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What have I tried to sell you without evidence?
you are the only one doing so
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According to the standard theory, our universe sprang into existence as "singularity" around 13.7 billion years ago. What is a "singularity" and where does it come from? Well, to be honest, we don't know for sure. Singularities are zones which defy our current understanding of physics. They are thought to exist at the core of "black holes." Black holes are areas of intense gravitational pressure. The pressure is thought to be so intense that finite matter is actually squished into infinite density (a mathematical concept which truly boggles the mind). These zones of infinite density are called "singularities." Our universe is thought to have begun as an infinitesimally small, infinitely hot, infinitely dense, something - a singularity. Where did it come from? We don't know. Why did it appear? We don't know.
What have I tried to sell you without evidence?
you are the only one doing so
That there is no God/MasterDesigner.
He's hung up on it because he is afraid of the implications it has on beliefs he has clung to for his entire life
I have never said that there is no god. Go back and find a post where I definitively state "there is no god."
As ive said many times, it would not be logical to make the claim that it doesn't exist.
Last edited by spurraider21; 10-17-2014 at 07:42 PM.
Yep, which is why the assertion/assumption that nothing proceeded the Bang is controversial. The actual Bang itself isn't, though. It's plain as day to anyone who knows about the universe from a physical standpoint.
The problem is Avante isn't among them.
He'll respond shortly with "so we have DNA, insects, birds, all from a........ bANG? Hahahahaha!
With a "little man" or two thrown in.
I'm not expecting him to understand the science behind anything. It's out of his reach.
But whats annoying is that he can't grasp the concept of the null. I've tried to be very clear in that nobody can prove the lack if existence of god. I have stated many times quite clearly that I am not making the claim that god doesn't exist. And then I see his most recent post and it's literally him covering his ears going "blablablablablablabla"
Well, he's doing a poor job at explaining the same argument that I used (that it's more reasonable to assume something set the universe into motion rather than assuming that nothing did). In such a case, asserting that the universe/existence began spontaneously, is actually the alternate (which is why he's arguing you have the burden of proof). So I obviously sympathize with his point of view. I just think he's going about defending it the wrong way.
Not that I want to get into that, of course. I've had my rodeo already.
Oh yes totally out of my reach? Dude....stop it ok? What it is is that it makes no sense and it cannot be proved. So why keep trying to peddle something you can't prove?
Wow!
Not much for the obvious are ya slugger. I was ....OBVIOUSLY...talking about howe so many things that take some complexities coming into existence over something as chaotic as a huge explosion. What are the odds?
So the day after...BIG BANG..what was there?
There's a difference between asserting that god doesn't exist and asserting that people shouldn't believe god exists. The first one is unknowable and unprovable logically. The second one is a debate topic. Spurraider is arguing the second one.
When you know a lot of very intelligent and successful people who wouldn't be caught dead doing this silly messgeboard trip beliving in a God, what chance does some guy in hiding have trying to sell...no it's evolution, the big bang....? Yep, none!
Last edited by Avante; 10-17-2014 at 08:50 PM.
i don't think he's using the same argument you did. his insistence on the big bang not making sense tells me he's making a fundamentally different argument than yours. you have no issue with the big bang and its ramifications.
So it's better to raise your children to not believe in any God....right? They need to believe in.....BANG!!!!!!!!!!!!!....right?
There are differences, for sure. I don't see science and theism as conflicting, so I have no problem accepting scientific findings. He does. But I think we agree that there are more reasons to believe things than empirical evidence.
sure, but i dont think that's been his argument at all. most of his argument seems to just be questioning the bang and what followed and using the judeo-christian god as a subs ute
if feel-good stories are better, why dont you raise your kids and have them believe that disease, statutory rape, and war don't exist.
So you think it's better that kids have no God in their life, right?
i don't think its better or worse either way. hopefully i can teach them to be good people without having to scare them into it, though. based on family custom, they'll grow up with the christian holidays and some traditions, the same way i did. i'm not going to force anything upon them and if they ask for my opinion i'd share it honestly without forcing a view on them one way or the other
So when asked.....hey dad is there a God, you tell them what? Especially since granny wants to take them to her church.
my family hasn't regularly attended church as far as i can remember. my father's father was a priest, but even then my immediate family never was into the weekly thing. we'd basically go for weddings/funerals/baptisms... and maybe for easter. so that wouldn't really factor in much.
if my kid asked me, i would just turn it around and ask him what he thinks, and then ask him why he thinks that way. what makes sense to them. get 'em into critical thinking. when it comes to religion, politics, i dont want to be the kind of father that imposes my beliefs. i'm sure there will be some regardless of my intentions, its human nature. same approach my old man took with me. anytime i asked him a question about religion or politics, he would ask me how i got to my thought process, and challenge it. even if i had the same view he did, he challenged me to defend it. i think it was a good exercise and something i'd go for as well
I see, ok how about this?
son...dad, I think there is a God, I lost Joey (dog) today, thought he was gone. So I started crying. Grandma said maybe if I prayed Joey would come back, so I did and in about fifteen minutes there was Joey at the door. There is a God isn't there dad?
Ok so what do you tell him?
son...dad, I don't think there is a God, I lost Joey (dog) today, thought he was gone. So I started crying. Grandma said maybe if I prayed Joey would come back, so I did and Joey never came back. There is no God, is there dad?
what do you say?
this is trivial... and none of this bears any relevance to the conversation we had been having. that being said, i dont think my kid would be growing up in an environment where god (at least in the biblical sense) is being shoved down his throat on a daily basis, where that would be his first reaction
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