Game thoughts - Spurs @ Thunder - Game 15

[TheyCallMePro]

It is absolutely unbelievable to me that Marco Belinelli didn't play a single second in the 1st quarter and played like only 3 minutes in the 3rd quarter. He only played 17 minutes total! We needed him desperately when our offense and ball movement bogged down in the 3rd. Sometimes Pop can be SO damn stubborn with the line-ups. I mean, he even put Bonner in before Belli in the 4th.

I rarely get on Pop, but he screwed up tonight. Other than not putting in Belli for long stretches he: left Patty in too long (Patty was in for Parker for half of the 4th quarter...) left Kawhi in too long (had only 2 points in the second half, because he was EXHAUSTED, and he also didn't play Splitter enough. The biggest mistake though was not trusting the foreign legion to carry the team. He left Kawhi in when they came in in the 2nd and left Belli on the bench. Big mistake. Screwed everything up.

[TD 21]

Marco Belinelli – 6 points, 2 rebounds, 2 assists, 1 steal.



Marco badly missed a 3 in the 3rd quarter. His solution was to step about 3-4 feet back and heave another one at the rim. No dice. Aside from his extremely questionable shot selection, which is probably the reason he only saw 17 minutes, Belinelli played a decent game. He supplied the Spurs with some energy and was going after loose balls. But if he’s not hitting threes, it severely diminishes his value on the court. Tonight was not a good night for the 2nd 5.

C-. Horrible shot selection tempers an otherwise decent performance.

No, it isn't. The reason is simple: Since they foolishly constructed a roster with one player capable of defending one of the two players that stand between them and a championship and since said player's team rarely plays small currently, that meant someone in the wing rotation was going to get squeezed for minutes and that someone was always going to be Belinelli.

One of the main reasons I wasn't thrilled with the signing is because I knew he'd be virtually useless against the Heat/Thunder.

We look like a completely different team against their length. We're slower moving the ball to the wings because they're in the passing lanes. We're scared to finish underneath because of Ibaka. We're all afraid to get in the paint because they have arms reaching all the time. We need to go deeper in the playbook tbh. They have us figured out- taking away our penetration and now our ball movement.

Exactly. Parker + the system is good enough against 27 teams, but not the 2 that stand between them and a championship.

It's the same thing always every time they play them, especially on the road: It's a grind offensively, Duncan struggles mightily, Ibaka is all world, a few of their role players join him in playing out of their mind and they win despite Westbrook struggling mightily.

The issues will probably remain the same no matter what tweaks are made, but the coaching staff needs to come up with something in the next meeting. Generally, you save that type of thing for the playoffs against this caliber of opponent, but in this specific case, they need to make an exception. It's more important to get a better idea of whether they can beat this team in a series with their current personnel.

[Skull-1]

But Belinelli doesn't take terrible shots. How can this be?

He doesn't take ONLY terrible shots. Reference Tracy Morgan, aka Gary Neal.

[Skull-1]

No, it isn't. The reason is simple: Since they foolishly constructed a roster with one player capable of defending one of the two players that stand between them and a championship and since said player's team rarely plays small currently, that meant someone in the wing rotation was going to get squeezed for minutes and that someone was always going to be Belinelli.

One of the main reasons I wasn't thrilled with the signing is because I knew he'd be virtually useless against the Heat/Thunder.




Exactly. Parker + the system is good enough against 27 teams, but not the 2 that stand between them and a championship.

It's the same thing always every time they play them, especially on the road: It's a grind offensively, Duncan struggles mightily, Ibaka is all world, a few of their role players join him in playing out of their mind and they win despite Westbrook struggling mightily.

The issues will probably remain the same no matter what tweaks are made, but the coaching staff needs to come up with something in the next meeting. Generally, you save that type of thing for the playoffs against this caliber of opponent, but in this specific case, they need to make an exception. It's more important to get a better idea of whether they can beat this team in a series with their current personnel.

/thread. He said it all.

[TheGoldStandard]

No, it isn't. The reason is simple: Since they foolishly constructed a roster with one player capable of defending one of the two players that stand between them and a championship and since said player's team rarely plays small currently, that meant someone in the wing rotation was going to get squeezed for minutes and that someone was always going to be Belinelli.

One of the main reasons I wasn't thrilled with the signing is because I knew he'd be virtually useless against the Heat/Thunder.




Exactly. Parker + the system is good enough against 27 teams, but not the 2 that stand between them and a championship.

It's the same thing always every time they play them, especially on the road: It's a grind offensively, Duncan struggles mightily, Ibaka is all world, a few of their role players join him in playing out of their mind and they win despite Westbrook struggling mightily.

The issues will probably remain the same no matter what tweaks are made, but the coaching staff needs to come up with something in the next meeting. Generally, you save that type of thing for the playoffs against this caliber of opponent, but in this specific case, they need to make an exception. It's more important to get a better idea of whether they can beat this team in a series with their current personnel.

Insert Jeff Ayers

[Cry Havoc]

No, it isn't. The reason is simple: Since they foolishly constructed a roster with one player capable of defending one of the two players that stand between them and a championship and since said player's team rarely plays small currently, that meant someone in the wing rotation was going to get squeezed for minutes and that someone was always going to be Belinelli.

One of the main reasons I wasn't thrilled with the signing is because I knew he'd be virtually useless against the Heat/Thunder.

That's fine. Solid opinion. Who else were the Spurs going to get realistically in free agency?

Exactly. Parker + the system is good enough against 27 teams, but not the 2 that stand between them and a championship.

It's the same thing always every time they play them, especially on the road: It's a grind offensively, Duncan struggles mightily, Ibaka is all world, a few of their role players join him in playing out of their mind and they win despite Westbrook struggling mightily.

The issues will probably remain the same no matter what tweaks are made, but the coaching staff needs to come up with something in the next meeting. Generally, you save that type of thing for the playoffs against this caliber of opponent, but in this specific case, they need to make an exception. It's more important to get a better idea of whether they can beat this team in a series with their current personnel.

First of all, we were an evenly officiated quarter away from beating the Thunder. Over a 7 game series, we might shoot this poorly once. We played awful basketball and lost by 6. I would take us in a 7 game series right now vs. OKC and feel pretty confident about it.

As far as the Heat go, you're probably right, but once again, who COULD we have got that's going to be a difference maker vs. Miami?

[TD 21]

That's fine. Solid opinion. Who else were the Spurs going to get realistically in free agency?

Either a 3D backup SF/combo forward or a backup combo guard who can get their own shot. Those were the needs and neither was addressed, because they prioritized Ginobili insurance.

First of all, we were an evenly officiated quarter away from beating the Thunder. Over a 7 game series, we might shoot this poorly once. We played awful basketball and lost by 6. I would take us in a 7 game series right now vs. OKC and feel pretty confident about it.

As far as the Heat go, you're probably right, but once again, who COULD we have got that's going to be a difference maker vs. Miami?

This wasn't a one off. If you've been paying attention the past few seasons, you'd realize that virtually every time they play them, especially on the road, the game follows the same script. At some point, it's not a fluke.

[ElNono]

No, it isn't. The reason is simple: Since they foolishly constructed a roster with one player capable of defending one of the two players that stand between them and a championship and since said player's team rarely plays small currently, that meant someone in the wing rotation was going to get squeezed for minutes and that someone was always going to be Belinelli.

One of the main reasons I wasn't thrilled with the signing is because I knew he'd be virtually useless against the Heat/Thunder.

Not necessarily true. While I agree Kawhi would potentially see most of the minutes guarding Durant/Lebron, Belli can still play SG in the second unit, with Gino/Patty running backup PG.

Pop was toying with the rotation a lot today. The Thunder are a tough team to beat at home (just like the Spurs are on our floor). It's what happens when you play a solid team. I still think they're much weaker than when they had Harden out there (and no, Reggie Jackson isn't a Harden caliber player). We've done good against them when Tiago had good games. You need to establish that interior presence to open up the shots. Didn't happen today.

[Cry Havoc]

Either a 3D backup SF/combo forward or a backup combo guard who can get their own shot. Those were the needs and neither was addressed, because they prioritized Ginobili insurance.

Yeah, well I was hoping they'd grab a 7'4" 310 pound PG who can run a 9.6 100 meters and can dunk from the FT line.

Specifying obvious traits is nice. Can you name even one player available that would fit our needs and our budget?

This wasn't a one off. If you've been paying attention the past few seasons, you'd realize that virtually every time they play them, especially on the road, the game follows the same script. At some point, it's not a fluke.

Yeah, the past two seasons we've been a horribly officiated quarter away from an NBA finals, and 20 seconds from a championship. If that's a fluke, then so is 99.9% of pro teams in history. Come on now. We just went to Game 7 against a Superteam. Now you call us flukes? That's some weak stuff, dude.

[mingus]

Duncan struggles really bad against OKC frontline.

We missed a lot of threes but OKC was closing out really well. You could say that them not letting us get into a groove indirectly influenced our missed open shots. Threes are easier to hit when you're in a rhythm. Credit to OKC for not letting us ever get into one.

Other than that the Spurs missed too many point blank shots.

And Patty was way overplaying Reggie Jackson, which he killed us for.

All this and we only lost by 6. OKC's role players aren't going to go for what they did tonight in SA. Durant and Westbrook will have to play better to beat us at home, and I like what our defense did with them tonight.

[rasuo214]

It is absolutely unbelievable to me that Marco Belinelli didn't play a single second in the 1st quarter and played like only 3 minutes in the 3rd quarter. He only played 17 minutes total! We needed him desperately when our offense and ball movement bogged down in the 3rd. Sometimes Pop can be SO damn stubborn with the line-ups. I mean, he even put Bonner in before Belli in the 4th.

I rarely get on Pop, but he screwed up tonight. Other than not putting in Belli for long stretches he: left Patty in too long (Patty was in for Parker for half of the 4th quarter...) left Kawhi in too long (had only 2 points in the second half, because he was EXHAUSTED, and he also didn't play Splitter enough. The biggest mistake though was not trusting the foreign legion to carry the team. He left Kawhi in when they came in in the 2nd and left Belli on the bench. Big mistake. Screwed everything up.

If you take Kawhi out who guards Durant? Marco? I think Pop should have tried Marco + Manu backcourt until Durant subbed out, then brought in Patty or Green (if Manu or Marco did a good enough job at point) for Kawhi.

[racm]

That's fine. Solid opinion. Who else were the Spurs going to get realistically in free agency?



First of all, we were an evenly officiated quarter away from beating the Thunder. Over a 7 game series, we might shoot this poorly once. We played awful basketball and lost by 6. I would take us in a 7 game series right now vs. OKC and feel pretty confident about it.

As far as the Heat go, you're probably right, but once again, who COULD we have got that's going to be a difference maker vs. Miami?

And this was @ OKC. If the Spurs have HCA over the Thunder that could be huge.

[romain.star]

Thanks Cry, nice grades

[KL2]

Splitter was disgraceful, I couldn't get over how scared he looked out there. There was one point where he missed a point blank lay up because he was afraid Ibaka would swat him, dude just threw it up there as fast as he could instead of finish strong.

[team-work]

Thanks for the grades

[boutons_deux]

Can't Pop see that Ayres' is size and energy don't make for his lack of BBIQ and inability to shoot?

[BillMc]

Nice grades. Many thanks.

[EVAY]

We look like a completely different team against their length. We're slower moving the ball to the wings because they're in the passing lanes. ...

Leonard is gonna want off the team in a couple years if he continues to not get touches because of hero ball tbh.

You are right that we look completely different against their length and we are much slower. The main reason we are slower is because the only really good ball handler among the starting five is Parker. So if they can (and do) put someone as long as Ibaka on Parker or double team him the offense stagnates because there is no one else they HAVE to focus on. They can slow down our offense by slowing down Parker. Our second unit's ball movement often looks better than the first because if Manu, Marco and Diaw are all on the court at the same time the defense can't just focus on one guy because all of those guys can dribble and distribute the ball. They just couldn't hit anything last night. It happens.

I also agree that the coaching staff has to come up with some way to improve the team's response to other teams double-teaming Parker or putting someone as big and long as Ibaka (or LeBron) on him. They have known that for a long time but they still don't seem to have a way figured out. I believe that the solution is going to be something like what you suggested - i.e., going deeper into the playbook. But they also need to get another ball handler in at the same time as Parker so that the defense can't just tee off on him. Green, Leonard, Duncan and Splitter can't dribble their way off the floor if they have a defender anywhere near them. When Manu comes in things get better because he can draw some attention to his own ball handling.

Let's face it...one other thing is slowing down the offense. Duncan really struggles to keep up with a fast pace any more.

Your last comment baffles me, though. Leonard took more shots at the basket last night than any other spur. He took more than Tony, more than Duncan, more than Manu, more than Green. In other words, if there was any hero ball going on last night, I don't know who you think was doing it. Everybody on the starting team shot poorly in the second half. Everyone. Tony was shooting 50% at the half, and then fell off in the second half. Leonard took 18 shots on the basket and made what, 6 of them? (Same makes as Tony I think but with more shot attempts than Tony). Accusing people of hero-ball is a common comment in this forum, but it is rarely well deserved on this Spurs team. Pop just doesn't allow it. People either make their shots or they don't, but Pop is not going to allow folks (including Tony) to take more shots than he is comfortable with them taking. Last week in a game he told Tony that he was 'on the ball too much' when Tony was dribbling around like a madman, and Tony changed. Point being...nothing is happening on the court in terms of shot attempts that Pop does not want to be happening.

[EVAY]

Thanks for the grades and the observations, Cry Havoc. I'm always happy to read your observations and takes. Please keep doing it whenever you can.

[dbestpro]

I give this grading effort a C-. A little too harsh in some areas. I mean get real. They lost by a few baskets on the road before Thanksgiving. Mills played the D the way he was suppose to. Mills crowded the shooter, while the big men struggled to rotate when Jackson penetrated. Might have been a good game for Baynes to play and knock a few people around.

[Raven]

i agree with most that's been written in this thread, also very solid grades.

[moisaenz]

Maybe this is the time Pop has to think about Baynes banging against OKC's front court.

[Cry Havoc]

Thanks for the grades and the observations, Cry Havoc. I'm always happy to read your observations and takes. Please keep doing it whenever you can.

You're welcome. It's fun to do, although I wish it would have been a win, would have been lot more enjoyable.

I give this grading effort a C-. A little too harsh in some areas. I mean get real. They lost by a few baskets on the road before Thanksgiving. Mills played the D the way he was suppose to. Mills crowded the shooter, while the big men struggled to rotate when Jackson penetrated. Might have been a good game for Baynes to play and knock a few people around.

My grades had only a little to do with the final score. Given how well we have BEEN playing, I expected more from our guys. The team had SO many chances in the 4th quarter, and just didn't convert. This isn't meant to be a condemnation of any particular player, but an analysis of a le contending team that didn't have it on a single given night. As trademark as it is for the Spurs, I cannot be generous on a night when a random 23 year old goes off on our defense. I expect better from our guys. Who in particular did you have a problem with as far as grades go?

[Baam]

I have yet to watch the game but right now it seems like we have the 2012 version of Tim Duncan, Jackson may not be Harden but then again does he really need to be to make this series uncertain at best...

The main problem to me is post game, with their length you need to counter with good post game, to bully them or at least show them the ball and get them off their feet "insert Boris cream shake gif".

If Splitter can't do it then it sucks... This team is made to defend TP tbh, you need someone good inside... Maybe you start both Boris and Beli to take pressure off TP and have Green on Jackson. Do you really need Green on chuckbrook? I don't know but I don't feel confident at all so far, and that didn't start with this loss, I'm just not sure this is a real contender if Duncan doesn't play better...

[EVAY]

I have yet to watch the game but right now it seems like we have the 2012 version of Tim Duncan, Jackson may not be Harden but then again does he really need to be to make this series uncertain at best...

The main problem to me is post game, with their length you need to counter with good post game, to bully them or at least show them the ball and get them off their feet "insert Boris cream shake gif".

If Splitter can't do it then it sucks... This team is made to defend TP tbh, you need someone good inside... Maybe you start both Boris and Beli to take pressure off TP and have Green on Jackson. Do you really need Green on chuckbrook? I don't know but I don't feel confident at all so far, and that didn't start with this loss, I'm just not sure this is a real contender if Duncan doesn't play better...

I certainly think that your suggestion about starting Boris and Beli is worth a shot. Really, I was half expecting Boris to start last night and I think it would have been a good idea had he done so. I don't know for sure what the answer is, but I think you are awfully close, given our current personnel.