Derrick Rose winning an MVP would be a travesty

[ChrisRichards]

He's shooting a ty 44% from the field. He's going to be the most flawed offensive MVP player in its history since the modern era if he wins this. This is going to be a huge joke. Its a scam just like Iverson winning it over Shaq in 01.


Give this MVP award to Lebron James, because Lebron is the best and MVP in the league (See Cleveland's record). Rose winning it is going to be a huge joke just like Kobe making All NBA Defense teams for the past 8 yrs.

I can't stand this anymore. The media has ruined the prestige of all these awards.

[Giuseppe]

Calf tats & MVP:::six of one, half dozen of the other.

[ambchang]

Lebron isn't even the MVP of his own team.

[ChrisRichards]

Lebron isn't even the MVP of his own team.

Of course he is. He missed a few clutch shots, but who hasn't in Miami? Wade is the leader but Lebron is the MVP there no doubt.

[ALVAREZ6]

Rose>LeBron

[ChrisRichards]

Rose>LeBron

I see who doesn't watch basketball games here.

[Reck]

lmao a Heat fan demanding an MVP award for someone that's not even guy#1 on his team.

[redzero]

Rose>LeBron

no.

Lebron isn't even the MVP of his own team.

yes he is.

[Kyle Orton]

I agree Lebron >>> Rose, but the MVP is a regular season award. Rose has done more with less than Lebron.

[ALVAREZ6]

I see who doesn't watch basketball games here.

I see who believes a lame ass season from a player deserves the award when another player as been equally as good and probably believes Lebron deserves it because he has the ball in his hands 75% of the time who runs a terrible half court offense...despite having a high assist average.


I like Lebron's game, I've been a fan for some time, but Rose as the only big time star on the Bulls (compared to 3 in Miami) is taking that team to an unexpected level, and he's still improving. Lebron won the last 2, deservedly so, but I think Rose makes a strong case, stronger than Lebron in Miami. Their (Miami's) own expectations back in the summer and fall = championship.

[ALVAREZ6]

For the record, to clarify, when I said Rose>Lebron, I meant in the regard to this thread...who deserves MVP more. Lebron is still obviously the superior player.

[manufan10]

If LeBron James won the MVP, now that would be the real travesty. No way LeBron deserves to be MVP. Just because Cleveland sucks now, doesn't make LeBron James is the league MVP. Look at the struggles and crying of the Miami Heat. I think Rose has done the better job, and he has less talent around him. He also has his team with a better record than the Heat. Rose is definitely the MVP over LeBron.

[ALVAREZ6]

If LeBron James won the MVP, now that would be the real travesty. No way LeBron deserves to be MVP. Just because Cleveland sucks now, doesn't make LeBron James is the league MVP. Look at the struggles and crying of the Miami Heat. I think Rose has done the better job, and he has less talent around him. He also has his team with a better record than the Heat. Rose is definitely the MVP over LeBron.

MVPs don't cry like es, and quite frankly all 3 of the Big 3 are guilty and none deserve the award..obviously not Bosh for tons of reasons.

Rose makes a stronger case. Does anyone else think someone else deserves it, who are we overlooking?

[Daddy_Of_All_Trolls]

Earlier in MVP discussions, I didn't give much thought to Rose simply because he is new to the MVP mix. However, the MVP award usually goes to the best player on the best regular season team, or one right up there. Also, the Bulls are having a turnaround year, and that factors in.

Logically, Manu or Dirk deserve a look for team records and the fact Dallas started losing when Nowitzki went down to injury. However, I don't see them much in the discussions. Durant has an outside shot, won't finish as high as expeted pre-season.

LeBron and Kobe both have a chance, and the final games may decide. Both the Heat and the Lakers have a good shot at winning the rest of their games.

At the very least, the balloting should be close, especially from #2 on down.

[j.dizzle]

This forum was better when you were missing in action tbh. Chicago 3>0 vs Miami this season.

[manufan10]

MVPs don't cry like es, and quite frankly all 3 of the Big 3 are guilty and none deserve the award..obviously not Bosh for tons of reasons.

Rose makes a stronger case. Does anyone else think someone else deserves it, who are we overlooking?

I think Dirk should probably be in the discussion. With no real #2 option behind him, and how they struggled when he was out, I'd give consideration to Dirk.

Obviously, Kobe will be in the discussion, but in the end I think it will be either Rose or Dirk.

Edit: Daddy of all Trolls beat me to it.

[Pelicans78]

Kobe is ahead of Lebron IMO.

[Booharv]

I found this article from John Hollinger a while back to be quite good tbqh

Ask somebody about this season's Chicago Bulls, and the answer you'll get is likely to be something along the lines of "DerrickRoseDerrickRoseDerrickRoseDerrickRose. "

Not to diminish what Rose has accomplished in what's been a breakout season for the third-year star, but the focus on his season has left the Bulls one of the most misunderstood teams in basketball. Chicago has the league's fifth-best record and is challenging for the top seed in the East for several reasons, and other than Rose, those reasons have received comparatively little attention. So let's look a little closer.

It's the defense.

From one perspective, the focus on the point guard's offensive accomplishments seems misguided. The Bulls have the league's 16th-best offense this season, and although that might improve a little in the second half of the season with Carlos Boozer and Joakim Noah back from injury, offense will remain a distant second on the list of reasons for Chicago's success.

Instead, the Bulls are winning with a suffocating defense that allows their very ordinary offense to be enough on most nights. Chicago is No. 1 in defensive efficiency, an accomplishment made more amazing by the fact that Noah, the team's defensive stalwart, has missed just more than half of its games (30 of 59).

But it's important to understand the Bulls as an extreme defensive team to understand their success. You often hear, sometimes in praise of Rose's offensive prowess, people wondering aloud about how the Bulls can be playing so well with Keith Bogans at shooting guard and only two good scorers.

The answer is that, offensively, they're not playing so well. They're just so awesome on defense that it doesn't matter.

And in particular, it's been the supporting cast that's been dominant defensively. Speaking of which …

It's the bench.

Chicago's defensive stats with its starters in the game are pretty good. But with the bench? They're ridiculously good.

The Bulls give up just more than a point per possession with any of their five starters on the court, but with the second unit, it's a different story. When Taj Gibson is on the floor, opponents score .994 points per trip. When Ronnie Brewer plays, they muster just .956. When C.J. Watson plays, the number drops to .938.

And with Omer Asik on the court, it's a phenomenal .919 points per possession. Asik, not Rose, is the team leader in plus/minus, even though he has limited offensive skills and a player efficiency rating of 11.35. The backup center is a force as a shot-blocker and help defender, combining with Gibson to form what is, hands down, the best second-unit defensive frontcourt in basketball.

Nobody thinks of Asik as a dominating defensive player because he has a fairly thin build and limited offensive skills, plus it's hard to consider somebody an intimidating presence when he looks like the chef from "Ratatouille." But trust me, he's a monster. This time, instead of hearing me rave about Asik's D again, listen to his coaches.

"When you put he and Taj out there together, the defense of that unit has been great," Bulls coach Tom Thibodeau said. "That's his mindset, and he's got a lot of experience. It's international experience, so, in my eyes, he's not a typical rookie. He's very, very bright, picks things up quickly, rarely makes the same mistake twice and [has] great drive, a great worker."

Yet Thibodeau sounds like a rank pessimist compared with assistant coach Ron Adams.

"I think he can be as good as any defensive player in this league," Adams said. "Defensively, I just think he's top-of-the-line. And he's getting close to it already."

Of course, it's not just the rook -- Asik is playing only 11.7 minutes per game, so as dominant as he's been defensively, he explains only a portion of Chicago's improved D.

Gibson, as Thibodeau mentioned, also has been a major factor. So has Brewer, with his perimeter ball hawking, and of course Noah. But perhaps the best attribute of Chicago's defense is that, other than Boozer, there really hasn't been a weak link. Rose was a poor defender under Vinny Del Negro but has improved dramatically this season, and Kyle Korver -- the closest thing to a weakness on the perimeter -- has good size and is a quality team defender.

On the other hand, a lot of these guys were on far less successful defensive teams in the past. The Bulls were good defensively a year ago, but by no means great. Boozer, Korver and Brewer were all part of mediocre defensive teams in Utah, with Brewer washing out as a defensive stopper. Watson participated in a woeful Golden State defense and appeared to be no better than his peers, and Bogans and Kurt Thomas have been mostly bit players.

Which takes us to the next logical conclusion …

It's the coach.

Yes, Thibodeau's stuff works. The top defensive assistant in Boston, he was the architect of the Celtics' system that won a le in 2008 and has largely stymied opponents ever since. In fact, you can argue that Thibodeau owns the top two defenses in the game -- the Bulls are first in defensive efficiency, and the Celtics are second.

Before coming to Boston, Thibodeau was Jeff Van Gundy's defensive guru in Houston, where he posted similarly gaudy defensive stats despite some teams that appear to be rather modestly talented in that department.

Sum it all up, and there's a fairly ironclad coach of the year case to be made for Thibodeau, especially given the injuries to Boozer and Noah that Chicago has overcome this season. That doesn't mean he'll win, not when Gregg Popovich has the Spurs en route to a mid-60s win total, Rick Carlisle is squeezing just as much out of the Mavs and Doug Collins is leading the Sixers to a surprise playoff charge.

But the Bulls' collective success is best understood as a combination of a great defensive concept being implemented by a 10-deep roster, one on which the bench is even more suffocating than the starters.

Rose's plays fill the highlight film, and for good reason -- many of them are spectacular. But in explaining how shockingly good Chicago has been thus far, all that takes a backseat. Rose might be the savior on offense, but in explaining the Bulls' success this season, the holy trinity is the D, the bench and the coach.

[Booharv]

Basically, the Bulls are winning with defense (#1 efficiency) and Derrick Rose has the worst defensive plus/minus on the team: The Bulls give up 10.4 more points per possession when he's on the court than when he's off.

http://www.82games.com/1011/10CHI3.HTM#onoff

[baseline bum]

Dwight Howard should be MVP, but the media anointed Rose months ago. It's not Dwight's fault his GM has for brains.

[Pelicans78]

I agree that Rose's importance is a bit overstated, but right now I'm fine with him getting the MVP.

[IronMexican]

Dwight Howard should be MVP, but the media anointed Rose months ago. It's not Dwight's fault his GM has for brains.

It's hard to give a guy who has his team in 4th place in the East the award. He's probably been the best player this season, though.

[ALVAREZ6]

Earlier in MVP discussions, I didn't give much thought to Rose simply because he is new to the MVP mix. However, the MVP award usually goes to the best player on the best regular season team, or one right up there. Also, the Bulls are having a turnaround year, and that factors in.

Logically, Manu or Dirk deserve a look for team records and the fact Dallas started losing when Nowitzki went down to injury. However, I don't see them much in the discussions. Durant has an outside shot, won't finish as high as expeted pre-season.

LeBron and Kobe both have a chance, and the final games may decide. Both the Heat and the Lakers have a good shot at winning the rest of their games.

At the very least, the balloting should be close, especially from #2 on down.

If the Mavs kept it up a little more, Dirk would be right up there IMO. Manu doesn't really deserve a shot IMO simply because the Spurs are doing well for a variety of reasons, and all of their big 3 are equally important to that team. Besides, Manu only started the season in dominating fashion, but Parker has been far more consistent.


I think Rose, who's team is #1 in the east, with no other big stars on his team (Boozer is a of a player, closest you get), makes the best case. Imagine if Lebron made the smart choice and went to Chicago

[ChrisRichards]

Dwight Howard should be MVP, but the media anointed Rose months ago. It's not Dwight's fault his GM has for brains.

I was against this before, but you know what? You'e right. If not Lebron then at least give Dwight the MVP. Enough of this "If you're not on a top 2 team you're not going to win MVP" BS.

Seriously, Rose to me is not any better than Brandon Roy when he was healthy. Rose is not better than Wade, Lebron or Dwight. He's slightly better than Kobe at this point but I don't see any reason why he should get the MVP this year. I credit Thibodeau and Luol Deng coming back to life. Rose is pretty exciting but he's not the main reason the Bulls made this turnaround.

[Pelicans78]

To be honest, Lebron would need Chicago more than Chicago needs him. Honestly, put a elite SG who can shoot next to Rose, the Bulls would be even better. I think Lebron would take away from Rose. The Bulls may be better with Lebron now, but they would be even better if they had a SG like Joe Johnson who can shoot from the perimeter, especially since Rose can penetrate as good as anyone.