Reproductive rights

[FromWayDowntown]

How is it you can be so ing positive that I am as you assume.

How is her conclusion about you -- based on facts that you've unabashedly provided to those who read this forum -- any different than the assumptions that inform your opinions of black surgeons?

[Wild Cobra]

So, affirmative action inflames prejudice in fearful, weak-minded people like Wild Cobra.

OK.

You know. For a moment, I thought you stopped being a Chump. I see you are still just that.

I would think the the first time I explain something, it should be good enough. If not, questions are in order. But to constantly be attacked over a misunderstood viewpoint gets old. I simply have to wonder how stupid people are to not understand that I often bring up "what ifs." Why can't you guys accept it as that?

Maybe I should take it as a complement. A complement meaning that I have owned you in debates so many times, that you do anything you can to find fault in me. Even when you have to fabricate it.

[Wild Cobra]

How is her conclusion about you -- based on facts that you've unabashedly provided to those who read this forum -- any different than the assumptions that inform your opinions of black surgeons?

Are you guys of the same younger age as to be indoctrinated of what certain things mean?

Really... can't you think outside the box, or is it so instilled in you that not being PC about race is being racist?

[CuckingFunt]

Delusions of persecution.

[ChumpDumper]

You know. For a moment, I thought you stopped being a Chump. I see you are still just that.

I would think the the first time I explain something, it should be good enough. If not, questions are in order. But to constantly be attacked over a misunderstood viewpoint gets old. I simply have to wonder how stupid people are to not understand that I often bring up "what ifs." Why can't you guys accept it as that?

Maybe I should take it as a complement. A complement meaning that I have owned you in debates so many times, that you do anything you can to find fault in me. Even when you have to fabricate it.

Your perception of affirmative action inflamed your prejudice against black surgeons.

You admitted it. No fabrication necessary.

I don't see why you get so angry about what you post yourself.

[mingus]

Though I know it has been pointed out countless times before, let me attempt to make it clear once more.

No one here thinks you are a bigot for, as you put it, railing against quota systems. For that, you are merely ignorant of how affirmative action programs actually work.

The reason that the whole black surgeon thing has gotten you the label of bigot 'round these parts is that it highlights the fact you assume, based on nothing other than skin color, that black surgeons are more likely to have gotten where they are based on affirmative action, and therefore less likely to have done so based on academic merit, than anyone else who wasn't black. Your su ion, based upon your own words, does not apply to Asian surgeons, female surgeons, or any other variety of med student who may have gotten a leg up thanks to quotas. Nor does it apply to rich white male surgeons who may have gotten through med school thanks to Daddy's money.

Again, unfounded su ion alone does not make you a bigot. It makes you paranoid. However, when your unfounded su ion applies only to members of a certain race, based solely on the color of their skin, well... welcome to bigot-town.

rich white male surgeons still have to get a 30 mcat score and at least have a GPA of 3.6. there are rare, and I MEAN rare exceptions where other things arre taken into consideration like loads of community service or if you worked long hours or something. as far as i know they don't give a about how rich applicants are. i know many people rich dudes who couldn't cut it.

that said, being race selective and paranoid about a black surgeon is stupid even knowing this because your family doctor or general practicioner, whose decisions and credentials you trust, usually recommends a particular surgeon. and you as a patient would be stupid and underqualified to argue against another doctor's recommendation, if you trust his credentials. if a surgeon has built a good reputation on what he does and other doctor's recommend him, nothing else should matter. you'd be a dumbass and a BIGOT in that case to argue it.

using a skin test to judge a doctor in the first place is bigorty though. there are more reliable and non-bigoted ways to pick a doctor.

[FromWayDowntown]

Are you guys of the same younger age as to be indoctrinated of what certain things mean?

Really... can't you think outside the box, or is it so instilled in you that not being PC about race is being racist?

Is mindless blabbering about being misunderstood your only retort to being shown your own hypocrisy?

You tell us you make assumptions about black surgeons without any facts pertaining to any particular black surgeon. In your mind -- whether racist or not -- this is somehow okay.

Funt, among others, discerns from those sorts of assumptions that you are a bigot insofar as you make assumptions about people based, apparently, primarily upon the color of their skin and your own assumptions about their achievements, and you go bat about being the subject of a negative assumption.

(Threads like this certainly do little to undermine the facts giving rise to that assumption).

You can finesse it all you want, but she's doing to you precisely what you do to others (albeit with far more proof to support her choice).

[Wild Cobra]

Is mindless blabbering about being misunderstood your only retort to being shown your own hypocrisy?

Hypocricy?

if someone clarifies their position from an incorrect assumption I had, I don't tell them my initial incorrect belief is still right.

You tell us you make assumptions about black surgeons without any facts pertaining to any particular black surgeon. In your mind -- whether racist or not -- this is somehow okay.

Why are examples of perception a bad thing? Why is pointing out the harm that quota systems do for the black community wrong? Now if i was only told this train of though was wrong, I would say we have differing beliefs. But to be called a bigot, racist, etc. over this. I get tired of people playing the race card. Really now, if that's all they have left for an argument, they may as well admit defeat.

Funt, among others, discerns from those sorts of assumptions that you are a bigot insofar as you make assumptions about people based, apparently, primarily upon the color of their skin and your own assumptions about their achievements, and you go bat about being the subject of a negative assumption.

I would love to see a colorblind society. However, ever time quota systems are endorsed, it is saying we cannot be colorblind. For blacks who make it by merit, they are perceived as in the same boat as products of quota systems by people who don't know better. Now what do you think could happen if an employer, of any type of job opening, would do if he finds two equally qualified candidates by all he can discern. If that question ever enters his mind "was this guy selected by a quota system," who do you think has a better chance of getting picked?

Sure, it's not universal, and you still have a few racists out there making hiring decision. I see it as one more stumbling block for a colorblind society.

You can finesse it all you want, but she's doing to you precisely what you do to others (albeit with far more proof to support her choice).

Bull . If I haven't explained it as many times as I did before, I might agree this is not the same. I perceive it as just being evil. I only have a real short fuse with a few here, and have been short with you at time. I don't recall you ever maintaining you know what I mean more than I do though.

[mingus]

I'm saying that the quota system within affirmative action makes too many people wonder if blacks, and yes, any group who is included in quota systems, are the best choice when choosing a professional.

you should make the choice based on that doctor's medical career/record, not his race. most times people don't even make the decision and should go by what their family doctor tells them. but if you're are going to make the decision on your own and if the deciding factor is race, that's racist. there are other, better, nonbigoted, ways of finding out the best-credentialed doctor near you. if race is the end all be all to your decision...that's pretty muc teh definition of prejudice.

[ChumpDumper]

It's alright, he doesn't like most black people anyway. I'm sure some government program is to blame.

[FromWayDowntown]

you should make the choice based on that doctor's medical career/record, not his race.

This is the most delicious irony of Wild Cobra's assumptions. Nobody becomes a surgeon by virtue of affirmative action. While affirmative action may allow some who might not otherwise be considered to get into medical school, one must do a considerable amount more than obtaining admission to become a surgeon. Residencies, fellowships, and the like -- particularly for surgeons -- are doled out by qualification demonstrated by achievement. Progressing successfully through those programs to obtain surgical credentialing takes still another level of achievement. Thus, the system almost absolutely ensures that those who become surgeons are abundantly qualified to be in those positions.

To graft horse excuses like admissions quotas upon a choice to view surgeons of a particular skin color in a negative light is the epitome of ignorance.

[Wild Cobra]

This is the most delicious irony of Wild Cobra's assumptions. Nobody becomes a surgeon by virtue of affirmative action. While affirmative action may allow some who might not otherwise be considered to get into medical school, one must do a considerable amount more than obtaining admission to become a surgeon. Residencies, fellowships, and the like -- particularly for surgeons -- are doled out by qualification demonstrated by achievement. Progressing successfully through those programs to obtain surgical credentialing takes still another level of achievement. Thus, the system almost absolutely ensures that those who become surgeons are abundantly qualified to be in those positions.

To graft horse excuses like admissions quotas upon a choice to view surgeons of a particular skin color in a negative light is the epitome of ignorance.

Maybe surgeons was a bad example. Are you saying such situations I speak of are not happening in other fields?

[Wild Cobra]

It's alright, he doesn't like most black people anyway.

Yep, I said that.

I'm sure some government program is to blame.

You would be wrong.

I don't like most black people. There are very few who I have met that grew up in a cultural setting I have any respect for. Most I have met are out right thugs, and lack integrity. I could say I don't like black people, but there are some exceptions. If I based all my decisions on statistics, I would stay clear of blacks.

Now take your time and carefully remember the context of my words.

Thank-You Oh Gee for maintaining my quote in your signature.

[ChumpDumper]

Yep, I said that.

You would be wrong.

Now take your time and carefully remember the context of my words.

Thank-You Oh Gee for maintaining my quote in your signature.

Well, you blame your perception of affirmative action for inflaming your existing prejudice.

The context is crystal clear.

[Wild Cobra]

Well, you blame your perception of affirmative action for inflaming your existing prejudice.

The context is crystal clear.

LOL...
Whatever.

Do you remember why I even said my initial remarks? It was a response:

I agree. Whenever I see Blacks in positions of authority, I am concerned that they were chosen because they were Black rather than qualified.

I think we all do. Affirmative action has done more harm to the black community than racism in some ways. Because of quotas, we cannot know if a person made certain position or jobs by merit, or by quotas.

Would you go to a black surgeon for an operation if he was a product of affirmative action? Of course this information isn't readily available, so most smart people avoid black surgeons. I wonder what type of impact this has on jobs for black. It is a form of prejudice, but it isn't racism.

[TeyshaBlue]

Maybe surgeons was a bad example. Are you saying such situations I speak of are not happening in other fields?

Maybe surgeons was an asinine example. Maybe your judgement, such as it is, should be called into question. As you backpeddle, obfuscate, and move the goal posts, I have to ask. What the point are you trying to make?

[TeyshaBlue]

This is your harpoon, Moby . "......so most smart people avoid black surgeons."

[Wild Cobra]

Maybe surgeons was an asinine example. Maybe your judgement, such as it is, should be called into question. As you backpeddle, obfuscate, and move the goal posts, I have to ask. What the point are you trying to make?

Like I said initially. Quota systems are a bad thing.

[TeyshaBlue]

It's hard to disown what's plainly sticking out of your chest.

[TeyshaBlue]

Like I said initially. Quota systems are a bad thing.

You haven't made a case for that.

[Winehole23]

It was in the other thread.

[TeyshaBlue]

most smart people can make a case for their opinions.

[Winehole23]

please catch up!

[CuckingFunt]

LOL...
Whatever.

Do you remember why I even said my initial remarks? It was a response:

Yes. A response.

A response in which you suggested that avoiding black surgeons was the smart choice.

[TeyshaBlue]

please catch up!

shup! I can't even find the other thread anymore.