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lol deserved
/thread.
lol deserved
Agreed -- I'd be fascinated to see what those numbers look like when Hill is playing without either Manu or Parker.
Just eyeballing things as the 2010-11 season progressed, when Hill was definitively the offensive initiator (usually in late 3rd quarter/early 4th quarter situations) the Spurs offense seemed to routinely grind to a halt -- they really struggled to get themselves into sets, Hill routinely failed to use screens that were set for him to start the offense, and he looked to me as if he didn't really have much of an idea about where he wanted to send the ball. In fact, in a lot of situations, the Spurs offense (it seemed to me) devolved into a 15-18 second pounded dribble, followed by some pell-mell effort to drive.
Numbers are frequently deceiving, no matter how advanced the metrics might be, particularly in basketball where true measurements tend to defy meaningful quantification.
Parker's only real issue as a PG is giving up the ball on the break. His speed as a ball handler is unmatched on the Spurs roster and he is probably top 3 in the league. For most of his career on the Spurs he has been the first one down the court on a fastbreak by a mile. This has given him a score first mentality in these situations. I believe it has also contributed to his confidence as a penetrating scorer in the paint.
The Spurs change in offensive philosophy has demanded that Parker give up the ball more and it's not something he's used to. He actually has, in Hill and RJ, players who are getting out and running the break, but his mindset is still locked on scoring.
The reason he wasn't effective vs the Grizz is because no one else on the team kept the Grizz's bigs honest by hitting midirange and perimeter shots that would pull a defense out of the lane leaving Parker some room to operate. Compounding the issue was the Spurs bigs being outplayed the Grizz's post players. Even if Parker could penetrate and dish inside, the Spurs bigs couldn't score or pass out because Gasol and Randolph had such good position and the Spurs perimeter players were being covered so well.
Parker's mistake in the series was not going to the midirange jumper enough, but when his game has been built on speed and penetration for his whole career, it's hard to blame him for that. His mid-range confidence is predicated by his ability to penetrate the lane sucessfully. He was completely out of his comfort zone the whole series. Credit Memphis for cutting off "the head of the snake".
Ohmwrecker, it seems you and I agree an awful lot lately
That's why I still liked having Elson on the team despite his halfcourt deficiencies.
Who is giving him a free pass? My point is that Hill is not a PG, Tony is, and runs the offense much better than anyone else we could probably get through a trade/draft/free agency. Parker played like ass, we all know that, but that's not what this topic is about.
Why isolate a single series and try to judge Parker's entire career on it? Like I said, we all know he sucked against the Grizz. LeBron James sucked hard against the Mavericks but he is still the best player in the NBA. Point is one series doesn't make the man. Parker has a Finals MVP over players like Paul, Williams, Rose, and Nash, who have never even sniffed the Finals. Does that make him better? Nah.
But Hill isnt a 3-time NBA champion, multiple time all-star, and Finals MVP! Who cares about the fact that the team plays just as good if not better with him starting.
Parker's midrange shot has been absolute trash for years now, thats from two seasons ago because they stopped doing it this past season. Which is unfortunate because Parker's shot was even worse this year.
Too bad your pic shows his outside shooting from the right side is actually quite good.
But but but... anyway I thought this wasn't about Parker?
Parker homers, one simple question:
From were do yall s get this myth that the Spurs would be a disaster with Hill running the point along with Manu? Hill's play during stretches were Tony was out clearly suggests otherwise. Yall s are focusing too much on Parker vs. Hill, this isnt an individual matchup between the two. Its how the Spurs function as a team when one is in the starting line-up vs. the other. I care about the Spurs winning and nothing else, not about my PG putting up monster numbers or playing like your prototypical PG. And in a world of hype George Hill just wins. The team has performed just fine with him starting.
Last edited by FkLA; 06-23-2011 at 01:08 PM.
43-44% is good?Too bad your pic shows his outside shooting from the right side is actually quite good.
But but but... anyway I thought this wasn't about Parker?
And what about the other 4 midrange hotspots were his combined shooting percentage is in the mid 30s?
How many games did Hill start at the point last season?
How about when Manu wasn't out there with him?
43-44% is more than enough to keep the defense honest. It's better than the overall shooting average of many guards.43-44% is good?
Oh, and about your "if Hill plays with Manu" crap, are you being intentionally dense, or don't you just understand that with Parker gone, the Spurs will not be in position of playing Hill and Manu together... or there's no PG on the floor for 20 minutes per game. What part of that isn't clear to you?
Like 2-3. Whats your point?
The Spurs and Hill are better with Manu out on the court? Shocking.
Is Tony a 3-time NBA Champion and Finals MVP if Timmy isnt out there with him?
quin looms
Of many guards, like who? And thats one spot, why conveniently ignore the other spots were his shooting is atrocious. Stop being a Parker homer. Thats from two seasons ago too btw, Im pretty sure his shot was even worse this past season.
And really?They seemed to play together just fine in the second half of 09-10 or whenever Tony has been injured. Also you need to understand that if Parker goes he isnt going to go for a bag of peanuts. There will be players coming back, one of which could easily be a back-up point that could fill in for a couple of minutes a game. If not theres FAs out there.
OK, I guess you just meant out of the game.
I agree Manu is a good point guard, but he doesn't make Hill a good point guard.
Another simple question for the Parker homers:
Parker at the point+current frontcourt or Hill at the point+an upgrade in the frontcourt that a Parker trade would ideally net?
Who are these ideally netted players?
And you still have Manu playing the point.
You saying 43-44% shooting from half of midrange isn't good just shows you don't know what you're talking about. Kobe has a 45.4% FG shooting for his career.
Because not being as dumb as you are, NBA players know how to pick their spots?And thats one spot, why conveniently ignore the other spots were his shooting is atrocious.
A couple of minutes? You suck at maths.And really?They seemed to play together just fine in the second half of 09-10 or whenever Tony has been injured. Also you need to understand that if Parker goes he isnt going to go for a bag of peanuts. There will be players coming back, one of which could easily be a back-up point that could fill in for a couple of minutes a game. If not theres FAs out there.
Manu has basically never averaged more than 30 mpg in his career, so even in the optimistic scenario that he isn't going to get fewer and fewer minutes, and that he also isn't going to miss any games due to injury (fat chance), that leaves at least 18 mpg where Hill (or a backup) will be running the point alone. That's one and a half quarters. This is going to be fun... for the other team at least.
I watched every game too and concur with this assessment. Painful to watch dribbling down the clock for 20 seconds without ball movement, and then some rushed attempt at penetrating and either finishing or passing to a teammate to rush the shot. If you actually remember, this was an improvement over the pre-season and very early in the season where he simply called iso after iso for himself.
This guy is ing ridiculous. What a joke.
If you have eyes and watched Spurs games last season you'd know the offense suffers tremendously when Hill is running it. You want him in the starting lineup but fail to realize we have absolutely no backup PG and Hill can only somewhat run the offense when Manu is out there to pretty much initiate everything for him. All Hill does really is walk the ball up the court and pass it to Manu. He can't run a pick and roll to save his life and he is pretty bad at getting into the lane and finding the open man.
If Hill is starting at PG next season then it will become apparently obvious how one dimensional he is.
Kobe Bryant is a great player but an efficient shooter he is not. 43-44% will never be considered good.
Oh you mean how he picked his spots and chose to shoot almost twice as much from the left side as he did from the right?A spot were he shot 29% from. Yea, Tony sure does know how to pick his spotsBecause not being as dumb as you are, NBA players know how to pick their spots?
About 10-12 minutes seems right. I consider that a couple.A couple of minutes? You suck at maths.
Manu has basically never averaged more than 30 mpg in his career, so even in the optimistic scenario that he isn't going to get fewer and fewer minutes, and that he also isn't going to miss any games due to injury (fat chance), that leaves at least 18 mpg where Hill (or a backup) will be running the point alone. That's one and a half quarters. This is going to be fun... for the other team at least.
People act like Manu is made out of glass, yet another SpursTalk misconception right up there with Hill simply being a SG. Yall s realize Tony has missed more time than Manu the past two seasons?Yall s realize Manu has played in atleast 75 games in 6 out of his 9 seasons as a pro?
10-12 minutes does =/= "a couple"
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