*** Official Dallas Mavericks 2011-2012 Discussion thread ***

[Findog]

NJ has more to offer in a trade than Dallas. While no superstars Lopez isn't crap and morrow & brooks are appealing young players. Their ability to absorb bad contracts helps to (although Dallas has some of that aspect too).

I'm already on record saying I think he will be traded to the Nets. I also think NJ is ahead of Dallas in FA.

IMO if Dwight is traded its: NJ/LA/DAL
If he hits FA: NJ/DAl

I think Dwight is not completely sold on New Jersey. It would be him, Deron and NOTHING else in Brooklyn. In Dallas it would be him, Deron AND Dirk, an organization that is first-class and has won a championship.

If he's traded, it will be because the Lakers dropped their resistance to dealing Bynum.

If he hits FA, he's a Mav.

[JamStone]

Wait. I can see Dallas signing Deron Williams this summer. But how do you propose the Mavericks sign both Williams and Dwight? The money just doesn't work unless both guys take considerably less than max. Dallas already has $40 million+ committed to 4 guys next season that aren't reasonably tradable, Dirk, Marion, Haywood, Carter. And none of them make sense for either New Jersey or Orlando to take back in return in a sign-and-trade. I don't see how Dallas has the financial flexibility to sign both guys.

I do see them as a heavy favorite in luring Deron Williams. I just don't see both.

[Amuseddaysleeper]

Well JamStone, I think that's why you are seeing the Mavs trying so hard to shop Marion. If they can get rid of his contract that would really open the floodgates for signing Deron and Dwight to max contracts.

Bill Simmons is saying Cuban has been pimping Marion for defensive player of the year in hopes of boosting his trade value

[clambake]

haywood still lost out there. he does something right and immediately kills it by doing the very next thing wrong.

[MavDynasty]

Wait. I can see Dallas signing Deron Williams this summer. But how do you propose the Mavericks sign both Williams and Dwight? The money just doesn't work unless both guys take considerably less than max. Dallas already has $40 million+ committed to 4 guys next season that aren't reasonably tradable, Dirk, Marion, Haywood, Carter. And none of them make sense for either New Jersey or Orlando to take back in return in a sign-and-trade. I don't see how Dallas has the financial flexibility to sign both guys.

I do see them as a heavy favorite in luring Deron Williams. I just don't see both.

Carter has a dampier like contract with the second and third year being partially guaranteed. It would only be a couple mill for Cuban to buy the contract out. As for Haywood/Marion, we still have the amnesty clause.

[MavDynasty]

Dirk would also restructure his contract to make the numbers work

[#41 Shoot Em Up]

People make such a big deal out of Dallas not being able to offer the full max or more money then the Nets can, but didn't all of the big 3 in Miami take less to play together?

[DAF86]

Spurs have to have extremely hot 3 point shooting to win a series against Dallas though. Really, if their 3's aren't falling against most any team, they are toast.

Not too long ago, with rosters similar to these ones the Spurs beat the Mavs 4-2 and we won a game where we didn't hit a single three.

[DPG21920]

I think Dwight is not completely sold on New Jersey. It would be him, Deron and NOTHING else in Brooklyn. In Dallas it would be him, Deron AND Dirk, an organization that is first-class and has won a championship.

If he's traded, it will be because the Lakers dropped their resistance to dealing Bynum.

If he hits FA, he's a Mav.

Dwight has made it known he prefers NJ. If he hits FA it will be NJ because it will be Dwight/Deron/Lopez/Brooks/Morrow/James + a heck of a first round pick in a deep draft.

If Dwight is traded to NJ they only do so knowing he will sign with them. So either way, especially with Dwight himself saying he prefers NJ, NJ appears to be the more desirable spot. You seem to place way to much emphasis on "world class organizations" and the impact on FA decisions. Spurs are the cream of the crop of world class organizations, have 4 les & and had a superior player to Dirk and still couldn't land free agents. It's about money first and foremost and then team second. Mavs can't offer both Dwight and Deron full contracts. They can get close but D&D will have to leave money on the table to sign with Dallas; that's not the case in NJ. Also Dallas will be capped out and depleted, NJ will still have good talent and a great draft pick.

If its via trade, the point is moot, Dallas has no real shot then and Orlando likely isnt letting Dwight walk for nothing. They are likely not going to trade him to LA due to perception as well unless it's a no brainer lIke Pau AND Bynum. Dallas should hope for ORL to trade with LA because that gets them at least Deron.

[DPG21920]

Dirk would also restructure his contract to make the numbers work

Can't do that.

[DPG21920]

Findog is right about Dallas cap though. Odom is only owed 2M of his 8M. Carter is owed 2M of his 3M. Then they can amnesty Haywood's 9M. Even with that they can't offer both max deals.

[#41 Shoot Em Up]

Dwight has made it known he prefers NJ. If he hits FA it will be NJ because it will be Dwight/Deron/Lopez/Brooks/Morrow/James.

[stretch]

haywood still lost out there. he does something right and immediately kills it by doing the very next thing wrong.

Yeah, he was pretty bad last night...

But last night was a perfect example of how valuable Odom actually is to the Mavs. His defense, length, and rebounding would have came in really handy, and offensively its not possible for him to be any more useless than Brian Cardinal.

I think if the Mavs had either West or Odom last night, they win that game. Both are going to be really important to the team's success in the playoffs.

[DPG21920]

What's even more funny is if you look at Dallas's roster next year beyond the big 3. NJ also has a sweet pick in this years draft to add; Dallas does not.

[clambake]

Yeah, he was pretty bad last night...

But last night was a perfect example of how valuable Odom actually is to the Mavs. His defense, length, and rebounding would have came in really handy, and offensively its not possible for him to be any more useless than Brian Cardinal.

I think if the Mavs had either West or Odom last night, they win that game. Both are going to be really important to the team's success in the playoffs.

where was odom? getting a wax?

[DPG21920]

Yeah, he was pretty bad last night...

But last night was a perfect example of how valuable Odom actually is to the Mavs. His defense, length, and rebounding would have came in really handy, and offensively its not possible for him to be any more useless than Brian Cardinal.

I think if the Mavs had either West or Odom last night, they win that game. Both are going to be really important to the team's success in the playoffs.

Agree and no matter how you look at odom he has value to the Mavs. If he plays well he really improves an already deep and talented team. He is ap very tradeable despite his recent play due to his upside and contract.

[#41 Shoot Em Up]

What's even more funny is if you look at Dallas's roster next year beyond the big 3. NJ also has a sweet pick in this years draft to add; Dallas does not.

[stretch]

where was odom? getting a wax?

No earthly idea...

Agree and no matter how you look at odom he has value to the Mavs. If he plays well he really improves an already deep and talented team. He is ap very tradeable despite his recent play due to his upside and contract.

Come playoff time when the game becomes more physical and more of a grind, his usefulness to the Mavs will definitely increase. Carter has definitely won fans hearts over during the regular season, but I wouldn't be suprised at all if Odom is the more impactful player in the playoffs. A guy with experience winning multiple championships, who has a nearly unlimited skillset, is always a good thing to have on your roster.

[JamStone]

Carter has a dampier like contract with the second and third year being partially guaranteed. It would only be a couple mill for Cuban to buy the contract out. As for Haywood/Marion, we still have the amnesty clause.

I forgot about the amnesty clause. Good point. And fair point on VC.

So they'd have somewhere in the neighborhood of $26-28 million in cap space and Dirk, Marion (I'd assume they'd amnesty Haywood if they go after Dwight), and Beaubois left to appeal to Deron and Dwight. They'd have to not pick up VC's contract. And they'd likely lose both Brandan Wright and Ian Mahinmi to other teams. Would be interesting how they'd fill the rest of the roster. Very interesting.

People make such a big deal out of Dallas not being able to offer the full max or more money then the Nets can, but didn't all of the big 3 in Miami take less to play together?

Yes they did. But before the point about using the amnesty clause, there was enough money to offer each of them roughly $10 million to start. That's much less than the LeBron, Bosh, and Wade took.

[stretch]

and in regards to the money aspect about Dwight and Deron, I don't know if it was stated or not, but I believe not having any state taxes will come pretty close to balancing things out financially, if they were to take a bit less to be in Dallas. I haven't done the math and have no intention to, but I would assume that the lack of state taxes would come close to negating the contract difference between NJ and Dallas.

IMO, either they hit FA and sign with Dallas, or Dwight gets traded to NJ and they stay there. Orlando would be stupid not to trade him to NJ, but I have a feeling they are going to be stupid, and hope that they can somehow win a championship and convince Dwight to stay.

[DPG21920]

I agree Dallas's chances are better if they both hit FA, but IMO NJ is in the lead both ways for the reasons I explained. Doesn't mean it can't happen just that I find it very unlikely.

[Killakobe81]

Dwight has made it known he prefers NJ. If he hits FA it will be NJ because it will be Dwight/Deron/Lopez/Brooks/Morrow/James + a heck of a first round pick in a deep draft.

If Dwight is traded to NJ they only do so knowing he will sign with them. So either way, especially with Dwight himself saying he prefers NJ, NJ appears to be the more desirable spot. You seem to place way to much emphasis on "world class organizations" and the impact on FA decisions. Spurs are the cream of the crop of world class organizations, have 4 les & and had a superior player to Dirk and still couldn't land free agents. It's about money first and foremost and then team second. Mavs can't offer both Dwight and Deron full contracts. They can get close but D&D will have to leave money on the table to sign with Dallas; that's not the case in NJ. Also Dallas will be capped out and depleted, NJ will still have good talent and a great draft pick.

If its via trade, the point is moot, Dallas has no real shot then and Orlando likely isnt letting Dwight walk for nothing. They are likely not going to trade him to LA due to perception as well unless it's a no brainer lIke Pau AND Bynum. Dallas should hope for ORL to trade with LA because that gets them at least Deron.

The reality is NJ if Orlando lets him walk, would have Dwill and Brooks could flip Lopez for a better SF or PF and use their draft pick to draft teh other starter. Lets say they draft Barnes and trade Lopez and a pick for ...Josh Smith.

Nets could rock:

PG Dwill
SG Brooks
SF Barnes
PF Smith
C Dwight

That team has potential to be a beast ...

Magic would be dumb to NOT trade Dwight period. If he wants NJ fleece them for the two #1's Brooks and Lopez. I dont like Lopez, but I think Brooks could be a potential all-star (two guard crop is weak) Magic could check out Lopez for half a year and then trade him if they dont like him. Bynum is better but to sit on Dwight makes no sense.

I think Dallas is the favorite for Dwill but Nets would have serious cap room to make moves if Dwight doesnt go there. They would have to make a trade with teams looking to clear cap space ... but Nets have options.

[DPG21920]

I agree Dallas's chances are better if they both hit FA, but IMO NJ is in the lead both ways for the reasons I explained. Doesn't mean it can't happen just that I find it very unlikely.

Just think about it logically: We already know Dwight is pushing for a trade to NJ. If NJ is appealing to him knowing they would gut their team to get him and give up their solid to great draft pick, it would only be more appealing if they kept all their assets. Dallas is depleted regardless.

[lefty]

lolmavs

[clambake]

zero chance of getting both. 50/50 of getting one.