Spurs: Kawhi is a top 5 SF in the league

[Killakobe81]

Pop's system hurts Leonard's game more than it helps it, tbh, see: Richard Jefferson..

Pop's system is extremely overrated..

Wait ... wHAT?!

[Killakobe81]

Tony Parker is the most overrated player in the league, as I've been saying for the past 2 years..with that being said, Parker is still an elite PG that the Spurs couldn't win big games without, despite "Pop's system"..

The rest of the team, including Duncan, doesn't receive nearly enough credit, up until Leonard's recent hype(which has made him overrated, as of late)..

The Spurs aren't the most talented team at the #1 position, but from 2 to 10, they're one of the most talented teams in the league..Pop's system didn't look special when he was playing Finley, Bogans and Mason at the wings..it didn't look special when he chose to bench Splitter in favor of Bonner and Blair..

He's not some magician, like the majority of non-Spurs fans seem to believe..

Wait, what? No magician but a great ing coach.
And some Spur fans criticize him unfairly yet others praise him so I dont think he is overrated on Spurstalk.
Media loves him unabashedly.

[HarlemHeat37]

He isn't overrated at all on ST..every fanbase unfairly criticizes their coach, tbh..

He's easily overrated in the media and by other fans, though..people act like Pop doesn't have talented players, and that he magically transforms them into NBA-caliber players..

And my point about Leonard is that he's treated like a spot-up shooter in Pop's system, despite being able to offer much more, as we have seen the past few weeks(with increased touches, finally)..Richard Jefferson was also relegated to a spot-up shooter, as well..

[HI-FI]

Wait, what? No magician but a great ing coach.
And some Spur fans criticize him unfairly yet others praise him so I dont think he is overrated on Spurstalk.
Media loves him unabashedly.

Media likes him because he's unique and successful. Spursfan has a lot of love/hate or daddy issues with Pop, but he's definitely a great coach and a big part of Spurs' lore.
I also wonder if the media showcasing him or his soundbytes comes from the top, ie Silver. I remember Silver saying he thought the Spurs' weren't appreciated enough by the media for what they've accomplished. Some truth to that.

[timtonymanu]

They're not loaded with talent. It's Tim, Tony, Manu and a band of role players who know their role and play to it very well

I agree with you that Leonard isn't a first-option at the moment and is a little overrated by Spurs fans, but I think he's more than just a "role player". He's already better than Manu at this point and if he can raise his level of play even more next season, he won't be far off from Tim and Tony.

[Killakobe81]

He isn't overrated at all on ST..every fanbase unfairly criticizes their coach, tbh..

He's easily overrated in the media and by other fans, though..people act like Pop doesn't have talented players, and that he magically transforms them into NBA-caliber players..

And my point about Leonard is that he's treated like a spot-up shooter in Pop's system, despite being able to offer much more, as we have seen the past few weeks(with increased touches, finally)..Richard Jefferson was also relegated to a spot-up shooter, as well..

Some great points ...even Phil was criticized. Maybe he is limiting KL to a degree but just like Phil with young Kobe or Dean smith with young Mj it could pay-off down the road.
Good thing is doesn't appear KL has the ego of either guy ...
Also sounds like you agree that in the Rox system (or lack there of) KL could do more ...

[spurraider21]

Kawhi's efficiency would drop on another team but his production would increase. I doubt the PER would fall off much or at all

[Venti Quattro]

I agree with you that Leonard isn't a first-option at the moment and is a little overrated by Spurs fans, but I think he's more than just a "role player". He's already better than Manu at this point and if he can raise his level of play even more next season, he won't be far off from Tim and Tony.

Kawhi's star potential is there. He should just get those goddamn awful braids off and shave his head

[Killakobe81]

I agree with you that Leonard isn't a first-option at the moment and is a little overrated by Spurs fans, but I think he's more than just a "role player". He's already better than Manu at this point and if he can raise his level of play even more next season, he won't be far off from Tim and Tony.

Spurs are very talented. Duncan and a healthy Parker are the only sure fire #1 or #2 on whatever team they are on ...But Tiago Mills, Diaw, Manu and Belli are better than every team's 6-10 ...
Not only cuz they are disciplined and flows Pop's system but because they have talent. Except tiago (who is Ok for a big man) all those guys can pass, shoot and create for their team-mates off the ball and player movement Pop's system dictates.

Spurs are like Europes top team led by 3 HOF'ers ... (Big 3)

Pop deserves credit for reviving Diaw, unleashing Patty Mills, and molding Green in to a third world country Bowen and for signing off on the Hill for KL.

[sook]

Seconded on those braids, reminds me too much of Stephen Jackson, AI, Spree...has there ever been a likeable player in the league with cornrows?

[Killakobe81]

Doubt KL can be a superstar. I see fringe all-star to solid all-star potential.

[Raven]

Doubt KL can be a superstar. I see fringe all-star to solid all-star potential.

Kobe was voted to the all star so leonard is already above that. Well, so is every player in the league at this point..

[timtonymanu]

Spurs are very talented. Duncan and a healthy Parker are the only sure fire #1 or #2 on whatever team they are on ...But Tiago Mills, Diaw, Manu and Belli are better than every team's 6-10 ...
Not only cuz they are disciplined and flows Pop's system but because they have talent. Except tiago (who is Ok for a big man) all those guys can pass, shoot and create for their team-mates off the ball and player movement Pop's system dictates.

Spurs are like Europes top team led by 3 HOF'ers ... (Big 3)

Pop deserves credit for reviving Diaw, unleashing Patty Mills, and molding Green in to a third world country Bowen and for signing off on the Hill for KL.

Yeah the Spurs easily have talent. Pop's system is good but like Harlem said, I do think Pop gets too much credit. Joseph/Bonner/Errors/Baynes still don't look like NBA caliber players even though they are in Pop's "system." Danny Green would be the only good argument about how Pop can turn garbage players into NBA players, even though I think Green has shown he's more than one-dimensional as an NBA player.

[Michael Jordan.]

Yeah the Spurs easily have talent. Pop's system is good but like Harlem said, I do think Pop gets too much credit. Joseph/Bonner/Errors/Baynes still don't look like NBA caliber players even though they are in Pop's "system." Danny Green would be the only good argument about how Pop can turn garbage players into NBA players, even though I think Green has shown he's more than one-dimensional as an NBA player.

Good coaches win with what they have.

[HarlemHeat37]

Pop has never won a le without a top 3 player..he's no different than any other great coach..

[Michael Jordan.]

Yeah the Spurs easily have talent. Pop's system is good but like Harlem said, I do think Pop gets too much credit. Joseph/Bonner/Errors/Baynes still don't look like NBA caliber players even though they are in Pop's "system." Danny Green would be the only good argument about how Pop can turn garbage players into NBA players, even though I think Green has shown he's more than one-dimensional as an NBA player.

Also, if he continues winning with those players, it's still his system.

[Michael Jordan.]

Pop has never won a le without a top 3 player..he's no different than any other great coach..

You really resorting to that?

[ElNono]

Pop is a coach that knows how to maximize talent. That's the biggest trait of all great coaches. Outside the actual core, they put subpar talent on a system and make it work. It's why players like Sasha Vujacic or Shannon Brown even had a career in the NBA.

You always need the core of star/solid players. Pop knows that well, but we're in a league where your 1st and 2nd option will eventually get shut down, and you're going to need contributions from your other guys. That's when great coaches shine.

[chief keef]

LB
Durant
Melo
George
Deng

Then you've got Kiwi fighting with some other s like Parsons and Gay for the next spot.

[ElNono]

^ Deng has fallen off a cliff... he was already awful in Chicago earlier in the season. Solid list otherwise.

[chief keef]

naw deng was still solid for us early on, the 2 way game was great.

did him dirty trading him to the worst state in the union. now he has nothing to play for

[GuerillaBlack]

Leonard will be the future face of our franchise.

Parsons... not so much.

Why does spursfan believe this? Kawhi isn't carrying a team anywhere. He isn't a number one.

[spurraider21]

LBJ
George
Durant
Carmello

Parsons
Gay
Pierce
Joe Johnson
Gerald Green
Josh Smith



not even top 10

Parsons > kiwi

Yeah, Kawhi is a better defender though. And Parsons was a 2nd rounder.

so 3 months ago it was Parsons > Kawhi, but now that he left Houston, you describe him as a player who is a worse defender than James Harden and can't create his own shot.

[Leetonidas]

If we're not putting LBJ and Melo in the PF category (iirc they have been playing most of their minutes there, no?) then Kawhi is still top 5 imo but without them he's the 3rd best behind KD/George.

1. LeBron
2. Durant
3. Carmelo
4. George
5. Leonard

[spurraider21]

I still like George at 3 over Melo, though it will be interesting to see how PG performs this year. Lance is gone, West will probably decline, and we really can't expect much out of Hibbert anymore. If he has a down year, I'll eat my crow on that one. Maybe I just really dislike Melo