I agree that Duncan should take as little as possible, tbh..
At this point, rings and his legacy >> money..
It's difficult to find comparable contracts but here's one:
Karl Malone at the same age signed a four-year contract worth $67 million. And that was back in 1999. Add inflation ... that's like $90 million today. So Malone gets $22.5 million per year but Duncan isn't worth $8 million or whatever it is some Spurs fans are saying.
First off, Gary Neal is NOT a free agent. I'm not sure how many times that point will have to be made on this board before it sinks in.
Danny Green IS a free agent, in case you care.
So your plan is to low ball Tim Duncan with 5M a year but then overpay tremendously for Neal? Theres no world that Neal is worth 6.75M per year.
why u comparing contracts signed today to franchise players of the 90s who were underpaid, where franchises gave them a loyalty contract cause they were underpaid for a number of years when the nba was not a big money machine as today...jordans last bulls contract is another example when he was paid all while being the best player in the nba in the early 90s
Most aren't saying "he isn't worth it", at least not me. It's about context and winning. I will not be mad at him for getting 15M a year; I'll be disappointed knowing there is 0 chance at winning because of it. I'll feel like DoK towards Nash tbh.
"great f*cking hero Nash
Actually DoK is ragingso not a good analogy.
i lowball duncan MLE type deal, or match whatever offers he gets in FA if its under 10m....
the teams with money are not favourable destinations to uproot and reallocate to play for pretenders
steve nash is the money maker and attraction whatever sarver needs to keep the fans coming in when he has a team out there....Most aren't saying "he isn't worth it", at least not me. It's about context and winning. I will not be mad at him for getting 15M a year; I'll be disappointed knowing there is 0 chance at winning because of it. I'll feel like DoK towards Nash tbh.
"
If the options are pay Tim 15M or let him walk, it's a no brainer you pay him. ^
Different cir stances and era..
Up until that point, Karl Malone had never been paid more than 6 million a year..loyalty contract under the new era of NBA money..
I wouldn't have advocated signing Malone to that kind of money, either, it's overpaying for his production..
Also, Malone at that age >> Duncan, at the moment..
Speaking of stats and contracts, the going rate in free agency is about $2 million per WARP (Wins Above Replacement Player). Here are Duncan's WARP numbers over the years:
2006: 17.4
2007: 21.2
2008: 17.7
2009: 17.5
2010: 17.2
2011: 12.2
2012: 11.7 (projected obviously)
So even if his level of play drops off considerably, his economic worth according to the standards of the NBA open market will still very likely clear $12 million in the coming years. This season he hasn't been great but he has a legit chance to be worth more than the $21 million the Spurs are paying him.
Production beats out age everytime. You don't base a contract on the past. You try to base it on he will bring to you in the future. Karl Malone in that 4 year span was putting up all-star caliber numbers
99 - 00 25.5/9.5 35.9 minutes
00 - 01 23.2/8.3 35.7
01 - 02 22.4/8.6 38.0
02 - 03 20.6/7.8 36.2
Duncan is slowly deteriorating and while he's still productive, can't compete with those numbers.
I think the Spurs have some leverage. It's doubtful he would want to play for someone else.
As a Spurs fan, I hope Duncan takes $1 million. If I'm the Spurs front office, I probably offer something lower than $11 million to start off with just to gauge his interest. In a strictly business sense, giving an aging player big money is obviously risky. In a vacuum, I might advocate the Spurs hardballing Duncan.
All that said though, if the argument is what Duncan's current level of play is actually worth and what his worth is likely to be over the next couple seasons, it's pretty damn difficult to make a case that he's worth less than $12 million per year.
in the open market his worth more then 10, but not many teams are going to throw that +10m at him if it doesnt improve them to become legit contenders...i dont want to see management overpaying for duncan and crippling the teams paycap for next 3-4 years (just like RJ OVER evaluation)
most of the contenders only have MLE to play with
scrub teams with capspace are still scrub teams with duncan with no shot at winning unless duncan turns back the clock
dallas i dont see them chasing duncan if they are chasing deron and dwight, unless they missed out on d12, are they going to chase after duncan? theres still KG i think whose also on the market....
It's hard to put a price on intangibles and loyalty but you can put a price on production.
Resign Gary Neal for 7 mil a year? You lost your damn mind... unless your his agent
I think it might come down to if the Spurs can show TD they can get him some quality big man help he might be more willing to accept less.
But there was no way for the Jazz to know Malone would continue to put up those big regular season numbers. There was no precedent of a power forward being able to play that well in the regular season at that age. For all the Jazz knew, they were giving Malone $67 million to watch him fall off a cliff like 99% of bigmen his age.
it was wrong to compare to previous players under different cba rules
then some clowns on here comparing duncan to what chumps in todays league earns......
WE shouldnt overpay cause teams overpaid, spurs still hold the trump card in the leverage for duncans new deal..
A s of his former self, sure...but 13/11/3/3 in the playoffs vs. a very physical team deserves more than 5 mill a year...I wouldn't be surprised to see 16/11/3/2 in the playoffs this year from Duncan...which, when you take loyalty + that into account, has to be worth more than 5mill...show me a player the Spurs could get for 6-7 mill that could put up better than that?
Also, can't be serious with the "resign Duncan for 5mill, give Neal almost 7mill a year for 4 years...wtf?
Wow, hard to believe you wrote this post timvp.
Nah, the trump card is Duncan saying: "Shortchange me and I'll go win a couple championships with the Miami Heat while being a hop, skip and jump away from St. Croix. Meanwhile, Spurs fans will boycott the team like after George Gervin left when they hear how little you offered me to stay despite all those championship trophies I brought to San Antonio."
That, my friend, is game, set and match if Duncan wants to actually negotiate. With that leverage, Duncan basically can get whatever he wants, tbh. If Duncan leaves in a messy way, the franchise value depreciation alone would be a lot more than whatever money the Spurs "save" by letting Duncan walk.
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