a ball hog who couldn't lead his team. With Lebron, his teammates suck. Go figure. And don't tell me Lebron has worse support, the Laker teams of the last few years were just dreadful.

Don't be such a homer. You say that Lebron probably won't make such trade demands publicly, well that's a big difference between he and Kobe. My problem wasn't with Kobe wanting a trade, my problem was with Kobe going about it so publicly and so easily throwing specifically named teammates under the bus and then acting like such a great team player when things start to go good for them.

And take a look at what Lebron averaged this postseason with that supporting cast. Game 4 against the Wiz, when Lebron passed to a wide open Delonte West for the game winning shot, you think Kobe would have done that? You think Kobe could average almost 9 assists a game on this Cavs team? Kobe was a ball hog when he had a crappy team, just look at the ridiculous amount of shots he was jacking up before this season. Compare that to how many shots Lebron is taking to average 30 this season, not to mention his assists, his leadership, and his maturity level at a much younger age. When Kobe was 23, he was fighting to be the man with Shaq. Sure he was winning les then and he was a great player then too. I'm not saying that he's not the best all around player in the NBA, I think he is. But I'd take Lebron any day over him, becasue with Kobe you just don't know how he's going to react when he doesn't get what he wants and when things don't go his way.

[z0sa]

And look at Kobe now, he's got a team that can contend until he exits his prime.

Don't be so naive to assume Lebron is just going to keep his mouth shut and sight tight while his team continues to get knocked out in the 1st/2nd round. If he has to put up with this much longer he will be making the same trade demands Kobe did, maybe not as publicly.

The double standard between Lebron and Kobe is just laughable. When Kobe had to deal with this the last 3 years he was labeled a ball hog who couldn't lead his team. With Lebron, his teammates suck. Go figure. And don't tell me Lebron has worse support, the Laker teams of the last few years were just dreadful.

I thought Kobe won three straight championships and thats why everyone thought he could be a leader, thus when he wasnt he became rightfully ridiculed.

LeBron, essentially by himself, AND WITH NO EXPERIENCE, took that team to the Finals. Kobe, essentially by himself, and with loads of playoff experience, could not get out of the first round.

No double standard, just a fact.

[z0sa]

LeBron's leadership skills really are far better than Kobe's. You could just tell against Boston he was gauging his own teammates fire and trying to get the one's who had it, ie West, shots. Its too bad West missed that three.

[DazedAndConfused]

Don't be such a homer. You say that Lebron probably won't make such trade demands publicly, well that's a big difference between he and Kobe. My problem wasn't with Kobe wanting a trade, my problem was with Kobe going about it so publicly and so easily throwing specifically named teammates under the bus and then acting like such a great team player when things start to go good for them.

And take a look at what Lebron averaged this postseason with that supporting cast. Game 4 against the Wiz, when Lebron passed to a wide open Delonte West for the game winning shot, you think Kobe would have done that? You think Kobe could average almost 9 assists a game on this Cavs team? Kobe was a ball hog when he had a crappy team, just look at the ridiculous amount of shots he was jacking up before this season. Compare that to how many shots Lebron is taking to average 30 this season, not to mention his assists, his leadership, and his maturity level at a much younger age. When Kobe was 23, he was fighting to be the man with Shaq. Sure he was winning les then and he was a great player then too. I'm not saying that he's not the best all around player in the NBA, I think he is. But I'd take Lebron any day over him, becasue with Kobe you just don't know how he's going to react when he doesn't get what he wants and when things don't go his way.

Blah, blah, blah......typical Kobe-hater BS. I'm not going to take the time to point out all the fallacies in your argument, but I find it laughable that you mention Lebron's assist numbers and fail to acknowledge that he has the ball in his hands 99% of the time. Of course his assists are going to be through the roof.

The thing with Kobe is people LOVE to hate him. It's always been that way, even before his rape trial, and it always will be. The fact that Lebron can shoot 50 shots and not be labeled as a ball hog is laughable. Kobe did the exact same thing the last two years and got crucified for it, his teammates just couldn't hit open shots the way Lebron's teammates can't now.

I don't like how Kobe went about his business in the offseason, but I can't argue with the results. And at the end of the day that's all that matters. The Lakers are now in a position to win rings for the next 5 years. Lebron, OTOH, is on a mediocre team that can't get out of the 2nd round in the LEASTERN conference.

[DazedAndConfused]

I thought Kobe won three straight championships and thats why everyone thought he could be a leader, thus when he wasnt he became rightfully ridiculed.

LeBron, essentially by himself, AND WITH NO EXPERIENCE, took that team to the Finals. Kobe, essentially by himself, and with loads of playoff experience, could not get out of the first round.

No double standard, just a fact.

Eastern conference.

[z0sa]

3-1 lead over Phoenix.

[z0sa]

Lebron, OTOH, is on a mediocre team that can't get out of the 2nd round in the LEASTERN conference.

So you're ridiculing LeBron for taking the celtics to 7 games, a team that won 66 regular season games?

wtf is wrong with you?

[z0sa]

I'd like to have seen Kobe's lakers from two years ago take these celtics to 7 games

[DazedAndConfused]

Really the same team that got taken to 7 games by the ATLANTA HAWKS WHO DIDNT EVEN WIN 40 GAMES THIS SEASON???

Big ing accomplishment.

[tlongII]

Blah, blah, blah......typical Kobe-hater BS. I'm not going to take the time to point out all the fallacies in your argument, but I find it laughable that you mention Lebron's assist numbers and fail to acknowledge that he has the ball in his hands 99% of the time. Of course his assists are going to be through the roof.

The thing with Kobe is people LOVE to hate him. It's always been that way, even before his rape trial, and it always will be. The fact that Lebron can shoot 50 shots and not be labeled as a ball hog is laughable. Kobe did the exact same thing the last two years and got crucified for it, his teammates just couldn't hit open shots the way Lebron's teammates can't now.

I don't like how Kobe went about his business in the offseason, but I can't argue with the results. And at the end of the day that's all that matters. The Lakers are now in a position to win rings for the next 5 years. Lebron, OTOH, is on a mediocre team that can't get out of the 2nd round in the LEASTERN conference.

Your only shot for rings is this year buddy. The Blazers dynasty begins next year.

[E20]

What Dazed and Confused doesn't seem to understand (maybe because he is ing re ed), is that Lebron WILL NOT DEMAND A TRADE. Because his contract has an opt-out option next year. So Lebron will simply say: Give me better talent or I will opt out next year. His image won't be tarnished like Kobe's. (I have the utomst respect for Kobe as a ball player, as a person not so much)

[DazedAndConfused]

You're a damn fool if you are looking to NBA players for moral role models. I could care less what Kobe does off the court as long as it doesn't affect the team or his performance in the game.

[endrity]

What Dazed and Confused doesn't seem to understand (maybe because he is ing re ed), is that Lebron WILL NOT DEMAND A TRADE. Because his contract has an opt-out option next year. So Lebron will simply say: Give me better talent or I will opt out next year. His image won't be tarnished like Kobe's. (I have the utomst respect for Kobe as a ball player, as a person not so much)

This here says it pretty well for me. Kobe has probably been the best all around player in the league, the most skilled, the last 2-3 years. I think LeBron is catching up really quickly, even though his game is nowhere close to being as complete as Kobe's with his physical talents it doesn't need to be.

But Kobe is very immature at times, while LeBron shows maturity on the court that is way beyond his year. I was not a big fan of LeBron prior to this year, but he made a fan out of me in this series. He did everything he could to lead his team to a victory while facing a much superior team.

Kobe's main problem I think is his early success. He took it for granted, never understood how hard it is to build a championship team. I am sure that all these tough years will eventually make LeBron better.

[endrity]

You're a damn fool if you are looking to NBA players for moral role models. I could care less what Kobe does off the court as long as it doesn't affect the team or his performance in the game.

I think he means as a leader on the court, not his personal life.I as well, could care less about that.

[E20]

You're a damn fool if you are looking to NBA players for moral role models. I could care less what Kobe does off the court as long as it doesn't affect the team or his performance in the game.

His Colorado scandal did affect the team's cohesion and contributed more to the Shaq/Kobe feud. Him calling out Bynum behind his back also must have made his teammates think twice about what he thinks about them.

[Allanon]

You can say all you want in the past about Kobe selfish, immature, not a leader, etc.

But this year, he's matured into the ideal player and teammate. There's absolutely nothing bad you can say about him this year, which is even surprising to me.

LeBron's leadership skills really are far better than Kobe's. You could just tell against Boston he was gauging his own teammates fire and trying to get the one's who had it, ie West, shots. Its too bad West missed that three.

Early on in the season, haters were waiting for him to become selfish again, it never happened. They said he didn't know how to lead. Then the haters said the Nuggets would wipe out the soft Lakers, it didn't happen. Then for sure the Jazz would take the Lakers...nope, nada.

You can continue to live in the past and say he's not a great leader or that he's selfish, but the truth is, the new Kobe is the perfect teammate. With Kobe in his prime and the support of his teammates, Kobe has a chance to get more rings than even Jordan while LeBron will still be looking for #1.

[DazedAndConfused]

No question Kobe has a lot of maturing left to do as a leader. This season he took a huge step forward in the right direction though. I agree with what others said, his early success made him take for granted how hard it is to win championships in this league. I think he now has a better understanding of how rare it is to have that opportunity though. And FWIW, the Laker disintegration in the '04 season had as much to do with Shaq as it did with Kobe.

[jacobdrj]

Boozer wasn't Ferry's fault. He has been trying to make up for Gund's mistake for 3 years...

[endrity]

But this year, he's matured into the ideal player and teammate. There's absolutely nothing bad you can say about him this year, which is even surprising to me.

Early on in the season, haters were waiting for him to become selfish again, it never happened. They said he didn't know how to lead. Then the haters said the Nuggets would wipe out the soft Lakers, it didn't happen. Then for sure the Jazz would take the Lakers...nope, nada.

You can continue to live in the past and say he's not a great leader or that he's selfish, but the truth is, the new Kobe is the perfect teammate. With Kobe in his prime and the support of his teammates, Kobe has a chance to get more rings than even Jordan while LeBron will still be looking for #1.

I don't know where you read that. I don't think anyone sane predicted the Nuggets would have a chance, and I was one of the first to applaud Hollinger when he switched his pick from the Jazz because it was clear the Lakers are better.

Kobe has a perfect opportunity now, no question. It is my belief that he is still too much about himself, example being game 4 in Utah. Jackson called out the rest of the team I think to make Kobe feel better, but Kobe just jacked up shots.

I don't know that the new Kobe is the perfect teammate, at least wait until he wins the ring as a team leader before saying that. Your argument would be much stronger.

No question Kobe has a lot of maturing left to do as a leader. This season he took a huge step forward in the right direction though. I agree with what others said, his early success made him take for granted how hard it is to win championships in this league. I think he now has a better understanding of how rare it is to have that opportunity though. And FWIW, the Laker disintegration in the '04 season had as much to do with Shaq as it did with Kobe.

No question about Shaq, he is a much bigger than Kobe. However 01-03 he was simply the most dominating player in the league, and therefore he was given a leeway. Now he looks like a fool with all his stupid claims. Thanks for agreeing with Kobe's early success. He is a great player, truly the MVP this year, and I wouldn't mind one bit to see him win it. The only team I really really would hate to win it is the Celtics and KG (and yes, because I think Dirk is a much superior player, and somehow a ring won by jumping on the back of Rondo and Pierce would make KG seem better in the eyes of most).

All I am saying about Kobe is that he still has his 'me' moments, and until he wins it I don't wanna crown him prematurely.

[Allanon]

I don't know where you read that. I don't think anyone sane predicted the Nuggets would have a chance, and I was one of the first to applaud Hollinger when he switched his pick from the Jazz because it was clear the Lakers are better.

"Anyone sane" are the key words there but as you know, most haters aren't sane

I don't know that the new Kobe is the perfect teammate, at least wait until he wins the ring as a team leader before saying that. Your argument would be much stronger.

Ah, more waiting for Kobe to screw up, but that's fine. I have to admit that his leadership has been too good to be true this year. I suppose lots of people are still thinking he's going to revert back to bad Kobe for extended stretches. After seeing this Kobe for a year now, I have a feeling he's finally "got it" but fair enough, we shall see.

[Dim Tuncan]

You're a damn fool if you are looking to NBA players for moral role models. I could care less what Kobe does off the court as long as it doesn't affect the team or his performance in the game.

WE HAVE A WINNER!

Kobe, like our Timmy, or Manu, etc. etc. etc. plays basketball really well. And that's about it.

These guys aren't my role models and they won't be my future children's role models either.

I swear... The personality cult on this board really creeps me out sometimes.

P.S. LeBron is gay

[Trainwreck2100]

P.S. LeBron is gay

Takes one to know one

[Dim Tuncan]

Takes one to know one

So where did you guys meet?

[Trainwreck2100]

So where did you guys meet?

In a chatroom remember, you were there, but you were busy taking it up the ass, cause you're a .